Hope everyone has calmed down now...

[Luxo Jr.]

5 hours ago, chipdawg said:

It absolutely wasn't, but why give a poor referee an opportunity to 'even things up' after he's just shown a home defender a straight red card? 

Disagree. It's the referee's prerogative to get it right, not ours to adapt to their poor decisions and game management. If he made a good hard tackle, it's not a yellow, whatever the situation. This is the reason football's becoming a non contact sport. Would totally understand your point if it was a foul, but if it isn't, of course it's not a stupid tackle. No legal tackle is stupid.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

35 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I go to experimental361's website a fair bit.  The guy is a statistician and works a bit with Paddy Power - but this is his own website.  At the start of the season he put together a table showing the relative predicted difficulty of each teams fixtures.  This is what he said about us: "It looks like Bristol City have a tough start – they have to play five of the six most-fancied sides in their first eight fixtures – so Robins fans shouldn’t be too dejected if they are lingering near the drop zone in September."

I am not too dejected at 12th with one of those first eight to go.

I agree however the fixture list has little or nothing to do with the 4 points dropped + 5 goals conceded in the last 2 games and let's be honest it is 4 points dropped in anybody's language, it's about lack of professionalism, poor decision making and very bad individual mistakes.

if you expect the worst then it will in all probability happen and we as fans might think like that luckily LJ does not.

[ExiledAjax]

12 minutes ago, Esmond Million's Bung said:

we are a Jekyll and Hyde team, last night we played very well in the first half and the same at Norwich but usually we play well in the 2nd half of games, we just seem incapable of 2 consistent halves of football

Spot on

[old_eastender]

6 hours ago, cidered abroad said:

I dared to dream.

I dared to dream that Bristol City had really turned the corner and for the first time in a very long time, I could see something good happening at City. I was beginning to believe that the continual underachievement was a thing of the past.

But after the last two matches, only a few miles apart in South Yorkshire, I'm not sure that we have.

We concede two schoolboy goals to Rotherham, who are quickly becoming acknowledged as a very poor team,

We have over thirty shots on goal but only manage two when chasing the game.

At Wednesday, we build a two goal lead at half time. Admittedly, a two goal lead is well known as the worst lead in football; do you go for more goals or sit on it? We cannot do either.

We leave a Scottish International striker unmarked at a corner for Wednesday's first.

Tomlin smashes a penalty against a post and we are still 2-1 against ten instead of 3-1 against ten.

O'Neil makes a stupid tackle from behind and we're down to ten.

A goalkeeping howler for the second.

Keeper kicks ball out of play with thirty seconds left, instead of playing keep ball.

Wednesday player is totally unchallenged as he gets the winner.

We are now 12th instead of 5th. Unless the whole squad are totally impervious to setbacks, we could have a lack of confidence syndrome coming.

The next game is at home against a team who sit 20th with one goal scored that gave them their only win out of seven games. The team is Derby, and we've lost five and drawn once in our last six matches with them.

Anyone care to argue the case that we will "give" them their second win of the season?

I have to stop dreaming and face the reality of my sixty seven years as a City fan? 

I was going to 'like' this post, as I agree with all of it, but it's more a 'dislike'. Need a win against Derby to restore belief and that will not be easy.

[One Team In Keynsham]

I was livid straight after the game, and was still mithering a couple of friends in the coffee shop this morning as recently as 2 hours ago.

Caveat all comments with the fact that I only listened to the commentary, and have not seen any footage, but the obvious 3 things that grinded my gears:

1.  Tomlin not hitting the target with his penalty:  if the keeper makes a save, fair enough, but hit the bloody target.

2. The red card 30 seconds later

3. Piss-poor game management at the death:  having shipped 2 goals to let them get back to 2-2, I despaired at the return of last season's last-gasp goals.  Have we learned nothing from the dismal autumn/winter of last year?

I trust LJ gave the team a collective bollocking, especially on the back of the Coco-the-Clown defending on Saturday.

OK, off my chest now.

[JamesBCFC]

we have played 4 of the toughest teams in this division already, 2 of those away from home, with one of the younger squads in the league we have held our own (minimum) in every single game.

The positives right now outweigh the negatives tremendously.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

22 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

we have played 4 of the toughest teams in this division already, 2 of those away from home, with one of the younger squads in the league we have held our own (minimum) in every single game.

The positives right now outweigh the negatives tremendously.

