Just when it looks good on the pitch ...

[East End Old Boy]

18 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

They are not the only fund platform that are struggling, there is far less investment available in tough times. I have a SIPP with H&L but I have been considering moving a portion of it into a normal savings account to offset the losses I have incurred in the last 6 months, I am sure others have as well. Less investment, less fees for H&L.

They also didn't do themselves any favours by giving a high rating to an investment fund right up to the day it went bust.

You’re not alone with your thinking there!

[tin]

I’m sure Esteban Holdings will make a healthy profit once the 510 houses are built on Ashton Vale. 

[OneTeamInBristol]

10 hours ago, IAmNick said:

I know these aren't you words but oh please. Cry me a bloody river.

Millions around the country seriously worrying about being able to heat their homes this winter and we're meant to give two shits about a billionaire with a few tens of millions wiped off his net worth? It's already an obscene and depraved amount of wealth for anyone to have.

It's not like he can even invest it all in City if he wanted due to FFP. I personally could not care less about the H&L share price.

He started a business from his bedroom in his 20's which has turned him into a billionaire.

Why is it obscene and depraved for him to have earnt that right through his own efforts? 

[CyderInACan]

9 hours ago, Selred said:

The Pantomime at the Hippodrome is top price £56 for the best seats, whilst the lowest price is £13. What you get is pretty much guaranteed entertainment. 
 
Preston fans don’t get options. They have to pay £33 to be shoved in the smallest stand, the worst seats in the house behind the goal, having to drive 380 mile round trip, to watch your team lose to Bristol City, that isn’t a great bargain. 

You don’t go to away games do you Robbo.

 

Disagree. They don't have to go! It's simple. Anybody who HAS to go is deluded and clearly can afford £33 for a (not) shit seat following their team. Nothing compels them to go but their own circumstances allowing them. 

[IAmNick]

1 hour ago, OneTeamInBristol said:

He started a business from his bedroom in his 20's which has turned him into a billionaire.

Why is it obscene and depraved for him to have earnt that right through his own efforts? 

He has worked extremely hard, and I applaud him for that. He has every right to do so and become very wealthy as he has. I completely support that.

I don't support people owning such an incredible amount of wealth when others in this country are starving or unable to heat their homes. I think that's morally wrong.

I support people being rich and others having the ability to become rich through hard work (and a lot of luck), I don't support some people having more wealth than thousands and thousands of others combined who work extremely hard but chose to teach children, nurse injured people, or drive a bus instead of get into financial services (or whatever).

It's not the fact he's rich, it's how rich some people are in comparison to others. That's what I think is obscene and depraved!

I don't think some people realise quite how big of a number a billion is.

Edited September 8, 2022 by IAmNick

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

11 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I know you’re stating an opinion, I just didn’t understand the opinion you were making.  Now I do.

FWIW my opinion is that if we had £10m of headroom for FFP limits I reckon SL would’ve allowed a large chunk of that to be invested in the team, whether be fees, wages or both.  He’s said he’s happy to continue backing the team.

Only time will tell what SL will do as and when FFP is not a barrier to further investment. Position in the table come January may well become the crucial factor.

In so far as other points made by several posters: Irrespective of SL's financial diversification away from HL he has seen his fortune reduce by almost half a billion pounds and still holds a huge sum in HL which , as stated in the OP, is under pressure from shorts. Despite opinion to the contrary, I believe this is going to affect decisions regarding BCFC and his future investment. As such, my OP was not about share prices generally but about implications to BCFC and as such becomes football matter.

But as I say, only time will tell. The state of the economy and the state of SL's wealth may well be the overriding factor. It's obvious that he will be well diversified but that doesn't mean he'll start undiversifying in order to pump more money into a loss making liability.

Surely the fact that he's actively seeking outside investment for BCFC is a red flag in itself? IMO.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by Marina's Rolls Royce

[OneTeamInBristol]

25 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

He has worked extremely hard, and I applaud him for that. He has every right to do so and become very wealthy as he has. I completely support that.

I don't support people owning such an incredible amount of wealth when others in this country are starving or unable to heat their homes. I think that's morally wrong.

I support people being rich and others having the ability to become rich through hard work (and a lot of luck), I don't support some people having more wealth than thousands and thousands of others combined who work extremely hard but chose to teach children, nurse injured people, or drive a bus instead of get into financial services (or whatever).

It's not the fact he's rich, it's how rich some people are in comparison to others. That's what I think is obscene and depraved!

