Guest Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 5 minutes ago, GrahamC said: Not a reasonable comparison at all. Stewart's legs had gone and we were a better side without him. As with Cotts and Burns, it was about the manager showing some respect to the player, just as the manager would expect respect from the player. i recall the player who GJ played instead of MS falling over with no one around him, had his legs gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southstandoriginal Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 The effect on the club as a whole of Steve's inability to manage tactical substitutions is much more concerning than the effect on Wes Burns as an individual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 1 minute ago, Countryfile said: As with Cotts and Burns, it was about the manager showing some respect to the player, just as the manager would expect respect from the player. i recall the player who GJ played instead of MS falling over with no one around him, had his legs gone? No, but the "hand grenade" saw us promoted automatically the following season and then make the Championship play off final the year after, so I think he got it right.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephenkibby. Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 Didn't burns come on last season and smash in the winner in a 3/2 win or the season before? Or am I already pissed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 4 minutes ago, GrahamC said: No, but the "hand grenade" saw us promoted automatically the following season and then make the Championship play off final the year after, so I think he got it right.. And a little bit later he got it wrong, very wrong, assaulting his own player(s), and we all know what happened next. The only decent reason I can think of for Cotts putting Burns on so late, so many times, is that the lad is on a decent appearance bonus, and Cotts is just boosting Burns pay packet, he certainly can't be doing it to build up a young players confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashtonphil Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 When Cotterill first arrived he spoke at the senior Reds dinner and said that he saw something Wes that he could work with... What happened...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 14 minutes ago, Southstandoriginal said: The effect on the club as a whole of Steve's inability to manage tactical substitutions is much more concerning than the effect on Wes Burns as an individual. Agree completely, but Burns is for my money the most obvious manifestation of that. We may not have scored a single extra goal, or gained a single extra point with Burns on the pitch earlier than he has been, but surely it couldn't be any worse had Burns been given more of a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Between heaven and hell Posted January 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 18 minutes ago, stephenkibby. said: Didn't burns come on last season and smash in the winner in a 3/2 win or the season before? Or am I already pissed? Home to Chesterfield last season won 3-2 with a Burns 90th minute winner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Cyril Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 16 minutes ago, Countryfile said: We may not have scored a single extra goal, or gained a single extra point with Burns on the pitch earlier than he has been, but surely it couldn't be any worse had Burns been given more of a chance. It's so obvious the current set up isn't working. I would love to see Burns given a chance. Saying that, I would be happy to see the tea lady given a run out just on the off chance it makes us less predictable. Bonus if one goes in off her fat backside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City1970 Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 2 hours ago, Between heaven and hell said: The way Wes Burns is being treated by our manager is nothing short of a disgrace. He may not be the answer to our problems but surely for the last 15 mins of a game he's got to be better than a Knackered out 37 yr old. Good enough for international call ups but apparently not for a struggling Championship side. He was considered not good enough for a top of the table league 1 side either. I do agree he is being ignored by Cotts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted January 2, 2016 Admin Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 Only downside to Wes game is his height, Wilbraham is a better option defencesively and I'm convinced cotts doesn't have the balls to gamble with Wes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bissellredhead Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 3 hours ago, Super said: Thought this was going to be about some blaming Reid for today's defeat. Funny you should say that... There was an absolute tool near me at the end when the players came over to the fans, shouting to Bobby and saying 'you're fcuking sh1t!' I do despair at times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Between heaven and hell Posted January 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 56 minutes ago, bissellredhead said: Funny you should say that... There was an absolute tool near me at the end when the players came over to the fans, shouting to Bobby and saying 'you're fcuking sh1t!' I do despair at times Same here we had three bell ends in the first half that slagged off every player, luckily before my red mist came down they moved off at half time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inactive user Posted January 2, 2016 Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 4 hours ago, Between heaven and hell said: The way Wes Burns is being treated by our manager is nothing short of a disgrace. He may not be the answer to our problems but surely for the last 15 mins of a game he's got to be better than a Knackered out 37 yr old. Good enough for international call ups but apparently not for a struggling Championship side. Hi Wes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfOfWestStreet Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 Wes burns ain't that young, cotterill works with him every day so clearly doesn't think he is up to it. He didn't play under mcinnes or sod, so for what ever reason 3 managers don't think he is good enough. If he was good enough he'd be starting, not coming on for two minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireSection Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 Burns strengths. you can knock balls into the corners/flanks and he will get to everyone holding the ball up for the rest of the offensive side of the team to catch up/ alternatively knock long balls into Wilbs who can't jump or link play from midfield as he's 5 yards of the pace. Knock balls over the top for he and Codger to race on to, or let Burns run at defenders with the ball, maybe leaving him with 1/1 occasionally. Just give the lad a chance because whatever we keep repeatedly doing up top IT DOESNT WORK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 The "good enough for international call ups" argument is completely irrelevant. It's