World Cup 2022 thread (football only)

[Coin-op]

Can anyone explain what a forced turnover is? Also what is a defensive line break? Are these for American audiences? Not heard (seen) these before. 

[redkev]

Personally even though England didn’t play that well I thought the yanks were really very good . Very strong , physical and quick all round the pitch .

if I were manager I would change things a little , walker Henderson Foden grealish possibly Rashford doesn’t weaken the side at all just freshens it up a little . 
on another note how does mount get in ahead of foden . Offers nothing in my eyes 

[BigTone]

Come on Saudi !!

[Numero Uno]

16 hours ago, Globe Trotter said:

The fact Southgate feels the need for Henderson to make us solid against the USA tells me all I need to know 

Well, he really did need Henderson in there to make us more solid as USA were pissing all over us in midield and Bellingham had an absolute stinker of a game, a 3/10 effort. The game passed him by and changing Bellingham for Foden as a single change would have done nothing to help us defensively. He was right to bring Henderson on to give us a degree of defensive control but to leave Mason ******* Mount out there whilst Foden was sat there picking splinters out of his arse was criminal and for that alone Southgate couldn't moan if he got his ass kicked out of it tbh. He's an over-cautious Manager who doesn't have the faintest clue how to accommodate the best English midfield player in the country and I would fire him after this tournament unless he wins it.

[redkev]

2 hours ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

I think when Southgate gets it right pre game it goes well, what he has shown is he struggles to adapt during the game when it isn't panning out the way he expected.

He was simply too slow to react last night in terms of subs, we played 2 touch football, US played 1 touch, our man marking in defence was very poor.

We have all the talent required, he just needs to make the right calls.

I don’t think our defence was too bad last night I thought the likes of saka , mount , Sterling we’re very poor even Bellingham and rice were only average at best 

[Will Rollason]

Just now, Coin-op said:

Can anyone explain what a forced turnover is? Also what is a defensive line break? Are these for American audiences? Not heard (seen) these before. 

A turnover is any time, outside of downs,   the team with the ball loses control of the ball to the other team usually via an interception ,a fumble from a ball carrier,  sacking the qb or stripping the ball.

[Red Army 75]

Lovely goal 

[The Gasbuster]

3 hours ago, spudski said:

England v Wales...state of this lot. It's like a comedy sketch. Some blokes even thumping his own head  

 

No doubt England fans will get the blame. Chances are it was more 50:50 regarding responsibility

[redkev]

1 minute ago, Numero Uno said:

Well, he really did need Henderson in there to make us more solid as USA were pissing all over us in midield and Bellingham had an absolute stinker of a game, a 3/10 effort. The game passed him by and changing Bellingham for Foden as a single change would have done nothing to help us defensively. He was right to bring Henderson on to give us a degree of defensive control but to leave Mason ******* Mount out there whilst Foden was sat there picking splinters out of his arse was criminal and for that alone Southgate couldn't moan if he got his ass kicked out of it tbh. He's an over-cautious Manager who doesn't have the faintest clue how to accommodate the best English midfield player in the country and I would fire him after this tournament unless he wins it.

I agree people bemoan Henderson but there are certain games when you need a steady Eddie and last night was one of them . As for being slow to change things that there shows why top top managers earn the corn so to speak the likes of sir Alex / mourinio would have been changing things long before Southgate did , he was hoping we would get ourselves out of the rut we were in . Good managers are proactive not reactive I’m afraid Southgate is the latter 

 

[The Gasbuster]

56 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

Difficult to know who to compare Khomeini and Khameini to, but they are both hypocritical power-mad dictators and murderers. One name comes to mind....

The only difference is that one is dead (good riddance), and unfortunately the other isn't.

[Numero Uno]

5 hours ago, Bris Red said:

Have you lived under a rock for the past 56 years or what? Have you not seen the countless managers that have tried and failed to get us to be competitive at international tournament level..

Just getting to the later stages of tournament football has proved impossible for the vast majority of previous England managers let alone winning things. Some have had better squads than what Southgate has at his disposal right now.

