Inactive user Posted September 7, 2017 Posted September 7, 2017 Did anyone else hear anything about the possible Malaysian investors tonight? Apparently it's a group who already have sporting interests in other clubs. Not sure if this would be a good thing or not but perhaps it's a sign of intent to push on and make a real bid to get to the Premier League.
m42 Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 NO THANKS AT 1000 Decibels. If foreign investors become owners at Ashton Gate then I will seriously have to consider my position. I'm committed to a 180 mile round trip for home matches for a club I've supported for 60 years. Bristol City is a proper Bristol club. A magnificent stadium that brings tears to my eyes as I walk down from The Robins. And currently a great squad of players. The thought of it being owned by people who are just business focussed saddens me greatly. Mr Lansdown has some serious wealth. Perhaps he could consider a trust fund arrangement that would ensure that Bristol City remains in UK ownership. What a legacy that would be.
WayOutWest Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Have the Malaysians done their due diligence? They must be getting us mixed up with Moron FC. Championship sprinklers. Loyal fan base the world loves. Unique kit. Massive potential. Billy Fackin Bodin. Their manager loves dogs ... For more than eating #WeWannaBeCarriedDownGwosterLoad
RumRed Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 I thought SL said he would welcome outside investment a while ago? If so this maybe it, if true.
BS15_RED Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 5 hours ago, Rednwhiterob said: Did anyone else hear anything about the possible Malaysian investors tonight? Apparently it's a group who already have sporting interests in other clubs. Not sure if this would be a good thing or not but perhaps it's a sign of intent to push on and make a real bid to get to the Premier League. It's not Vincent Tan is it?
Inactive user Posted September 8, 2017 Author Posted September 8, 2017 11 minutes ago, 054123 said: Got to be a wind up. I can't quite square it, but heard from a sensible City mate. Hence my post to see if anyone else has heard anything.
Eddie Hitler Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 How do we improve upon a Bristolian owner who is not ladening the club with debt? I calculated that the gas will have fully drawn their debt facility of £10m secured upon the ground by March at which point, with all the assets mortgaged, the owners would need to start putting their own cash at risk. So I'd expect them to be sounding out potential buyers already and this may be the source of the OP.
BS15_RED Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 21 minutes ago, Rednwhiterob said: I can't quite square it, but heard from a sensible City mate. Hence my post to see if anyone else has heard anything. Any more details? Are we talking a complete buy out or is it SL possibly selling a part of his share?
ZiderEyed Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Surely this is a wind up? This cant be true, it'd be soul crushing. We're not the cardiff red dragons.
Port Said Red Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Investing in Bristol City or Bristol Sport? Can they do one without the other and would they want to?
sodburyred Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 As long as SL is still in overall charge, significant investment would be a great thing. It would most likely just add an extra face to the board of directors. If SL was to be selling though, that I would be worried about.
Monkeh Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 1 hour ago, RumRed said: I thought SL said he would welcome outside investment a while ago? If so this maybe it, if true. he would welcome the correct investment that had the clubs best interests at heart I think was the quote
Cowshed Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 1 hour ago, Eddie Hitler said: How do we improve upon a Bristolian owner who is not ladening the club with debt? I calculated that the gas will have fully drawn their debt facility of £10m secured upon the ground by March at which point, with all the assets mortgaged, the owners would need to start putting their own cash at risk. So I'd expect them to be sounding out potential buyers already and this may be the source of the OP. The club is in debt. Mr Lansdown could clear that debt and still be in total control of BCFC etc.
Phileas Fogg Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Look who the original poster is and ponder - 'is this likely to be a windup?'
wendyredredrobin Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Im sure that foreign investors could help if the deal was right. A foreign takeover, no way. However, nobody is ever going to make any money out of a football club, so the word investor is a bit of a misnomer Equally, money alone does not always bring success. Quite a few Champonship clubs have spent an awful lot and are still Championship clubs, yet how much have Huddersfield and Burnley spent?
