Too many players who look like they don't want to be here

[Engvall’s Splinter]

Famara has had spells like this during his whole time at the club. Appears to have a burst of good games/goals and then it will dry up and he looks lazy, fans get on his back and then he’ll have another burst. Fans will then state he is a world beater. Repeat. Will have very little to do with his contract. 
 

Nagy looked frustrated when substituted. As you’d expect and hope for. I don’t want to see him skipping him off high fiving  everyone on the way off. We were losing the game. 
 

Nakhi Wells will be more disappointed with how it’s going than anyone, more so with his performances and lack of goal return. He’s a striker, not playing regularly or in a system that suits him. Strikers thrive on goals. He’s scored only a few.

[LondonBristolian]

10 hours ago, Homer Simpson said:

Thread title should read.

Too many players who look like they're not good enough to be here.

I don’t even agree with that.

I think the major issue is that there are too many players who don’t look like they play in the same team or the same way.

Whilst we are nowhere near Brentford’s level, I don’t think there are many - and maybe not any- players in the team that are not good enough for Championship level.

But I do think we have a slapdash recruitment policy and sign players with no clear idea of how they fit together as a team.

Take Diedhiou, Martin and Wells. All individually good Championship strikers. But none are best suited to playing one up top and nor is there a combination of the two that feels like an instinctively good strike partnership.

I think we’ve got a lot of players who could slot into a different side in the Championship, fit in and play well. But that doesn’t necessarily mean they fit in and play well with each other and it shows...

[Numero Uno]

7 hours ago, grifty said:

It's all down to why you support a football club.

Do you support them to be entertained? For the great football? Then you should support the team that plays the best football.

Do you support them because they win everything? Then support the team that's win the league each season.

Do you support them because of locality or family ties, then results or performance shouldn't really matter.

It's strange in the other thread that's just popped up, people moaning that footballs not like it was, no soul in the club, players don't care, club doesn't care, treated like customers, but then want to be entertained, won't renew season tickets, won't buy merchandise...like a customer...

It's a very strange statement to say results or performance doesn't matter. We aren't talking 1950's football here where players were on the same money as the average working man and caught the bus to the game with a Woodbine on the go...............in a world where there wasn't a lot else to do on a Saturday afternoon and where stereotypical behaviour was the order of the day, like it or not.

People travel far and wide to watch City play - why shouldn't the performance and the type of football matter? Nobody is saying we have to play great football EVERY week but ANY week would do many of us nicely right now. I know people who, I would suggest, have at least put as much effort into Bristol City FC as you might have if not a hell of a lot more by following them up and down the country for years and years through thick and through thin and who have never felt so removed from the club as they do currently. You can say "what about Osman, what about Pulis" till the cows come home, well those supporters have put up with that and now they have to put up with the three wise men shit show and have literally had a guts full of it.

We now watch a game where 18/19 year old players are on "Corporate" money (and a few of them really are at AG) and we have CEO's literally taking people for mugs with such bullshit as "our DNA" and "great human beings". Football has done this to itself and will now use your argument that people should support football clubs out of BLIND LOYALTY because their Dad did and their Grandfather before him etc. The club really need to be careful if they think this flawed logic will see them through.

Your argument comes from a position of clearly being comfortable financially (otherwise you really wouldn't have made it tbh) but you would do well to remember that with Covid people will have tough choices to make and relieving yourself of 90 minutes of tedium 23 or so times a season might end up being one of the easier choices for many if this club doesn't change it's attitude.

Wanting to watch nice football now and again doesn't make you, ergo, "a customer". What a strange statement to come out with.

[Super]

Lets be honest we have been dire to watch but have to say not once have i watched a game and thought these players arent giving a 100%.

[Numero Uno]

1 minute ago, Super said:

Lets be honest we have been dire to watch but have to say not once have i watched a game and thought these players arent giving a 100%.

The above statement should end this topic as it's the perfect summing up.

[LondonBristolian]

9 hours ago, Silvio Dante said:

I’ve said this for a few years - Fam is very much a “desire” footballer. If he’s on, and going at full pelt, then he’s more than good enough. If he’s not - he’s a passenger. I’ve seen him not bust a gut to make a cross, but also seen him, when wound up, be exceptional.

My question is why would he now bust a gut? He’s going in the summer, we all know that, and Holdens “he really wants to be here” is insulting. I have no problem with him leaving in the summer, as he’s likely to get set up for life and fair play to him. But you then wouldn’t risk that opportunity in the future by going full tilt now for a club who are going nowhere.

