If You Owned A Football Club...

[Barrs Court Red]

I'd give myself the title of "El Presidente" and hang 5 dissenters at the next match as a warning to others.

[RedBrizzleRobin]

Change their home colours. Appeal to ti change the club name and plaster the sponser everywhere. Also where long trousers and the new home kit in front of the fans

 

 

Hmm sounds like someone over the river....

 

Excuse the poor grammar. Bloody phone

 

Sounds like justification... Ah ha, you've been had MR Tan!

 

 

Well. I'd take over rovers and do the exact same thing as Higgs - down to the conference! Also every two years put up pictures of a  'new' sadium for them to give them hope only to go 'nope, sorry, I lied, cant do it'. Actually **** it I'll leave Higgs to it, the guys doing a brilliant job running that club as is.

[Cowshed]

[NickJ]

Individuals shouldn't own what are community assets.

 

Nevertheless if I owned a football club I'd run it as though I were a temporary custodian not an "owner".

[spudski]

[Bar BS3]

Ignore Bar BS3 for some reason he has had his head shoved up his arse for the last week or so. A shame really as he is normally a level headed poster 

I was not being argumentative or anything. I was saying that the wishes of the OP, if he were in a position to run Bristol City, were not actually alot different to what SL is trying to do here now.

 

That is a good thing, imo.

 

Having someone with lots of money as owner of any club is one thing, but having a real fan of that club in that position is great!

 

Ok, for sure, things don't always go to plan, but there is no doubt that the best interests and intentions are there.

 

Personally, if I had massive wealth like SL, I would certainly invest and like a say in the running and decisions of the club, but more often than not these people are on a hiding to nothing and have to take alot of flack for essentially just giving their money to chase the dreams of many. There are not very many people who actually make profit out of running a football club.

 

For every SL there is a Vincent Tan or Peter Risdale and for that, we are very fortunate. Hopefully the good times that SL and us fans all crave are on the horizon!

[Bar BS3]

[UK0wnag3]

Damn football hipsters. They're the sort of blokes who rock up at 5 a-side and suggests playing two in the holding midfield role.

Route one for all!

[Cowshed]

Excellent post...agree 100%

Spain has so many more children to choose from of good quality.

They have more and better quality coach's.

One thing you'll here older seasoned English pros here moan about is being bored in training.

Football training is all about repetition...so that it becomes ingrained...muscle memory...so that when under the stress of a game you can produce without thinking...it becomes second nature.

In Spain...they train repetitively over and over again...and the players don't complain because they know it's needed to be good.

Older English footballers are miles behind in their thinking because of poor coaching in this country when they were growing up.

Things seem to be on the change here...but we are still miles behind the likes of Spain, Germany and Italy.

Football training is all about repetition...so that it becomes ingrained...muscle memory ... My Son is coached by a man who has also coached current Internationals. His words "this has to become like walking".

Foreign models of training use repetition in different forms in games for kids at three, four, five etc to produce the above natural response in both feet. English football players as children in general are behind their peers abroad due to not coming into contact with any coaching that moulds that same core skill from an early age.

The UK appears to have an attitude that foreign kids are naturally gifted and talented. It is ridiculous, core skill only comes from "this has to become like walking". Tens of thousands of hundreds of thousands of touches of the ball creates skill.

Work with kids earlier, get more coaches out there with single minded focus and the results will improve.

[spudski]

I was not being argumentative or anything. I was saying that the wishes of the OP, if he were in a position to run Bristol City, were not actually alot different to what SL is trying to do here now.

 

That is a good thing, imo.

 

Having someone with lots of money as owner of any club is one thing, but having a real fan of that club in that position is great!

 

Ok, for sure, things don't always go to plan, but there is no doubt that the best interests and intentions are there.

 

Personally, if I had massive wealth like SL, I would certainly invest and like a say in the running and decisions of the club, but more often than not these people are on a hiding to nothing and have to take alot of flack for essentially just giving their money to chase the dreams of many. There are not very many people who actually make profit out of running a football club.

 

For every SL there is a Vincent Tan or Peter Risdale and for that, we are very fortunate. Hopefully the good times that SL and us fans all crave are on the horizon!

