Uk Forced Out Of Europe

[CiderHider]

So Cameron uses his vito to protect the banks, we knew this, but the Euro is going down, what next? Germany and France have made a mistake it forcing us into an impossible position. I Think the importance of this decision is historic, I can only wonder where it will end. We have been cut lose from the huddle of the Euro zone country's, and in effect the big decision about the EU, Does anyone care? The EU is a bad idea, the EURO was a disaster unless it was a deliberate tactic to, Some people are blaming Germany, if they can't do it by military power they will do it financially, and this time France is their bitch.

I don't know what I think, I liked the idea of the UK taking the helm and steering this EU titanic to safty, they don't want our help? They wish to keep us away from big decisions and effectively sanction our country from EU trade.

Either you are in the EU or you are out, we dont need a referendum any more Germany and France have made the decision for us, they have told us in diplomatic terms to go screw ourselves.

As of today, I no longer consider myself European.

[Mr Mosquito]

AT LAST !!!!!!! David Cameron is now proving himself as a worthy British Prime Minister by being more like Nigel Farage of UKIP. About time a British political leader stood up to the European Union and all its corrupt cronies. The way David Cameron dealt with the corrupt and criminal led EU project at that EU conference yesterday was flawless. Well done David Cameron.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

AT LAST !!!!!!! David Cameron is now proving himself as a worthy British Prime Minister by being more like Nigel Farage of UKIP. About time a British political leader stood up to the European Union and all its corrupt cronies. The way David Cameron dealt with the corrupt and criminal led EU project at that EU conference yesterday was flawless. Well done David Cameron.

Thank **** Liebore are still not in power, they would have signed anything.

[Mr Mosquito]

Thank **** Liebore are still not in power, they would have signed anything.

I know, Millipede and his gang of EU loving traitors would have signed. We must always remember that Gordon Brown infamously signed the EU Lisbon Treaty behind our backs after promising us a referendum on it !!!!!! However, apparently, Gordon Brown did keep us out of the hopelessly flawed Euro currency project that Tony Blair wanted us to join. We'd now be being shafted by Angela Merkel and the EU central banksters in Frankfurt had we joined the Euro.

[Barrs Court Red]

I do worry what it might mean for Filton in the long run.

Not only did labour **** up our economy they sat back and let all our manufacturing disappear, swallowed by our eu "partners" like Poland.

If we left the EU that could be rebuilt without interference.

Some people have branded Cameron as isionaltionist. I say bravo. Trade yes, meddling corrupt non elected eu commissioners no.

[marshy]

AT LAST !!!!!!! David Cameron is now proving himself as a worthy British Prime Minister by being more like Nigel Farage of UKIP. About time a British political leader stood up to the European Union and all its corrupt cronies. The way David Cameron dealt with the corrupt and criminal led EU project at that EU conference yesterday was flawless. Well done David Cameron.

Hear, hear ! And they can stick their regulations on the sale of cabbages, all 26,911 words of it, in the place where the sun don't shine.

[CiderHider]

No going back now. Cameron's back bencher's will be egging him on further and will push us out of Europe completely. to what ends I don't know.,, or even if its best in the long term, but I think todaty marks a historical day. The day Europe turned on us and the day we began to completely sever links

I mean what is now the point in suffering all of the EU bullshit rules and its massive cost when we no longer get to make those rules and the rules that will now be made will NOT be made in our interest at all, ? infact I will go further to say Germany and France will make a point of making us suffer, for why I don't know. Ones things for sure, things never change and nor do country's.

None of the Euro zones country's even spoke out in our support, none of them. Screw them then, and send back their non skilled workers, that goes for Ireland too.

[Red-Robbo]

Not only did labour **** up our economy they sat back and let all our manufacturing disappear, swallowed by our eu "partners" like Poland.

It's a good job successive Tory administrations from Thatcher onwards have done so much to protect our manufacturing base ... oh, hang on....

[screech]

Can we go back to having arc shaped bananas now?

[screech]

Lets be fair here, Germany have all the power in the Eurozone, and to pretend Adolf Merkel sits at the top table with anyone else is quite laughable. France may think they are an equal but they aren't, this is a dictatorship, and a classic case of the big bully throwing their weight about on the little guys, sign up or else. Glad Cameron walked away, for the life of me I couldn't see any of the Labour leaders doing the same, especially this latest blocked up nose twerp.

