Angus Scott

[Red-Robbo]

1 minute ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

I said he understood football , not that he was a good manager !!!

Two different things

 

Phew! I was worried for you there or a minute Bob!

[steviestevieneville]

32 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

That might explain why he's so ridiculously awful in interview then !!!!!

Steve Lansdown advising on how to deal with the press 

Hmmmmmm

Says it all really

Nothing like advice from an expert 

Mind you he's so good at deflection and spin I think he took advice from Joesph goebbles 

[Greedo]

6 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

You know it is an interesting period for City fans when the Steve Cotterill haters of yesteryear are now posting that he was a misunderstood genius whose last season was sabotaged by the bloke who had appointed him, and had just given him a contract extension and huge pay rise....        

SC wasn't Lansdown's man, he was Dawe's

Not pretending to be itk, but I remember at the time we appointed SC that we came very close to giving him the gig several times before but SL personally veto'd it. He never wanted him. 

[Greedo]

6 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

You know it is an interesting period for City fans when the Steve Cotterill haters of yesteryear are now posting that he was a misunderstood genius whose last season was sabotaged by the bloke who had appointed him, and had just given him a contract extension and huge pay rise....        

SC wasn't Lansdown's man, he was Dawe's

Not pretending to be itk, but I remember at the time we appointed SC that we came very close to giving him the gig several times before but SL personally veto'd it. He never wanted him. 

[Red-Robbo]

1 minute ago, Greedo said:

SC wasn't Lansdown's man, he was Dawe's

Not pretending to be itk, but I remember at the time we appointed SC that we came very close to giving him the gig several times before but SL personally veto'd it. He never wanted him. 

If he hadn't wanted him he'd hardly have appointed him when he did. He owns 97% of the shares. He'll do what he wants - as would I if I was in his position.

It's a matter of record that Dawes put forward the name of Cotterill, but if Lansdown hadn't have wanted him in 2013 he wouldn't have ever come here. dawes couldn't appoint someone without the owner's agreement.

[lenred]

45 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

We have a history of rumours of outside interference from the board. And guess what, so does nearly every other club. 

When things go wrong, "the suits" get it wherever you are and whether it is really their fault or not. Who likes a suit after all.

You stated earlier that the formation played rigidly by Cotterill wasn't the problem, but recruitment was. In which case, how did Pembo and Johnson pull free of the drop zone with the same group of players? 

Cotterill was in my opinion very blasé about that summer's recruitment.  There needed to be considerable strengthening and not just in the strike force.  I think he had underestimated how tough the Championship would be, having had such success in lower leagues. 

This season's failings gave been debated extensively,  but are not relevant to Cotterill's failure.

 

You've said this a couple of times now. Do you really think that people are upset with Lansdown and Ashton because of their status (i.e. being a 'suit')? Or is it because of their actions (or lack of) regard LJ?

Think you do most people a discredit if you think they'd brazenly apportion blame simply because of a social status. It's the lack of action from these people that's the problem. 

[Red-Robbo]

Just now, lenred said:

You've said this a couple of times now. Do you really think that people are upset with Lansdown and Ashton because of their status (i.e. being a 'suit')? Or is it because of their actions (or lack of) regard LJ?

Think you do most people a discredit if you think they'd brazenly apportion blame simply because of a social status. It's the lack of action from these people that's the problem. 

I'm upset about the lack of action too. However I don't subscribe to this theory that everything Lansdown has done in the past must therefore be bad. Every decision. Every sacking. Everything could have been done better by some hypothetical other owner - an owner able to afford the ground improvements we've had. 

His stubbornness over LJ is really turning me off the bloke. IF we just survive the season that isn't in any way an achievement, given the funds spent.It's really pitiful.

However i'm not going to say I blame Lansdown for other managers' mistakes. Others here are, hence my comments.

[Rich]

1 hour ago, Cheesleysmate said:

Yep. Cotts laid it on the line that promoting academy players in the Championship was a no no. He wanted proven quality whether they were under 24 or over. Lansdown said no. Then no signings were made, Cotterill was pissy as **** and then the joke last minute bids were made for Gray and Gayle to try and make it look like City were serious. Then they left Cotts to work with what he had and it failed. He couldn't play his 3-5-2 because the quality wasn't there but continued with it almost to prove a point and as a result got the Sir Steve bullet.

Got to say, in my opinion, that's 100 percent correct.

[lenred]

Just now, Red-Robbo said:

I'm upset about the lack of action too. However I don't subscribe to this theory that everything Lansdown has done in the past must therefore be bad. Every decision. Every sacking. Everything could have been done better by some hypothetical other owner - an owner able to afford the ground improvements we've had. 

