AshtonGreat Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I was reading The Sun last night (I know, I know) and there was a double-page spread in it where chief sports writer Shaun Custis judged which England players were the future of the team and which ones should be dumped. And right in the centre was a big picture of Wayne Rooney, alongside words to the effect of 'The team should be built around Rooney, our only world-class player'. How bloody depressing. That's THREE World Cups where Rooney has under-achieved (one cross and one tap-in doesn't count) and STILL the so-called experts are labelling him as some kind of messiah. STILL! If you don't perform in three World Cups, you are not world-class. Simple as. And scoring a bunch of goals against the likes of Lichtenstein in the qualifiers doesn't count either. All I can say is that Rooney must have a VERY good marketing team behind him, because he is in the top three highest- paid players in the world, he consistently shares TV adverts/videogame covers/column inches with Messi and Ronaldo (whose boots he isn't fit to tie up), and the British press continue to think the sun shines out of his behind. It's like the Beckham disease all over again - another player whose hype machine far, far outweighed his talent (although he was more effective than Rooney will ever be). The trouble is, England managers (including the gormless Hodgson) believe this kind of hype. Which is why people like Shaun Custis are very dangerous to the future of our international team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob k Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I don't know anybody that thinks Rooney is more than just a very good player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted June 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I wouldn't even go that far really. I'd say a good club footballer, but certainly not world class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I wouldn't even go that far really. I'd say a good club footballer, but certainly not world class. I would say less. He is in and has been in the best club side in England for near on 10 years' a team set up to created shit loads of chances. And apart from 2 seasons, he has struggled to muster 13 league goals a season. Average average average. You really look at the stats and remove the goals in cups and lowly European opposition and it doesn't leave you with much. There have been and still are better English strikers out there. The bloke would be hard pressed to trap a bag of cement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted June 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 TRL, you speak my language. Amen brother! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One BCFC Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I wouldn't even go that far really. I'd say a good club footballer, but certainly not world class. And that is the difference between England and Germany. Playing well against Norwich, Stoke and West Brom is ok but to perform well at a World Cup you have to be consistently world class against Champions League quality players, which England dont have. Our League clubs like Chelsea do well in Europe because they have foreign imports who are World class, they wouldnt do well otherwise. Luke Shaw 30Million? What a joke, unbelievable, he couldnt even make a below average England side and dont comment on his age because if you are good enogh you are old enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted June 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob k Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 I would say less. He is in and has been in the best club side in England for near on 10 years' a team set up to created shit loads of chances. And apart from 2 seasons, he has struggled to muster 13 league goals a season. Average average average. You really look at the stats and remove the goals in cups and lowly European opposition and it doesn't leave you with much. There have been and still are better English strikers out there. The bloke would be hard pressed to trap a bag of cement. He still will end up as Man U and England's top scorer though so I think your being slightly unfair as that is some achievement whether you like him or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoldenBall Posted June 27, 2014 Report Share Posted June 27, 2014 Paul Scholes was right, he peaked around 2-3 years ago. He's won everything domestically that's there to be won, clearly his desire is less, and can you blame him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe jordans teeth Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Not only that they signed herrera for 29 million who hasnt played champions league as well,fergie played a blinder letting pogba go for nothing,if they would of paid what he and his agent wanted he would still be there and saved man u a whole lot of cash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe jordans teeth Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Paul scholes turnt his back on his country tho cuz he was being played out of position bless his cotton socks,cant see rooney doing that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Paul Scholes was right, he peaked around 2-3 years ago. He's won everything domestically that's there to be won, clearly his desire is less, and can you blame him? Yeah, when he's on 300 grand a week I can blame him. I would also argue that that 'peak' was about as lofty as Brent Knoll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One BCFC Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Paul Scholes was right, he peaked around 2-3 years ago. He's won everything domestically that's there to be won, clearly his desire is less, and can you blame him? Have to say a lot of what Paul Scholes says makes sense! Saw he reckons England going the same way as all the other Home Nations have gone, I tend to agree. Very intelligent footballer and reads the game excellently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North London Red Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Cristiano Ronaldo has also played in three world cups and he hasn't really delivered either - does this mean he isn't world class? I wouldn't put Rooney in Ronaldo's class but to conveniently overlook Rooney's performances in Euro 2004 (he was arguably the best player in that tournament), the fact he was nowhere near 100 per cent fit in either the 2006 or 2010 world cups, or the fact he's played in three Champions League finals (scoring against Barcelona in one) is a little unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North London Red Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Also, why do goals in cup competitions not count? Why do goals against European opposition not count? Why does his goal against Uruguay not count? Why does his assist against Italy not count? (All arguments that have been put forward above) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Cristiano Ronaldo has also played in three world cups and he hasn't really delivered either - does this mean he isn't world class? I wouldn't put Rooney in Ronaldo's class but to conveniently overlook Rooney's performances in Euro 2004 (he was arguably the best player in that tournament), the fact he was nowhere near 100 per cent fit in either the 2006 or 2010 world cups, or the fact he's played in three Champions League finals (scoring against Barcelona in one) is a little unfair. Quite. People seem to line up to take a pop at Rooney. I would still put him as the first name on the England team sheet so I agree with the Sun sports writer that in that case the team should then be built around him. And that does not mean playing him as left wing back. That said we were never going to get anywhere this tournament and most people knew this, there was a distinct lack of anticipation and excitement for this WC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 He's our best forward but he isn't world class. Our problems at international level run so much