a reflection of Wales lack of forward options rather than Wes Burns ability. Robson-Kanu is a regular starter for Wales but only came on for Reading for the last 15 minutes. If Scott Wagstaff's Mum was born in San Marino he'd be playing international football every month. Would this suddenly mean he was worthy of a place in the side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shtanley Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 I watched Burns absolutely terrorise John Stones for 90 minutes about a year ago. Isn't John Stones quite good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djb6162 Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 6 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said: The "good enough for international call ups" argument is completely irrelevant. It's a reflection of Wales lack of forward options rather than Wes Burns ability. Robson-Kanu is a regular starter for Wales but only came on for Reading for the last 15 minutes. If Scott Wagstaff's Mum was born in San Marino he'd be playing international football every month. Would this suddenly mean he was worthy of a place in the side? On our current form yes !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djb6162 Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 7 hours ago, WolfOfWestStreet said: Wes burns ain't that young, cotterill works with him every day so clearly doesn't think he is up to it. He didn't play under mcinnes or sod, so for what ever reason 3 managers don't think he is good enough. If he was good enough he'd be starting, not coming on for two minutes. mcinnes signed him and gave him his debut at 18, in the championship by the way, then got the sack the next morning. i wouldnt use Del as an argument against Wes, he is a big admirer and still is !!!! Sod played him in both the championship and L1 as an 18/19 year old in difficult circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bemmyredjeff Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 11 hours ago, Portland Bill said: I was hoping he would come on for the last 15, but, thinking rationally now I'm home, we had already used 2 subs and if someone had got injured ( especially if it was Fielding) in those 15 minutes, we would have had to play out time with ten men. SC had a tough call to make at the time, tough job being a manager of City! I'm afraid he's brought most of that on himself ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogkev Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 This is one of my biggest problems with SC, he is not making full use of his limited playing squad. Burns could have already played at least 7 games this season and might have scored a couple of goals and developed within the team. He would now be giving us an effective option. Cotterill has hampered his development and potential to affect the first team. I feel sorry for Burns, and DJB, you must be tearing your hair out with frustration, or biding your time for a change of management, or for Burns to transfer to a new club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Between heaven and hell Posted January 3, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 7 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said: The "good enough for international call ups" argument is completely irrelevant. It's a reflection of Wales lack of forward options rather than Wes Burns ability. Robson-Kanu is a regular starter for Wales but only came on for Reading for the last 15 minutes. If Scott Wagstaff's Mum was born in San Marino he'd be playing international football every month. Would this suddenly mean he was worthy of a place in the side? So a lad that has done well for Wales u21's and forced himself onto the bench of their national side isn't good enough to replace a Knackered 37 yr old after 80 mins for our lot because Wales arnt very good. Unbelievable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 4 minutes ago, Between heaven and hell said: So a lad that has done well for Wales u21's and forced himself onto the bench of their national side isn't good enough to replace a Knackered 37 yr old after 80 mins for our lot because Wales arnt very good. Unbelievable Is that what I said? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfieldred Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 reid was at fault for the goal. He was caught in possession, the same as freeman had been 5 or 6 times. The difference was this was late in the game and we were going for a win. reid also created a very good chance seconds after coming on. Unfortunately freeman created very little despite having a lot of the ball for 81 minutes. Having watched the last 3 away games 270 mins a lot of possession and no goals, it is becoming very clear that although he tries his heart out, In terms of creating chances Freeman is not good enough. People slag pack off, but most of our good chances started from him and we looked more dangerous when we played direct thereby not allowing freeman to run into a blind alley through overplay which allows the defence to organise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 Saido Berahino has scored 10 goals in 11 international U21 games and is being considered for a £25m bid by Tottenham. Wes has scored 6 in 14 for Wales U21 which theoretically make him worth half as much (I am aware these things don't work like FIFA), yet he can't get a game for a struggling championship side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murraysrightplum Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 Also, Wales are pretty good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 Just now, Murraysrightplum said: Also, Wales are pretty good! As a side yes, but their striker options are severely limited. As I said, Robson-Kanu is a regular starter for Wales but played 15 minutes yesterday. I am not suggesting Burns shouldn't get a chance - he should. My point is that saying he gets international call ups does not necessarily add any weight to the argument - it depends entirely on the country in question and who else they have to choose from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Between heaven and hell Posted January 3, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 17 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said: Is that what I said? Probably not on reflection but still fuming this morning! Alrhough the cricket is helping a little! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murraysrightplum Posted January 3, 2016 Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 2 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said: As a side yes, but their striker options are severely limited. As I said, Robson-Kanu is a regular starter for Wales but played 15 minutes yesterday. I am not suggesting Burns shouldn't get a chance - he should. My point is that saying he gets international call ups does not necessarily add any weight to the argument - it depends entirely on the country in question and who else they have to choose from. I take your point but the days of comparing Wales to San Marino are gone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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