Some people in this country unfortunately are fairly deluded when it comes to international football. If people think winning world cups and euros is all about playing scintillating attacking football every game then they are very mistaken.

Just ask the Italians or the Germans - both countries masters at grinding out results and winning trophies not always playing pretty expansive football.

It's not about expecting to win the World Cup (I don't) but leaving your best player out of the side because you can't find a way of accommodating him is criminal. Let's be fair about that. I don't ever recall Germany or Italy leaving out their best midfield player when they were "grinding" out trophies. Pirlo was alright, he was picked by Italy. Mattheus was never told "sorry me old China, I know you're ******* brilliant but I just can't fit you in with this shower of shit alongside you, they can win the trophies and you just sit there watching".........so on that basis if Southgate doesn't win it after making a conscious decision to bench his best player he's got to go for me..........or he's got to bang his head against a wall and start picking a lad who is the only English midfield player that would even be allowed to attend training by Pep let alone get a regular starting berth in his side. Pep would just tell Mount to go and put the cones out and stay out of the ******* way for the rest of the session.

Either that or one of you tell me, with a straight face, that you genuinely think Mason Mount is better than Phil Foden - who's going to start the bidding?

[DolmanGaz]

that pen is a joke of a decision. minimal contact and throws himself to the floor. game is gone

[redkev]

3 minutes ago, The Gasbuster said:

No doubt England fans will get the blame. Chances are it was more 50:50 regarding responsibility

Goes to show no alcohol in Qatar no trouble 

Alcohol in Tenerife trouble 

you can tell it’s alcohol related by the state of the punches being thrown 

[Ronnie Sinclair]

What a double save 

[Mr Popodopolous]

5 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

It's not about expecting to win the World Cup (I don't) but leaving your best player out of the side because you can't find a way of accommodating him is criminal. Let's be fair about that. I don't ever recall Germany or Italy leaving out their best midfield player when they were "grinding" out trophies. Pirlo was alright, he was picked by Italy. Mattheus was never told "sorry me old China, I know you're ******* brilliant but I just can't fit you in with this shower of shit alongside you, they can win the trophies and you just sit there watching".........so on that basis if Southgate doesn't win it after making a conscious decision to bench his best player he's got to go for me..........or he's got to bang his head against a wall and start picking a lad who is the only English midfield player that would even be allowed to attend training by Pep let alone get a regular starting berth in his side. Pep would just tell Mount to go and put the cones out and stay out of the ******* way for the rest of the session.

Either that or one of you tell me, with a straight face, that you genuinely think Mason Mount is better than Phil Foden - who's going to start the bidding?

Different types of Player too,and  Mount and Foden.

If playing both I'd go Mount higher up and Foden in a CM 3.

[1960maaan]

Didn't catch the first 20 odd, but really enjoying the game. 
Full of energy and threat, hope it stays like this 2nd half.

[Numero Uno]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

Different types of Player too,and  Mount and Foden.

If playing both I'd go Mount higher up and Foden in a CM 3.

The point is it doesn't matter too much about "types" of player unless you are fixated, which Southgate is, about playing a full compliment of midfield players who can do defensive job over a player than can go past people and create something. When you have top players playing for top teams at your disposal you get them on the pitch and you find a water carrier to do the defensive work for them (like Brazil and France do) - that's the reason why you have to pick players like of Henderson, it's not because they have an unrivalled range of passing or can glide past players. Not to use Foden and to play Mount the full 90 was shambolic management.

[stephenkibby.]

12 minutes ago, DolmanGaz said:

that pen is a joke of a decision. minimal contact and throws himself to the floor. game is gone

If that's a Pen there should be 500 Free Kicks a game.

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

It was dull and tedious. That is the main point for me - because it doesn't have to be. We have some very exciting players.

I certainly don't expect England to win every game they take part in, but I do like to be entertained, not frustrated by timidity.

As for naming teams that do well in the group stages and advance to finals, you only have to cast your mind back to Russia, where Croatia beat Argentina and Nigeria to top their group and looked good VFM throughout. They may not have won it, but they advanced further than their nation ever had. Or take Brazil in 2002, scoring 11 goals to top their group and going on to win. 