His stubbornness over LJ is really turning me off the bloke. IF we just survive the season that isn't in any way an achievement, given the funds spent.It's really pitiful.

However i'm not going to say I blame Lansdown for other managers' mistakes. Others here are, hence my comments.

Fair play RR.  Thought you were saying people were blaming them simply because of their position / status as opposed to their actions or lack of. Think I probably misunderstood you so apologies, it's past my bedtime! 

[Nbafc]

"No, Lansdown sacked Cotterill at the right time. The fact that he hasn't done that with Johnson doesn't make previous managers any less deserving of their P45s."

A popular view at the time I remember, but I always I thought Lansdown sacked him at the wrong time.

I thought if Steve Cotterill wasn't the best man for BCFC on the 14th January then he shouldn't of been the best man on the 29th December, a day after a 4-0 thumping at Burnley and 3 days after a failure to beat relegation rivals Charlton (who had lost 12 of their previous 20 league games) at home.

I thought it was common sense to give a new man as much time as possible in a  transfer window. Surely an experienced owner knew the man coming in would have nearly no chance in getting in the players he wanted 2 weeks before the deadline?

It always occurred to me that the timing of SC's departure could possibly be due to a non football incident and I wondered if i was the only one?

 Like this

[Jin]

21 hours ago, exAtyeoMax said:

Ben Gladwin from Swindon was mentioned to me… Cotts refused to play him because SL got him in, against his wishes.

Didn't he get injured very quickly and sent back to QPR?

['Orns]

12 hours ago, Nbafc said:

"No, Lansdown sacked Cotterill at the right time. The fact that he hasn't done that with Johnson doesn't make previous managers any less deserving of their P45s."

A popular view at the time I remember, but I always I thought Lansdown sacked him at the wrong time.

I thought if Steve Cotterill wasn't the best man for BCFC on the 14th January then he shouldn't of been the best man on the 29th December, a day after a 4-0 thumping at Burnley and 3 days after a failure to beat relegation rivals Charlton (who had lost 12 of their previous 20 league games) at home.

I thought it was common sense to give a new man as much time as possible in a  transfer window. Surely an experienced owner knew the man coming in would have nearly no chance in getting in the players he wanted 2 weeks before the deadline?

It always occurred to me that the timing of SC's departure could possibly be due to a non football incident and I wondered if i was the only one?

 Like this

Ah, the 4-0 thumping at Burnley. I seem to remember a few of us on here won a lot of money that day. They were something daft like 10/11 to win

If ever there was a footballing 'nap of the day' then that was it. A bit like Preston being 5/6 (I think) on Tuesday

 

[SuperDziek]

Lots of stuff on here about Cotterill.  At the time it seemed like he should go, and maybe time plays tricks on your mind about how bad things were (or werent), but I'd have him back now.  The stories about what happened in that summer transfer window have done the rounds for some time now from different sources - how different things could have been.  What a bond that promotion team had not only with themselves, but with the fans.

Anyway, two years ago since we beat Swindle at home 3-0.  I love Cotterill's reaction to the third goal going in, and how much it meant (to all of us as well!)  Have a gander at it on the youtube.

[exAtyeoMax]

1 hour ago, CityLew said:

Didn't he get injured very quickly and sent back to QPR?

I think he did.I got the wrong man. It was probably Simon Cox.

[Natchfever]

Cotts had to go unfortunately. We were being relegated whilst he stuck to his guns. Everyone could see it wasn't working and he was simply making a point, and minor tinkering by Pembo and Wade brought it on track.

I wanted Cotts to succeed, and expected him to be backed. I am as ITK as 99.99% of people on here in that I know jack shit, but enough has been implied that SL intervened on two transfers which undermined the manager, who then spat out his dummy.

Last seasons cluster **** looks like a triumph compared to this complete and utter shambles though.

[Boston Red]

21 hours ago, Olé said:

Personally I wouldn't say the owner buggers up our managers' chances, but I do think that NOW there is something more than is visible to us, that explains the stubbornness and may relate to the level of influence and access the owner has with the incumbent. You can pick up on it even from direct quotes. 

Cotterill's successful season was the exception because we'd dug such a big hole, I believe he was given free reign. We didn't hear about pillars or structure. Whether or not the time was right to sack Cotterill, the haste we got Johnson and returned to prior operating strategy tells me it was always the aim.

Lansdown rode the Cotterill horse on Cotterill's terms as long as it got us up the league, when it faltered, it was always back to plan A - and quickly. There is nothing necessarily wrong with Plan A, but in parallel I suggest SL's interest also evolved as the structure could afford him greater insight and control.

