Reality - Three Out Of Six

[cottsciderarmy]

They say the table never lies halfway through the season and whilst it looked a possible dog fight of 9 a month ago, it's shaping up to be a 6 horse race.

 

Blackburn (dame in hand) and Preston have got themselves 6pts away from the squeaky bum area and neither team ship many goals which has helped them in odd 1 goal wins and when they do get beat it's not by many. Both are doing enough to suggest they can steer clear of where the pressure mounts up. Fulham's win over Rotherham yesterday suggested they have the class when needed and also are now 5pts clear of the ruck.

Consistency is the problem for those in the bottom five, they all seem to be able to win in their turn but a trait of very heavy defeats is doing goal differences no good, as the 1-0 merchants start to draw distance between themselves and the struggling pack of five.

Of the five Bolton lay bottom of the pile on 17pts but a win at home to Blackburn in a north west derby on Monday will give the club confidence. No doubt the outcome of their season will be decided on an administration hearing where they could be docked 12 points and also what players depart in January. If they get through January without going into administration and selling their best assets (unlikely), the 5pts they are behind could well be made up as they are another team who don't concede many and have a better goal difference than ourselves and Charlton. However it is likely the points deduction will come into force and should that happen they will easily be the banker team to go down.

Charlton are probably the weakest team I've seen this season and again a loss to Wolves on Saturday has their fans questioning what fight they have left. They are dropping points left right and centre, and their comeback 1-1 draw against ourselves only papered over massive cracks. The fans want the board out and the players seem to have already thrown in the towel. They seem incapable of winning at present and even their fans are struggling to see where the goals are coming from. Things look bleak, but as with any London based club with solid support they have the finances to bring in a few quality players next month which could help them out.

Despite 1pt ahead of the drop, MK Dons I personally feel have enough about them to stay up. They score goals and grind out the odd results, but they are inconsistent which is why they are where they are.

Rotherham are poor and they let in goals, the worry is they thrashed us ! Yesterday against Fulham they gave up easy and with many of their players aging pro's, it might be questioned how many will fancy a dogfight scrap.

Huddersfield are currently 4pts adrift but they also are a team who know how to close out games and not lose by many, something which helps them with a negative goal difference of 8. Their season will hinge in the next few weeks on whether star midfielder Huws and their star striker Wells stick around. To lose them could have devastating effects, but with them in their armour they will probably survive the drop for another season.

Then their is ourselves, we are definitely struggling and the goal difference is worrying but there is that feeling that we can at times play good football which can see us get results against some of the leagues better teams. Having looked more than capable on Sky every time this season, the inability to kill a game is costing us. Monday was disgraceful and the manager saying that we could have won with a couple of Burnley's players is purely just naive. Poor in front of goal, we have a disjointed defence and the fans are finally turning against the manager. It's now time for those who run the club to show some backbone and realise the team isn't consistently strong enough without 3/4 quality additions. Given we have used up most of our loan options (we cant loan anyone over 24 unless Baker or Bennett sign permanently) and 3 months is the longest we can sign anyone for, so any loans are likely to be made towards the end of the window. WE can also loan a maximum of two players. Therefore any signings will have to be permanent and it worries me who will want to come here and jump aboard a sinking ship. In the summer signing a Bradley Dack or Tom Bradshaw would have been appealing to both players but now with their own clubs looking like they will be playing Championship football next season and ourselves possibly league One football, I fear we are not attractive at all for them and we could actually be seen as a step backwards.

Steve Cotterill has to get it right, but so do the board, if they back him and it doesn't work, we go down with a side and a manager that has undone a lot of the previous seasons good strides, but sacking Cotts in Feb or March would be pointless, as no manager will be able to come in and create their own team. So if the board have the confidence in Steve we have to stick with him until the season's out. Otherwise the board need to act now, whether it be before the Reading game or after it. If they fear we are going down and he may not attract the players needed, then a new manager whether it be an interim boss or someone permanent will need to be in charge to make their signings in January.

Most managers when they go to a club have a couple of faces they like to take with them, much like Cotts did with Elliott, and someone like Warnock would probably get a couple of his older experienced heads in cheaply but on good wages until the end of the year to get us out the shit. My worry is, Cotts doesn't have any of these to turn to.

Saturday won't see us relegated but a defeat to Reading does look likely. They score goals and defend well, the opposite to ourselves and should be capable of seeing us off. Luckily for us, Bolton play Huddersfield and in many ways a Bolton win may be the best result for us, but a draw does look likely. Charlton who play Forest looks a poor match and this would not surprise me if ended 0-0, whilst Preston could do us a favour by beating Rotherham. Leeds should be too good for MK Dons whilst Fulham vs Sheffield Wednesday could see Fulham pull away. The five at the bottom all look unlikely to improve their situations, so defeat for us won't see us in a worse position, but much like when we fluffed against Charlton, it's one of those days where a win could have a huge effect on our position.

