Who Will Be "Thrown Under The Bus" ?

[The Original OTIB]

The Head Coach position is not in jeopardy. We all know that despite what some may feel in that regard. As the chosen one, the HC will still be here next season. However, as Pemberton found, somebody has to take the bullet and this season I suspect that it will be Holden who will no doubt head back oop North for "Family Reasons". The wider corporate speak will be of "restructuring" and the football cliched speak will be "we go again". Perhaps the groundhog day (another cliché, sorry) will unfold again ... to be continued ...

[tinman85]

2 minutes ago, The Original OTIB said:

The Head Coach position is not in jeopardy. We all know that despite what some may feel in that regard. As the chosen one, the HC will still be here next season. However, as Pemberton found, somebody has to take the bullet and this season I suspect that it will be Holden who will no doubt head back oop North for "Family Reasons". The wider corporate speak will be of "restructuring" and the football cliched speak will be "we go again". Perhaps the groundhog day (another cliché, sorry) will unfold again ... to be continued ...

Surely the most inexperienced coaching team in this league. None of them fill you with confidence. 

[INCRED]

And everyone was singing his and JMs praises earlier in the season!

[The Original OTIB]

2 minutes ago, INCRED said:

And everyone was singing his and JMs praises earlier in the season!

That isn't the point I'm making. Protection of the HC and the "project" is and the suits will do what is required to stay on that very message.

[Eddie Hitler]

Nobody.

I'm not enthused, how can anybody be, but we are going to end the season in the top half of the division with zero threat of relegation all season.

It may be ending with a whimper but take a step back and it is a good season.

The only comparison tables that I've seen are cost of squad and amounts paid to agents and on both those measures we are well down the Championship and therefore over-performing in the league.

I won't be cracking open the champagne but it has been a good season and we have done incredibly well in the cups.

Okay it peaked in January rather than April but it still peaked.

[The Original OTIB]

5 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Nobody.

I'm not enthused, how can anybody be, but we are going to end the season in the top half of the division with zero threat of relegation all season.

It may be ending with a whimper but take a step back and it is a good season.

The only comparison tables that I've seen are cost of squad and amounts paid to agents and on both those measures we are well down the Championship and therefore over-performing in the league.

I won't be cracking open the champagne but it has been a good season and we have done incredibly well in the cups.

Okay it peaked in January rather than April but it still peaked.

Again, not what I'm saying. They will feel the need to be seen to do something, ergo: politics.

[slartibartfast]

14 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Nobody.

I'm not enthused, how can anybody be, but we are going to end the season in the top half of the division with zero threat of relegation all season.

It may be ending with a whimper but take a step back and it is a good season.

The only comparison tables that I've seen are cost of squad and amounts paid to agents and on both those measures we are well down the Championship and therefore over-performing in the league.

I won't be cracking open the champagne but it has been a good season and we have done incredibly well in the cups.

Okay it peaked in January rather than April but it still peaked.

And if the form had been reversed over this season, it would have been almost identical to last! Sorry, can't see any improvement in that !

[INCRED]

21 minutes ago, The Original OTIB said:

That isn't the point I'm making. Protection of the HC and the "project" is and the suits will do what is required to stay on that very message.

There won’t be a scapegoat in the coaching staff but there is mitigation this season regards the amount of long term injuries and lack of squad depth. What needs to be looked at is who the hell is leading the scouting and player recruitment? The last 2 January windows have been bloody awful! Look at the players brought in and what they have contributed?

[Eddie Hitler]

38 minutes ago, The Original OTIB said:

Again, not what I'm saying. They will feel the need to be seen to do something, ergo: politics.

You may be right.  I would hope not because I don't see the season as a failure but clubs do like to be seen to be doing something about their staff each summer.

28 minutes ago, slartibartfast said:

And if the form had been reversed over this season, it would have been almost identical to last! Sorry, can't see any improvement in that !

The main improvement is the cup runs.

25 minutes ago, INCRED said:

There won’t be a scapegoat in the coaching staff but there is mitigation this season regards the amount of long term injuries and lack of squad depth. What needs to be looked at is who the hell is leading the scouting and player recruitment? The last 2 January windows have been bloody awful! Look at the players brought in and what they have contributed?

January windows are not the answer for any club save a desperate one.  I don't think it's fair to judge on that.

However the last summer recruitment we got spot on IMO, and pretty much everyone thought and said so at the time, was the summer before the promotion season.

Signings happened quickly and were impressive; there was no sense of being second in the queue let alone third or fourth.  Each time we were top and signed the best players.

I accept that it's different in the Championship when so many clubs have serious, mainly parachute, money to spend and will overpay but you can still get a similar positive feeling from early, quality signings that demonstrate that we're doing it correctly.