Poor contract management by Ashton. And probably a poor decision to play him as first choice by Holden with the above in mind

 

I think a lot of what people see as a lack of desire in Fam is actually a lack of confidence. I think the difference in him when he believes in himself and when he doesn't is remarkable.

That said, I disagree with your second paragraph in that I'm not sure that, especially given the pandemic, the offers that he wants are automatically going to be coming in for him, both in terms of the money and the level of football. I think he's still got a lot to prove in order to make sure he gets the move he wants, financially and career-wise and he is going to need to bust a gut in order to get that move sorted. 

[Red white and red]

10 hours ago, Robbored said:

What on earth are you on about?

Ive seen many ridiculous threads on here and this one is definitely in the top 10............jeez..............

The other 9 are yours. 

[Numero Uno]

10 hours ago, Silvio Dante said:

I’ve said this for a few years - Fam is very much a “desire” footballer. If he’s on, and going at full pelt, then he’s more than good enough. If he’s not - he’s a passenger. I’ve seen him not bust a gut to make a cross, but also seen him, when wound up, be exceptional.

My question is why would he now bust a gut? He’s going in the summer, we all know that, and Holdens “he really wants to be here” is insulting. I have no problem with him leaving in the summer, as he’s likely to get set up for life and fair play to him. But you then wouldn’t risk that opportunity in the future by going full tilt now for a club who are going nowhere.

Poor contract management by Ashton. And probably a poor decision to play him as first choice by Holden with the above in mind

 

There was me thinking Fam is our top scorer and our only consistent goal threat. Yeah, lets leave him out and see what Wells and Martin (whoops) can do in his place. In fact what have they done when they have been in his place? Who had to come on and get the winner against Blackburn and Wycombe? Who got the all important first goal against Preston? Who got both goals us the game against Huddersfield? Who scored in both cup games recently? But hey, he didn't have a great game against Brentford so that means that he clearly isn't trying and doesn't want to be here?

Unbelievable logic.

[Jeez]

Overall you couldn’t fault the effort last night with expectation of Fam.

There have been periods this season where he was the only one putting in a shift. But last night it felt like he didn’t get his move so his motivation wasn’t there and should have been subbed off.

[grifty]

38 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

It's a very strange statement to say results or performance doesn't matter. We aren't talking 1950's football here where players were on the same money as the average working man and caught the bus to the game with a Woodbine on the go...............in a world where there wasn't a lot else to do on a Saturday afternoon and where stereotypical behaviour was the order of the day, like it or not.

People travel far and wide to watch City play - why shouldn't the performance and the type of football matter? Nobody is saying we have to play great football EVERY week but ANY week would do many of us nicely right now. I know people who, I would suggest, have at least put as much effort into Bristol City FC as you might have if not a hell of a lot more by following them up and down the country for years and years through thick and through thin and who have never felt so removed from the club as they do currently. You can say "what about Osman, what about Pulis" till the cows come home, well those supporters have put up with that and now they have to put up with the three wise men shit show and have literally had a guts full of it.

We now watch a game where 18/19 year old players are on "Corporate" money (and a few of them really are at AG) and we have CEO's literally taking people for mugs with such bullshit as "our DNA" and "great human beings". Football has done this to itself and will now use your argument that people should support football clubs out of BLIND LOYALTY because their Dad did and their Grandfather before him etc. The club really need to be careful if they think this flawed logic will see them through.

Your argument comes from a position of clearly being comfortable financially (otherwise you really wouldn't have made it tbh) but you would do well to remember that with Covid people will have tough choices to make and relieving yourself of 90 minutes of tedium 23 or so times a season might end up being one of the easier choices for many if this club doesn't change it's attitude.

Wanting to watch nice football now and again doesn't make you, ergo, "a customer". What a strange statement to come out with.

Wanting and expecting are two different things IMO. If you pay for you ticket at Bristol City and expect to be entertained and won't go again if you're not, to me makes a customer. Entertaining football is a bonus to the team you support. Most teams have a few years of good football/being successful, then there is a lull and it will ramp up again. People like yourself just expect it all the time and it doesn't work like that.

[Numero Uno]

Just now, grifty said:

Wanting and expecting are two different things IMO. If you pay for you ticket at Bristol City and expect to be entertained and won't go again if you're not, to me makes a customer. Entertaining football is a bonus to the team you support. Most teams have a few years of good football/being successful, then there is a lull and it will ramp up again. People like yourself just expect it all the time and it doesn't work like that.