[kevinmabbuttshair]

Hopefully this is the first step on the road to becoming an asscioate member like Norway and Switzerland.

I'll be happy to be on the outside while the middle crumbles

[Duesseldorf Citizen]

With Germany being one of the few European countries with a working economy at the moment (the UK doesn't !) it is not a surprise how things are going...

[Mr Mosquito]

It's a good job successive Tory administrations from Thatcher onwards have done so much to protect our manufacturing base ... oh, hang on....

........and hang on, the public school educated EU loving Marxists that are the Labour Party High Kommand did nothing to stop aeroplane engine production from moving from Rolls Royce Filton to East Germany or to stop production of chocolate bars being moved from Keynesham to Poland. We must also remember that the European Union project currently costs the British taxpayer £60 million PER DAY in membership fees. Partly due to Labour giving away the rebate that Thatcher gained for us. That equates to £365 PER YEAR for every British man, woman and child. A terrible financial cost for the beleaguered British taxpayer. The sooner Great Britain can leave the EU the better.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

........and hang on, the public school educated EU loving Marxists that are the Labour Party High Kommand did nothing to stop aeroplane engine production from moving from Rolls Royce Filton to East Germany or to stop production of chocolate bars being moved from Keynesham to Poland. We must also remember that the European Union project currently costs the British taxpayer £60 million PER DAY in membership fees. Partly due to Labour giving away the rebate that Thatcher gained for us. That equates to £365 PER YEAR for every British man, woman and child. A terrible financial cost for the beleaguered British taxpayer. The sooner Great Britain can leave the EU the better.

Here, Here not to mention an illegal war and an unwinnable war where Bliar blindly followed the half wit American Bush into, costing the country billions as well, socialists my arse.

[The Red Planet]

Hopefully this is the first step on the road to becoming an asscioate member like Norway and Switzerland.

I'll be happy to be on the outside while the middle crumbles

And it is worth noting that those two non-EU member countries have the highest GDP per capita in Europe (if you exclude Luxembourg which is a tiny country)

Source here:

. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_in_Europe_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita

Quite apart from anything else we would save the Ten Million pounds per DAY we contribute towards running the EU.

That would certainly help with reducing our debts.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Full ramifications remain to be seen but time will tell. Shame if this leads to a full parting of the ways from Europe though, worse places. Been to a number of European nations, good features about each.

Still, is it such a worthy cause? The City of London has been somewhat reckless in recent times to say the least...Interesting to see how things will change over time though.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Full ramifications remain to be seen but time will tell. Shame if this leads to a full parting of the ways from Europe though, worse places. Been to a number of European nations, good features about each.

Still, is it such a worthy cause? The City of London has been somewhat reckless in recent times to say the least...Interesting to see how things will change over time though.

Part of the problem was in their haste to allow countries to join the euro, the books of some of those countries were never properly scrutinised, had they been thoroughly audited it would have been obvious that Greece was lying through it's teeth about the scale of it's actual debt, in fact the EU were not only conned when Greece joined the euro they were also conned by Greece during the first bailout. That is why for the 2nd bailout France and Germany insisted on having some of their own politicians actually working within the Greek treasury to ensure the bailout money was being properly managed and that Greece was adhering to the austerity cuts insisted on by the EU.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Part of the problem was in their haste to allow countries to join the euro, the books of some of those countries were never properly scrutinised, had they been thoroughly audited it would have been obvious that Greece was lying through it's teeth about the scale of it's actual debt, in fact the EU were not only conned when Greece joined the euro they were also conned by Greece during the first bailout. That is why for the 2nd bailout France and Germany insisted on having some of their own politicians actually working within the Greek treasury to ensure the bailout money was being properly managed and that Greece was adhering to the austerity cuts insisted on by the EU.

Oh, very much so. Clearly politics over economics were the key driving force in that. Greece is a prime example of a nation unfit to join the Euro, a few other borderline ones also.

[Fiale]

[Mr Mosquito]

Anyway, here is what joining the EEC - as it used to be - got us.........