[spudski]

Not saying it is going to happen...but if it did, it wouldn't surprise me.

MA leaving.

[Galley is our king]

1 minute ago, spudski said:

Not saying it is going to happen...but if it did, it wouldn't surprise me.

MA leaving.

Looked VERY uncomfortable at the meeting recently, something between hitting someone and bursting into tears. I think he was trying to support someone else's decisions not his own. May actually walk before being pushed.

[ScottishRed]

3 minutes ago, Galley is our king said:

Looked VERY uncomfortable at the meeting recently, something between hitting someone and bursting into tears. I think he was trying to support someone else's decisions not his own. May actually walk before being pushed.

The reality of MA's position, and I am not in any way a fan, is that he has the role of CEO in a 'family business' , in theory,he has a major say in decisions , not the last word but nonetheless a major say.

I strongly suspect the reality is very very different.

[Robbored]

7 minutes ago, ScottishRed said:

The reality of MA's position, and I am not in any way a fan, is that he has the role of CEO in a 'family business' , in theory,he has a major say in decisions , not the last word but nonetheless a major say.

I strongly suspect the reality is very very different.

I can only relay what MA said the last time he spoke at Senior Reds - as COE he's the guy who runs the entire club and is every clubs employee boss, including LJ.

I asked him who his boss was and he thought a second and said 'I guess it's Steve Lansdown' 

If MA is "thrown under the bus" it'll be SL that pushes him, but he'll want a replacement lined up before hand.

[GrahamC]

No way will Holden leave, he is LJ’s mate and he has worked with him before.

Pemberton wasn’t and he also inherited him, he was appointed by SOD then worked so successfully with Cotts, totally different scenario.

I would be amazed if McAllister & Holden aren’t both still here in August.

[marmite]

4 minutes ago, Robbored said:

I can only relay what MA said the last time he spoke at Senior Reds - as COE he's the guy who runs the entire club and is every clubs employee boss, including LJ.

I asked him who his boss was and he thought a second and said 'I guess it's Steve Lansdown' 

If MA is "thrown under the bus" it'll be SL that pushes him, but he'll want a replacement lined up before hand.

Is he not the guest at the next Senior Reds Robbored?

[BobBobSuperBob]

dbl post

 

[Galley is our king]

1 minute ago, ScottishRed said:

The reality of MA's position, and I am not in any way a fan, is that he has the role of CEO in a 'family business' , in theory,he has a major say in decisions , not the last word but nonetheless a major say.

I strongly suspect the reality is very very different.

I think your right. The fact he couldn't make the smallest of concessions on the night said it all. Had to take the requests away and "have a look". 

They did make some changes, and who was it who told supporters? Not the CEO, it was JL, coming over the hill on his white stallion to the rescue, like he wasn't behind the original pricing!!

[BobBobSuperBob]

8 minutes ago, Robbored said:

I can only relay what MA said the last time he spoke at Senior Reds - as COE he's the guy who runs the entire club and is every clubs employee boss, including LJ.

I asked him who his boss was and he thought a second and said 'I guess it's Steve Lansdown' 

If MA is "thrown under the bus" it'll be SL that pushes him, but he'll want a replacement lined up before hand.

Or ‘Junior’ , by proxy

 

I don’t suppose ‘Junior’ has been given the recruitment process to play with has he ?

[Robbored]

2 minutes ago, marmite said:

Is he not the guest at the next Senior Reds Robbored?

He is. Unfortunately I'm away at my sisters that week so won't be able to make it.

[Redmycolour]

1 hour ago, INCRED said:

And everyone was singing his and JMs praises earlier in the season!

I for one WASN'T 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Nobody.

I'm not enthused, how can anybody be, but we are going to end the season in the top half of the division with zero threat of relegation all season.

It may be ending with a whimper but take a step back and it is a good season.

The only comparison tables that I've seen are cost of squad and amounts paid to agents and on both those measures we are well down the Championship and therefore over-performing in the league.

I won't be cracking open the champagne but it has been a good season and we have done incredibly well in the cups.

Okay it peaked in January rather than April but it still peaked.

If you take the whole season as exactly that, a full season, then it has been good.  The problem is that it has raised expectations within the season itself, and for next....which assuming we don’t win 4 or 5 of our last 5, will be the problem.  See below

46 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

You may be right.  I would hope not because I don't see the season as a failure but clubs do like to be seen to be doing something about their staff each summer.

The main improvement is the cup runs.

January windows are not the answer for any club save a desperate one.  I don't think it's fair to judge on that.

However the last summer recruitment we got spot on IMO, and pretty much everyone thought and said so at the time, was the summer before the promotion season.

Signings happened quickly and were impressive; there was no sense of being second in the queue let alone third or fourth.  Each time we were top and signed the best players.