I don't think some people realise quite how big of a number a billion is.

Surely the issue there is that those roles aren't paid enough?

It's not individuals like SL's responsibility to ensure that they are not 'too' wealthy in comparisons to others.

Many see it as inspirational. 

[phantom]

12 hours ago, mozo said:

Our current league position and young 'assets' can't do any harm. 

Our ground and training ground are though

[spudski]

46 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

He has worked extremely hard, and I applaud him for that. He has every right to do so and become very wealthy as he has. I completely support that.

I don't support people owning such an incredible amount of wealth when others in this country are starving or unable to heat their homes. I think that's morally wrong.

I support people being rich and others having the ability to become rich through hard work (and a lot of luck), I don't support some people having more wealth than thousands and thousands of others combined who work extremely hard but chose to teach children, nurse injured people, or drive a bus instead of get into financial services (or whatever).

It's not the fact he's rich, it's how rich some people are in comparison to others. That's what I think is obscene and depraved!

I don't think some people realise quite how big of a number a billion is.

So it's the system you don't support rather than the person?

The system allows you to become educated, and work hard. You benefit the rewards from how hard you work.

You can employ others and share your wealth with others if you choose to do so.

For example, you can fund the losses of a football club. Put money into it, for the enjoyment of others. Providing facilities that others will enjoy, and every week be entertained. Yet many will complain about how much money is swashing about in football. Players wages being too much etc...Yet those people still support the system of football by buying tickets to watch games and subscribing to sports channels that create the wealth that those fans are complaining about.

You can't win. 

Another example...my ex father in law was a millionaire businessman. He had businesses all around the world. When he wanted to pay higher wages to his staff in India, the Government stepped in and told him he couldn't as it would set a precedent. He had to pay wages which he thought was too little. Same happened in China and South Africa.

I agree it's morally wrong that people are starving and can't afford to live. 

But that situation has arisen through Government, the system, shareholders profits etc etc. 

A broken system across the world.

The system creates extreme wealth and extreme poverty. 

Pretty much everything you do in life supports the system...it's hard to avoid doing so. 

We all moan about it...yet still contribute to it. 

The only way you'll get what you desire, is if the system changes. And that will never change sadly.

 

 

 

[Monkeh]

1 hour ago, IAmNick said:

He has worked extremely hard, and I applaud him for that. He has every right to do so and become very wealthy as he has. I completely support that.

I don't support people owning such an incredible amount of wealth when others in this country are starving or unable to heat their homes. I think that's morally wrong.

I support people being rich and others having the ability to become rich through hard work (and a lot of luck), I don't support some people having more wealth than thousands and thousands of others combined who work extremely hard but chose to teach children, nurse injured people, or drive a bus instead of get into financial services (or whatever).

It's not the fact he's rich, it's how rich some people are in comparison to others. That's what I think is obscene and depraved!

I don't think some people realise quite how big of a number a billion is.

Doesn't he have a few charity organisations 

[IAmNick]

1 hour ago, spudski said:

So it's the system you don't support rather than the person?

The system allows you to become educated, and work hard. You benefit the rewards from how hard you work.

You can employ others and share your wealth with others if you choose to do so.

For example, you can fund the losses of a football club. Put money into it, for the enjoyment of others. Providing facilities that others will enjoy, and every week be entertained. Yet many will complain about how much money is swashing about in football. Players wages being too much etc...Yet those people still support the system of football by buying tickets to watch games and subscribing to sports channels that create the wealth that those fans are complaining about.

You can't win. 

Another example...my ex father in law was a millionaire businessman. He had businesses all around the world. When he wanted to pay higher wages to his staff in India, the Government stepped in and told him he couldn't as it would set a precedent. He had to pay wages which he thought was too little. Same happened in China and South Africa.

I agree it's morally wrong that people are starving and can't afford to live. 

But that situation has arisen through Government, the system, shareholders profits etc etc. 

A broken system across the world.

The system creates extreme wealth and extreme poverty. 

Pretty much everything you do in life supports the system...it's hard to avoid doing so. 

We all moan about it...yet still contribute to it. 

The only way you'll get what you desire, is if the system changes. And that will never change sadly.

 

Yeah you're spot on in your first line, I have nothing against him personally and it's broadly not his fault for living in the system we have, although how much you choose to exploit that is another question. It does make it hard for me to care when he gets more than most of us will earn in a lifetime (or ten lifetimes) wiped off his net worth though.