For me Bolton and Charlton look the likely ones to go down, but the battle between 4, doesn't fill me with confidence. I think unless they lose their assets Huddersfield will be okay, so then it's a straight scrap between ourselves and Rotherham and MK Dons and with our goal difference 8 or 9 worse than them, we need to stop getting hammered by the bigger teams away. 

I don't see MK Dons or Rotherham losing by many if they lose on Saturday, but ourselves it could easily be 2 or 3, and that there lays another worry for me, as although our points tally may not get worse, the goal difference is mounting up.

For the first time this season I'm concerned. Before I thought we would beat the drop, but I'm not convinced we are better than those around us and our inability to score and get results when it matters is very worrying.

Changing the manager isn't guaranteed to bring about a change in fortune, but if there is a solid candidate like Warnock waiting in the wings then it would be foolish of the board not to act now before it's too late. The best way to solve a problem is being proactive and not reactive, unfortunately Bristol City never do this. January is a big month and it starts on Saturday. SL, JL  & KD need to address Cotts on Friday and make it crystal clear another heavy defeat on Saturday and he has to go. Sadly we are too nice and we won't do this. The board will keep burying their heads and then react in February when all the money is spent, and we are still in the relegation zone and bring in someone with an impossible task. We do nee change, whether it's a change of system, manager or a change in our recruitment policy , but one thing is certain, we're in a relegation fight that unless some people stand up and make a stand, will see us playing in a 27K stadium in League One next season.

If things don't change I fear we're going down with Bolton and Charlton.

[daored]

2 hours ago, cottsciderarmy said:

They say the table never lies halfway through the season and whilst it looked a possible dog fight of 9 a month ago, it's shaping up to be a 6 horse race.

 

Blackburn (dame in hand) and Preston have got themselves 6pts away from the squeaky bum area and neither team ship many goals which has helped them in odd 1 goal wins and when they do get beat it's not by many. Both are doing enough to suggest they can steer clear of where the pressure mounts up. Fulham's win over Rotherham yesterday suggested they have the class when needed and also are now 5pts clear of the ruck.

Consistency is the problem for those in the bottom five, they all seem to be able to win in their turn but a trait of very heavy defeats is doing goal differences no good, as the 1-0 merchants start to draw distance between themselves and the struggling pack of five.

Of the five Bolton lay bottom of the pile on 17pts but a win at home to Blackburn in a north west derby on Monday will give the club confidence. No doubt the outcome of their season will be decided on an administration hearing where they could be docked 12 points and also what players depart in January. If they get through January without going into administration and selling their best assets (unlikely), the 5pts they are behind could well be made up as they are another team who don't concede many and have a better goal difference than ourselves and Charlton. However it is likely the points deduction will come into force and should that happen they will easily be the banker team to go down.

Charlton are probably the weakest team I've seen this season and again a loss to Wolves on Saturday has their fans questioning what fight they have left. They are dropping points left right and centre, and their comeback 1-1 draw against ourselves only papered over massive cracks. The fans want the board out and the players seem to have already thrown in the towel. They seem incapable of winning at present and even their fans are struggling to see where the goals are coming from. Things look bleak, but as with any London based club with solid support they have the finances to bring in a few quality players next month which could help them out.

Despite 1pt ahead of the drop, MK Dons I personally feel have enough about them to stay up. They score goals and grind out the odd results, but they are inconsistent which is why they are where they are.

Rotherham are poor and they let in goals, the worry is they thrashed us ! Yesterday against Fulham they gave up easy and with many of their players aging pro's, it might be questioned how many will fancy a dogfight scrap.

Huddersfield are currently 4pts adrift but they also are a team who know how to close out games and not lose by many, something which helps them with a negative goal difference of 8. Their season will hinge in the next few weeks on whether star midfielder Huws and their star striker Wells stick around. To lose them could have devastating effects, but with them in their armour they will probably survive the drop for another season.

Then their is ourselves, we are definitely struggling and the goal difference is worrying but there is that feeling that we can at times play good football which can see us get results against some of the leagues better teams. Having looked more than capable on Sky every time this season, the inability to kill a game is costing us. Monday was disgraceful and the manager saying that we could have won with a couple of Burnley's players is purely just naive. Poor in front of goal, we have a disjointed defence and the fans are finally turning against the manager. It's now time for those who run the club to show some backbone and realise the team isn't consistently strong enough without 3/4 quality additions. Given we have used up most of our loan options (we cant loan anyone over 24 unless Baker or Bennett sign permanently) and 3 months is the longest we can sign anyone for, so any loans are likely to be made towards the end of the window. WE can also loan a maximum of two players. Therefore any signings will have to be permanent and it worries me who will want to come here and jump aboard a sinking ship. In the summer signing a Bradley Dack or Tom Bradshaw would have been appealing to both players but now with their own clubs looking like they will be playing Championship football next season and ourselves possibly league One football, I fear we are not attractive at all for them and we could actually be seen as a step backwards.