I accept that it's different in the Championship when so many clubs have serious, mainly parachute, money to spend and will overpay but you can still get a similar positive feeling from early, quality signings that demonstrate that we're doing it correctly.

See my post re Championship Finances, repeating summer 2017 recruitment will be very difficult imho.

[headhunter]

Ashton the one to go for me.

He's "played" SL with all the waffle about finding players with the right DNA. Listening to LJ, the current failings are very much about the players mental toughness - lack of.

LJ is like his dad, he will never have a strong experienced character in the dressing room who might answer back. O'Neill is one such character IMO and as someone else has commented on this thread he has something to offer even as a non-playing member of the matchday squad - is it three promotions from this league in his career?

The Johnson family love in by SL could be strengthened by GJ coming back to help his son and uncle Pete becoming chief scout!!!!!

[Guest]

No-one although players will no doubt already know whos "liked" and staying; it will be a statement like " we re-group and go again" sh1te

 

[Olé]

Don't forget Des Taylor was also sacrificed last summer, and it would be quite hard to argue that our signings since then have significantly improved.

Mervyn Day is our Head of Scouting, although per Google, he was "helping" last summer while the club advertised that role (and an international one).

I don't know what happened after that, but presumably he was appointed. Easy to sit on a forum now and say we've scouted badly because players haven't performed, but it would be an easy scapegoat for the club to use, to exercise the fan frustration at the standard of the likes of Diony and others that we've recruited.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Nobody.

I'm not enthused, how can anybody be, but we are going to end the season in the top half of the division with zero threat of relegation all season.

It may be ending with a whimper but take a step back and it is a good season.

The only comparison tables that I've seen are cost of squad and amounts paid to agents and on both those measures we are well down the Championship and therefore over-performing in the league.

I won't be cracking open the champagne but it has been a good season and we have done incredibly well in the cups.

Okay it peaked in January rather than April but it still peaked.

you do know we were up with Wolves in Dec and missed a rare chance to push on and upwards to the top div, we have in fact fallen away so bad that many managers would have paid the price by now with their jobs. The players seem to have lost respect with LJ and maybe a visit from SL to the dressing room waving his cheque book and banging the table may wake the wasters up? like he did last season.

[The Original OTIB]

2 minutes ago, Bri Stool City said:

you do know we were up with Wolves in Dec and have fallen away so bad that many managers would have paid the price by now with their jobs. The players seem to have lost respect with LJ and maybe a visit from SL to the dressing room waving his cheque book and banging the table may wake the wasters up? like he did last season.

More this than Churchill:

 

[DT The Optimist]

4 minutes ago, Bri Stool City said:

you do know we were up with Wolves in Dec and missed a rare chance to push on and upwards we have fallen away so bad that many managers would have paid the price by now with their jobs. The players seem to have lost respect with LJ and maybe a visit from SL to the dressing room waving his cheque book and banging the table may wake the wasters up? like he did last season.

‘The players seem to have lost respect for LJ’. 

What do you base that statement on?  Evidence  of appalling loss of form since the Wolves defeat yes, the respect thing can only be ‘fake news’   

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, DT The Optimist said:

‘The players seem to have lost respect for LJ’. 

What do you base that statement on?  Evidence  of appalling loss of form since the Wolves defeat yes, the respect thing can only be ‘fake news’   

Do they seem bothered or worried what will happen if they don't "break a leg" when they cross the white line, many reports of players "not trying" "not bothered" lacking effort" etc I believe (rightly or wrongly) that the recent newbies have upset the team spirit and players faith/belief in the management.

[Andy082005]

10 minutes ago, DT The Optimist said:

‘The players seem to have lost respect for LJ’. 

What do you base that statement on?  Evidence  of appalling loss of form since the Wolves defeat yes, the respect thing can only be ‘fake news’   

One thing is for certain...there are certain players who really need to be held accountable for their performances.

As much as I feel the buck stops with our head coach...serious questions need to be asked of certain players. Especially players like Bryan, Paterson etc. They have been absolutely shocking since Christmas

I genuinely think Bryan is playing like a player who has already...in his own head... left the club. 

[The Coach]

22 minutes ago, Olé said:

Don't forget Des Taylor was also sacrificed last summer, and it would be quite hard to argue that our signings since then have significantly improved.

Mervyn Day is our Head of Scouting, although per Google, he was "helping" last summer while the club advertised that role (and an international one).

I don't know what happened after that, but presumably he was appointed. Easy to sit on a forum now and say we've scouted badly because players haven't performed, but it would be an easy scapegoat for the club to use, to exercise the fan frustration at the standard of the likes of Diony and others that we've recruited.

Debatable to some, I'd say it's a sideways step.