I think personally it's an intentionally perpetuated lie though that you benefit the rewards from how hard you work - many people work incredibly hard and barely benefit, while others benefit hugely from other people's hard work. If people believe it's just hard work to get to the top rather than the system being broken then that benefits those in the system.

The fact is though we all have to exist together somehow, so short of going to live in a hole on Dartmoor (or at the Mem) eating mud we all participate in these systems, and that shouldn't preclude us from criticising them or wanting them to change. I think we can and should strive as a society to do better regardless of what other countries are doing (i.e. not just try to be the 2nd worst) and a huge part of that will be to tackle this wealth inequality somehow.

I'm not quite going to go all "The workers must seize the means of production!" but there will be a shift one day, hopefully to a middle ground that's fairer for us all.

People shouldn't have to put up with this. Great change has been made in the past to pull people out of deeply unfair systems, there's no reason it can't or won't happen again.

The real question is what's more likely to happen first - Steve L somehow funding us into the premier league, or social turmoil and the evolution of a complete system change?

1 hour ago, OneTeamInBristol said:

Surely the issue there is that those roles aren't paid enough?

It's not individuals like SL's responsibility to ensure that they are not 'too' wealthy in comparisons to others.

Many see it as inspirational. 

Of course, and broadly it's those who have most to lose from the system changing (i.e. those at the top) who ensure that things stay the same or enable them even more, because they're the ones with the power to do so.

It's not his individual responsibility no, and he probably is inspirational to many! There's nothing wrong with that.

I don't find it inspirational, because it perpetuates the myth that it's just hard work to get to the top. Examples of wealth inequality don't inspire me at all. Are you a billionaire? Do you not work hard? What about your friends/family? Hmm.

As I said above, it's the system I disagree with - and that's why I find it hard to care when some tens of millions are wiped off his net worth.

Edited September 8, 2022 by IAmNick

[Selred]

5 hours ago, CyderInACan said:

Disagree. They don't have to go! It's simple. Anybody who HAS to go is deluded and clearly can afford £33 for a (not) shit seat following their team. Nothing compels them to go but their own circumstances allowing them. 

I mean in terms of their seats / price. Yes they have options to go or not, the same as theatre goers. But I could pick a cheap seat for theatre at £13, you don't get those options in away ends.

[Red_Alligator]

I have a feeling some of us may not have as much pocket money in the coming months either. 

Remember, we're all in this together aren't we....?

[Port Said Red]

16 hours ago, Red_Alligator said:

I have a feeling some of us may not have as much pocket money in the coming months either. 

Remember, we're all in this together aren't we....?

At the risk of taking this into the politics forum, that was exactly my question when I heard that the woman with many hats (Like Spurs fans with George Graham I can't bring myself to use her name) said she was "going to show zero tolerance to the workers". She clearly feels that she is a different country to those do the day to day stuff, and she's probably right.

[swanker]

On 08/09/2022 at 12:35, IAmNick said:

Yeah you're spot on in your first line, I have nothing against him personally and it's broadly not his fault for living in the system we have, although how much you choose to exploit that is another question. It does make it hard for me to care when he gets more than most of us will earn in a lifetime (or ten lifetimes) wiped off his net worth though.

I think personally it's an intentionally perpetuated lie though that you benefit the rewards from how hard you work - many people work incredibly hard and barely benefit, while others benefit hugely from other people's hard work. If people believe it's just hard work to get to the top rather than the system being broken then that benefits those in the system.

The fact is though we all have to exist together somehow, so short of going to live in a hole on Dartmoor (or at the Mem) eating mud we all participate in these systems, and that shouldn't preclude us from criticising them or wanting them to change. I think we can and should strive as a society to do better regardless of what other countries are doing (i.e. not just try to be the 2nd worst) and a huge part of that will be to tackle this wealth inequality somehow.

I'm not quite going to go all "The workers must seize the means of production!" but there will be a shift one day, hopefully to a middle ground that's fairer for us all.

People shouldn't have to put up with this. Great change has been made in the past to pull people out of deeply unfair systems, there's no reason it can't or won't happen again.

The real question is what's more likely to happen first - Steve L somehow funding us into the premier league, or social turmoil and the evolution of a complete system change?

Of course, and broadly it's those who have most to lose from the system changing (i.e. those at the top) who ensure that things stay the same or enable them even more, because they're the ones with the power to do so.