Wrong on two counts. I do not expect entertainment "all the time" and I will be renewing my season ticket. However not getting "any" entertainment is starting to grate and why shouldn't I question that?

[Rob k]

9 hours ago, Andy082005 said:

Genuine question here....what motivation do any of these players have to get better an imorove?

They earn a fantastic, life changing wage here already, have the best facilities and surroundings to work in, live in a fantastic City and play for a club where there is no real expectation or demand to push to the next level. 

As fans far to many accept mediocrity. I have seen fellow City fans on social media tonight talking about how as fans we are 'spoilt' and should be grateful for what we have 

We have a small minded mentality as a fan base and as a club 

Spot on Sammie S barley kicked a ball for City yet i bet his time here has set him up for life - set up for life and he was a punt 

[Cowshed]

1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

There was me thinking Fam is our top scorer and our only consistent goal threat. Yeah, lets leave him out and see what Wells and Martin (whoops) can do in his place. In fact what have they done when they have been in his place? Who had to come on and get the winner against Blackburn and Wycombe? Who got the all important first goal against Preston? Who got both goals us the game against Huddersfield? Who scored in both cup games recently? But hey, he didn't have a great game against Brentford so that means that he clearly isn't trying and doesn't want to be here?

Unbelievable logic.

Its risk and reward. 

The opponents last night closed down from the front. Bristol City allowed the opponents uncontested possession consistently in the first third to build attacks. Their forwards had a defensive tactical intensity that Famara does not come close to and will not develop. Brentford's work rate was higher out of possession and their movement was better in possession. 

The risk over seasons has been Famara limits the tactical flexibility of the team in and out of possession. 

The reward is he possesses a slightly higher goal threat than other options. 

 

[Numero Uno]

1 minute ago, Cowshed said:

Its risk and reward. 

The opponents last night closed down from the front. Bristol City allowed the opponents uncontested possession consistently in the first third to build attacks. Their forwards had a defensive tactical intensity that Famara does not come close to and will not develop. Brentford's work rate was higher out of possession and their movement was better in possession. 

The risk over seasons has been Famara limits the tactical flexibility of the team in and out of possession. 

The reward is he possesses a slightly higher goal threat than other options. 

 

That's the tactical explanation rather than the emotional one which seems to be he's on easy street. What you are saying is somewhat different, it's his game that is an issue. As with all players he shouldn't be an automatic pick and there is always that horses for courses argument and which risks you take against varying types of opposition.

[Sturny]

This is going to sound seriously tinpot. But from what i've seen this season that looked like our best performance defeat?  Hope that this is a sign things are on the up. I feel like we're going to get a good result against Cardiff if they play like that.. 

[Numero Uno]

3 minutes ago, Sturny said:

This is going to sound seriously tinpot. But from what i've seen this season that looked like our best performance defeat?  Hope that this is a sign things are on the up. I feel like we're going to get a good result against Cardiff if they play like that.. 

First half was our best 45 of the season given the opposition. Brentford acknowledged that we matched them first half and they weren't being patronising either. Second half they showed the extra bit of quality that we don't possess. You can criticise every single goal you concede defensively but it has to be acknowledged that the second goal was class, the third goal could have been avoided but overall their extra quality shone through.................and as things currently stand I can live with that because we gave it a go even if our shortcomings meant we were always going to lose the game.

[Cowshed]

17 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

That's the tactical explanation rather than the emotional one which seems to be he's on easy street. What you are saying is somewhat different, it's his game that is an issue. As with all players he shouldn't be an automatic pick and there is always that horses for courses argument and which risks you take against varying types of opposition.

His mindset is an issue. He is on easy street frequently. Last night he didn't screen possession at times. At 2-1/3-1 he is walking rather than showing commitment to get into shape so pressure can be applied on the opposition. His confidence clearly waxes and wanes and affects his game - That mindset is part of his game. 

If Mr Holden wants front foot football how does this players skills fit the team need? Short term it may be deemed Bristol City are better with him in the team. The opposition last highlighted shortcomings in one of City's players if high tempo is an aim.   

[Tin Soldier]

I thought it was a good performance last night, all committed. That was really pleasing to see.
The issue I have seen all season is the fact that they know that DH is not the boss so to speak, and that MA especially pulls all the strings from a distance.

As a player, I would have wanted to work with the boss, not the messenger boy. Just wondering if there is a difference of opinion in terms of tactics that DH is told to follow at times.
Why can we go from an awful performance at Derby where it looked like noone could be assed to a half decent performance against arguably the best team in the league last night?

