Sweeneys Penalties Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 On 1/21/2017 at 17:17, Kim_il_sung said: And Im not talking about Lee Johnson. For too long, Steve Lansdown and the board have been immune to criticism because Steve is a local lad who is a city fan through and through. But just looking at this list demands answers. Coppell Millen McInnes O'Driscoll Cotterill Johnson All but Cotterill have been a complete failure overall and all bar Cotterill have been a complete failure at Championship level. All came to us with lots of promise and all have left being branded clueless and out of their depth. Co-incidence? I dont claim to have any inside knowledge or owt but it looks highly likely that the problems of our perpetual failures go far beyond making the wrong managerial appointments. Being in charge of this club is like having a poisoned chalice and being doomed to failure. There is something there... An individual, a system, a mindset that stops this club from moving forward. I dont know what it is, but it is fundamentally ingrained into the club and has been for years. The likes of Reading, Brighton, Preston and Huddersfield clearly have something behind the scenes that we do not. Its not money, resources or the prestige of being bigger clubs. So what is it? Lansdown, its time for you to look at these things closely and seriously because whilst it may be YOUR money, it is OUR club. And I for one am sick and tired of seing promise and talk turn into failure time and time and time again. No matter who our next managerial appointment is, I cant see anything but another failure at this time. wash, rinse and repeat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xiled Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 What's lost in all of this debate is no team, coach, owner or set of fans can guarantee success with any managerial appointment. Football is by its nature a losers' game. This season only 3 teams out of 24 in the Championship will have a reward for their 46 league matches. Some of our managers listed above have achieved seasons without relegation and regardless of our individual views that means they did not fail. Historically using all reasonable metrics we are a bad second tier club or a good third tier club. Why have managers who kept us in the Championship or the top half of League 1 failed? They didn't. The difference now is that our expectation is (rightly) greater. After spending £45M on the stadium and many millions on new players, we should be better than we are. That's why LJ will be sacked in the next few weeks. We cannot afford to be relegated with him in charge because the stakes are now higher. Very few managers retire with season after season of success. Funnily enough they tend to work for the top teams. We have never been a top team. All I want is mid-table mediocrity!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 perhaps it was MA's idea to hire LJ, and not SL's… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontariored Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 3 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said: perhaps it was MA's idea to hire LJ, and not SL's… Exactly, nobody on OTIB is aware of our management decision making process. We have nobody on the board who understands modern footie through and through!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said: perhaps it was MA's idea to hire LJ, and not SL's… It was...... Well........ at least that's the idea Steve has in mind to explain when the Press start asking this week !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inactive user Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Really pleased to see healthy debate about the club structure. These are the issues that need to be addressed. Sacking and appointing one manager after another just pushes the blame on someone else. I was extremely hopeful with the appointments of Coppell, DMC and to an extent SOD. Why do they all fail? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 If LJ does go I'd like us to go for a foreign manager. We've tried with many managers from these shores and it hasn't yet really worked so let's try setting different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontariored Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, Rednwhiterob said: Really pleased to see healthy debate about the club structure. These are the issues that need to be addressed. Sacking and appointing one manager after another just pushes the blame on someone else. I was extremely hopeful with the appointments of Coppell, DMC and to an extent SOD. Why do they all fail? They all fought with the owners. A double edged sword!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inactive user Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 1 minute ago, ontariored said: They all fought with the owners. A double edged sword!! Yes. I wonder if they were all in the wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 7 hours ago, Rednwhiterob said: Yes. I wonder if they were all in the wrong? I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busterrimes Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 On 21/01/2017 at 17:17, Londoner said: Cotterill i would argue was a big success. Correct and I believe was chosen by Keith Dawe and Steve Lansdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dolman Pragmatist Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 1 hour ago, Busterrimes said: Correct and I believe was chosen by Keith Dawe and Steve Lansdown. I heard that Steve was less than keen, but that Keith Dawe stuck his neck out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivorguy Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 Twenty years of going round in circles and still some blame the managers. Let us be crystal clear, our club is badly run by Board and owner. Their failure to acknowledge this for decades has got us where we are, i.e. Precisely nowhere. I am nonplussed by their overwhelming arrogance in not seeking professional help I am really low about our short and medium term prospects unless the club is given a massive shake up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City since 67 Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 I remembered reading this a while ago, and you have to ask has anything really