The positives are great but LJ knows that we cannot use this as an excuse, as I said on a previous post that does not explain the loss of 4 points, the shipping of 5 goals, unprofessionalism, poor decision making,  poor game management and really poor individual errors in the last 2 games.

 

[Fiale]

 

3 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

I go to experimental361's website a fair bit.  The guy is a statistician and works a bit with Paddy Power - but this is his own website.  At the start of the season he put together a table showing the relative predicted difficulty of each teams fixtures.  This is what he said about us: "It looks like Bristol City have a tough start – they have to play five of the six most-fancied sides in their first eight fixtures – so Robins fans shouldn’t be too dejected if they are lingering near the drop zone in September."

I am not too dejected at 12th with one of those first eight to go.

 

That's a nice table, seems he thinks we have a nice run now - for those interested 

 

https://experimental361.com/2016/06/22/fixture-difficulty-matrix-championship/

[ChippenhamRed]

4 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

Because I don't believe there was any need for him to go to ground in that situation.  The play was in their half....it's not like he was through on goal and we needed a last ditch tackle. 

Why put yourself in a situation where the ref can send you off?

 

I accept it was a little unnecessary and not without risk, but I can't bring myself to blame a player entirely for a poor refereeing decision, let alone describe it as "100% his fault".

[formerly known as ivan]

I don't get why people have a problem with others venting their frustrations after losing a game in which we were 2-0 up!

Personally still fuming about it but maybe a shit day at work hasn't helped?

[JamesBCFC]

18 minutes ago, Esmond Million's Bung said:

The positives are great but LJ knows that we cannot use this as an excuse, as I said on a previous post that does not explain the loss of 4 points, the shipping of 5 goals, unprofessionalism, poor decision making,  poor game management and really poor individual errors in the last 2 games.

 

what excuse?

I am simply weighing things up.

*3 points lost in the last 2 games. all of them last night.

What happened last night was very disappointing, but it can happen to anyone, we have a very young squad and there is a fair amount of naivety. The players will learn from this. Wednesday are one of the better teams in this division and we had them on the ropes until a rather bizarre 60 seconds occurred.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

13 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

what excuse?

I am simply weighing things up.

*3 points lost in the last 2 games. all of them last night.

What happened last night was very disappointing, but it can happen to anyone, we have a very young squad and there is a fair amount of naivety. The players will learn from this. Wednesday are one of the better teams in this division and we had them on the ropes until a rather bizarre 60 seconds occurred.

That excuse.

5 points in 2 games, Rotherham can hardly be claimed as as a point gained.

and for the record it was not just that a rather bizarre 60 seconds, it was an equally bizarre final 60 seconds as well.

 

[JamesBCFC]

Just now, Esmond Million's Bung said:

That excuse.

5 points in 2 games, Rotherham can hardly be claimed as as a point gained.

and for the record it was not just that a rather bizarre 60 seconds, it was an equally bizarre final 60 seconds as well.

 

any away point is a point gained, and from 2 goals down as well? yes it is a point gained most definitely.

If Rotherham had been like yesterday where we threw away a 2 goal lead you would have a point, but as it is? Just no.

Simply stating a fact, about a bizarre 60 seconds isn't making an excuse? I haven't blamed the defeat on then, just highlighted it as a turning point.

[BCFC Grim]

Am I the only one who thinks top 6 is a possibility? A slight but still possible. I haven't felt so down after a defeat since Hull in the play offs. And was so disappointing not to beat Rotherham but the signs are there that we are going to compete in this league.

I don't buy this 'happy to be mid-table'. This league is only going to get harder year on year. We are going to lose our main forward next season. I genuinely think we are in for a shout of the play offs and i for one will be dissapointed if we don't atleast challenge.

Just need to cut the xxxxxxx mistakes out.

[cityexile]

Cannot in a rational way argue with the OP.

Equally, the moment we stop getting passionately irrational about it, it just becomes a bunch of people chasing a ball around.

Turn arounds happen. Let's be honest, we did the same to Villa. Just the penalty, late late goal, poor defending just made it harder to stomach.

I have always thought if we make a big push, it would be next season. LJ will have sorted out who he likes, his 'go to' players etc, feels he is still tinkering and searching a bit at the moment, which is to be expected with so many new players. And then, and then, it is this season we have Tammy.

 

[Esmond Million's Bung]

3 minutes ago, JamesBCFC said:

any away point is a point gained, and from 2 goals down as well? yes it is a point gained most definitely.