deeper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdliketoRogerMoore Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Cristiano Ronaldo has also played in three world cups and he hasn't really delivered either - does this mean he isn't world class?I wouldn't put Rooney in Ronaldo's class but to conveniently overlook Rooney's performances in Euro 2004 (he was arguably the best player in that tournament), the fact he was nowhere near 100 per cent fit in either the 2006 or 2010 world cups, or the fact he's played in three Champions League finals (scoring against Barcelona in one) is a little unfair.someone put a video on here the other day about to obeys involvement in that tournament his first touch was shocking as was his passing but he run after everything buldozing players out the way so if that makes the him player of the tournament maybe next time we should take a buffalo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corleone Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Our best player by a considerable distance. Personally I would say he is world class at club level,,,,at international level he is playing with shitte and is brought down to their level IMO, a common occurance across the football pyramids. Some football fans are both thick as shit and have a vendetta against players they don't like....OP being the perfect example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfred Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Wayne Rooney is an enigma. He has definitely got world class talent in him, but something seems to be holding him back from achieving that status. Whether it is years of not being played in his best position by Utd that has stripped him of a bit if verve, or whether the pressure to do well gets to him, but either way he showed in that five minutes after we equalised against Uruguay that he can be top drawer and very influential if the circumstances are right. Also none of us can forget that there was a massive campaign to get Rooney to sort his temperament out after he got sent off stamping on Ronaldo in 2006. Players and characters such as Rooney thrive on that edgy temperament that sparks creativity and brilliance, and yet here we are now saying that he is lost it and doesn't care. I think the two situations go hand in hand and maybe this is the answer as to why he hasn't been the same since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRISTOL86 Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Some football fans are both thick as shit and have a vendetta against players they don't like.... I agree with you on Rooney but that sentence....coming from you.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRISTOL86 Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Rooney...it's a difficult one. Clearly he's an above average football player.....the haters say "take out his goals against XYZ...." well OK if you're going to start manipulating stats to suit your argument, you have to apply the same logic to all players. Messi would have a lot less league goals if you took out your Osasuna's and your Almeria's. But back on track..... He's undoubtedly underachieved at World Cups, but the problems on the international front - as someone else alluded to - run a lot deeper than Wayne Rooney. World Class is a term that gets bandied about too much these days - for me a player who is World Class is one who would get into a "World XI" - and it's clear that Rooney doesn't fit that criteria. However he is the first name on the team sheet for a succession of managers for a reason. He's our best player. Take him out of the World Cup and the stats don't lie - zero goals for England. We scored two and he created one and scored the other. Yes OK things may have been different but does anyone believe Wayne Rooney actually hindered us at the World Cup? I don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdliketoRogerMoore Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Rooney...it's a difficult one. Clearly he's an above average football player.....the haters say "take out his goals against XYZ...." well OK if you're going to start manipulating stats to suit your argument, you have to apply the same logic to all players. Messi would have a lot less league goals if you took out your Osasuna's and your Almeria's. But back on track..... He's undoubtedly underachieved at World Cups, but the problems on the international front - as someone else alluded to - run a lot deeper than Wayne Rooney. World Class is a term that gets bandied about too much these days - for me a player who is World Class is one who would get into a "World XI" - and it's clear that Rooney doesn't fit that criteria. However he is the first name on the team sheet for a succession of managers for a reason. He's our best player. Take him out of the World Cup and the stats don't lie - zero goals for England. We scored two and he created one and scored the other. Yes OK things may have been different but does anyone believe Wayne Rooney actually hindered us at the World Cup? I don't.no he is a best player but has been hyped up way to much (not his fault) blame the media and society for this obsession for building up any teenager that has half a good season! Plus the fact we don't produce enough for the press not to just focus on one individual every few years ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Our best player by a considerable distance. Personally I would say he is world class at club level,,,,at international level he is playing with shitte and is brought down to their level IMO, a common occurance across the football pyramids. Some football fans are both thick as shit and have a vendetta against players they don't like....OP being the perfect example. Who you calling thick as shit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRISTOL86 Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Who you calling thick as shit? Everyone but him normally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Hilarious how someone can call a critic of a man who hasn't delivered in three World Cups 'thick as shit'. Some people have been irreparably swayed by the Premier League hype machine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corleone Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Hilarious how someone can call a critic of a man who hasn't delivered in three World Cups 'thick as shit'. Some people have been irreparably swayed by the Premier League hype machine Name an England player who has delivered in any of the last 4 world cups? Guarantee you EVERY other international side in this World Cup would love to have Rooney in their squad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Name an England player who has delivered in any of the last 4 world cups? Guarantee you EVERY other international side in this World Cup would love to have Rooney in their squad That means nothing though - none of the England players are world class, it's just that Rooney gets hyped to high heaven and gets paid 300k a week. Rooney would not make the first XI of any of the top sides in the WC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corleone Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 That means nothing though - none of the England players are world class, it's just that Rooney gets hyped to high heaven and gets paid 300k a week. Rooney would not make the first XI of any of the top sides in the WC. Ah ok so the 300k per week is the reason you have a vendetta....that's interesting explains why your so bitter. As for not getting into first xi's......your right, Fred is a class above isn't he. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob k Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 That means nothing though - none of the England players are world class, it's just that Rooney gets hyped to high heaven and gets paid 300k a week. Rooney would not make the first XI of any of the top sides in the WC. Of course it means something, Rooney can't carry a whole team, who else has delivered in last 3 world cups? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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