Celtic / Rangers And A Possible Move South?

[Aizoon]

The Scottish FA would never allow it - it would undermine their claim for a separate international team.

Anyway, do we really want all the sectarian rowlocks around the "Old Firm" here in England?

[22A]

Roll on the independence vote in Scotland.

The SNP have already discussed leaving the EU when Scotland gains it's independence from Britain.

If that happens the old firm can't go running to the Euro Courts to enter out league as they won't even be British any more.

[willie pullar]

They bring nothing to the table, all about benefit to them.

With their current squads they would do well to compete in the Championship

Expect that they just want a wedge of the Sky TV cash

Celtic reached the last 16 of the champions league you moron. Do you think , say , hull city could make the last 16 with their current squad ?

Won't happen though.

[You Do The Dziekanowski]

Celtic reached the last 16 of the champions league you moron. Do you think , say , hull city could make the last 16 with their current squad ?

Won't happen though.

Well If they play 10 at the back they will have a chance just like Celtic did,, I've always thought that the SPL was L1 standard.

[chipdawg]

Roll on the independence vote in Scotland.

The SNP have already discussed leaving the EU when Scotland gains it's independence from Britain.

If that happens the old firm can't go running to the Euro Courts to enter out league as they won't even be British any more.

No, the SNP have tried to negotiate staying in the EU after independence and Jose Manuel Barroso as told them probably not, which has them absolutely papping themselves. Scotland won't vote for independence; I think they need 60% of the vote trigger a formal discussion with Westminster about the terms of a disolution of the UK and even if they won the referendum (which they won't- most recent poll has the NO vote at around 62%) they'd go down to London with ridiculous terms that the central government will never accept then go back to Edinburgh blaming the British government for it not happening. The SNP don't want independence, they want further devolution so they can control more budget without having to take responsibility for EU treaties, foreign policy, etc. It's all a pathetic dance that's being done by Salmond to try and push his 'Braveheart Credentials'. I just hope that the £25 million or so it's costing to put on this pointless charade is coming from Holyrood's budget and not from Westminster. Rant over

PS The SPL might be poor, but if Celtic & Rangers were in the Premier League they'd be very competitive; big crowds, extended fan base buying merchandise, topped up with Sky money. But it'll not happen as the only people who'd benefit would be Celtic and Rangers

[CardiffBlackLabel]

My two pence worth;

I can see in post-devolution Britain why people might say there is a 'moral' argument behind the proposal and they cite the Welsh clubs as an example, but really this isn't valid. 'The English Leagues' or 'EPL' etc are misnomers. They may be culturally refered to as such, but in practice they are the Football League and Premier League and always have been for clubs from England and Wales. It's as valid for Cardiff and Wrexham to play in those leagues as it is for Bristol City and Hull.

I suppose in another time and place a British league would work well, but as it is I'm opposed to Celtic and Rangers joining the league. The Scottish league for the size of the country is actually very strong with comparatively good crowds. They know what they need to do to make the league more competitive, but it means the big teams having a smaller share of the cake.

[Red-Robbo]

I've never bothered to research the reason Welsh clubs are allowed in English leagues, but would the sweaty's be able use the same argument (whatever it is).

Wales was annexed by England in the 13th century and further acts made this clear in Tudor times. Constitutionally it is in a very different position to Scotland - which passed an act of union, joined but not merged - in 1707.

This is why the "English" cricket team includes Welshmen and, until the last century, the established church in Wales was the Church of England.

[bucksred]

No a thousand times NO, should we let the Irish and the Jocks play in our league. The sheepshaggers were/are different as they have always played in the various leagues here.

Celtic, shouldnt be allowed under any circumstances the anti British stuff their shower of shit supporters come out with is good enough reason to keep them out (It will save the clubs here a fortune in police wages). Celtic playing in our leagues would ganatee a European ban for English clubs, because the brain dead brigade would love havin a go at the mickeys. They shouldnt even be in the Scottish league, as I have never seen any Scottish, let alone british flags in their crowds, apart from away fans

And those arrogant cnuts at Rangers should be kept out too, as the rest of the league is not there for THEIR benefit, cheating tax dodging bunch of cnuts. We have quite enough of them in the leagues already.

Both clubs have some of the least attractive sets of fans in the world anyways.

Stay where you obnoxious ***** belong..

[exiledinwatford]

No a thousand times NO, should we let the Irish and the Jocks play in our league. The sheepshaggers were/are different as they have always played in the various leagues here.

Celtic, shouldnt be allowed under any circumstances the anti British stuff their shower of shit supporters come out with is good enough reason to keep them out (It will save the clubs here a fortune in police wages). Celtic playing in our leagues would ganatee a European ban for English clubs, because the brain dead brigade would love havin a go at the mickeys. They shouldnt even be in the Scottish league, as I have never seen any Scottish, let alone british flags in their crowds, apart from away fans

And those arrogant cnuts at Rangers should be kept out too, as the rest of the league is not there for THEIR benefit, cheating tax dodging bunch of cnuts. We have quite enough of them in the leagues already.