I agree...the Club are definitely moving in the right direction.

 

The one thing, that I do approve of, that happens at many Clubs abroad...and what we don't do... is having a Director of football and board of selectors that are used to decide which players are signed...and it not just left down to the manager in charge at that moment in time.

 

So many times managers come and go...play different styles...change personel to suit their way...and it's a constant merry go round.

 

It's great that our Club now have set down paremeters that they wish any manager we have to work with.

 

But it would be even better, if we were to take it to another level and not just allow one man, the manager,and his side kick to dictate what players are signed.

 

Agree on a way to play...to become the 'Bristol City way'...stick to it...find players that will be able to play that way...then get a manager to carry it out.

 

Also in reply to Cowsheds post...totally agree mate...again.

 

I think I read somewhere...that in sport, you need to train 10,000 hours before you are seen as an 'expert'.

 

Repeat...repeat...repeat...so it becomes like walking...too true mate.

[Bedminster Born And Red]

[Bedminster Born And Red]

I agree...the Club are definitely moving in the right direction.

 

The one thing, that I do approve of, that happens at many Clubs abroad...and what we don't do... is having a Director of football and board of selectors that are used to decide which players are signed...and it not just left down to the manager in charge at that moment in time.

 

So many times managers come and go...play different styles...change personel to suit their way...and it's a constant merry go round.

 

It's great that our Club now have set down paremeters that they wish any manager we have to work with.

 

But it would be even better, if we were to take it to another level and not just allow one man, the manager,and his side kick to dictate what players are signed.

 

Agree on a way to play...to become the 'Bristol City way'...stick to it...find players that will be able to play that way...then get a manager to carry it out.

 

Also in reply to Cowsheds post...totally agree mate...again.

 

I think I read somewhere...that in sport, you need to train 10,000 hours before you are seen as an 'expert'.

 

Repeat...repeat...repeat...so it becomes like walking...too true mate.

It takes 700 hours of repetition before things start to become "ingrained" and 10,000 hours to perfect your game.................apparently!!

[spudski]

It takes 700 hours of repetition before things start to become "ingrained" and 10,000 hours to perfect your game.................apparently!!

Thanks for the clarification

 

what strikes me with those figures is how important it is to have good coach's at a young age.

 

If you can 'ingrain' good habits at a young age...then life becomes a lot simpler.

 

During the winter months I work as a Ski Instructor and Race Coach.

 

It's so much easier to teach people that are complete beginners...than those that have years of bad habits ingrained into them.

It can take ages, if ever, to rid them of those bad habits.

I found the same when I taught golf.

 

This is why having a good quality coach is paramount throughout your career, to keep checking for faults and bad habits creeping in.

 

Chopping and changing in football can cause so much confusion...that's why I'm a fan of the Spanish system...they stick to what they know works across the country. It helps a player so much...and is often a reason why one player will do well under one manager here...but not another.

[steveybadger]

Interesting stuff on here, a hearty back slap to everyone. A couple of thoughts.

 

1. Recruitment. In Simon Kuiper's book 'Why England lose' he talks abouts Lyon's recruitment set up. Basically this entails every transfer target having to be agreed by committee of 7 (i think), with the thinking being that if you get 7 knowledgeable people involved and they all agree then they are more likely to get the right guy, than a single manager. Seemed to work in the 2000's for them, anyway, although there are clearly pitfalls (especially with the club culture here).

 

2. Reducing admission prices. For my sins I also follow Gloucester RFC. I remember around 10-15 years ago that the prices at Kingsholm went up from one season to the next by an astronomical amount (50%?). Crowds went down the next season but revenue went up. Might be deemed short termism if you don't get new younger faces in (who can't afford it), but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that reducing admission costs and getting more people inmight not necessaily mean the same amount of revenue is generated.   

[spudski]

Interesting stuff on here, a hearty back slap to everyone. A couple of thoughts.

 

1. Recruitment. In Simon Kuiper's book 'Why England lose' he talks abouts Lyon's recruitment set up. Basically this entails every transfer target having to be agreed by committee of 7 (i think), with the thinking being that if you get 7 knowledgeable people involved and they all agree then they are more likely to get the right guy, than a single manager. Seemed to work in the 2000's for them, anyway, although there are clearly pitfalls (especially with the club culture here).

