Steve Lansdown……..

[Numero Uno]

20 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Let's pull out of the football bubble a minute, and look at it rationally and from a business perspective.

We protest against a guy not using his money to bankroll us. If he is running us cash breakeven he is totally well within his rights. The apparent moving of the goal posts is something else entirely but if an entity in this case us, are not cash breakeven or better than we are reliant on the owner topping that up...we had about £158,641 in Cash in Bank and Cash Equivalents at the end of 2021-22, how long would that last.

Unless there is a binding contract there is no legal obligation.

Totally understand what you are saying and totally grateful for the AMOUNT OF MONEY that Steve has invested from his own personal wealth that he certainly didn't have to. In that regard the bloke is generous to a fault and has to be applauded for that.

On the flip said of that I would say that once Steve CHOSE to take that course of action and, furthermore, informed the fanbase that due to this course of action "it's his money, his club and he's not funding people to watch football in Bristol", his prerogative obviously, then he does put himself in a position that is ripe for scrutiny on his decision making in my view. The fact we are an entity that seems to be virtually unbuyable unless you are prepared to also buy tens of millions of pounds of assets related to other sporting organsations is the way that STEVE decided to set the operation up, nobody else.

The fact that he allowed Lee Johnson to fill our squad at huge expense (didn't we have over 30 pro's at one time?) and the result of that was to remain in the division and end up with a significant FFP problem after COVID hit is not of anyone's making but Steve's. He sanctioned it, granted he PAID for it, but that's on him. What sticks in my throat is that Johnson gets a free ride (and the CEO at the time) and we now have a Manager who has agreed to work under severe restrictions (we all know that's true whether some like to admit it for their own agenda or not), has comfortably kept us in the division twice under those restrictions but who apparently hasn't "achieved anything" and ought to be able to "do a Luton" with the fantastic squad he has at his disposal. You don't need to be a genius to work out the dynamic of spiky Manager who has enough confidence in his standing in the game and record to say it as it is and Owner who doesn't appreciate being told how it is..............

It's comments of crass stupidity which make people quickly forget the purely business perspective of it all.

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Totally understand what you are saying and totally grateful for the AMOUNT OF MONEY that Steve has invested from his own personal wealth that he certainly didn't have to. In that regard the bloke is generous to a fault and has to be applauded for that.

On the flip said of that I would say that once Steve CHOSE to take that course of action and, furthermore, informed the fanbase that due to this course of action "it's his money, his club and he's not funding people to watch football in Bristol", his prerogative obviously, then he does put himself in a position that is ripe for scrutiny on his decision making in my view. The fact we are an entity that seems to be virtually unbuyable unless you are prepared to also buy tens of millions of pounds of assets related to other sporting organsations is the way that STEVE decided to set the operation up, nobody else.

The fact that he allowed Lee Johnson to fill our squad at huge expense (didn't we have over 30 pro's at one time?) and the result of that was to remain in the division and end up with a significant FFP problem after COVID hit is not of anyone's making but Steve's. He sanctioned it, granted he PAID for it, but that's on him. What sticks in my throat is that Johnson gets a free ride (and the CEO at the time) and we now have a Manager who has agreed to work under severe restrictions (we all know that's true whether some like to admit it for their own agenda or not), has comfortably kept us in the division twice under those restrictions but who apparently hasn't "achieved anything" and ought to be able to "do a Luton" with the fantastic squad he has at his disposal. You don't need to be a genius to work out the dynamic of spiky Manager who has enough confidence in his standing in the game and record to say it as it is and Owner who doesn't appreciate being told how it is..............

It's comments of crass stupidity which make people quickly forget the purely business perspective of it all.

Yeah I agree. This is not fair on the fans and it isn't fair on NP. Certainly there is a huge disconnect in the backing granted to Johnson and Ashton vs that of NP.

Yeah Luton feels a bit of a one-off really.  Can't see that of all models as being particularly easy to replicate her and in addition they had a bigger squad than we have which would assist with competition, depth, rotation. The comparison is a poor one by SL.

Yes the amount he poured in is on him somewhat but not entirely, Millwall, Prsston, a host of clubs require funding to some degree from owners and in increasing amounts. It also reflects a division where 100 pct of turnover has been known to go on wages as a divisional average.

