Semenyo sale

[tin]

I don’t think his attitude’s the issue; his performances have nosedived since he changed his agent a few months ago and I suspect they are in his ear, telling him he’s bigger and better than us. Going to the World Cup would fuel that, even if his performances won’t. 

[Sleepy1968]

He spent more time yesterday moaning to the ref than he did concentrating on his game. Bloody shut up and get on with it.

[petehinton]

I think this window could be a bit chaotic personally. Judging by Pearson’s comments recently, there’s clearly work being done for in and outgoings, and he’s probably realising we can’t just rely on frees in the summer now so will want to speed up the likes of Bentley & HNM going. Atkinson could even be a consideration if he really wanted it to, based on yesterdays presser & his market value. Wouldn’t rule out Semenyo leaving considering he’s not even a starter now. 

Edited December 18, 2022 by petehinton

[AshtonRobin21]

2 minutes ago, petehinton said:

I think this window could be a bit chaotic personally. Judging by Pearson’s comments recently, there’s clearly work being done for in and outgoings, and he’s probably realising we can’t just rely on frees in the summer now so will want to speed up the likes of Bentley & HNM going. Atkinson could even be a consideration if he really wanted it to, based on yesterdays presser & his market value. Wouldn’t rule out Semenyo leaving considering he’s not even a starter now. 

I agree with all of those.

The comments about Atkinson yesterday, just made me question if he would consider a sale.

Between now and the start of next season, our squad will look very, very different. Too many players approaching the end of their deals. 

[sh1t_ref_again]

Value depends on if you look at The Semenyo last year scoring for fun and bullying bigger centre halfs or Semenyo this year who is either suffering from a lack of confidence and needs a goal or to to find some form or had world cup and agent talk on his mind instead. No way would I sell for even 5 million.

[Fammyfan]

It depends on how likely he is to sign a new contract. If unlikely, at that stage I’d be looking for £5m with a decent sell on.

[TBW]

Probably should've pushed his sale while we had the chance and he was scoring regularly. He's been a bit-part player for a while this season and that's never good for value in the transfer market. He didn't give a bad showing at the World Cup but didn't set anything alight either so don't know... maybe we find a way to fit him in more and just stop worrying about selling him...

Nevertheless, we will find out in the next six weeks.

[Sir Geoff]

1 hour ago, petehinton said:

I think this window could be a bit chaotic personally. Judging by Pearson’s comments recently, there’s clearly work being done for in and outgoings, and he’s probably realising we can’t just rely on frees in the summer now so will want to speed up the likes of Bentley & HNM going. Atkinson could even be a consideration if he really wanted it to, based on yesterdays presser & his market value. Wouldn’t rule out Semenyo leaving considering he’s not even a starter now. 

That's how I interpreted what he was saying too. I.e a few deals being brought forward by 6 months. Got a funny feeling a deal has been done for Semenyo and therefore Pearson has a bit of wriggle room to bring a couple in.

[Ivorguy]

2 hours ago, AshtonRobin21 said:

I agree with all of those.

The comments about Atkinson yesterday, just made me question if he would consider a sale.

Between now and the start of next season, our squad will look very, very different. Too many players approaching the end of their deals. 

Maybe to start on the road, yet again, in Third Division, with new owner,  new manager and coaches with a three season plan for promotion and a three year plan for a second promotion.  In short, proper planning to reach and stay in top division.  Something I have never seem in over 70 seasons.

Planning is key - short term, mid term, and long term.  Coaching, team, academy, financial, ground  - in fact the lot.  Start with a total clean slate and the let’s go.  Do I think that at all likely.  This is City, so no I don’t.  SL will fail to pull in a seller, even if he wants to (which isn’t clear), we shall go on overpaying for washed up senior players, continue with poor coaching (why cannot the players be trained to take dead balls at free kicks and corners with at least some degree of consistency, or indeed throw ins).  I have been an NP supporter but now I want him as Director of Football, with a young hungry proven manager, and when promotion comes find an experienced manager for that next level

 

But above all I am done with all the claptrap the owner spouts about the goal of top division

[Davefevs]

10 minutes ago, Ivorguy said:

Maybe to start on the road, yet again, in Third Division, with new owner,  new manager and coaches with a three season plan for promotion and a three year plan for a second promotion.  In short, proper planning to reach and stay in top division.  Something I have never seem in over 70 seasons.

Perhaps you need someone who’s experienced it and knows what it takes to build that?

[Davefevs]

13 minutes ago, Ivorguy said:

 I have been an NP supporter but now I want him as Director of Football, with a young hungry proven manager, and when promotion comes find an experienced manager for that next level

The Tinnion appointment has ruled that out I reckon, but I see that “consultant” type role being a good fit…as long as you get the right “first team” playing manager.  That’s the hard bit.

[Ivorguy]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

The Tinnion appointment has ruled that out I reckon, but I see that “consultant” type role being a good fit…as long as you get the right “first team” playing manager.  That’s the hard bit.