Steve Cotterill has to get it right, but so do the board, if they back him and it doesn't work, we go down with a side and a manager that has undone a lot of the previous seasons good strides, but sacking Cotts in Feb or March would be pointless, as no manager will be able to come in and create their own team. So if the board have the confidence in Steve we have to stick with him until the season's out. Otherwise the board need to act now, whether it be before the Reading game or after it. If they fear we are going down and he may not attract the players needed, then a new manager whether it be an interim boss or someone permanent will need to be in charge to make their signings in January.

Most managers when they go to a club have a couple of faces they like to take with them, much like Cotts did with Elliott, and someone like Warnock would probably get a couple of his older experienced heads in cheaply but on good wages until the end of the year to get us out the shit. My worry is, Cotts doesn't have any of these to turn to.

Saturday won't see us relegated but a defeat to Reading does look likely. They score goals and defend well, the opposite to ourselves and should be capable of seeing us off. Luckily for us, Bolton play Huddersfield and in many ways a Bolton win may be the best result for us, but a draw does look likely. Charlton who play Forest looks a poor match and this would not surprise me if ended 0-0, whilst Preston could do us a favour by beating Rotherham. Leeds should be too good for MK Dons whilst Fulham vs Sheffield Wednesday could see Fulham pull away. The five at the bottom all look unlikely to improve their situations, so defeat for us won't see us in a worse position, but much like when we fluffed against Charlton, it's one of those days where a win could have a huge effect on our position.

For me Bolton and Charlton look the likely ones to go down, but the battle between 4, doesn't fill me with confidence. I think unless they lose their assets Huddersfield will be okay, so then it's a straight scrap between ourselves and Rotherham and MK Dons and with our goal difference 8 or 9 worse than them, we need to stop getting hammered by the bigger teams away. 

I don't see MK Dons or Rotherham losing by many if they lose on Saturday, but ourselves it could easily be 2 or 3, and that there lays another worry for me, as although our points tally may not get worse, the goal difference is mounting up.

For the first time this season I'm concerned. Before I thought we would beat the drop, but I'm not convinced we are better than those around us and our inability to score and get results when it matters is very worrying.

Changing the manager isn't guaranteed to bring about a change in fortune, but if there is a solid candidate like Warnock waiting in the wings then it would be foolish of the board not to act now before it's too late. The best way to solve a problem is being proactive and not reactive, unfortunately Bristol City never do this. January is a big month and it starts on Saturday. SL, JL  & KD need to address Cotts on Friday and make it crystal clear another heavy defeat on Saturday and he has to go. Sadly we are too nice and we won't do this. The board will keep burying their heads and then react in February when all the money is spent, and we are still in the relegation zone and bring in someone with an impossible task. We do nee change, whether it's a change of system, manager or a change in our recruitment policy , but one thing is certain, we're in a relegation fight that unless some people stand up and make a stand, will see us playing in a 27K stadium in League One next season.

If things don't change I fear we're going down with Bolton and Charlton.

Really good article and agree with your points. It is starting to look like the bottom six will soon be cut adrift and agree we're looking one of the weakest in that group. Must admit, whilst SC's comments following the Derby game were honest , what impact that has had on the players and whether they now question their own ability to play at this level.

I've mentioned on another post, that as critical as January is, we may need to be creative with offers we make to players and by that I mean potentially offer an incentive based deal to players like Sidwell (been mentioned a few times) who may be available on a free transfer moderate wages but with a bonus if the club stays up. I am not convinced that Baker or Bennett would accept contracts at this stage with our position in the league , which will make our recruitment in January that bit harder.

[ChippenhamRed]

It's too early to limit the relegation fight to six teams in my opinion. Blackburn, Preston and Fulham are all within three points of Huddersfield with 66 points left to play for.

[archie andrews]

4 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said:

It's too early to limit the relegation fight to six teams in my opinion. Blackburn, Preston and Fulham are all within three points of Huddersfield with 66 points left to play for.

do me a favour.....those 3 safe as houses

[ChippenhamRed]

2 minutes ago, archie andrews said:

do me a favour.....those 3 safe as houses

7 points from safety with 66 points to play for. The history of football is littered with examples of clubs going on bad runs and plummeting into the relegation places from much safer positions than that. Equally there are plenty of examples of clubs finding form and storming up the table, dragging others in as a result.

Just look at Leicester last season.

[phantom]

Can't see it being other than Charlton, Bolton, Rotherham and us in the bottom 4 places !