Yeah he let those two run amok and now we seem to be wildly over correcting at just the wrong time. Or should I say SL seems to be wildly overcorrecting at just the wrong time. 

[Ivorguy]

17 hours ago, One Team said:

I’ve said a number of times that when people declare sweeping statements about our fans opinions that OTIB represents a very, very small monitory of views. 

Of all the City fans I know, whether they go or not, local or not, only two of them even know this forum exists. 

That said, in OTIB universe, making the statements about SL (myself included) we’ve seen this week would never have occurred a few years ago. 

Nonsense.  I, amongst others, have warned about SL’s stewardship for a number of years now, and taken abuse for it.  It is good to note that others are now coming round to this critique of SL, especially the nonsense that is Bristol Sport.  Thank goodness he never got his hands on Glos cricket!

[Greedo]

Show us the money, Steve, or sell the club. 

[Davefevs]

@Numero Uno great post

@Ivorguy yes you did.  I know I always say it, but as a noob to OTIB I asked you why you had the view you held, and your reply made a lot of sense.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Required reading for some of the critics..from the 2021-22 Accounts. Other Borrowings 1 and 4.

Well not just the critics but everyone tbh.

In theory never mind cash break even he could run us in a way that very slowly begins to pay off some of his loans. 

Edited August 31, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[lenred]

1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

However I also see him as a Manager that won’t bullshit the fans to keep the Upstairs Mob happy and if things are playing out as many people are concerned about them we will be hearing a few interesting interviews before the season ends and/or he is relieved of his duties.

A nice big fat NDA may put paid to that! I say in jest but wouldn’t put it past them.  

[Clutton Caveman]

19 hours ago, Superjack said:

Indeed. 

 

Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

Would be interesting if SL sold the club to the fans. Clearly a few would have to buy big chunks of shares but the rest would be held by the 20,000 regulars. I wonder:

How many would put their hand in their pocket to buy the shares

How many would accept zero % return on their investment each year

How many would be happy to be continually asked to put their hand in their pocket to top up the coffers to cover our yearly loss.

How we could ever agree on anything such as a new manager

If we would still hear call for big spending

[richwwtk]

1 hour ago, glynriley said:

"And is not an Arab" on it as well, just to please a few on here...

I presume that is a dig at my comment about not wanting owners like Man City, the fewers or Newcastle?

Funnily enough the Arab thing hadn't even crossed my mind until you remarked on it.

I would just prefer someone with a connection to the club and not an owner that is effectively a nation state looking to boost their profile, or anyone else that only sees us as an investment.

[Lord Northski]

I can completely understand Steve Lansdown repeatedly pumping in cash to the club with no obvious evident improvement on the pitch.  His seeming refusal to do so again with the Scott money, despite there being obvious holes on in our playing squad is clearly an indication to us all that the tap has been turned off, and that the club cannot repeatedly make duff signings, wasting money on players that aren't good enough and simply expect to buy more. Cornick and Mehmeti aren't good enough, and although they may show promise, they both shouldn't be anywhere near the starting eleven on current form.

Is it that our scouting isn't good enough, or that there's a disconnect between what Steve Lansdown's been told about these players when the money request goes in, and what he sees in return.

Whatever it is, Steve Lansdown has seemingly fallen out of love with something: Pearson? Ungrateful fans? Owning a football club? or the removal of smoke blowers? We must clearly get accustomed to the new reality, until Pearson conjures something out of nothing, which is his job after all. Or Steve falls back in love with football again. Unlike many, I don't believe a new messiah will be able to provide any more funds than we've had already, and almost definitely won't support the other Bristol teams in the same way.  

[GrahamC]

55 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

I never mentioned the word outlier. I said we have half a dozen out, ok I was wrong it's five. You only have to look at our bench to see that we have a problem. We have a thin squad (and before anyone says that's Nige's choice we are either at or very close to agreed maximum wage bill aren't we?). So thin that when the U23's have a game we can't even fill the bench with players close to the standard at the moment. The injured players, even Benarous in my view, would all add something to the squad.