Prior to 1973, our export trade with the US was 32%, trade with Europe was 11%. Since then those figures swapped around to US 11% Europe 32% - so we've lost our lucrative English speaking US market and gained a load of bullshit rules and regulations in 30 odd languages and membership fees for the 'privilege' of trading with the EEC. Food prices shot up as commonwealth imports got whacked with EEC tariffs. The EEC then became the sovereignty sponge EU project. We got a lunatic fisheries policy, a border the far side of the old Warsaw pact and EU directives up to our eyeballs. But for the ERM fiasco of the early 1990s we'd be screwed with Euro currency membership as well. The only economically sane way forward is to get out of the EU completely and trade with the EU as Norway and Switzerland now do and re-develop our former lucrative trade links with the USA and the Commonwealth.

[Calculus]

Anyway, here is what joining the EEC - as it used to be - got us.........

Prior to 1973, our export trade with the US was 32%, trade with Europe was 11%. Since then those figures swapped around to US 11% Europe 32% - so we've lost our lucrative English speaking US market and gained a load of bullshit rules and regulations in 30 odd languages and membership fees for the 'privilege' of trading with the EEC. Food prices shot up as commonwealth imports got whacked with EEC tariffs. The EEC then became the sovereignty sponge EU project. We got a lunatic fisheries policy, a border the far side of the old Warsaw pact and EU directives up to our eyeballs. But for the ERM fiasco of the early 1990s we'd be screwed with Euro currency membership as well. The only economically sane way forward is to get out of the EU completely and trade with the EU as Norway and Switzerland now do and re-develop our former lucrative trade links with the USA and the Commonwealth.

All true but am not sure that I agree with that your way forward is workable. Very desirable, of course, but the trouble is that the US and Commonwealth have moved on since the 70s and before. Look at Australia and New Zealand now and you'll find that the look to to China, the far east and pacific regions. They used to be our trading partners and we sold them out - who on earth should they come back towards us? Similarly the US - prioritorising China and the east and paying no attention whatever to non existent 'special relationship'. Think our best option for now would be to stick with single market, stay well away from the euro, and prepare for the time when the other 25 (the non-German rest of the EU) realise that they're losing the ability to govern themselves. A lonely position in Europe for sure, but we've stood on our own many times before.

[Mr Mosquito]

All true but am not sure that I agree with that your way forward is workable. Very desirable, of course, but the trouble is that the US and Commonwealth have moved on since the 70s and before. Look at Australia and New Zealand now and you'll find that the look to to China, the far east and pacific regions. They used to be our trading partners and we sold them out - who on earth should they come back towards us? Similarly the US - prioritorising China and the east and paying no attention whatever to non existent 'special relationship'. Think our best option for now would be to stick with single market, stay well away from the euro, and prepare for the time when the other 25 (the non-German rest of the EU) realise that they're losing the ability to govern themselves. A lonely position in Europe for sure, but we've stood on our own many times before.

Excellent analysis. "and prepare for the time when the other 25 (the non-German rest of the EU) realise that they're losing the ability to govern themselves"......superb comment. When Germany re-united there was only ever going to be one outcome to continental Europe.....a German dominated Europe. The Euro (The Deutsche Mark in all but name) has its HQ in Frankfurt and its primary purpose is to benefit German industry - and it does so no matter what the costs to Southern Europe and to the Northern European taxpayers !!!!!

[Calculus]

Excellent analysis. "and prepare for the time when the other 25 (the non-German rest of the EU) realise that they're losing the ability to govern themselves"......superb comment. When Germany re-united there was only ever going to be one outcome to continental Europe.....a German dominated Europe. The Euro (The Deutsche Mark in all but name) has its HQ in Frankfurt and its primary purpose is to benefit German industry - and it does so no matter what the costs to Southern Europe and to the Northern European taxpayers !!!!!

Will be very interesting over the next few months ago: Clegg and Cameron are obviously due a major falling out and it may be that we end up with an earlier election that planned. Most entertaining sight, IMO, will be Sarkhozy facing re-election in April 2012. At the moment he's gone for a bit of Brit bashing but am not sure that as the deal unfolds his electorate will be all that pleased - he may pretend that it's all about France and Germany in equal partnership but the reality is that it isn't.. Maybe he should move his government to Vichy.

[...]

