Tickets and Inflation

[Bar BS3]

12 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

It's an interesting one, people who have been priced out of going. I wonder if there is any data on fans lost for financial reasons.

Reality is though, football - like loads of other social activities - aren't a necessity, they are a form of entertainment. 

Some people spend their cash of Sky subscriptions and get their football that way.

I'd hazard a guess that any TV subscription that includes the sport channels costs considerably more than a season ticket to go and watch your local club. 

Sadly sitting at home is preferable to a lot of people who then perhaps claim that they can't afford a season ticket. 

Sky sports is the main route of problems in modern day football. Player wages, ticket prices, arm chair fans, game timings etc. 

[Welcome To The Jungle]

20 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

It's an interesting one, people who have been priced out of going. I wonder if there is any data on fans lost for financial reasons.

Reality is though, football - like loads of other social activities - aren't a necessity, they are a form of entertainment. 

Some people spend their cash of Sky subscriptions and get their football that way.

True, but the reason football gained such support is that it was the cheapest thing to do on a Saturday. Slowly but surely the game in this country has rejected or is rejecting the very people (the working class) who made it what it is. And if you look at the atmosphere and feeling at teams overseas, you can see what benefits that inclusiveness can bring in terms of atmosphere and fans wanting to make a difference. In addition it is healthy do get out and do something once a week. Reducing stress and chances of depression by allowing a person to socialise and have a passion. I'd say that at least one activity a week out side of work is a necessity. 

As for the sky thing, it is cheaper to get a sky sports month pass for the 10 months of the football season than it is to get a ST at AG. This at the very least should be the price band to beat surely.

Edit: @Bar BS3 In reference to your above post about sky, you can get 10 months for the football season for £34 a month, so £340 for the season. (Although this is just for Sky Sports not all of sky)

[Bar BS3]

17 minutes ago, Welcome To The Jungle said:

I agree with your last point that if you reduce the price and it does not have the desired effect then you cannot simply put them back up. However if you look at the case studies like Bradford, like Huddersfield then gates have gone up and the clubs are really pushing for full gates each week. A full ground really adds to the football experience too.

The other case study I'd like to examine is that of Cardiff City. Their last season at Ninian they averaged just over 18k at home. The following season saw their gates increase at the new ground. However upon their relegation back to the Championship, their gates have slumped back to averaging around 16k. If you allow for the bigger away end due to the further expansion of their stadium, then the home gates have fallen by about 2.5k since their last season at Ninian despite being in the same division. 

You could argue that the Vincent Tan red kit fiasco contributed towards this but those two season were huge gates. What happens when you rely on nice facilities and the on the pitch performance, you may see gains, but any kind of slump can leave you with a half full ground. AG needs to be somewhere special to bring people to the ground, even if we're not doing so well. Part of that is creating a real sense of community and family, rather than that of customer and supplier. A big part of that is showing all supporters that their support is valued more than their cash. And if that means we have to be a bit more careful with our money and can't buy 5.3 million strikers as rumoured then I'd say that is nothing but a good thing.  

Cardiff's reduction is largely down to (as with most clubs who go up and down again) the fact that they had artificially increased attendances due to premier league football. Sadly, what most clubs aspire too. 

Interestingly, despite notable increase in attendances at bothHuddersfield and Bradford, due to very cheap season tickets, it's worth noting that Huddersfields average attendance was just 1,000 more than our own, in a season the were promoted to the premier league! No doubt, even at current prices, our average would have eclipsed theirs, in that position of success throughout the season. 

Bradford's average, albeit impressive at L1 level, was still lower than ours, despite season tickets costing considerably less than half of our prices. 

Bothclubs in areas densely populated with other, bigger, local clubs. 

We have a large catchment area, without meaningful competition. And our fan base is growing, not shrinking, even if it may perhaps be changing. 

Was Ashton Gate packed to the rafters with people from Knowle & Hartcliffe at the reduced ticket prices Vs premier league Hull..? No. 

Did the £10 ticket offers V Rotherham & Blackburn lead to a sell out on the back of our heartland working class support all clamouring for the reduced tickets? No. 

Was the ground full of working class traditional City followers who had more recently been priced out of attending football Vs Birmingham? No. Not noticeably anyway. 

I don't think people/punters are actually as price sensitive as people often assume. Look at the price of any entertainment nowadays. The cost of eating out, drinking out, weekends away, gigs, festivals, even going to the cinema. All vastly more expensive that they used to be, but people find the money when it's something they want to do.

I can't honestly see that charging £10 a game rather than £17 per game season tickets will really attract that many more people. They probably don't go more regularly because they simply don't fancy it, or it's just one of many entertainments that they take in. 

If we make the Premier league, we will be sold out. When we come back down, numbers will reduce again. 

One of the "downsides" to living in a great, vibrant, multicultural city, as we do, is that there are so many things to do. One of which is football, but not every other week, for most.

 

[Welcome To The Jungle]

1 hour ago, Bar BS3 said:

Cardiff's reduction is largely down to (as with most clubs who go up and down again) the fact that they had artificially increased attendances due to premier league football. Sadly, what most clubs aspire too. 

Interestingly, despite notable increase in attendances at bothHuddersfield and Bradford, due to very cheap season tickets, it's worth noting that Huddersfields average attendance was just 1,000 more than our own, in a season the were promoted to the premier league! No doubt, even at current prices, our average would have eclipsed theirs, in that position of success throughout the season. 