If we are going to exclude players with limited appearances then we have a squad that doesn't contain a competitive number 2 goalkeeper...................and can't afford to add one by the sound of it. We also have Yeboah, Aroaye, Knight-Lebell and Leeson filling the bench. If they only count as players "at a stretch" too due to limited appearances then that leaves us with around 15 available players at the moment!!

I just think in 2 specific cases we went into the season already knowing this.

Atkinson did his ACL in February, so he’s not likely to play this calendar year.

Benarous has done his ACL twice, he’s currently out with a hamstring injury, the prospect of us relying on him as a significant part of the squad in the near future seems improbable.

Therefore we currently have 3 others missing, one of whom is ill, this strikes me as about average (possibly even below) in terms of absentees.

The goalkeeper situation is what it is, we are relying on O’Leary staying fit & 2 inexperienced deputies (though Bajic has played 9 times in the French top flight), not ideal but unlikely to change.

Most on here think it odd we are trying to run on such low numbers & that we need a couple in, but now doubt it will happen.

Just to finish on the U21s, Leeson hasn’t been involved this season & those who were early on have dropped out not because of playing games but because their performances at level have been so poor.

@Davefevs said on another thread that the 9 subs business was a bit ridiculous anyway & I agree, provided we have a sub goalie then maybe we make a policy decision to just have 7 anyway, cover most positions with that & don’t include youngsters for the sake of it.

 

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, Ivorguy said:

Nonsense.  I, amongst others, have warned about SL’s stewardship for a number of years now, and taken abuse for it.  It is good to note that others are now coming round to this critique of SL, especially the nonsense that is Bristol Sport.  Thank goodness he never got his hands on Glos cricket!

we have arrived at our destination,

Edited August 31, 2023 by wtf

[milo1111]

It’s lansdowns poor decisions that have meant has had to prop up the club. Especially the decision to let Ashton run wild. The buck stops with him so the fact he has had to pump in millions is his own problem.

it’s hardly left him in the gutter has it.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, milo1111 said:

It’s lansdowns poor decisions that have meant has had to prop up the club. Especially the decision to let Ashton run wild. The buck stops with him so the fact he has had to pump in millions is his own problem.

it’s hardly left him in the gutter has it.

Sure but it is worth remembering that the Championship is a financial bin fire.

Partly him, partly the environment in which we operate.

[BS15_RED]

I’m certainly no fan of SL, indeed I’m one of many people who’ve found themselves blocked by him on Twitter, however I’m very wary of who comes after him. Watching Mission To Burnley on Sky was a real eye opener, absolutely not the sort of people I’d want running my club. 

[lenred]

4 minutes ago, BS15_RED said:

I’m certainly no fan of SL, indeed I’m one of many people who’ve found themselves blocked by him on Twitter, however I’m very wary of who comes after him. Watching Mission To Burnley on Sky was a real eye opener, absolutely not the sort of people I’d want running my club. 

Sort of people who got their team promoted? Who brought in football knowledge when they had little or none themselves?  Who went out and got the best coach available to them whilst also think outside of the box?   Why wouldn’t you? Because of the religion thing? 

[Davefevs]

39 minutes ago, Clutton Caveman said:

Would be interesting if SL sold the club to the fans. Clearly a few would have to buy big chunks of shares but the rest would be held by the 20,000 regulars. I wonder:

How many would put their hand in their pocket to buy the shares

How many would accept zero % return on their investment each year

How many would be happy to be continually asked to put their hand in their pocket to top up the coffers to cover our yearly loss.

How we could ever agree on anything such as a new manager

If we would still hear call for big spending

Steve - name your price for the football club and the ground please?  Give us a clue how much you want.  You can keep the rest, not interested in the rest from an investment point of view.

I’d put some money in, and then each year if I thought I had the right owners onboard.

[GrahamC]

16 minutes ago, BS15_RED said:

I’m certainly no fan of SL, indeed I’m one of many people who’ve found themselves blocked by him on Twitter, however I’m very wary of who comes after him. Watching Mission To Burnley on Sky was a real eye opener, absolutely not the sort of people I’d want running my club. 

Burnley have signed about 12 players this summer after getting promoted back to the Prem.

Their fans must be hating every moment, eh?