Both clubs have some of the least attractive sets of fans in the world anyways.

Stay where you obnoxious ***** belong..

Good old Bucks - sat on the fence again!

More chance (and sense) in having a Third Division North and South back again. Imagine the nasty dark Northern places we wouldn't have to go to again! Errr Ooops that's if the worst happens of course!

[The Swan and Cemetery]

It's a myth (but adds to the general sob story) that AFC Wimbledon entered at the bottom of the pyramid. They entered at level 9 out of at least 24. Lower than Conference admittedly, but a long way above the bottom. Guessing there were some health and safety reasons (or something similar) that meant given their fan base, it was considered inappropriate for them to enter lower? Given the respective sizes of Celtic/Rangers vs. AFC Wimbledon, Conference sounds reasonable.

Think Sky might quite fancy the Old Firm in the Premier League. Celtic vs Man U, Spurs vs. Rangers etc perhaps have more big match appeal than Wigan vs. Stoke? Kerrching.

All that said, both Celtic and (in particular) Rangers are reaping the rewards of a deliberate strategy to utterly dominate their league. Any up and coming players from Hearts, Hibs, Dundee Utd et al always end up at Rangers/Celtic; draining the rest of Scottish football of talent (and competition for the Old Firm) just to warm the benches of Glasgow.

They'll stay where they are that should be fine for everyone - no reason why, given the fan base, the Old Firm shouldn't have the finances to support broader improvements in Scottish football and make the league more competitive, making them more competitive and better able to compete in Europe. Whether that will happen or not is another story.

[ballwinningcentrehalf]

A lot of decent points made in this thread. Of course such a move would be all about money.

I'd much prefer Celtic to remain in Scotland, in a competitive environment. But is it possible to sacrifice our surpremacy in the SPL to support the long, long, path which offers only a small chance that the other clubs would eventually rise together as a strong unit? The fans would never allow it for one, everyone is greedy ultimately (in the same way I'd assume the majority here wouldn't surrender our relative size and assets to support Rovers in creating a stronger 'Bristol' sporting region).

With a few years Sky money from the EPL, along with the crowds and fanbases, Celtic and Rangers COULD be big players. But it's no guarentee, look at other clubs like Newcastle for instance. Either way, the relative strengths of the current squads are totally irrelevant.

Bucksred is quick to highlight the anarchy that would follow Celtic, especially, into England, but in reality I've followed Celtic all over the country and largely it has been trouble free. Be it friendly matches at Norwich, Fulham, QPR, Leicester or Bolton, or competitive games at Blackburn, Arsenal, Liverpool or Manchester United. I'm not saying our fanbase is full of saints (it isn't), but I've always maintained I've heard more sectarianism, abuse and brain-dead behaviour from English fans towards our visiting supporters at these games. This was startling to me, especially when I started attending these matches as a youngster having grown up amongst English people telling me how horrendous Celtic fans were.

I dare say that the visit of Celtic could bring out the worst in host supporters, which is a different worry, and that supporters with such obvious anti-Celtic feeling would be the first to create tension at these matches. Then I suppose you'd get the total opposite, a giant UK/Monarchy love in with the visit of Rangers. They do say football evens itself up over a season

Ultimately, football is broken financially and structually throughout the world. The EPL is in a decent position at the top of the pile, but it is still a pile built on a house of cards. At some point there will be changes to suit the money men in the game unless there is a revolution somewhere along the line.

[22A]

If they did start playing in the English league system; aster 4 or 5 years with no Euro experience (and cash), would they belatedly realise they were better off dominating a weak League?

[22A]

David Cameron is reportedly lobbying the FA to let the two Glasgow clubs play south of the border

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/scottish-premier-league-cameron-pushing-celtic-rangers-move-084107040.html

The Sunday People claims that the British PM is taking a "massive interest" in the potential move south of the border for the Glasgow giants.

"Two major powerbrokers ­involved in the process confirmed that ­meetings have taken place recently with Cameron and other leading figures," the paper reports.

"And the Prime Minister’s team are planning to pull strings to make the move happen sooner rather than later."

A "prominent figure, who wishes to remain anonymous" claims that the two clubs have "never had a better chance" to earn a money-spinning move to England.

Cameron is apparently trying to persuade the FA and the Football League to allow Celtic and Rangers to jump straight into the Championship, thus avoiding the potential logistical nightmare of lower league sides seeing their often tiny grounds inundated with tens of thousands of Rangers and Celtic fans heading to away matches.

That would mean two extra clubs down out of the Champs or only 1 team promoted from League 1.