Agree with that, but other clubs have found such managers, eg Brighton.  Our problem is that our owner does not take advice kindly.  That is the root of our problem, imo

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, Ivorguy said:

Agree with that, but other clubs have found such managers, eg Brighton.  Our problem is that our owner does not take advice kindly.  That is the root of our problem, imo

I think our owner thinks he knows a bit about football.  He doesn’t.  Employ professionals…at whatever level required.

[1960maaan]

2 hours ago, Ivorguy said:

Agree with that, but other clubs have found such managers, eg Brighton.  Our problem is that our owner does not take advice kindly.  That is the root of our problem, imo

 

9 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I think our owner thinks he knows a bit about football.  He doesn’t.  Employ professionals…at whatever level required.

That's the route of our troubles I think Steve has wanted to make decisions in a field he is not qualified to . TBF it's something that every one of us does, the difference every time he's made a mistake he has literally paid the price. I hope he's learned , he seems to have started to employ better, more suited people. You could say it started with Ashton, that didn't end well but I think he just put too much trust in someone who was ultimately a chancer, all be it one that seemed the ideal fit. Move on to Pearson and you could argue it was an appointment that Lansdown would not have made at any other time during his tenure. The typical Bristol City bit kicks in then, we have the perfect CEO only for him to be poached away again. It could be small signs that Steve has seen the light and realises he needs good, knowledgeable people in charge to actually take the Club forward. 
If they have any sense, Gould and the board will be looking for the new CEO but also looking at the next manager. That Pearson will go is inevitable, when is the question. If it is the end of the Season, we will be safe and set make another step, I think that will be without Pearson in charge.

[Davefevs]

37 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

 

That's the route of our troubles I think Steve has wanted to make decisions in a field he is not qualified to . TBF it's something that every one of us does, the difference every time he's made a mistake he has literally paid the price. I hope he's learned , he seems to have started to employ better, more suited people. You could say it started with Ashton, that didn't end well but I think he just put too much trust in someone who was ultimately a chancer, all be it one that seemed the ideal fit. Move on to Pearson and you could argue it was an appointment that Lansdown would not have made at any other time during his tenure. The typical Bristol City bit kicks in then, we have the perfect CEO only for him to be poached away again. It could be small signs that Steve has seen the light and realises he needs good, knowledgeable people in charge to actually take the Club forward. 
If they have any sense, Gould and the board will be looking for the new CEO but also looking at the next manager. That Pearson will go is inevitable, when is the question. If it is the end of the Season, we will be safe and set make another step, I think that will be without Pearson in charge.

[Spike]

On 17/12/2022 at 19:27, Ivorguy said:

Realistically how much would you pay for him.

I really am puzzled that clubs said to be interested rate him so highly.

Please sell and get us a goal scoring centre forward to support Conway.

I think to use he's not worth alot, to a club with the right players around him he could be lethal upfront. I say this because Semenyo is best when running side by side against a defender, his strength and pace see's him win most of those battles but if you look at how we play we never play those balls to him unless it's out wide where he has to slow down and come back. I think if you put him in a team like QPR with Johansen behind him and he's going to score for fun because he's the type of player who will play those passes for Semenyo to run along side a center back and beat him.

I think Semenyo has a lot of qualities that bigger club identify because they have the talent to play the kind of passes he would feed off of, we on the hand do not. Looking at our squad I cannot identify a single midfielder or forward other than Weimann who can identify those passes through the middle that strikers love to run onto, one of the key reasons Weimann is used here there and everywhere, he isn't one dimensional, he is a jack of all trades. Whilst on the subject of Weimann he's been getting stick for not being the same player as he was last season but again that comes from how he is being used and is a victim of his own success. If Weimann wasn't so good in so many different positions he'd undoubtedly be ahead of Wells IMO and with a striker like Conway next to him we'd be scoring a lot more.

I'm sure many people will read this as "Pearson's got it all wrong" but I don't think that's the case, I think it's more he inherited a team who played a 5-3-2/3-5-2 hybrid formation and he's not go the money or resources to change that so he has taken that formation that the players that have been brought up through the academy playing that system and tried to make the best of a bad situation. The issue is we've gone almost 2 seasons without a natural RWB and I think Pearson addressed with with Kane Wilson but was very unlucky in the sense that Wilson has a long term injury. Sykes is a midfielder naturally and he's has to adapt to that RWB position and obviously isn't up to the standard that we need as we rely on crossing and his crossing is hit and miss as it never was a part of his game when we signed him. He's another player who has become victim to being adaptable.

I think as it stands Semenyo is a player we should be looking to sell as we're not going to change this system and even if we did we would need a midfielder who could sit behind the front two and play the passes Semenyo would feed off of, as it is we play to the wings and cross which nullifies Semenyos strengths. Pearson is simply filling positions with adaptable players atm and I think he's doing this with the summer, or maybe even this window if we can sell, in mind. I think he'll look to move on the big earners who aren't performing and bring in players in the areas we're lacking cover for and then add the quality where we can.