 

2. Reducing admission prices. For my sins I also follow Gloucester RFC. I remember around 10-15 years ago that the prices at Kingsholm went up from one season to the next by an astronomical amount (50%?). Crowds went down the next season but revenue went up. Might be deemed short termism if you don't get new younger faces in (who can't afford it), but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that reducing admission costs and getting more people inmight not necessaily mean the same amount of revenue is generated.   

Your point 1...is exactly how I would run a Club...or wish BCFC did.

 

Bring together a Technical football advisor and Coaches and sit and talk about transfer targets...for the good of the Club.

 

Don't let the manager do it on his own... as he will always be looking short term...or for at least the duration of his contract...he needs instant results to survive.

 

If you aggregate many different opinions and options...rather than just one...you are more than likely to arrive at the best option rather than just listening to one persons idea.

 

Most Clubs in this country allow their manager to decide everything until he is sacked. The next manager comes along, clears out his predecessors signings cheaply...and the merry go round continues...madness when you think about it.

 

You mention Lyon... they are revered throughout Europe for the way they control player signings.

 

It's mentioned that you never see an expensive signing rotting on their bench...as they don't have revolutions...they realise that the manager is only their temporary. When a manager leaves them, not much changes...as the team always plays the same brand of football. It creates stability...which we as a club have been lacking for years.

[Bar BS3]

I agree...the Club are definitely moving in the right direction.

 

The one thing, that I do approve of, that happens at many Clubs abroad...and what we don't do... is having a Director of football and board of selectors that are used to decide which players are signed...and it not just left down to the manager in charge at that moment in time.

 

So many times managers come and go...play different styles...change personel to suit their way...and it's a constant merry go round.

 

It's great that our Club now have set down paremeters that they wish any manager we have to work with.

 

But it would be even better, if we were to take it to another level and not just allow one man, the manager,and his side kick to dictate what players are signed.

 

Agree on a way to play...to become the 'Bristol City way'...stick to it...find players that will be able to play that way...then get a manager to carry it out.

 

Also in reply to Cowsheds post...totally agree mate...again.

 

I think I read somewhere...that in sport, you need to train 10,000 hours before you are seen as an 'expert'.

 

Repeat...repeat...repeat...so it becomes like walking...too true mate.

Funnily enough, I actually think that that type of position would have suited someone like Sean O'Driscol!

I'm not suggesting we go back now, but I agree that having someone in that position on a long term basis, with an eye on "The Club" rather than "The Team" which any potential manager would need to be comfortabel working with on certain aspects, such as player recruitment, playing style etc, would be a long term benfit. Someone who knows football inside out, but does not want or possibly even suit a managers position, but a more general over seeing of the clubs playing side.

 

As I say, ironically, two of the names that might spring straight to mind for such a position might have been SOD or maybe Steve Coppell!

 

There must be others out there that could be within our reach though. I'm not sure who, but someone with experience, knowledge, contacts and well respected within the game, but for whom a managerial position is not best suited. They would need to be innovative and pro youth (no Coppell jokes, please!)

 

Would be interesting to see what suggestions might come up...?

[spudski]

Funnily enough, I actually think that that type of position would have suited someone like Sean O'Driscol!

I'm not suggesting we go back now, but I agree that having someone in that position on a long term basis, with an eye on "The Club" rather than "The Team" which any potential manager would need to be comfortabel working with on certain aspects, such as player recruitment, playing style etc, would be a long term benfit. Someone who knows football inside out, but does not want or possibly even suit a managers position, but a more general over seeing of the clubs playing side.

 

As I say, ironically, two of the names that might spring straight to mind for such a position might have been SOD or maybe Steve Coppell!

 

There must be others out there that could be within our reach though. I'm not sure who, but someone with experience, knowledge, contacts and well respected within the game, but for whom a managerial position is not best suited. They would need to be innovative and pro youth (no Coppell jokes, please!)

 

Would be interesting to see what suggestions might come up...?

I couldn't agree more...SoD, Coppell and good ol Benny Lennartsson would be perfect for that type of position.

 

It's only in this Country where say certain older managers may not be comfortable with it...but it's perfectly normal throughout the rest of the world...we need to catch up as a Country.