Would also add different tournament but Spain in the Euros of 2008 looked strong throughout, and the group stage no exception. Italy for the most part in 2021 as well, Germany had a strong tournament group stage included in the WC of 2014 and Italy a sort of middling one in 2006. Not brilliant but not terrible either- perfectly reasonable.

Edited November 26, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 hours ago, chinapig said:

Fair comment. There seems to be a belief that teams win the World Cup playing thrilling attacking football throughout, which tends not to be the case. France won in 2018 yet Deschamps was getting a lot of stick at home for being too cautious.

By their own admission the 2010 Spain side kept the ball for long periods to prevent the opposition from scoring. They won the competition with a succession of 1-0 wins; exciting they were not!

Whether all that justifies playing for a clean sheet against the USA remains a moot point though.

Spain of 2010 was a weird one.

Always thought they had more gears to go through attacking wise, vs most.

While keeping the ball is a good defensive strategy, it is also the case perhaps that a lot of opposition sat deep or counter pressed which gave them little choice. They still had good shot numbers in addition to possession even if not so prolific .

Edited November 26, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[spudski]

23 minutes ago, The Gasbuster said:

No doubt England fans will get the blame. Chances are it was more 50:50 regarding responsibility

Bunch of brain dead pond life...the lot of em. 

As someone else said...it just needs Benny Hill music to it.

The Welsh bloke on the left, helps his mate up, then ends up lumping him one by accident another ends up wearing a chair on his head...and just stands there. English bloke starts thumping his own head. Two face off then start waltzing together. A whole load of ice skating going on. It's like a comedy sketch.

 

 

[Red-Robbo]

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Would also add differs t tournament but Spain in the Euros of 2008 looked strong throughout the group stage no exception. Italy for the most part in 2021 as well, Germany had a strong tournament group stage included in the WC of 2014 and Italy a sort of middling one in 2006. Not brilliant but not terrible either- perfectly reasonable.

 

Exactly. Don't get me wrong. I'm certainly not saying one underwhelming performance will define England's tournament.

It's just fickin typical that it happens to be the only game I watched that was so dull. 

[joe jordans teeth]

49 minutes ago, Coin-op said:

Can anyone explain what a forced turnover is? Also what is a defensive line break? Are these for American audiences? Not heard (seen) these before. 

Forced turnover is a tackle and defensive line break I’m guessing is a ball through or a man running with the ball,it’s all tosh 

[And Its Smith]

If England win its because the opposition were awful. If England don’t win, the opposition is irrelevant and England are awful 

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 24/11/2022 at 23:09, Harry said:

It’s number 3) 

To follow up my last penalties, checked some Championship penalty ratios for recent years.

NO VAR so it's a perfect sample size.

Last season, it was 0.1938 per game.

This season (to date) it is 0.1726 per game.

2019-20 it was 0.2409 per game.

2020-21 it was 0.2536 per game.

A sharp fall in penalties awarded without doubt.

[maxjak]

Versus Wales..........we need to rest Kane, drop Sterling, and play Foden and Wilson..........and with Wilson in the middle, also play Alexander Arnold  IMO...............it so easy being England manager....Ha!

[joe jordans teeth]

3 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

If England win its because the opposition were awful. If England don’t win, the opposition is irrelevant and England are awful 

Don’t forget we have the best midfielders and strike force when we score but our defence is awful,when we don’t score but keep a clean sheet our forward players are crap and our defence is still crap 

[maxjak]

Such a shame that whenever SA find themselves in a good shooting position as a result of excellent approach play.......they blast it, instead of placing it, they should be at least drawing.........gonna cost them?

[Rossi the Robin]

44 minutes ago, redkev said:

Goes to show no alcohol in Qatar no trouble 

Alcohol in Tenerife trouble 

you can tell it’s alcohol related by the state of the punches being thrown 

There is alcohol out there but I’d imagine it’s the stricter punishments that are more of a deterrent 

[Sir Geoff]

Not apologising for Southgate but I wonder how much the Wales result changed his thinking and approach to the game. Wales win then we need to beat USA to retain control of the group. Wales lose and we only need a point so play not to lose.