[joe jordans teeth]

14 hours ago, grifty said:

It's all down to why you support a football club.

Do you support them to be entertained? For the great football? Then you should support the team that plays the best football.

Do you support them because they win everything? Then support the team that's win the league each season.

Do you support them because of locality or family ties, then results or performance shouldn't really matter.

It's strange in the other thread that's just popped up, people moaning that footballs not like it was, no soul in the club, players don't care, club doesn't care, treated like customers, but then want to be entertained, won't renew season tickets, won't buy merchandise...like a customer...

So if you are born and bread Bristolian and a city supporter you can’t expect to be entertained just hope we nick a few wins playing crap,heard it all now 

[grifty]

1 hour ago, joe jordans teeth said:

So if you are born and bread Bristolian and a city supporter you can’t expect to be entertained just hope we nick a few wins playing crap,heard it all now 

Nothing to do with supporting City, so well done for missing the point of my post.

"It's all down to why you support a football club. (No mention of City)

Do you support them to be entertained? For the great football? Then you should support the team that plays the best football.

Do you support them because they win everything? Then support the team that's win the league each season.

Do you support them because of locality or family ties, then results or performance shouldn't really matter. (It shouldn't should it? Unequivocal support. Whether they are great or rubbish you support them? You can hope/want your team to play great, but if they don't, well never mind because they're my team and I'll support them.)

It's strange in the other thread that's just popped up, people moaning that footballs not like it was, no soul in the club, players don't care, club doesn't care, treated like customers, but then want to be entertained, won't renew season tickets, won't buy merchandise...like a customer..."

[joe jordans teeth]

3 hours ago, grifty said:

Nothing to do with supporting City, so well done for missing the point of my post.

 

"It's all down to why you support a football club. (No mention of City)

Do you support them to be entertained? For the great football? Then you should support the team that plays the best football.

Do you support them because they win everything? Then support the team that's win the league each season.

Do you support them because of locality or family ties, then results or performance shouldn't really matter. (It shouldn't should it? Unequivocal support. Whether they are great or rubbish you support them? You can hope/want your team to play great, but if they don't, well never mind because they're my team and I'll support them.)

It's strange in the other thread that's just popped up, people moaning that footballs not like it was, no soul in the club, players don't care, club doesn't care, treated like customers, but then want to be entertained, won't renew season tickets, won't buy merchandise...like a customer..."

Repeating yourself now mate,still a old load of old nonsense,just to confirm are you suggesting Bristolians should expect crap football unless you want to watch good football and then you should support premier league teams.Ask spurs fans If they would rather win a cup playing turgid football under Jose the whole season or win nothing playing decent football ,we all know the answer 

[Redtrojan]

Being a Bristolian and family living in Bedminster for generations,I naturally became a died in the wool City supporter.

That will never change.

However that doesn’t mean I happily put up with mediocrity.

I don’t go as often as I did and with the fair on offer this season I would probably have been an irregular attender,as someone above stated ,there are lots of things in life competing for my funds.

Interestingly I went a lot through the dire early eighties.But at least those teams were full of characters and we were backs to the wall in it together.

This current squad seems devoid of characters,the manager and back room seem very corporate,party line types.

It is very difficult to get fired up over this group of players.

[grifty]

33 minutes ago, joe jordans teeth said:

Repeating yourself now mate,still a old load of old nonsense,just to confirm are you suggesting Bristolians should expect crap football unless you want to watch good football and then you should support premier league teams.Ask spurs fans If they would rather win a cup playing turgid football under Jose the whole season or win nothing playing decent football ,we all know the answer 

No, you still don't understand, or just trying to be argumentative as usual.

[joe jordans teeth]

17 minutes ago, grifty said:

No, you still don't understand, or just trying to be argumentative as usual.

No just calling bs out that’s all

[joe jordans teeth]

23 minutes ago, Redtrojan said:

Being a Bristolian and family living in Bedminster for generations,I naturally became a died in the wool City supporter.

That will never change.

However that doesn’t mean I happily put up with mediocrity.

I don’t go as often as I did and with the fair on offer this season I would probably have been an irregular attender,as someone above stated ,there are lots of things in life competing for my funds.

Interestingly I went a lot through the dire early eighties.But at least those teams were full of characters and we were backs to the wall in it together.

This current squad seems devoid of characters,the manager and back room seem very corporate,party line types.

It is very difficult to get fired up over this group of players.

Obviously you don’t get griftys point either