 

If we could afford him and we could sell the idea to him, the Frank Arnesen would be awesome...and he is currently available

[glynriley]

Funnily enough, I actually think that that type of position would have suited someone like Sean O'Driscol!

I'm not suggesting we go back now, but I agree that having someone in that position on a long term basis, with an eye on "The Club" rather than "The Team" which any potential manager would need to be comfortabel working with on certain aspects, such as player recruitment, playing style etc, would be a long term benfit. Someone who knows football inside out, but does not want or possibly even suit a managers position, but a more general over seeing of the clubs playing side.

 

As I say, ironically, two of the names that might spring straight to mind for such a position might have been SOD or maybe Steve Coppell!

 

There must be others out there that could be within our reach though. I'm not sure who, but someone with experience, knowledge, contacts and well respected within the game, but for whom a managerial position is not best suited. They would need to be innovative and pro youth (no Coppell jokes, please!)

 

Would be interesting to see what suggestions might come up...?

 

That's like the Tottenham model, isn't it?

[Bar BS3]

That's like the Tottenham model, isn't it?

I have no idea mate, but yes, it's not a totally unique concept.

 

AVB would actually be well suited to such a role, but obviously out of our reach.

[Cowshed]

[spudski]

[Bedminster Born And Red]

[spudski]

It would have to be a nationally led directive under FA control. The problem with schools is they want to leave it to the junior clubs. Soccer schools like BSS that you have mentioned a few times and I know are very good do a great job but you do have to pay. But the biggest problem in Youth football is JUNIOR CLUBS and the COACHES/PARENTS of the kids playing for them.

 

I'll share a little story with you to represent the hurdles you face at that level. A goalkeeper in this area was spotted by an Academy to play in their Under 8 Prep Squad but was still allowed to play for his club until he reached Under 9. He was being taught at his Academy to play short - roll and pass the ball out to defenders rather than banging it long (effectively a 50/50 ball most of the time). The kid replicated what he was being taught at his club and as a consequence the team conceded one or two goals to start off with and whilst the Coach did not have a problem with that because he understood what was happening and how it would benefit the outfield players in the long run he ended up abandoning the idea and telling the young lad to bang the ball long rather than play short. And I'll tell you why - it was because of the constant grief he got from several PARENTS over a period of weeks moaning that their son was being put under unfair pressure by having the ball played out to them and being responsible for conceding a goal (even though the Coach didn't moan once when it happened and told the boys that was how he wanted them to play).

 

Know it all parents are the scourge of Youth football development in this country. Go to a game and listen to some of the crap that gets spouted "get rid", "get amongst them", "kick him", "second balls lads" "knock it down the channel" etc. Then watch and listen to them getting in the Coaches ear before, during and after the game. Your ideas are very good but how do you make these parents shut up and accept what you are trying to do? In other words, stand over there and if you can't encourage then button it!! At the highest level (Academy) it's easy because the club will say "shut your mouth or bugger off and take your son with you" but at the lower levels it is really difficult. Presumably Spanish parents prefer to leave it to the experts!!

That last paragraph reminded me of a few shouts I've heard down the Gate...it runs deep I'm afraid...

[Cowshed]

It would have to be a nationally led directive under FA control. The problem with schools is they want to leave it to the junior clubs. Soccer schools like BSS that you have mentioned a few times and I know are very good do a great job but you do have to pay. But the biggest problem in Youth football is JUNIOR CLUBS and the COACHES/PARENTS of the kids playing for them.

I'll share a little story with you to represent the hurdles you face at that level. A goalkeeper in this area was spotted by an Academy to play in their Under 8 Prep Squad but was still allowed to play for his club until he reached Under 9. He was being taught at his Academy to play short - roll and pass the ball out to defenders rather than banging it long (effectively a 50/50 ball most of the time). The kid replicated what he was being taught at his club and as a consequence the team conceded one or two goals to start off with and whilst the Coach did not have a problem with that because he understood what was happening and how it would benefit the outfield players in the long run he ended up abandoning the idea and telling the young lad to bang the ball long rather than play short. And I'll tell you why - it was because of the constant grief he got from several PARENTS over a period of weeks moaning that their son was being put under unfair pressure by having the ball played out to them and being responsible for conceding a goal (even though the Coach didn't moan once when it happened and told the boys that was how he wanted them to play).