changed since McInnes left.... THEY says honesty is the best policy. And, Derek McInnes hasn't held back in his brutal summary of what life was like as manager of Bristol City. The 44-year-old, who since leaving BS3 has gone on to forge a successful career as boss of Aberdeen, was handed the reins at Ashton Gate in 2011 but after an eventful two seasons was eventually sacked in January 2013. In an interview with the Times, McInnes says players were "hemorrhaging money" at the Robins and went onto say that "Everything at Bristol was a mess." Talking to Graham Spiers about how he needed to just "strip everything back" after moving to Scotland, McInnes said: "After Bristol I just needed to strip everything right back, and do the job the way any football manager is supposed to do his job. "Bristol City had fought relegation for three or four seasons prior to me. I kept the club up in 2012 and, looking back now, that was when I was in my strongest position there. At the end of that season I should have been kicking and screaming to finally get things done properly at that club. "We had players haemorrhaging money at Ashton Gate, earning 14k or 15k a week which the club couldn't afford. But I wasn't convinced the club wanted to deal with the situation. I had four different managers' signings in the dressing room. It was incredible. "I remember one of my first days at training; all these players parked their cars and came over the hill towards me in their red training gear. There was maybe 40 or 50 of them — it was like watching Zulus coming towards me. I had to try to ship loads of them out on loan and get the squad down to an acceptable level." McInnes took over at City with the club lying in the Championship relegation zone. However, an eight-game unbeaten run saw City survive and play another season in the the second tier of English football. The next season saw the Robins fall to a club record seven successive defeats, and McInnes saw himself out the door in January of 2013. He went onto say: "We managed to keep the club up in 2012, having been way adrift when I arrived there. The board had said, 'if we go down with Derek McInnes, we'll come back with Derek McInnes'. I had regiments of players I had to move on, but these guys had nowhere to go. Bristol City was Utopia to them — they were on great money. The club was vastly over-paying its players by thousands of pounds per week."Everything at Bristol was a mess, including some of the posturing for power in the boardroom. That's why I said, at Aberdeen, I just needed simplicity. I needed to get back to doing what a football manager does."Bristol City taught me one key lesson — when things are going your way, and you are hot, then insist there and then on getting things done. Because it can all change so quickly. You go from a king to a clown." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 This is a very good thread, because however way you look at it, whatever we seem to do, it doesn't work. We've been run poorly as a Professional Club for years. Every manager has failed long term. Right now, I'd say as a Club, we are set up better than we've ever been before. However...we aren't getting results on the pitch AGAIN. I'm not sure what the answer is. Another manager could come in, and we could find ourselves in exactly the same position again in a years time. We've spent money, and bought some decent players in. On paper...we shouldn't be where we are. I think LJ and his team are doing the right thing, more so than any other time before. However...if results continue, he'll have to go. I watch the games, and we are doing exactly the same things as when we were winning. What I do see are less committed players in some instances. Nothing to do with tactics, positions or formations....just basic footballing errors. You've only got to look at the Highlights against Forest to see the same individual errors when chances arose or goal scored. GoN pointing and marking no one and out of position. Liitle giving too much space again. Look at the wall for the goal...can't work out who's on the end of the wall...but neither in it, marking no one, and makes no attempt to rush the free kick once it's touched. Now is that a managers fault or a players fault?...because it happens every game. Either way...for everyone saying sack the manager...Fair enough, I understand that. But with this owner, you've got someone who imo, feels the need to have a close working relationship with. He's got that with LJ. He didn't with SC come the end and SoD. I don't think a manager like for example a 'Warnock' type would work well with this owner or backroom staff that we've put together. Another manager would have to agree to fit in with the Clubs philosophy. Another manager wouldn't be able to come in and get rid of MA, Des, the other coach's, analysts. We've built all that up over recent seasons. Another new manager wouldn't be allowed to come in and rip all that up. Any new manager will have be 'the right fit' again. Whether fans agree with this or not, it's the reality. So when people are venting their frustrations against LJ and other forum users, and saying LJ must go, it's easier said than done. If they sack LJ and another manager is in exactly the same position this time next season...who do you blame? If that 'experienced' manager so many want comes in and finds himself in the same position, who are they going to blame? Is constantly sacking managers the answer? I don't know. Right now...can't see LJ changing it...or a new manager making a long term difference. If it were me as owner...I'd be hoping we still had a couple more players coming in this window. So in that respect, I'd be letting LJ stay to oversee the work gone in to doing all the back ground work on players. I'd be keeping tabs or any managers that could be the right fit and available. I'd probably give LJ a couple more league games...but if the players are still making the same mistakes, I'd make a change. Sometimes players just get better motivated by someone else, and in this instance I think a few players aren't giving their all for the Club or LJ. Hopefully it will get better and this part of the season will be seen as just a sorry awful blip....however it's a close call right now imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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