That is natural for any business leader. And if you look at Lansdown's tenure of the football club, he's gone from the starry eyed owner who bonded with Gary Johnson and picked up the mic now and again to get affirmation from fans, to having to become more personally involved due to managerial turnover.

That's come to a head this season with a family friend as "head coach", and a far more bullish and secure position for him with a giant new stand with his name on it that he sits atop. I think it's far more symbolic for him that we realise. The humbled, shy, low-confidence custodian of the club is now firmly entrenched. 

As stated elsewhere, my guess is he now does have access and influence over footballing matters - even if it's through passive manipulation - and that is a contributing factor to the retention of Lee Jonhson. The Lansdown of old would've been terrified of not being popular - he doesn't seek to appease us now.

In terms of Lansdown's influence, there are three things that stick out that back all this up.

1. When Tinnion was struggling as manager, we had a home game on the tv against Colchester. We played nervously and drew 0-0. In those days SL took questions from fans on otib. One fan said that Tinnion must have made a real mess-up of the teamtalk. Lansdown said that he was in the dressing room before the match for the teamtalk and it was fine. Should a chairman be in the dressing room?

2. We recently learnt that SL and LJ talk before and after a game. I would find this an oppressive environment to work in, but ideal for a jolly yes man like Millen, or someone who can talk the talk like LJ. For a man who can do the job like Cotterill, not so much. Alex Ferguson never spoke to the Glazers about football once.

3. After Coppell left, he went on Talk Sport. They asked him why he quit BCFC. He said "I was a bit disappointed with the environment I found myself in." Very telling remark from a manager who had succeeded and who knew what a successful environment at a football club looks like. And he bolted after only a few months!!! 

[Portland Bill]

15 hours ago, Nbafc said:

"No, Lansdown sacked Cotterill at the right time. The fact that he hasn't done that with Johnson doesn't make previous managers any less deserving of their P45s."

A popular view at the time I remember, but I always I thought Lansdown sacked him at the wrong time.

I thought if Steve Cotterill wasn't the best man for BCFC on the 14th January then he shouldn't of been the best man on the 29th December, a day after a 4-0 thumping at Burnley and 3 days after a failure to beat relegation rivals Charlton (who had lost 12 of their previous 20 league games) at home.

I thought it was common sense to give a new man as much time as possible in a  transfer window. Surely an experienced owner knew the man coming in would have nearly no chance in getting in the players he wanted 2 weeks before the deadline?

It always occurred to me that the timing of SC's departure could possibly be due to a non football incident and I wondered if i was the only one?

 Like this

Ive always been convinced it was non football related, simply because of the timing. He was sacked on a Thursday evening 'after' doing the pre match press conference for game on the Saturday. If it was just a results based sacking it would have been on any of the previous four days after the previous Saturday's game.

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

11 minutes ago, Boston Red said:

In terms of Lansdown's influence, there are three things that stick out that back all this up.

1. When Tinnion was struggling as manager, we had a home game on the tv against Colchester. We played nervously and drew 0-0. In those days SL took questions from fans on otib. One fan said that Tinnion must have made a real mess-up of the teamtalk. Lansdown said that he was in the dressing room before the match for the teamtalk and it was fine. Should a chairman be in the dressing room?

2. We recently learnt that SL and LJ talk before and after a game. I would find this an oppressive environment to work in, but ideal for a jolly yes man like Millen, or someone who can talk the talk like LJ. For a man who can do the job like Cotterill, not so much. Alex Ferguson never spoke to the Glazers about football once.

3. After Coppell left, he went on Talk Sport. They asked him why he quit BCFC. He said "I was a bit disappointed with the environment I found myself in." Very telling remark from a manager who had succeeded and who knew what a successful environment at a football club looks like. And he bolted after only a few months!!! 

1.  Why on earth not?

2.  Really?  Oppressive for the Head Coach to talk to the owner before and after a match?  The fact that Ferguson didn't speak to the Glazers says a lot about the Glazers' involvement in football, which was little short of criminal.

3.  Please don't say you're defending Coppell's behaviour!  Nearly every football manager comes into a club at a point when it is in at least partial disarray.  I do not believe that Coppell did not understand the position at City before he came in: if he did, he must have been very naive.

Can't see that what you are saying about Lansdown in any of the above examples sticks.  My gripe with him has always been the appointment of Brian Tinnion as manager, which even at the time looked extremely foolhardy.

 

[Nbafc]

"My gripe with him has always been the appointment of Brian Tinnion as manager, which even at the time looked extremely foolhardy."

Only part of your reply I agree with but good point!

I remember a shellshocked BT sat in a midweek local football show with Richard Latham shortly after his dismissal. Explaining his circumstances he said he had requested an experienced DoF be brought in to work with him but SL did not acquiesce.