BobBobSuperBob Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 8 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said: Im sure that foreign investors could help if the deal was right. A foreign takeover, no way. However, nobody is ever going to make any money out of a football club, so the word investor is a bit of a misnomer Equally, money alone does not always bring success. Quite a few Champonship clubs have spent an awful lot and are still Championship clubs, yet how much have Huddersfield and Burnley spent? Oh they are Wendy - albeit only a few There was an interesting radio piece the other day when the foreign ownership was discussed from a business perspective I can't remember the figures quoted but, in essence buy a Championship Club , invest to get promoted , get promoted to the Prem and your shares / Club / investment is suddenly worth x your investment I do think Chinese / Malaysian type investors must have looked at us - we'd be ripe in theory to be bought However , listening to MA speaking about SL , as a English , Bristolian , last night as the Clubs biggest asset , I can't see SL selling to a foreign owner (Could see him allowing some investment but can't see him ever relinquishing a majority shareholding)
RumRed Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 46 minutes ago, Monkeh said: he would welcome the correct investment that had the clubs best interests at heart I think was the quote Thanks Monkeh
shelts Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 I've not heard of this rumour before and I'm not really sure what to think . From what I've heard last night it wouldn't suit our current model . Would love to see us throw shed loads of money at it and what a giddy ride that would be . Is it in the evil post yet ?
Fat Cigar Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 3 hours ago, Eddie Hitler said: How do we improve upon a Bristolian owner who is not ladening the club with debt? I calculated that the gas will have fully drawn their debt facility of £10m secured upon the ground by March at which point, with all the assets mortgaged, the owners would need to start putting their own cash at risk. So I'd expect them to be sounding out potential buyers already and this may be the source of the OP. We can't. I dread the day we ever get taken over by an owner who couldn't give two hoots about our beloved club. Hopefully, that day will never come. Too many foreign owners are destroying so many of our football clubs. Although it's by no means just foreign owners. There have been/are some truly dreadful British owners.
MichaelRobartes Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 2 hours ago, Raging_Robin said: SL has stated in the past, the only way he would sell this club is if the buyers were credible and would benefit the club more than he would. If someone were to buy the club, I'm sure they wouldn't be cowboys and that they would invest heavily. I would welcome anything that would push this club forward, however, I can't see anyone pushing this club forward more than SL (in a sustainable way). David Moores said that same and then sold Liverpool to Hicks and Gillett. I'm sure he had the right intentions given his family's history with the club but he ended up selling to two guys who didn't benefit the club at all, quite the opposite. If that can happen to Liverpool it could absolutely happen to us.
Septic Peg Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Think this is bullshit. SL has created and funded BS with City and the Rugby and all the other factions for one reason only. A legacy. We all know JL will take the reins one day. It will become his baby and one he will nurture until it passes onwards. Any future owners would come after Jon.
Port Said Red Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 I know I am repeating myself, but would investment be in Bristol City or Bristol Sport? I am not enough of a businessman to work out whether these are two separate entities or whether they are so tightly knit now, that any investment could not be ring fenced into the football side. My impression from previous interviews etc, that part of the development of Bristol Sport was to negate any hostile takeover of the football club by foreign investors.
wendyredredrobin Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Problem with foreign investors is they invest a bit, then they hold 49% and soon it is 51% and they have control. As Donald keeps saying, "we shall see".
