Robbored Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 Found these stats on another site so can't confirm their accuracy but you'll get the gist... Tinnion - sacked with City 22nd Johnson Sr -sacked with City 15th but essentially sacked himself. Millen - sacked with City 22nd McInnes - sacked with City 24th SoD. - sacked with City 22nd Cotterill -sacked with City 22nd. Looks like SL doesn't pull the "fire" trigger until City are in the drop zone. We can draw our own conclusions from that.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 I have said, let him have more time for weeks now, but am afraid that time is now up. It's getting from bad to worse. He will go after Rotherham beat us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honiton Tony Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 That will be next week then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottishRed Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 Assuming we exit the FA cup on Saturday, I suspect a bad defeat on Tuesday night will be the end point I think a change - maybe JP - will be required for a game we simply must win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 JP would be the cheapest option and possibly the best too. Problem is that nobody is available that I would want to take over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honiton Tony Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 SL will not hit the button until we hit the bottom and then i am not sure he will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 It's also worth considering when he didn't sack the manager. Notably, he didn't sack Gary Johnson when the team was bottom of league one with 16 points from 20 games having lost the last 9 games in all competitions. Granted 7 of those games (1-3-3) were under Tinnion, but plenty of people would have happily pushed the button at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dolman Pragmatist Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 4 minutes ago, BCFC_Dan said: It's also worth considering when he didn't sack the manager. Notably, he didn't sack Gary Johnson when the team was bottom of league one with 16 points from 20 games having lost the last 9 games in all competitions. Granted 7 of those games (1-3-3) were under Tinnion, but plenty of people would have happily pushed the button at that point. Nor did we sack Alan Dicks despite several season fighting relegation from then Division 2, before he led us into the top division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 14 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said: JP would be the cheapest option and possibly the best too. Problem is that nobody is available that I would want to take over. JP's a sound short term option but we really need a Championship proven manager when LJ finally goes. If he did well in the caretaker role he'd be an obvious and easy choice for SL perhaps, and no doubt his appointment wouldn't be wholly unpopular, but if we want to progress he'd be the wrong man for the job imo. Promoting Pembo full time would be just like Millen all over again, a trusted and long term coach, no doubt popular but over familliar with the players, being put in the hot seat for the wrong reasons, and the chances are too high that he'd be another to sink rather than swim. Fresh face and fresh ideas required, and preferably someone with a record in the game the players will respect and look up to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 58 minutes ago, Robbored said: Found these stats on another site so can't confirm their accuracy but you'll get the gist... Tinnion - sacked with City 22nd Johnson Sr -sacked with City 15th but essentially sacked himself. Millen - sacked with City 22nd McInnes - sacked with City 24th SoD. - sacked with City 22nd Cotterill -sacked with City 22nd. Looks like SL doesn't pull the "fire" trigger until City are in the drop zone. We can draw our own conclusions from that.. So, GJ 'sacked himself'. Presuming you are talking about what (allegedly) happened in the changing room at Plymouth But SoD didn't do so, in that interview where he waved away the questions And Cotts didn't by having a go at that fan after the Preston game? Odd that you remember the facts behind GJ leaving, but not others. Has something happened between the two of you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAl&Toby Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 18 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said: Nor did we sack Alan Dicks despite several season fighting relegation from then Division 2, before he led us into the top division. This is the most telling fact or stat for me and is what I was alluding to when I asked the question about our most successful manager in recent times. Terry Cooper did well. Joe Jordan too. Gary Johnson had success. Alan Dicks though - at least in my time - had the most. And City kept him through thick and thin and look where that ended up. Ok some might say 1982 but from a footballing perspective promotion to Division 1 has to be the best definition of success. I still say consistency is the key, with support where needed. Bit like riding a bike. Can't recall letting the young 'un fall off only to throw the bike on the ground. Keep holding the saddle and stick with it. I hope SL continues to hold LJ's! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 1 hour ago, Robbored said: Found these stats on another site so can't confirm their accuracy but you'll get the gist... Tinnion - sacked with City 22nd Johnson Sr -sacked with City 15th but essentially sacked himself. Millen - sacked with City 22nd McInnes - sacked with City 24th SoD. - sacked with City 22nd Cotterill -sacked with City 22nd. Looks like SL doesn't pull the "fire" trigger until City are in the drop zone. We can draw our own conclusions from that.. Yes we can and I'm afraid it smacks of someone who is reactive, conservative and at worst probably someone too proud to admit they've made a mistake by sacking the person who they appointed into the role of manager. You could make a case for all of the above having being kept for far too long. A visionary or someone more proactive would've acted faster or more decisively as per Adkins/Pochettino. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 25, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 23 minutes ago, Woodsy said: So, GJ 'sacked himself'. Presuming you are talking about what (allegedly) happened in the changing room at Plymouth But SoD didn't do so, in that interview where he waved away the questions And Cotts didn't by having a go at that fan after the Preston game? Odd that you remember the facts behind GJ leaving, but not others. Has something happened between the two of you? You seem to be missing point of this thread here Woodsy.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 5 minutes ago, Robbored said: You seem to be missing point of this thread here Woodsy.... No, I got the point, thank you Another thread about SL sacking, not sacking LJ. Just what we needed, zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz You seem to be missing the point of my question, however Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 25, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 33 minutes ago, Woodsy said: So, GJ 'sacked himself'. Presuming you are talking about what (allegedly) happened in the changing room at Plymouth But SoD didn't do so, in that interview where he waved away the questions And Cotts didn't by having a go at that fan after the Preston game? It's common knowledge that Senior Johnson lost control of himself at Plymouth and ended up being removed from the changing room by senior players having got into a very unprofessional fracas. SoD was difficult to work with as we saw from his dealings with the media. He's the Jeremy Corbyn of the football world. Cotterill was unwilling to buy into SLs strategy which was why he was sacked. But.....the point of this thread was to highlight the pattern of what the league position is when managers get sacked., not to discuss other reasons why they were sacked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 7 minutes ago, Robbored said: It's common knowledge that Senior Johnson lost control of himself at Plymouth and ended up being removed from the changing room by senior players having got into a very unprofessional fracas. SoD was difficult to work with as we saw from his dealings with the media. He's the Jeremy Corbyn of the football world. Cotterill was unwilling to buy into SLs strategy which was why he was sacked. But.....the point of this thread was to highlight the pattern of what the league position is when managers get sacked., not to discuss other reasons why they were sacked. He was turning things around according to some..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1960maaan Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 8 minutes ago, Robbored said: But.....the point of this thread was to highlight the pattern of what the league position is when managers get sacked., not to discuss other reasons why they were sacked. So , one more League game then . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 1 hour ago, Robbored said: Found these stats on another site so can't confirm their accuracy but you'll get the gist... Tinnion - sacked with City 22nd Johnson Sr -sacked with City 15th but essentially sacked himself. Millen - sacked with City 22nd McInnes - sacked with City 24th SoD. - sacked with City 22nd Cotterill -sacked with City 22nd. Looks like SL doesn't pull the "fire" trigger until City are in the drop zone. We can draw our own conclusions from that.. I think I see a pattern here. Is it Bristol City? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 39 minutes ago, Robbored said: But.....the point of this thread was to highlight the pattern of what the league position is when managers get sacked., not to discuss other reasons why they were sacked. Or sack themselves If the point of the thread was to highlight the point at which SL pulled the trigger, you didn't need to have the pointless dig at GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCulturalBomb Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 An interesting way to look at it is where they go and their success once they leave Bristol City. None of our managers in the past 2 decades have gone on to any form of success as a proper manager maybe except Pulis and you could argue Mcinnes has done well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 41 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said: Nor did we sack Alan Dicks despite several season fighting relegation from then Division 2, before he led us into the top division. Expectations were lower at that time, but even then Dicks came very close to the sack on a number of occasions as he's since admitted - the Leeds Cup win famously being one unlikely triumph which kept him in the job by the skin of his teeth. Fans won't put up with season after season of div. 2 struggle these days, we know AG crowds tend to drop each season even in this division if we're struggling and when that stagnation gets the upper hand at City it's always the inevitable road to eventual and demoralising relegation. The game in general is less stable now. Fans were more used to their club to remaining in the same division in the late 60's/early70's - there are more promotion and relegation places now so there's a quicker turnover of clubs in each division. Dicks' 4 consecutive seasons of struggle, including 2 near relegations, would not be acceptable now. In those days football was cheap entertainment, more fans went every week out of habit, or just paid on the day on a whim, and crowds remained remarkably stable between 14k and 16k throughout those 4 years. These days though most fans pay up front and the prospect of more of the same would see ST sales drop, with even some of those ST holders who did purchase liable to stop attending, and the detrimental affect on the club would be far quicker and more visible. Fans get bored and frustrated with watching a struggling team, chairmen likewise, so, rightly or wrongly there's far less patience - something