If Rotherham had been like yesterday where we threw away a 2 goal lead you would have a point, but as it is? Just no.

Simply stating a fact, about a bizarre 60 seconds isn't making an excuse? I haven't blamed the defeat on then, just highlighted it as a turning point.

I actually meant the Wednesday are one of the better sides portion, i'm sure LJ would say "so what?" given the circumstances of the game.

As for Rotherham, gifting a piss poor team 2 goals joke goals yes a point was ok but should have 3 all day long.

All I am saying is LJ isn't making excuses so why should we as fans?.

We played ok against Norwich and may have grabbed an unlikely point but we lost and that's fine, we played better against Newcastle and probably deserved a point but didn't get it and that's fine but the last 2 games should serve as a wake up call, something that LJ is well aware of probably more so than some fans, ask him whether he is satisfied with the results of the last 2 games, me I think that he is tamping and quite rightly.

Luckily we have a game on Saturday to hopefully put things right, against a team who have scored 1 goal all season.

[ExiledAjax]

3 hours ago, Esmond Million's Bung said:

I agree however the fixture list has little or nothing to do with the 4 points dropped + 5 goals conceded in the last 2 games and let's be honest it is 4 points dropped in anybody's language, it's about lack of professionalism, poor decision making and very bad individual mistakes.

if you expect the worst then it will in all probability happen and we as fans might think like that luckily LJ does not.

I agree with this.  I am not trying to excuse the team for dropping points last night.  At 2-0 up and cruising you should not lose. At 2-1 up with a penalty against 10 men you should not lose.  At 2-2 with a minute left you should not lose.

The purpose of the post was to put the disappointing loss into a little perspective.  Before the season, and indeed before the game, the away fixture at Sheffield Wednesday was seen as a tough fixture, potentially the 6th toughest of the 46 games that we will play.  We would have done well to get a point and very well to get three. I am just trying to show that in the grand scheme of things a narrow loss does not need to be too heavily mourned.

Back to AG and bring on Derby.

[iamalagerdrinker]

I still feel like we need a big overhaul with our defence. Granted we have some fantastic talent at the back but maybe something behind the scenes needs to be adjusted maybe new defence coaches? ROD for me isn't a Championship goalkeeper. Don't get me wrong I think he's a good keeper but when we do make a defensive error and it's down to him I just don't trust him but then again he has saved our arses a few times. 

[JamesBCFC]

7 minutes ago, Esmond Million's Bung said:

I actually meant the Wednesday are one of the better sides portion, i'm sure LJ would say "so what?" given the circumstances of the game.

As for Rotherham, gifting a piss poor team 2 goals joke goals yes a point was ok but should have 3 all day long.

All I am saying is LJ isn't making excuses so why should we as fans?.

We played ok against Norwich and may have grabbed an unlikely point but we lost and that's fine, we played better against Newcastle and probably deserved a point but didn't get it and that's fine but the last 2 games should serve as a wake up call, something that LJ is well aware of probably more so than some fans, ask him whether he is satisfied with the results of the last 2 games, me I think that he is tamping and quite rightly.

Luckily we have a game on Saturday to hopefully put things right, against a team who have scored 1 goal all season.

I'm not using anything as an excuse.

Again it is a factual statement. Wednesday are one of the better side in this division and made it to the playoff final last year. So that makes it arguable that if you ignore the relegated sides, they are the best side in this league. I am not making an excuse for losing, but I am saying that despite the end result, the fact we went to Sheffield and more than matched them for the first 55 minutes of the game, is something to build on. Instead of focussing solely on the negatives.

As for Rotherham, their squad is similar in strength to Burtons, we struggled to get a point at Burton, but look at other results there. A point isn't ideal, but any away point is a positive.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

1 minute ago, JamesBCFC said:

I'm not using anything as an excuse.

Again it is a factual statement. Wednesday are one of the better side in this division and made it to the playoff final last year. So that makes it arguable that if you ignore the relegated sides, they are the best side in this league. I am not making an excuse for losing, but I am saying that despite the end result, the fact we went to Sheffield and more than matched them for the first 55 minutes of the game, is something to build on. Instead of focussing solely on the negatives.

Well hey ho, i'm on LJ's side on this one, because he is right.

 

[JamesBCFC]

1 minute ago, Esmond Million's Bung said:

Well hey ho, i'm on LJ's side on this one, because he is right.

 

I'm not disagreeing with LJ?