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 55 minutes ago, Port Said Red said: I know I am repeating myself, but would investment be in Bristol City or Bristol Sport? I am not enough of a businessman to work out whether these are two separate entities or whether they are so tightly knit now, that any investment could not be ring fenced into the football side. My impression from previous interviews etc, that part of the development of Bristol Sport was to negate any hostile takeover of the football club by foreign investors. Close but no cigar
Grey Fox Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 No one is going to "invest" without some aspect of "ownership", otherwise their "investment" is effectively just a "loan". To be an investment they would want an equity stake, so they make money if the share value goes up (i.e on promotion). That of course means by selling some of the shares SL would make less as he would have diluted his holdings. Bearing in mind what he has invested so far I can not see him doing this now , after he has completed the new stadium, bought the training ground and put money in to the team. If he was going to sell some of his shares it would have been before all that not after. Americans buy purely to make profits, Russians to get a higher profile and therefore les likely to suffer "an accident", Chinese to get in with their leader and Arabs for International recognition. Me, I prefer SL everyday of the week.
Grey Fox Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 1 hour ago, Port Said Red said: I know I am repeating myself, but would investment be in Bristol City or Bristol Sport? I am not enough of a businessman to work out whether these are two separate entities or whether they are so tightly knit now, that any investment could not be ring fenced into the football side. My impression from previous interviews etc, that part of the development of Bristol Sport was to negate any hostile takeover of the football club by foreign investors. Bristol Sport own Bristol City FC plus the others, therefore Bristol Sport as a whole could be sold, or Bristol Sport could sell Bristol City FC to someone else and retain the rugby etc
View from the Dolman Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 5 minutes ago, Grey Fox said: Bristol Sport own Bristol City FC plus the others, therefore Bristol Sport as a whole could be sold, or Bristol Sport could sell Bristol City FC to someone else and retain the rugby etc Bristol Sport doesn't own Bristol City.
wendyredredrobin Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 BCFC is owned by SL, not Bristol Sport. He bought a controlling holding from Scott Davidson if I remember correctly then lent City a lot of money which was then converted to equity. That's my understanding.
Inactive user Posted September 8, 2017 Author Posted September 8, 2017 My take is that SL could be persuaded if the terms we're right and say his reduced 65% stake (picking a figure out of the air) becomes worth more than his current 100% share because we end up in the Premier League as a result of investment. Seems sensible to me. BTW, not a wind up, hence just asking if anyone had heard anything. It's probably all piffle but who knows.
Sweeneys Penalties Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Agreed. Probably is a load of piffle, but I wouldn't throw the idea out without deeper consideration. Some foreign owners (we all know who they are) have been notorious but other clubs like Southampton have benefited from foreign money, as (currently) are Liverpool. Don't see too many Man City fans complaining either. If the rumour is true, it's "Jury out" for me til I know more
Betty Swallocks Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 6 minutes ago, Sweeneys Penalties said: Agreed. Probably is a load of piffle, but I wouldn't throw the idea out without deeper consideration. Some foreign owners (we all know who they are) have been notorious but other clubs like Southampton have benefited from foreign money, as (currently) are Liverpool. Don't see too many Man City fans complaining either. If the rumour is true, it's "Jury out" for me til I know more A lot of Liverpool fans are deeply unhappy with the owners up there.
Natchfever Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 2 hours ago, cynic said: Not for a minute am I saying that this rumour is true, but there is difference between ownership and investment. I'm sure SL would welcome investment without rescinding the ownership or even a part of it - he'd be mad not to (if its the "right" sort of investment of course). Investors generally want a return on their investment. In terms of many overseas investors in lower level football clubs the aim is to get to the promised land and then sell at a profit. FFP prevents much more investment on the playing side, and SL's decision to recruit a fairly inexperienced coach, plus the player recruitment policy indicates a longer term strategy which i'm not sure would be attractive to what could only be a minority stakeholder. Then you have the rugby/BS set up so any investor would I presume have to invest in the whole of BS ? Of course SL could simply flog the stadium, get back his investment and a new owner recoup over a longer period - 5% pa return on £50m split between the football and rugby clubs based upon matchday revenue ? Might mean City paying about £1.5m next season if the rugby club gets promoted. The rent could be fixed security of tenure established and SL could then continue to bankroll the club .