I personally hope Massengo, Semenyo, Kalas and Bentley are sold in the January window as we'll not get anything for them otherwise. Bentley must go this window, as should Massengo as he's not going to sign a new contract, that much is clear.

I'd also add no matter what we sell Semenyo for it will come back to "bit us in the ass" if the buying team has the right players to play to his strengths as I think he'll find form with the right players around him, hence Chelseas interest a while ago, they obviously saw the raw power and pace and thought "we can work with that".

[Davefevs]

Good summary @Spike.  I think most things are a compromise at the mo’…trying to get by until a point where we can be more strategic with recruitment.

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

4 hours ago, Spike said:

I think to use he's not worth alot, to a club with the right players around him he could be lethal upfront. I say this because Semenyo is best when running side by side against a defender, his strength and pace see's him win most of those battles but if you look at how we play we never play those balls to him unless it's out wide where he has to slow down and come back. I think if you put him in a team like QPR with Johansen behind him and he's going to score for fun because he's the type of player who will play those passes for Semenyo to run along side a center back and beat him.

I think Semenyo has a lot of qualities that bigger club identify because they have the talent to play the kind of passes he would feed off of, we on the hand do not. Looking at our squad I cannot identify a single midfielder or forward other than Weimann who can identify those passes through the middle that strikers love to run onto, one of the key reasons Weimann is used here there and everywhere, he isn't one dimensional, he is a jack of all trades. Whilst on the subject of Weimann he's been getting stick for not being the same player as he was last season but again that comes from how he is being used and is a victim of his own success. If Weimann wasn't so good in so many different positions he'd undoubtedly be ahead of Wells IMO and with a striker like Conway next to him we'd be scoring a lot more.

I'm sure many people will read this as "Pearson's got it all wrong" but I don't think that's the case, I think it's more he inherited a team who played a 5-3-2/3-5-2 hybrid formation and he's not go the money or resources to change that so he has taken that formation that the players that have been brought up through the academy playing that system and tried to make the best of a bad situation. The issue is we've gone almost 2 seasons without a natural RWB and I think Pearson addressed with with Kane Wilson but was very unlucky in the sense that Wilson has a long term injury. Sykes is a midfielder naturally and he's has to adapt to that RWB position and obviously isn't up to the standard that we need as we rely on crossing and his crossing is hit and miss as it never was a part of his game when we signed him. He's another player who has become victim to being adaptable.

I think as it stands Semenyo is a player we should be looking to sell as we're not going to change this system and even if we did we would need a midfielder who could sit behind the front two and play the passes Semenyo would feed off of, as it is we play to the wings and cross which nullifies Semenyos strengths. Pearson is simply filling positions with adaptable players atm and I think he's doing this with the summer, or maybe even this window if we can sell, in mind. I think he'll look to move on the big earners who aren't performing and bring in players in the areas we're lacking cover for and then add the quality where we can.

I personally hope Massengo, Semenyo, Kalas and Bentley are sold in the January window as we'll not get anything for them otherwise. Bentley must go this window, as should Massengo as he's not going to sign a new contract, that much is clear.

I'd also add no matter what we sell Semenyo for it will come back to "bit us in the ass" if the buying team has the right players to play to his strengths as I think he'll find form with the right players around him, hence Chelseas interest a while ago, they obviously saw the raw power and pace and thought "we can work with that".

I understand what you say about Semenyo but I remain to be convinced he will ever become a, prolific goalscorer, as his lack of ball control and more importantly his lack of composure say to me he'll never reach those heights. He is a power forward who relies on the strength of his shot rather than any guile to beat the keeper, and snatches at too many opportunities to see a regular return of 20 goals per season. 

[Sir Geoff]

1 hour ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

I understand what you say about Semenyo but I remain to be convinced he will ever become a, prolific goalscorer, as his lack of ball control and more importantly his lack of composure say to me he'll never reach those heights. He is a power forward who relies on the strength of his shot rather than any guile to beat the keeper, and snatches at too many opportunities to see a regular return of 20 goals per season. 

Thought he lacked a bit of bravery on Saturday too. It was easy to miss that header. A braver forward puts his head in there without a second thought, scores and gets a whack for his troubles.

[Spike]

4 hours ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

I understand what you say about Semenyo but I remain to be convinced he will ever become a, prolific goalscorer, as his lack of ball control and more importantly his lack of composure say to me he'll never reach those heights. He is a power forward who relies on the strength of his shot rather than any guile to beat the keeper, and snatches at too many opportunities to see a regular return of 20 goals per season. 

I do agree to an extent but that touch and control of the ball can be taught, not to the level that he's going to be mistaken for a Brazilian but certainly to the point where he can make the most of his best assets. I guess we'll see in time, I mean he's destined to go IMO.