Bolton with a bit of luck will have a points deduction

Charlton were the worst side I have seen for a long time last weekend

Rotherham are more of a yo-yo club than us

IF we don't change something (personnel / formation) in January - can't see us improving that much, we've dominated games and got nothing - why would anything currently improve?

[cityloyal473]

2 from 6 IMO.  Bolton are gone, regardless of any future points deduction.

[old_eastender]

4 hours ago, cottsciderarmy said:

They say the table never lies halfway through the season and whilst it looked a possible dog fight of 9 a month ago, it's shaping up to be a 6 horse race.

 

Blackburn (dame in hand) and Preston have got themselves 6pts away from the squeaky bum area and neither team ship many goals which has helped them in odd 1 goal wins and when they do get beat it's not by many. Both are doing enough to suggest they can steer clear of where the pressure mounts up. Fulham's win over Rotherham yesterday suggested they have the class when needed and also are now 5pts clear of the ruck.

Consistency is the problem for those in the bottom five, they all seem to be able to win in their turn but a trait of very heavy defeats is doing goal differences no good, as the 1-0 merchants start to draw distance between themselves and the struggling pack of five.

Of the five Bolton lay bottom of the pile on 17pts but a win at home to Blackburn in a north west derby on Monday will give the club confidence. No doubt the outcome of their season will be decided on an administration hearing where they could be docked 12 points and also what players depart in January. If they get through January without going into administration and selling their best assets (unlikely), the 5pts they are behind could well be made up as they are another team who don't concede many and have a better goal difference than ourselves and Charlton. However it is likely the points deduction will come into force and should that happen they will easily be the banker team to go down.

Charlton are probably the weakest team I've seen this season and again a loss to Wolves on Saturday has their fans questioning what fight they have left. They are dropping points left right and centre, and their comeback 1-1 draw against ourselves only papered over massive cracks. The fans want the board out and the players seem to have already thrown in the towel. They seem incapable of winning at present and even their fans are struggling to see where the goals are coming from. Things look bleak, but as with any London based club with solid support they have the finances to bring in a few quality players next month which could help them out.

Despite 1pt ahead of the drop, MK Dons I personally feel have enough about them to stay up. They score goals and grind out the odd results, but they are inconsistent which is why they are where they are.

Rotherham are poor and they let in goals, the worry is they thrashed us ! Yesterday against Fulham they gave up easy and with many of their players aging pro's, it might be questioned how many will fancy a dogfight scrap.

Huddersfield are currently 4pts adrift but they also are a team who know how to close out games and not lose by many, something which helps them with a negative goal difference of 8. Their season will hinge in the next few weeks on whether star midfielder Huws and their star striker Wells stick around. To lose them could have devastating effects, but with them in their armour they will probably survive the drop for another season.

Then their is ourselves, we are definitely struggling and the goal difference is worrying but there is that feeling that we can at times play good football which can see us get results against some of the leagues better teams. Having looked more than capable on Sky every time this season, the inability to kill a game is costing us. Monday was disgraceful and the manager saying that we could have won with a couple of Burnley's players is purely just naive. Poor in front of goal, we have a disjointed defence and the fans are finally turning against the manager. It's now time for those who run the club to show some backbone and realise the team isn't consistently strong enough without 3/4 quality additions. Given we have used up most of our loan options (we cant loan anyone over 24 unless Baker or Bennett sign permanently) and 3 months is the longest we can sign anyone for, so any loans are likely to be made towards the end of the window. WE can also loan a maximum of two players. Therefore any signings will have to be permanent and it worries me who will want to come here and jump aboard a sinking ship. In the summer signing a Bradley Dack or Tom Bradshaw would have been appealing to both players but now with their own clubs looking like they will be playing Championship football next season and ourselves possibly league One football, I fear we are not attractive at all for them and we could actually be seen as a step backwards.

Steve Cotterill has to get it right, but so do the board, if they back him and it doesn't work, we go down with a side and a manager that has undone a lot of the previous seasons good strides, but sacking Cotts in Feb or March would be pointless, as no manager will be able to come in and create their own team. So if the board have the confidence in Steve we have to stick with him until the season's out. Otherwise the board need to act now, whether it be before the Reading game or after it. If they fear we are going down and he may not attract the players needed, then a new manager whether it be an interim boss or someone permanent will need to be in charge to make their signings in January.

Most managers when they go to a club have a couple of faces they like to take with them, much like Cotts did with Elliott, and someone like Warnock would probably get a couple of his older experienced heads in cheaply but on good wages until the end of the year to get us out the shit. My worry is, Cotts doesn't have any of these to turn to.