Sweeneys Penalties Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 32 minutes ago, Betty Swallocks said: A lot of Liverpool fans are deeply unhappy with the owners up there. you can only please some people some of the time....you can't please all of 'em all of the time
Admin Phantom Posted September 8, 2017 Admin Posted September 8, 2017 13 hours ago, Rednwhiterob said: Did anyone else hear anything about the possible Malaysian investors tonight? Apparently it's a group who already have sporting interests in other clubs. Not sure if this would be a good thing or not but perhaps it's a sign of intent to push on and make a real bid to get to the Premier League. Interesting news @Rednwhiterob, someone completely unconnected with City mentioned something similar a few weeks back but it wasn't Malaysian investors 13 hours ago, Bar BS3 said: No thanks. I would say I would be concerned about foreign investment of any kind, particularly because of that idiot over the bridge, BUT I would have to assume if it is someone "coming on board" to work with SL, it wouldn't get anyway near to happening unless the person was 100% solid as SL has put way too much time, money and effort into this club to let someone come in and ruin all that
Admin Phantom Posted September 8, 2017 Admin Posted September 8, 2017 33 minutes ago, Loon plage said: Investors generally want a return on their investment. In terms of many overseas investors in lower level football clubs the aim is to get to the promised land and then sell at a profit. Unless it is someone who has a similar thinking and passion as SL does?
Ska Junkie Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 What would they be buying though? It can't be the stadium as that is solely owned by SL AFAIK? IF they were offering to buy a stake in BS, I could understand the logistics but wouldn't an outright takeover of the football club make us tenants at the Gate? I just don't see it unless, as mentioned above, SL is selling some of his shares in return for hefty investment with SL retaining control.
View from the Dolman Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 5 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said: What would they be buying though? It can't be the stadium as that is solely owned by SL AFAIK? That's not correct either. Ashton Gate Limited remains wholly owned by Bristol City Holdings of which SL is (indirectly) the largest - but not the only - shareholder.
Ska Junkie Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 4 minutes ago, View from the Dolman said: That's not correct either. Ashton Gate Limited remains wholly owned by Bristol City Holdings of which SL is (indirectly) the largest - but not the only - shareholder. Thanks fella. The point is the same though isn't it VFTD? We would, if sold entirely, be tenants at what was our own stadium?
ashton_fan Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 Surely we're spending the max amount we can already in FFP rules so change of owner isn't going to mean an increase in investment, the only way it could move is down.
Ska Junkie Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 2 minutes ago, ashton_fan said: Surely we're spending the max amount we can already in FFP rules so change of owner isn't going to mean an increase in investment, the only way it could move is down. Not saying we would do anything similar but Man City get around things by their owner sponsoring them for an obscene amount of money. Your point is a good one though.
ashton_fan Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 2 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said: Not saying we would do anything similar but Man City get around things by their owner sponsoring them for an obscene amount of money. Your point is a good one though. I think they've already tied up that loophole with a change in the rules
MichaelRobartes Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 1 hour ago, Betty Swallocks said: A lot of Liverpool fans are deeply unhappy with the owners up there. They should count themselves lucky not to have been lumbered with the previous Americans for longer than they were!
CyderInACan Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 I for one will welcome our new ant overlords.
wendyredredrobin Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 So long as we dont end up with someone like Tan and become the blue robins.
bristolcitysweden Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 I will never accept a criminal money laundring shit ass as owner of Bristol City FC. Piss off and stay away. You are not welcome and will never be. Stay away.
Natchfever Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 3 hours ago, phantom said: Unless it is someone who has a similar thinking and passion as SL does? Blimey mate not too many of them about !
Top Robin Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 It all depends on the 'nature' of the investment......some foreign investments conducted in the 'proper' way can be very beneficial to a club. For gods sake don't just dismiss a potential opportunity to take this club forward before looking at the detail just because it's a 'foreign' investment.