Will be very interesting over the next few months ago: Clegg and Cameron are obviously due a major falling out and it may be that we end up with an earlier election that planned. Most entertaining sight, IMO, will be Sarkhozy facing re-election in April 2012. At the moment he's gone for a bit of Brit bashing but am not sure that as the deal unfolds his electorate will be all that pleased - he may pretend that it's all about France and Germany in equal partnership but the reality is that it isn't.. Maybe he should move his government to Vichy.

I am very concerned about this development.

I, for one, think we should start building up the Navy and Air Force, without further ado.

After all - they best form of defence is attack - what have we got to lose, now United and City are out of europe, anyway?

And another thing:

I DEMAND an immediate import ban on Camenbert.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I am very concerned about this development.

I, for one, think we should start building up the Navy and Air Force, without further ado.

After all - they best form of defence is attack - what have we got to lose, now United and City are out of europe, anyway?

And another thing:

I DEMAND an immediate import ban on Camenbert.

Why ban the people who run the lottery?, you'll be banning cheese next.

[Duesseldorf Citizen]

Did we talk about half of the UK's exports going to the EU´, yet ?

[Red-Robbo]

........and hang on, the public school educated EU loving Marxists that are the Labour Party High Kommand

The Labour party has as much to do with Marxism as Clarkson has to with Swampy the road protester. Yer talking out yer hole, man.

Basically, this whole stance has nothing to do with 'protecting Britain's interests' and 'beating back the sinister centralistic influence' of the EU. It has to do with protecting the red-braced ***** in the City of London from regulations that would curb their casino capitalism.

Even conservatives like Sarko and Merkel have come to realise that the influence of unfettered financial fluttering in commodity markets by banks and other large financial instititutions has a negative and destabilising influence on the economy as a whole for everyone apart from those engaged in these pointless tradings. The stock market started out as a place where you could raise money to start a firm or expand your existing business. Now, a vast amount of its energy is invested in futures trading with computers moving billions hither and thither in seconds to make a quick buck. The huge profits generated don't come from thin air, they come from the pockets of people buying food, fuel and all the other commodities that are hoarded and released onto the market when prices rise.

Cameron, himself the son of a stockbroker, knows whose interests he represents and they aint ours. He knows who his friends are and who pays his party's bills.

So, resisting the financial regulation that the EU is proposing gets dressed-up as 'protecting jobs in Britain'. Dear old Maggie's lovely "Big Bang" - which set us off on the road to the financial shitstorm we are all currently in - can live on in the UK.

Have a read of this: http://m.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/dec/11/will-hutton-david-cameron-wrong-on-europe?cat=commentisfree&type=article

Gets to the heart of the matter nicely.

[Red-Robbo]

........and hang on, the public school educated EU loving Marxists that are the Labour Party High Kommand did nothing to stop aeroplane engine production from moving from Rolls Royce Filton to East Germany or to stop production of chocolate bars being moved from Keynesham to Poland.

Somerdale's fate was sealed in 2010, Gobbers, after Kraft gave false assurances to the ConDem government that its takeover would secure the plant's future.

[Mr Mosquito]

The Labour party has as much to do with Marxism as Clarkson has to with Swampy the road protester. Yer talking out yer hole, man.

The Labour Party High Kommand are public school educated Marxists. None of them have ever had to do a shit job for a shit wage and so they're totally unrepresentative of the people that actually work that they're supposed to represent via the 'Labour' Party. The Labour Party High Kommand are "Cultural Marxists" that follow the German Frankfurt School methods of political subversion.

[Red-Robbo]

The Labour Party High Kommand are public school educated Marxists. None of them have ever had to do a shit job for a shit wage and so they're totally unrepresentative of the people that actually work that they're supposed to represent via the 'Labour' Party. The Labour Party High Kommand are "Cultural Marxists" that follow the German Frankfurt School methods of political subversion.

You castigate (rightly) Labour for failing to stop the decline of British manufacturing, but then reckon they are Marxists. If they were Marxists they would nationalise Industry, not bring in God-awful PPF initiatives. I'd read up on political economy if I were you.

As for being public school educated, the Milibands went to a comp, as did the majority of the shadow cabinet (and as did Gordon Brown for that matter!)

Not sure the relavance of that, but that's the truth of the matter.