The Original OTIB Posted February 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 John Stuart Mill, eh... well no, the actions of others are not irrelevant. Actions reflect our society and society impacts upon us all. Unless we are a) hermits b) live on our own island. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 John Stuart Mill, eh... well no, the actions of others are not irrelevant. Actions reflect our society and society impacts upon us all. Unless we are a) hermits b) live on our own island. Lecture time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcusX Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 If this happened last week, last month or even last year this might be a story. The whole point / intent is to undermine England and stir it up. We are in a better world in relation to things race, gender, etc but a huge amount still needs to be done. That's the focus. Dragging up things from a different era has no particular relevance. Especially as it was known at the time and dealt with. Exactly this... why wasnt it dragged up when he took over the under 21s if they have a genuine problem with him being near the England set-up because of this comment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Exactly this... why wasnt it dragged up when he took over the under 21s if they have a genuine problem with him being near the England set-up because of this comment? BECAUSE OF THE WAY CAPPELLO LEFT IT WOULD NOT OF SURFACED OTHERWISE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaverface Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 They are role models of how to play football. Not general life is my point. I tend to look at people I respect as role models, not necessarily people in positions of power as role models. If I see an England football captain with a respectable point of view, then I may look at them as a role model - if they also morally meet my approval. What I'm trying to say is role models shouldn't be looked at as role models just because of their position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 I tend to look at people I respect as role models, not necessarily people in positions of power as role models. If I see an England football captain with a respectable point of view, then I may look at them as a role model - if they also morally meet my approval. What I'm trying to say is role models shouldn't be looked at as role models just because of their position. Respect is the key word, in all walks of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcusX Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 BECAUSE OF THE WAY CAPPELLO LEFT IT WOULD NOT OF SURFACED OTHERWISE. Why does that matter? If we're implying that rascists shouldnt be allowed near the england set-up then this should have come up when Pearce became part of the England set-up. Its old news dragged up just to cause a stir. The Sun is full of ******* to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Why does that matter? If we're implying that rascists shouldnt be allowed near the england set-up then this should have come up when Pearce became part of the England set-up. Its old news dragged up just to cause a stir. The Sun is full of ******* to be honest. If Terry is convicted of Racist words, can he be manager in eighteen years time?, Mate not backing anyone here just interested in peoples views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original OTIB Posted February 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 those of a religious bent have recourse to the sacrament of penance and through it redemption. It would be nice if society could allow for sorrow, reflection and change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 If you follow that thought through, then it's logical that Terry should not be playing for England until his court case is concluded. I fail to understand why the FA have come out and said he can't be captain, but he can still play for England. You could have 10 players being accused and still play for England using the FAs logic. They should have spoken to the manager, explained their stance on racism, and left it at that until the next squad is announced. At that time, they should have then announced that any player going through a judicial process with regards to racism will not be selected for England. It's not guilty until proven innocent, it's suspending the individual from that area of work until an investigation has been concluded. Why should a player miss out on what could be his last tournement - when he could be innocent and nothing as yet been proven against him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 If you follow that thought through, then it's logical that Terry should not be playing for England until his court case is concluded. I fail to understand why the FA have come out and said he can't be captain, but he can still play for England. You could have 10 players being accused and still play for England using the FAs logic. They should have spoken to the manager, explained their stance on racism, and left it at that until the next squad is announced. At that time, they should have then announced that any player going through a judicial process with regards to racism will not be selected for England. It's not guilty until proven innocent, it's suspending the individual from that area of work until an investigation has been concluded. I can't argue with any of that, I think your spot on. Personally I didn't know that JT would still be eligible to play for England. Seems strange as I thought he was stripped of the captaincy due to the rascism allegations and court proceedings against him so if they are going to go to that length then why would they want him representing his country. Regarding your last sentence, Im glad you wrote it because some people don't understand this logic. Just because someone is suspended from a job due to allegations made against them does not mean they are being presumed guilty, it may be the only way that a proper investigation can be carried out without further complications clouding the original issue (I'm not necessarily talking about the John Terry case) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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