Cowshed Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 11 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said: Im sure that foreign investors could help if the deal was right. A foreign takeover, no way. However, nobody is ever going to make any money out of a football club, so the word investor is a bit of a misnomer Equally, money alone does not always bring success. Quite a few Champonship clubs have spent an awful lot and are still Championship clubs, yet how much have Huddersfield and Burnley spent? People like Martin Edwards and Sir John Hall made tens of millions. Foreign owners involved in EPL clubs have made far larger sums via NFL franchises in America, they are not involved here due to altruism, they are asset strippers who have moved teams across states in the pursuit of cash .. Being associated with a football club can make money by its status, it is beneficial in business ..
Inactive user Posted September 8, 2017 Author Posted September 8, 2017 17 minutes ago, Cowshed said: People like Martin Edwards and Sir John Hall made tens of millions. Foreign owners involved in EPL clubs have made far larger sums via NFL franchises in America, they are not involved here due to altruism, they are asset strippers who have moved teams across states in the pursuit of cash .. Being associated with a football club can make money by its status, it is beneficial in business. Unless it's Rovers .. I've corrected it for you.
cityred exile Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 19 hours ago, m42 said: NO THANKS AT 1000 Decibels. If foreign investors become owners at Ashton Gate then I will seriously have to consider my position. I'm committed to a 180 mile round trip for home matches for a club I've supported for 60 years. Bristol City is a proper Bristol club. A magnificent stadium that brings tears to my eyes as I walk down from The Robins. And currently a great squad of players. The thought of it being owned by people who are just business focussed saddens me greatly. Mr Lansdown has some serious wealth. Perhaps he could consider a trust fund arrangement that would ensure that Bristol City remains in UK ownership. What a legacy that would be. you and me pal , 260 mile trip and 58yrs only difference to you
Lanterne Rouge Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 4 minutes ago, cityred exile said: you and me pal , 260 mile trip and 58yrs only difference to you 240 and 44 years but the same applies!
Xiled Posted September 8, 2017 Posted September 8, 2017 The only thing that would make Steve Lansdown take an offer for the club would be if he was hounded out of Ashton Gate by a sustained supporters campaign. Thankfully the ownership stupidity that exists in the Prem and Champ has afforded genuine City fans the chance to see the alternative to our owner. Many might disagree with his strategy, decisions, choice of 1st team coach etc but very few people question his integrity and commitment. Some years ago (relegation with O'Driscoll or maybe before?) there were a growing number of very vocal critics who seemed determined to get SL out of the club. Around that time, I think he could have walked away or sold up. Thankfully, we now have a redeveloped stadium and rightfully the Lansdown name is at the heart of it. I think he does want a genuine legacy that involves the mix of sports within the Bristol Sport wrapper. Maybe Jon Lansdown will take the reigns one day. Current investment is affordable in as much as SL's paper earnings from Hargreaves Lansdown outstrip the BCFC and rugby losses. And even then he's still got more cash than most people could spend in a thousand lifetimes. My view is that there is currently nobody in the world who could buy BCFC from him unless fan pressure made him question his ongoing involvement. But, even then, I don't think he would be happy walking away with a profit. Football has never been an investment for him. SL is clearly in it for the same buzz that the fans get when the team is winning. And that faraway dream of one day receiving parachute payments So, in my view, it's very unlikely that Malaysian investors would get a sniff. Thank goodness.