the far better paid managers of today are well aware of when they take the job. Unless you're one of the bigger clubs in the division ( i.e. City in L1) staying in the same division for a number of years usually means you'll be struggling sooner or later, and maybe constantly, and a club simply can't sell itself as a good spend for ST's if the fans can foresee the team's going to be near the bottom of the table, will lose alot, and that they won't be entertained much in the process. Like it or not it's a different football world to AD's time now. Mediocrity, or worse, is not enough. Progress needs to be shown each season and clubs and chairmen have to show ambition and 'go for it' or the supporter base will dwindle. That might mean ruthlessly changing your manager with some regularity until you're certain you've get the right one to match your club's immediate and stated ambition - and he's proving it by results on the pitch - may actually be the ONLY way forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 43 minutes ago, Woodsy said: Or sack themselves If the point of the thread was to highlight the point at which SL pulled the trigger, you didn't need to have the pointless dig at GJ Far be it from me to defend Robbored but I think GJ was the only one in the list who required some clarification. SC and SO'D both did things other than bad results that might have contributed to their dismissal but the main reason was the team being in the relegation zone. GJ was sacked with the team clear of the relegation zone (if on a poor run and possibly heading there anyway), so the extra circumstances are worth mentioning (or alluding to). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 25, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 1 minute ago, BCFC_Dan said: Far be it from me to defend Robbored but I think GJ was the only one in the list who required some clarification. SC and SO'D both did things other than bad results that might have contributed to their dismissal but the main reason was the team being in the relegation zone. GJ was sacked with the team clear of the relegation zone (if on a poor run and possibly heading there anyway), so the extra circumstances are worth mentioning (or alluding to). I delighted that someone appreciates why GJ was dismissed when, compared to other sacked managers he was in 15th place. All the others were in the drop zone. That was obviously lost on Woodsy.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontariored Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 Thank you everyone. I am finding it all entertaining. Popping out to do some shopping!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milo1111 Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 2 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said: Yes we can and I'm afraid it smacks of someone who is reactive, conservative and at worst probably someone too proud to admit they've made a mistake by sacking the person who they appointed into the role of manager. You could make a case for all of the above having being kept for far too long. A visionary or someone more proactive would've acted faster or more decisively as per Adkins/Pochettino. Exactly. Apart from gary johnson who had only been here 2 months anyway when was the last time SLs faith has been rewarded and his man turned things around?? I cant think of one apart from GJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelton’s Love Gravy Posted January 25, 2017 Report Share Posted January 25, 2017 I liked GJ. He was a good one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric04 Posted January 26, 2017 Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 15 hours ago, TheCulturalBomb said: An interesting way to look at it is where they go and their success once they leave Bristol City. None of our managers in the past 2 decades have gone on to any form of success as a proper manager maybe except Pulis and you could argue Mcinnes has done well. GJ got Yeovil into the Championship after leaving us - huge achievement, albeit they then went back down again (hardly surprising considering their budget and crowds). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidercity1987 Posted January 26, 2017 Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 18 hours ago, Robbored said: Found these stats on another site so can't confirm their accuracy but you'll get the gist... Tinnion - sacked with City 22nd Johnson Sr -sacked with City 15th but essentially sacked himself. Millen - sacked with City 22nd McInnes - sacked with City 24th SoD. - sacked with City 22nd Cotterill -sacked with City 22nd. Looks like SL doesn't pull the "fire" trigger until City are in the drop zone. We can draw our own conclusions from that.. Shows what a lunacy sacking Johnson was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 26, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 12 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said: Shows what a lunacy sacking Johnson was Sure.......of course.............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted January 26, 2017 Report Share Posted January 26, 2017 15 hours ago, BCFC_Dan said: Far be it from me to defend Robbored but I think GJ was the only one in the list who required some clarification. SC and SO'D both did things other than bad results that might have contributed to their dismissal but the main reason was the team being in the relegation zone. GJ was sacked with the team clear of the relegation zone (if on a poor run and possibly heading there anyway), so the extra circumstances are worth mentioning (or alluding to). My point, and I think it was rather obvious, was that there was no need for the comment. We all know GJ sussed Robbo out, time to let this go. We all know the reasons behind it 15 hours ago, Robbored said: I delighted that someone appreciates why GJ was dismissed when, compared to other sacked managers he was in 15th place. All the others were in the drop zone. That was obviously lost on Woodsy.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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