[nickolas]

6 hours ago, Robbored said:

One of them must be Flint. He was at fault for Fletchers free header direct from a corner. Conceding like that must infuriate the coaching staff.

Maybe Flint has become complacent in being first choice CB and a spell out of the team would just remind him that he's not irreplaceable.

LJ has other CB options. Ekstrand or Moore could step in.

The corner wouldve been kicked off the line had we marked each post. It infuriates me when, as we probably were all told when we were 8, put a man on both posts. Why we choose not to is beyond me. Seems to be the modern way for some reason. 

[Portland Bill]

32 minutes ago, nickolas said:

The corner wouldve been kicked off the line had we marked each post. It infuriates me when, as we probably were all told when we were 8, put a man on both posts. Why we choose not to is beyond me. Seems to be the modern way for some reason. 

Drives me nuts as well mate, when teams defend corners they are possibly at their most vulnerable than at any other time during a game. Surely it makes sense to protect the goal as much as possible for those 10 seconds, I've never understood why teams don't do this.

[Portland Bill]

7 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

There was still plenty of experience and players with hundreds of appearances out there last night. Only Magnusson and Abraham have very limited experience in pro 'mens' football and neither of them could be blamed for last night. In fact the mistakes came from more experienced players like Flint, O'Donnell and possibly O'Neill and Pack, all of whom have hundreds of appearances to their name.

Just a night of individual errors that cost us unfortunately.

Interestingly I see that O'Donnell is a Wednesday fan!!!! That is true, but I'm only joking by making reference to it!

[GrahamC]

7 hours ago, Robbored said:

One of them must be Flint. He was at fault for Fletchers free header direct from a corner. Conceding like that must infuriate the coaching staff.

Maybe Flint has become complacent in being first choice CB and a spell out of the team would just remind him that he's not irreplaceable.

LJ has other CB options. Ekstrand or Moore could step in.

If you watch the highlights closely it is clearly Abraham who lets Fletcher go.

I don't know if we mark zonally or man for man but Flint can't be everywhere..

Before we throw the baby out with the bath water LJ will know better than us just how likely it is that Ekstrand could start and finish a game and also how near to a first team place young Moore is. I reckon Fielding for O'Donnell may be a more likely change myself..

One further point, O'Neil may have got the ball but I can completely understand why a ref might see that challenge as a yellow card for the away side.

What I don't get though is that their keeper is absolutely miles off his line when the penalty is taken and 100% it should have been re-taken.

[Jerseybean]

Mood and blood pressure back to normal after last night. 

Great first half, superb approach play by Brownhill for the second, Tammy sensational again.

Then all sorts of massive learning opportunities throughout the 2nd half; let's learn and be a better squad/manager as a result of this result.

The record book will show we lost 3-2 away to Sheffield Wednesady to a 96th minute goal, while everything else that happened and has been debated and observed about the game will forever be etched on the psyche of all who love BCFC.

[Offside]

I wasn't at the game last night and have only just been able to force myself to watch the highlights. Looks like another case of fine margins, especially with the penalty miss and what happened just after.

I like the sentiments in the OP. LJ and the squad just need to ensure the mistakes in the last two games don't become a habit.

[Red-Robbo]

Let's face it, had Sheffield scored the first three and then we clawed it back to 3-2 everyone would be praising a plucky performance away from home 

Yet the net result would be the same. 

[samo II]

5 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

Let's face it, had Sheffield scored the first three and then we clawed it back to 3-2 everyone would be praising a plucky performance away from home 

Yet the net result would be the same. 

I'm of a similar mind.

Utterly gutted about the nature of the result, but not the result itself, if that makes any sense at all.

We were comfortably bypassed there last year; they controlled the game and put us to the sword.  This year we ran them danger-close, and I'd argue they are a better team now.

I'm actually more annoyed at the Rotherham result, as they felt like 2 points dropped, and that was an improvement on last year: against Wednesday I'd have taken a draw before a ball was kicked, so can't be too down hearted.

Roll on Saturday; Derby will be desperate to score/get something, and I think our squad will be out to prove something after a tricky week.

Can't wait.

[ChippenhamRed]

13 hours ago, nickolas said:

The corner wouldve been kicked off the line had we marked each post. It infuriates me when, as we probably were all told when we were 8, put a man on both posts. Why we choose not to is beyond me. Seems to be the modern way for some reason. 

I tend to agree, but just to present the counter-argument, it is worth remembering that putting a man of both posts means you are leaving 2 opposition players unmarked.