Saturday won't see us relegated but a defeat to Reading does look likely. They score goals and defend well, the opposite to ourselves and should be capable of seeing us off. Luckily for us, Bolton play Huddersfield and in many ways a Bolton win may be the best result for us, but a draw does look likely. Charlton who play Forest looks a poor match and this would not surprise me if ended 0-0, whilst Preston could do us a favour by beating Rotherham. Leeds should be too good for MK Dons whilst Fulham vs Sheffield Wednesday could see Fulham pull away. The five at the bottom all look unlikely to improve their situations, so defeat for us won't see us in a worse position, but much like when we fluffed against Charlton, it's one of those days where a win could have a huge effect on our position.

For me Bolton and Charlton look the likely ones to go down, but the battle between 4, doesn't fill me with confidence. I think unless they lose their assets Huddersfield will be okay, so then it's a straight scrap between ourselves and Rotherham and MK Dons and with our goal difference 8 or 9 worse than them, we need to stop getting hammered by the bigger teams away. 

I don't see MK Dons or Rotherham losing by many if they lose on Saturday, but ourselves it could easily be 2 or 3, and that there lays another worry for me, as although our points tally may not get worse, the goal difference is mounting up.

For the first time this season I'm concerned. Before I thought we would beat the drop, but I'm not convinced we are better than those around us and our inability to score and get results when it matters is very worrying.

Changing the manager isn't guaranteed to bring about a change in fortune, but if there is a solid candidate like Warnock waiting in the wings then it would be foolish of the board not to act now before it's too late. The best way to solve a problem is being proactive and not reactive, unfortunately Bristol City never do this. January is a big month and it starts on Saturday. SL, JL  & KD need to address Cotts on Friday and make it crystal clear another heavy defeat on Saturday and he has to go. Sadly we are too nice and we won't do this. The board will keep burying their heads and then react in February when all the money is spent, and we are still in the relegation zone and bring in someone with an impossible task. We do nee change, whether it's a change of system, manager or a change in our recruitment policy , but one thing is certain, we're in a relegation fight that unless some people stand up and make a stand, will see us playing in a 27K stadium in League One next season.

If things don't change I fear we're going down with Bolton and Charlton.

Good article, for me it's all about the Jan window. If we don't strengthen then relegation awaits, don't think changing the manager now will make any difference. As someone on another thread said if Wilbs & Pack are still first choice in the starting eleven end of Jan, we will have failed to do the necessary business in the transfer window and will be going down.

[ChippenhamRed]

Can we maybe not quote the OP every time?!

[Kodjia 22]

Also consider 'that' mid table team which seems to go into free fall in about February and March to get sucked towards the bottom 3, strengthen in January and I think we'll have enough.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said:

7 points from safety with 66 points to play for. The history of football is littered with examples of clubs going on bad runs and plummeting into the relegation places from much safer positions than that. Equally there are plenty of examples of clubs finding form and storming up the table, dragging others in as a result.

Just look at Leicester last season.

And Sunderland when they got promoted from the bottom, and Hull when they beat us in the playoffs, and Leic like you say, and I believe Palace did also turn their season on its head one year at this level.

A game of two halves; a season of two halves sometimes too. 

 

[Inactive user]

Id say it's between us, Charlton, Bolton and Rotherham. Maybe MKD.

Worried? Yes.

[Davefevs]

@cottsciderarmy nice summary.

I tend to agree that it's a mini-league of 6, but transfer embargo on Fulham could be interesting.  What are the rules if they sold McCormack for say £15m in this window.  Can they re-invest?

Preston aren't out of the woods yet.  They have a small squad like us and if they don't invest in this window could see them falling into a battle.  I think they will be ok though.  Probably goes to show how crucial our home game against them is in a couple of weeks.  Perhaps the West Brom game must be considered as either a rest game for a couple of key players, or a start for 60, but come off.  That would take different sub tactics from Cotts.

Our loan situation is also interesting.  I can't see us being in a position to make Baker permanent, Bennett, maybe? 

Which players come under which loan category:

Baker over 24

Hamer over 24 (returned)

Robinson under 24

Moore under 24

Emergency:

Cox

Bennett

Does that give us a bit more scope than we think?  Or have I got some of them wrong?

 

[cottsciderarmy]

22 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

@cottsciderarmy nice summary.

Which players come under which loan category:

Baker over 24

Hamer over 24 (returned)

Robinson under 24

Moore under 24

Emergency:

Cox

Bennett

Does that give us a bit more scope than we think?  Or have I got some of them wrong?

 

Sadly loans are simple, you are allowed 8 in a season, 4 long term, 4 short term, 4 under 24 , 4 over 24. If a loan is made permanent during a season, that loan spot is then again reopened.

We have used 6 loans, 3 permanent (Hamer was a season long loan as is Robinson, and Baker. Hamer being returned has no change on this), and 3 short term. We can only extend Cox, Bennett or Moore, not all three, as we have already used 3 long term loans. My guess would be Bennett will be extended and Moore and Cox will be returned. But we can only bring in 2 more loans, unless Bennett or Baker are signed permanently (could also be any of the other 3 but can't see it) as then their own is revoqued, so we can use that loan option again.