BigAl&Toby Posted September 9, 2017 Posted September 9, 2017 7 hours ago, Xiled said: The only thing that would make Steve Lansdown take an offer for the club would be if he was hounded out of Ashton Gate by a sustained supporters campaign. Thankfully the ownership stupidity that exists in the Prem and Champ has afforded genuine City fans the chance to see the alternative to our owner. Many might disagree with his strategy, decisions, choice of 1st team coach etc but very few people question his integrity and commitment. Some years ago (relegation with O'Driscoll or maybe before?) there were a growing number of very vocal critics who seemed determined to get SL out of the club. Around that time, I think he could have walked away or sold up. Thankfully, we now have a redeveloped stadium and rightfully the Lansdown name is at the heart of it. I think he does want a genuine legacy that involves the mix of sports within the Bristol Sport wrapper. Maybe Jon Lansdown will take the reigns one day. Current investment is affordable in as much as SL's paper earnings from Hargreaves Lansdown outstrip the BCFC and rugby losses. And even then he's still got more cash than most people could spend in a thousand lifetimes. My view is that there is currently nobody in the world who could buy BCFC from him unless fan pressure made him question his ongoing involvement. But, even then, I don't think he would be happy walking away with a profit. Football has never been an investment for him. SL is clearly in it for the same buzz that the fans get when the team is winning. And that faraway dream of one day receiving parachute payments So, in my view, it's very unlikely that Malaysian investors would get a sniff. Thank goodness. Here's an alternative view. When SL gets whatever it is he wants he'll sell up. i don't buy the philanthropic benefactor line. I see him as an investor. Sport and his home town are the vehicles to get him whatever he wants. He'll have an exit strategy that when reached he'll be off. Who knows what that is? I also don't buy the line about the club not being laden with debt. It is. To the Bank of Lansdown. I'm not saying I'm not appreciative of his investment and the improvements that have been made - just that I don't see him in the same way as many others seem to. Discuss?
Norn Iron Posted September 9, 2017 Posted September 9, 2017 New outside major investment=maybe Premier League=higher ticket prices=tourism football (if a successful team in the Prem)=locals no longer able to afford going to all home games. Not that I think greed has entered into the sport that I love.....at all.
Xiled Posted September 9, 2017 Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, BigAlToby&Liam said: .... I also don't buy the line about the club not being laden with debt. It is. To the Bank of Lansdown. I'm not saying I'm not appreciative of his investment and the improvements that have been made - just that I don't see him in the same way as many others seem to. Discuss? He's turned actual debt (bank loans) into equity (a higher proportion of ownership of the club) and written some of it off. Neither of those actions are the same as has happened elsewhere when clubs like Bolton have borrowed hundreds of millions against physical assets or within high interest loans. The difference with Steve Lansdown is that he has a far better financial return from Hargreaves Lansdown than any football investment would give him. A lot of UK football investors don't have that income - they are fans or ex-players. Foreign investors have very different motives such as vanity, money-laundering, tax-evasion and profile raising. SL has none of those reasons to pour money into Ashton Gate.
Inactive user Posted September 9, 2017 Author Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, BigAlToby&Liam said: Here's an alternative view. When SL gets whatever it is he wants he'll sell up. i don't buy the philanthropic benefactor line. I see him as an investor. Sport and his home town are the vehicles to get him whatever he wants. He'll have an exit strategy that when reached he'll be off. Who knows what that is? I also don't buy the line about the club not being laden with debt. It is. To the Bank of Lansdown. I'm not saying I'm not appreciative of his investment and the improvements that have been made - just that I don't see him in the same way as many others seem to. Discuss? Interesting. He's taken a huge gamble. Who's to say he's not entitled to get his money back one day.
class not gas Posted September 9, 2017 Posted September 9, 2017 His son Jon is a massive city fan,so the future looks bright even if Steve decides to step down.
CiderHider Posted September 9, 2017 Posted September 9, 2017 I'm virtually certain SL has no interest in selling the club.
Inactive user Posted September 11, 2017 Author Posted September 11, 2017 On 09/09/2017 at 17:01, CiderHider said: I'm virtually certain SL has no interest in selling the club. Agreed. Selling no, investment? Possibly.
brizzlelou Posted September 11, 2017 Posted September 11, 2017 On 09/09/2017 at 11:57, class not gas said: His son Jon is a massive city fan,so the future looks bright even if Steve decides to step down. His son is about as useful as a penis flavoured lolly pop!
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