Know it all parents are the scourge of Youth football development in this country. Go to a game and listen to some of the crap that gets spouted "get rid", "get amongst them", "kick him", "second balls lads" "knock it down the channel" etc. Then watch and listen to them getting in the Coaches ear before, during and after the game. Your ideas are very good but how do you make these parents shut up and accept what you are trying to do? In other words, stand over there and if you can't encourage then button it!! At the highest level (Academy) it's easy because the club will say "shut your mouth or bugger off and take your son with you" but at the lower levels it is really difficult. Presumably Spanish parents prefer to leave it to the experts!!

And I refer to pesky Johnny Foreigner again. The Spanish do have nationally led directives under their FA's control, directives that are monitored by the FA.

The FA here have introduced a ruling at mini level where the referee instructs one side to withdraw to the half way line at goal kicks to encourage play through the thirds.

Enlightened clubs have details for parents on "playing through the thirds", club principles and parent conduct.

Non-competitive football and small sided games should be about learn today, not win today learn tomorrow and that is back to the FA, as that is its intent, that came from the FA's own review. Anybody can get a level one and two coaching badge and coach whatever rubbish they feel is playing the right way. Back to the FA again here to look at what is successful abroad and why England fails.

BSS ideas, or similar because it does not suit all kids can become national for infants to nine year olds who like football. Back to the FA again.

A thing I would like to see is national skills awards for children. Aims for young kids to work towards where learning core skills are rewarded with certificates. Know it all parents kids can also work with them to learn to pass that ball with both feet, perform step overs, complete various turns just like their clubs should.

[cheese]

As someone heavily involved in trying to create a pheonix club from the ashes of one which went into liquidation last October, I'd say that no one individual should be able to "own" a football club.  Club's are more than just a business - they are community assets and should be treated as such.  Our own model, which follows the model supported by Supporters Direct and implemented by clubs such as Portsmouth, Telford, Chester City, Barcelona to name but a few, is one member one vote - the membership votes on the make up of the board and the board are duty bound to run the club within strict financial constraints and the directors remain unpaid.  

 

No-one can own more than 1 share and all profits are reinvested into the club.  One day I would hope all clubs would be run along these lines - even my beloved BCFC (and that's not a criticism of SL) - but I suspect it will never happen without legislation.

[Pickled Onion]

If I had a football club I would put Never The Bridesmaid in charge of entertainment, Aizoon as head of catering and BristolRob on foodvouchers.  I would appoint Harry as Chairman as he talks a lot of sense and RedRobbo could be Financial Director.  I would run the team, with entire OTIB forum as assistant managers.

 

Job done and what could possibly go wrong? 

[Red-Robbo]

I'd start by removing all the salesman/business language used by the club to liaise with the fans. Tell it like it is.

Get some proper ale in the stadium bars.

Sit with the fans on a Saturday afternoon and invite a few of them to join me during the week to see how it works.

And, most importantly, sort out bloody disabled access and facilities throughout the stadium. I've never been into a publicly accessible building that ever gets it right.

What sensible points!

[Red-Robbo]

If I had a football club I would put Never The Bridesmaid in charge of entertainment, Aizoon as head of catering and BristolRob on foodvouchers.  I would appoint Harry as Chairman as he talks a lot of sense and RedRobbo could be Financial Director.  I would run the team, with entire OTIB forum as assistant managers.

 

Job done and what could possibly go wrong? 

 

 

     

 

The team could run out to The Lunatics Have Taken Over The Asylum!

[Aizoon]

If I had a football club I would put Never The Bridesmaid in charge of entertainment, Aizoon as head of catering and BristolRob on foodvouchers.  I would appoint Harry as Chairman as he talks a lot of sense and RedRobbo could be Financial Director.  I would run the team, with entire OTIB forum as assistant managers.

 

Job done and what could possibly go wrong? 

 

Can Horace do Pest Control?

[Red-Robbo]

Can Horace do Pest Control?

 

 

Jody Morris left ages ago, Aiz......