The two loans we can make, one can be for a max of 93 days so realistically this won't be used until the middle of February so they can play until the end of the season, but we can sign one player on loan until the end of the season from Friday. Both of these have to be under 24.

I feel we have used the loan system really poorly this season and to an extent, the loans of Cox, Hamer & Robinson have been pretty pointless as none of them were really used, and Hamer being returned was a poor decision given it meant a long term loan was wasted and we also weren't paying his wages, but we had agreed with Leicester he would be used as a first team player so I can understand him wanting his loan terminated.

Baker and Bennett have been good loan signings and for the sake of being able to make a 3rd loan, I feel we should try and sign one of them permanently, my preference would be for Baker but he won't be cheap.

Like it or lump it we will have to pay over the odds for permanent signings next month, clubs know we need to buy, and loan isn't a strong option for us, so we will be forced to sign free agents or players whose asking price will make it a sellers market.

Our inability to bolster in the summer, isn't something that can be easily rectified in January, the damage is already done. 

[Davefevs]

Ok, ta.  I didn't realise the emergency loans counted towards the 8.

[cottsciderarmy]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Ok, ta.  I didn't realise the emergency loans counted towards the 8.

A 3 month loan is an emergency loan, but you can't use extra loans and claim as emergency loans.

The only time that applies is a 7 day loan for a keeper providing you don't have a keeper available.

[Davefevs]

Just been reading the football league rules....not straightforward.

in your explanation are you calling 'temporary loans' permanent loans?  According to the rules these can be half or full season...and commenced during the normal window  In which case:

Baker, Robinson and Hamer were full season temporary loans

Moore was half season temporary loan.

Therefore we have used our quota of four temporary loans.  Although if we were to make Baker, Robinson or Moore permanent, a slot would be re-opened.

In addition, we have taken Cox and Bennett on emergency loans, which can range from 28-93 days.  We would have to make Bennett a permanent signing to allow him to continue to play for us beyond Jan 3rd.

i can't see anything in the rules re under23/over23???????

the issue with emergency loans is that they could run out before the end if the season?

[cottsciderarmy]

An emergency loan can't be extended past 93 days, we only have 2 loans left sadly. There are age restrictions on them sadly.

Cox and Bennett I'm not sure are emergency loans as they were signed during the loan window. An emergency loan is that which is done outside the loan window.

Bennett's loan according to his agent company can be extended, so he can't have been an emergency loan.

[View from the Dolman]

6 minutes ago, cottsciderarmy said:

An emergency loan can't be extended past 93 days, we only have 2 loans left sadly. There are age restrictions on them sadly.

Cox and Bennett I'm not sure are emergency loans as they were signed during the loan window. An emergency loan is that which is done outside the loan window.

Bennett's loan according to his agent company can be extended, so he can't have been an emergency loan.

Where are you getting your rules from? I really don't see how they tally with the FL regulations page at http://www.football-league.co.uk/global/section6.aspx

[Davefevs]

Bennet and Cox were ELs....9th October, which was way outside the normal summer transfer window, i.e. in the EL window.

According to FA rules (which gave different wording to Football League rules) it is only Conference clubs governed by age restricted loans....and they can have 8 rather than 4.

It also says a club can have 12 ELs.

i need a lie down!  Let's hope City know the rules!

[North London Red]

The bookies still think there are 4 teams more likely than us to be relegated (Charlton, Bolton, Rotherham and MK Dons). City are currently best priced at 100-30 (with Sky Bet) for anyone who fancies an 'insurance / compensation' bet:

http://www.oddschecker.com/football/english/championship/relegation

[cottsciderarmy]

4 minutes ago, North London Red said:

The bookies still think there are 4 teams more likely than us to be relegated (Charlton, Bolton, Rotherham and MK Dons). City are currently best priced at 100-30 (with Sky Bet) for anyone who fancies an 'insurance / compensation' bet:

http://www.oddschecker.com/football/english/championship/relegation

I'm amazed Bolton are as big as 1/3, they look sure to get docked points and look to have to sell a number of players in January and can't recruit anyone. Now your average high street bank gives you 1.5% per annum if lucky, but Corals are willing to give you 33% ROI for roughly 5 months, seems rather generous to me.

[wallaceboy]

66 points to play for yet.if we can turn them draws into wins we will be fine.8wins n 5 draws leaving us with 50points n survival.

[Shtanley]

I think we will finish outside bottom 5

[Roe]

Didn't @cottsciderarmy (such a brilliantly ironic username) hand in his forum resignation a few weeks ago?

Nice summary of where the rest of the teams around us are though.