Bradford's average, albeit impressive at L1 level, was still lower than ours, despite season tickets costing considerably less than half of our prices. 

Bothclubs in areas densely populated with other, bigger, local clubs. 

We have a large catchment area, without meaningful competition. And our fan base is growing, not shrinking, even if it may perhaps be changing. 

Was Ashton Gate packed to the rafters with people from Knowle & Hartcliffe at the reduced ticket prices Vs premier league Hull..? No. 

Did the £10 ticket offers V Rotherham & Blackburn lead to a sell out on the back of our heartland working class support all clamouring for the reduced tickets? No. 

Was the ground full of working class traditional City followers who had more recently been priced out of attending football Vs Birmingham? No. Not noticeably anyway. 

I don't think people/punters are actually as price sensitive as people often assume. Look at the price of any entertainment nowadays. The cost of eating out, drinking out, weekends away, gigs, festivals, even going to the cinema. All vastly more expensive that they used to be, but people find the money when it's something they want to do.

I can't honestly see that charging £10 a game rather than £17 per game season tickets will really attract that many more people. They probably don't go more regularly because they simply don't fancy it, or it's just one of many entertainments that they take in. 

If we make the Premier league, we will be sold out. When we come back down, numbers will reduce again. 

One of the "downsides" to living in a great, vibrant, multicultural city, as we do, is that there are so many things to do. One of which is football, but not every other week, for most.

 

So firstly Cardiffs attendance climbed into the 22,23k mark after moving to the CCS. So the artificial increase in attendance that the new ground and top flight football brought has left them with smaller crowds after it all settled down. 

Regarding both Huddersfield and Bradford you pointed out that both clubs saw increased attendances despite being in densely populated areas. I'd argue that if lowering ticket prices see increases in attendance for two clubs with plenty of rivals, imagine how a club with just one rival within 40 miles would see its attendances rise.

As for the offers this year, AG didn't fill in its entirety but they did offer our biggest gates of the league season, with the Hull game being league cup and gates being down consistently across the country. In fact we saw players like Moore, Engvall and McCoulsky playing so the game wasn't being taken too seriously by anyone.

However I believe that there is a real disillusionment with both City and Rovers among many people in Bristol. If you walk around on a Saturday in town I'm sure you'd see more Man U, Chelsea, Liverpool shirts than City or Rovers. So how do you get people back in? Well I went to my first City game because my father took me. In fact many people attend their first game not because they fancy it, but because they are taken by a friend or family member. Therefore to re-engage you need to make it as easy as possible for a fan to bring a friend or family member. Football is a drug and drugs are easier to get hooked on if there are more users and the drugs are cheaper. A crass analogy I'm sure but one that I think rings true. The best ambassadors for this club are the fans. Lower ticket prices mean more fans can act as ambassadors and bring friends, and it also makes bringing other people easier. 

There is a good reason why Dortmund, a City not too much bigger than Bristol and big Bundesliga rivals Schalke on their doorstep, can pull 80,000 every week with 30,000 (I believe this is correct but I may be wrong) on a Season Ticket waiting list. Sure, top football helps but Dortmund are not on the same level as Bayern, Barca, Real, Man U etc. Despite this they are the best supported team in Europe and maybe the world. The reason for this is a commitment to its supporters when it comes to pricing and supporting fans with their displays. Dortmund has become almost an overused cliche, but for good reason, when it comes to putting fans first and growing a club. As a result they are revered world wide not for their success, but by their identity.

As for your argument regarding Bristol being so vibrant, then I'd say lower prices to compete with everything else the City has to offer. I'd also say to City to embrace the City. Next upfest (north street festival of street art) get artists to paint parts of AG with a huge City mural like the one on the side of the Tobacco factory. If there is a festival on the harbour side, get a small stand down there or at least have a presence so no matter what people do in Bristol, City are never too far from their minds. 

All that said we can debate till the cows come home but we'd never know exactly what would happen, until/if they ever lowered prices. I fully understand that the status quo seems fairly rosy at the moment so it's not an easy call, but I honestly believe that football in Bristol and the whole UK would improve with a drop in prices. 

[foghornred]

I can't remember the prices but in the 70s I did a paper round and got pocket money and it was enough to go to football and have some left over to buy records.

Nowadays that sort of income would not get you into a match, inflation by 100's % and has the product got better ?

Happy days growing up.

[Bar BS3]

1 hour ago, foghornred said:

I can't remember the prices but in the 70s I did a paper round and got pocket money and it was enough to go to football and have some left over to buy records.

Nowadays that sort of income would not get you into a match, inflation by 100's % and has the product got better ?

Happy days growing up.

I'm pretty sure that the income from a paper round would get you an under 19 season ticket, quite comfirtably. 

[Judda]

On 6/23/2017 at 20:28, East End Old Boy said:

I'm sure I paid 7/6 for a ringside seat around that time. Hands up if you know what 7/6 was? 

1.167

[City Rocker]

3 hours ago, foghornred said:

I can't remember the prices but in the 70s I did a paper round and got pocket money and it was enough to go to football and have some left over to buy records.

Nowadays that sort of income would not get you into a match, inflation by 100's % and has the product got better ?

Happy days growing up.

Ah the 70s, football and music were the only things we had in those dark days weren't they?

Whereas now... oh actually they're still the only things I'm really interested in, though when I grow up I'll leave it all behind and take up some more worthy cultural pursuits. Almost certainly.