It's not his individual responsibility no, and he probably is inspirational to many! There's nothing wrong with that.

I don't find it inspirational, because it perpetuates the myth that it's just hard work to get to the top. Examples of wealth inequality don't inspire me at all. Are you a billionaire? Do you not work hard? What about your friends/family? Hmm.

As I said above, it's the system I disagree with - and that's why I find it hard to care when some tens of millions are wiped off his net worth.

Most people are doing their best, that’s all you can do. 
What hurts is all the dole busters lapping it up on the backs of the working people. 
social housing and all that. My daughter has to work hard for her home while her neighbour smokes up the weed and gets all the handouts.  
 

[IAmNick]

15 hours ago, swanker said:

Most people are doing their best, that’s all you can do. 
What hurts is all the dole busters lapping it up on the backs of the working people. 
social housing and all that. My daughter has to work hard for her home while her neighbour smokes up the weed and gets all the handouts.  
 

People are trying to do their best I agree, in a system that isn't fair and doesn't reward them appropriately.

In 2017 (so before COVID etc.) The welfare budget was £264 billion. Of that, £2.2 billion went for jobseekers allowance, so less than 1%.

Is that a lot of money? Sure - But I think your anger is misplaced. The Tories gave dodgy COVID contracts out to their mates worth many more times than that for example.

It's an incredibly small minority who'd choose to struggle on the dole (and it is a struggle). In my opinion the solution is to improve working conditions, and give people help, support, and a route to work if they're able. Not to just abandon them and leave them even further behind. They aren't hurting you.

[steveybadger]

1 hour ago, IAmNick said:

People are trying to do their best I agree, in a system that isn't fair and doesn't reward them appropriately.

In 2017 (so before COVID etc.) The welfare budget was £264 billion. Of that, £2.2 billion went for jobseekers allowance, so less than 1%.

Is that a lot of money? Sure - But I think your anger is misplaced. The Tories gave dodgy COVID contracts out to their mates worth many more times than that for example.

It's an incredibly small minority who'd choose to struggle on the dole (and it is a struggle). In my opinion the solution is to improve working conditions, and give people help, support, and a route to work if they're able. Not to just abandon them and leave them even further behind. They aren't hurting you.

I used to work in a job centre and support your comments. The millions of scroungers myth is just that. Very very few choose to remain on benefits if they have to.

[joe jordans teeth]

17 hours ago, swanker said:

Most people are doing their best, that’s all you can do. 
What hurts is all the dole busters lapping it up on the backs of the working people. 
social housing and all that. My daughter has to work hard for her home while her neighbour smokes up the weed and gets all the handouts.  
 

Spot on,bloke down road has had a bad toe for about 20 years,doesn’t stop him walking down the pub and doing home improvements but it does stop him working 

[swanker]

2 hours ago, IAmNick said:

People are trying to do their best I agree, in a system that isn't fair and doesn't reward them appropriately.

In 2017 (so before COVID etc.) The welfare budget was £264 billion. Of that, £2.2 billion went for jobseekers allowance, so less than 1%.

Is that a lot of money? Sure - But I think your anger is misplaced. The Tories gave dodgy COVID contracts out to their mates worth many more times than that for example.

It's an incredibly small minority who'd choose to struggle on the dole (and it is a struggle). In my opinion the solution is to improve working conditions, and give people help, support, and a route to work if they're able. Not to just abandon them and leave them even further behind. They aren't hurting you.

I’m not angry with people who milk the system, just saying it all very unfair. 

I totally agree with you on the fact that the system doesn’t work. It’s broken, but I don’t think many people realise just how broken. 
From my point of view the future looks exciting. 
We haven’t seen anything yet

 

Also, I really appreciate you putting the away goals on here. I always look out for them. 
 

Edited September 10, 2022 by swanker

[swanker]

11 minutes ago, joe jordans teeth said:

Spot on,bloke down road has had a bad toe for about 20 years,doesn’t stop him walking down the pub and doing home improvements but it does stop him working 

I bet he can’t walk Pizza Hut, he most probably gets them delivered. 

[joe jordans teeth]

1 hour ago, swanker said:

I bet he can’t walk Pizza Hut, he most probably gets them delivered. 

Tbf he says himself he can work but it’s a cushty number and doesn’t need to,and he’s not a scumbag with litter outside his gaff,houses going up here for 900k which is complete madness so he’s thinking about moving on and don’t blame him