[Mortis]

Very nice post and well thought out 

Having seen most of the sides in League One this season I do think Bolton and Charlton will do incredibly well to avoid the drop and the fight/battle does look to be between a number of sides for one place , I genuinely do not think at all you will go down , there are far worse sides in the division and I just cannot see ( even where you are at present ) going down this season , I think Rotherham who are pretty dire away from home / MK Dons will be the likely one to go although I certainly do not rule out Huddersfield/ourselves but do think Fulham/Blackburn etc will be more than safe , we seem to have learnt the ability to grind out a 1-0 and the number of clean sheets we keep should see us safe but having only scored in 2 games more than 1 goal in a game is a real problem and 5 yes 5 goals between all of our strikers needs to improve , Saturday against Rotherham is the type of game having beaten Hull we will make a mess of but a win it that and even the most pessimistic Preston fans will feel better considering 14 games ago we went bottom ..... very much looking forward to the visit again to Ashton Gate ( bringing my dad who the last time he came we lost 3-0 and before kick off he fell of a wall and broke his wrist ) !!!!! and would take a turgid 0-0 draw 

Think its easy being close to the action to feel all doom and gloom but you will survive this season , cannot see a situation where your ultra ambitious chairman allows relegation 

 

Mortis

 

[Major Isewater]

11 minutes ago, Mortis said:

Very nice post and well thought out 

Having seen most of the sides in League One this season I do think Bolton and Charlton will do incredibly well to avoid the drop and the fight/battle does look to be between a number of sides for one place , I genuinely do not think at all you will go down , there are far worse sides in the division and I just cannot see ( even where you are at present ) going down this season , I think Rotherham who are pretty dire away from home / MK Dons will be the likely one to go although I certainly do not rule out Huddersfield/ourselves but do think Fulham/Blackburn etc will be more than safe , we seem to have learnt the ability to grind out a 1-0 and the number of clean sheets we keep should see us safe but having only scored in 2 games more than 1 goal in a game is a real problem and 5 yes 5 goals between all of our strikers needs to improve , Saturday against Rotherham is the type of game having beaten Hull we will make a mess of but a win it that and even the most pessimistic Preston fans will feel better considering 14 games ago we went bottom ..... very much looking forward to the visit again to Ashton Gate ( bringing my dad who the last time he came we lost 3-0 and before kick off he fell of a wall and broke his wrist ) !!!!! and would take a turgid 0-0 draw 

Think its easy being close to the action to feel all doom and gloom but you will survive this season , cannot see a situation where your ultra ambitious chairman allows relegation 

 

Mortis

 

How very dare you coming on to our forum being positive .

In reality we should be well placed to avoid the drop but things need to change pretty damn quick because, despite everything,  we are not winning enough games . Strong mentality is very important in the game and we are ,at the moment , a bit too fragile.

I'm hoping that Cotterill can up his game but worry that he's shot his bolt .

Still a couple of wins can change everything and we are counting ,desperately , on a good performance in the january transfer window where we are going to sign players who transform us into a top Championship team .

Happy New year to you and yours .

[Mortis]

And to you Major Isewater , Happy New Year 

 

Mortis

 

[Son of Fred]

On 30/12/2015 at 04:55, cottsciderarmy said:

They say the table never lies halfway through the season and whilst it looked a possible dog fight of 9 a month ago, it's shaping up to be a 6 horse race.

 

Blackburn (dame in hand) and Preston have got themselves 6pts away from the squeaky bum area and neither team ship many goals which has helped them in odd 1 goal wins and when they do get beat it's not by many. Both are doing enough to suggest they can steer clear of where the pressure mounts up. Fulham's win over Rotherham yesterday suggested they have the class when needed and also are now 5pts clear of the ruck.

Consistency is the problem for those in the bottom five, they all seem to be able to win in their turn but a trait of very heavy defeats is doing goal differences no good, as the 1-0 merchants start to draw distance between themselves and the struggling pack of five.

Of the five Bolton lay bottom of the pile on 17pts but a win at home to Blackburn in a north west derby on Monday will give the club confidence. No doubt the outcome of their season will be decided on an administration hearing where they could be docked 12 points and also what players depart in January. If they get through January without going into administration and selling their best assets (unlikely), the 5pts they are behind could well be made up as they are another team who don't concede many and have a better goal difference than ourselves and Charlton. However it is likely the points deduction will come into force and should that happen they will easily be the banker team to go down.

Charlton are probably the weakest team I've seen this season and again a loss to Wolves on Saturday has their fans questioning what fight they have left. They are dropping points left right and centre, and their comeback 1-1 draw against ourselves only papered over massive cracks. The fans want the board out and the players seem to have already thrown in the towel. They seem incapable of winning at present and even their fans are struggling to see where the goals are coming from. Things look bleak, but as with any London based club with solid support they have the finances to bring in a few quality players next month which could help them out.

Despite 1pt ahead of the drop, MK Dons I personally feel have enough about them to stay up. They score goals and grind out the odd results, but they are inconsistent which is why they are where they are.

Rotherham are poor and they let in goals, the worry is they thrashed us ! Yesterday against Fulham they gave up easy and with many of their players aging pro's, it might be questioned how many will fancy a dogfight scrap.

Huddersfield are currently 4pts adrift but they also are a team who know how to close out games and not lose by many, something which helps them with a negative goal difference of 8. Their season will hinge in the next few weeks on whether star midfielder Huws and their star striker Wells stick around. To lose them could have devastating effects, but with them in their armour they will probably survive the drop for another season.

Then their is ourselves, we are definitely struggling and the goal difference is worrying but there is that feeling that we can at times play good football which can see us get results against some of the leagues better teams. Having looked more than capable on Sky every time this season, the inability to kill a game is costing us. Monday was disgraceful and the manager saying that we could have won with a couple of Burnley's players is purely just naive. Poor in front of goal, we have a disjointed defence and the fans are finally turning against the manager. It's now time for those who run the club to show some backbone and realise the team isn't consistently strong enough without 3/4 quality additions. Given we have used up most of our loan options (we cant loan anyone over 24 unless Baker or Bennett sign permanently) and 3 months is the longest we can sign anyone for, so any loans are likely to be made towards the end of the window. WE can also loan a maximum of two players. Therefore any signings will have to be permanent and it worries me who will want to come here and jump aboard a sinking ship. In the summer signing a Bradley Dack or Tom Bradshaw would have been appealing to both players but now with their own clubs looking like they will be playing Championship football next season and ourselves possibly league One football, I fear we are not attractive at all for them and we could actually be seen as a step backwards.

Steve Cotterill has to get it right, but so do the board, if they back him and it doesn't work, we go down with a side and a manager that has undone a lot of the previous seasons good strides, but sacking Cotts in Feb or March would be pointless, as no manager will be able to come in and create their own team. So if the board have the confidence in Steve we have to stick with him until the season's out. Otherwise the board need to act now, whether it be before the Reading game or after it. If they fear we are going down and he may not attract the players needed, then a new manager whether it be an interim boss or someone permanent will need to be in charge to make their signings in January.

Most managers when they go to a club have a couple of faces they like to take with them, much like Cotts did with Elliott, and someone like Warnock would probably get a couple of his older experienced heads in cheaply but on good wages until the end of the year to get us out the shit. My worry is, Cotts doesn't have any of these to turn to.

Saturday won't see us relegated but a defeat to Reading does look likely. They score goals and defend well, the opposite to ourselves and should be capable of seeing us off. Luckily for us, Bolton play Huddersfield and in many ways a Bolton win may be the best result for us, but a draw does look likely. Charlton who play Forest looks a poor match and this would not surprise me if ended 0-0, whilst Preston could do us a favour by beating Rotherham. Leeds should be too good for MK Dons whilst Fulham vs Sheffield Wednesday could see Fulham pull away. The five at the bottom all look unlikely to improve their situations, so defeat for us won't see us in a worse position, but much like when we fluffed against Charlton, it's one of those days where a win could have a huge effect on our position.

For me Bolton and Charlton look the likely ones to go down, but the battle between 4, doesn't fill me with confidence. I think unless they lose their assets Huddersfield will be okay, so then it's a straight scrap between ourselves and Rotherham and MK Dons and with our goal difference 8 or 9 worse than them, we need to stop getting hammered by the bigger teams away. 

I don't see MK Dons or Rotherham losing by many if they lose on Saturday, but ourselves it could easily be 2 or 3, and that there lays another worry for me, as although our points tally may not get worse, the goal difference is mounting up.

For the first time this season I'm concerned. Before I thought we would beat the drop, but I'm not convinced we are better than those around us and our inability to score and get results when it matters is very worrying.

Changing the manager isn't guaranteed to bring about a change in fortune, but if there is a solid candidate like Warnock waiting in the wings then it would be foolish of the board not to act now before it's too late. The best way to solve a problem is being proactive and not reactive, unfortunately Bristol City never do this. January is a big month and it starts on Saturday. SL, JL  & KD need to address Cotts on Friday and make it crystal clear another heavy defeat on Saturday and he has to go. Sadly we are too nice and we won't do this. The board will keep burying their heads and then react in February when all the money is spent, and we are still in the relegation zone and bring in someone with an impossible task. We do nee change, whether it's a change of system, manager or a change in our recruitment policy , but one thing is certain, we're in a relegation fight that unless some people stand up and make a stand, will see us playing in a 27K stadium in League One next season.

If things don't change I fear we're going down with Bolton and Charlton.

Agree..Bolton and Charlton must go..truly dire..one place left folks!!....a division of six,top half stay up.....all aboard the pain train!