[frenchred]

17 minutes ago, BS15_RED said:

I’m certainly no fan of SL, indeed I’m one of many people who’ve found themselves blocked by him on Twitter, however I’m very wary of who comes after him. Watching Mission To Burnley on Sky was a real eye opener, absolutely not the sort of people I’d want running my club. 

I know what your saying, must be really shit sitting in the prem with an up and coming young coach

[Ian M]

I’ve seen suggestions along the lines of “Nige knew what the wage cap was, he chose to spend it this way” along with the general conception that we are 2 players short (see Norwich bench for evidence to back that up.

If we presume Cornick to be one our highest earners on around £15k per week and add that many fans fail to see what he brings (not me, I think he has his uses), potentially he would be a good example for someone we could have not signed and bought 3 players instead. To do that, those three players would have had to be signed on less than the League One average salary!

If we want to have a decently sized squad, we are going to have to cost cut yet further and impose a maximum salary of £10k per week and risk the results that players who will accept those terms may bring.

[One Team]

1 hour ago, Ivorguy said:

Nonsense.  I, amongst others, have warned about SL’s stewardship for a number of years now, and taken abuse for it.  It is good to note that others are now coming round to this critique of SL, especially the nonsense that is Bristol Sport.  Thank goodness he never got his hands on Glos cricket!

What’s nonsense? 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Parachute Payments don't half help though. That and a big profit of £36m pre tax in 2021-22 to bolster. Varied PL players retained. Sure they've done well but a good position to enter from.

Birmingham or Hull maybe a better comparison. Let's see how these fare in the next 2-3 years.

[BS15_RED]

31 minutes ago, lenred said:

Sort of people who got their team promoted? Who brought in football knowledge when they had little or none themselves?  Who went out and got the best coach available to them whilst also think outside of the box?   Why wouldn’t you? Because of the religion thing? 

The sort of people who take a club with £42m in the bank, and lumber them with £130m worth of debt….

[milo1111]

44 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Sure but it is worth remembering that the Championship is a financial bin fire.

Partly him, partly the environment in which we operate.

Very true Mr P

Purely down to the riches that exist above I’m sure most will agree. I’m so hoping the Saudi PL changes that over the next few years

[BS15_RED]

23 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Burnley have signed about 12 players this summer after getting promoted back to the Prem.

Their fans must be hating every moment, eh?

 

23 minutes ago, frenchred said:

I know what your saying, must be really shit sitting in the prem with an up and coming young coach

We’ll see how they fare this season, but you won’t convince me that in the long term that they’ll be good for Burnley.

[frenchred]

7 minutes ago, BS15_RED said:

 

We’ll see how they fare this season, but you won’t convince me that in the long term that they’ll be good for Burnley.

And you won't convince me that lansdown will be good for us in the short/mid/long term

[BS15_RED]

3 minutes ago, frenchred said:

And you won't convince me that lansdown will be good for us in the short/mid/long term

Mate, as I said in my original post, I’m not an SL fan, it’s just I’m wary of who comes in after him. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

It would be interesting to try and forecast the future post SL.

Would we want a 2-3 year roll of the dice on promotion? Spending accordingly.

Hire or retain the best in class, build on the good points that we do have and try to improve continuously on the weaker aspects.

Wage bill- how high?

Gross spend- how much?

Or would we risk getting some Private Equity. That can drive standards but if success doesn't arrive in a few years that can also go belly up given we are not a profitable or a cash rich entity in the main.

Edited August 31, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Red Exile]

9 minutes ago, BS15_RED said:

Mate, as I said in my original post, I’m not an SL fan, it’s just I’m wary of who comes in after him. 

I think we all would be wary, but the reality of professional sport is that it's about ambition. SL has thrown a blanket of unambitious mediocrity over the club for years.

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 minutes ago, Red Exile said:

I think we all would be wary, but the reality of professional sport is that it's about ambition. SL has thrown a blanket of unambitious mediocrity over the club for years.

Two to three years were FFP we were somewhat hamstrung. In part due to his decisions and lack of oversight but a £26.5m in Additions ie 2019-20 as well as the wage bill continuing to rise was a bit of a statement tbh.

Wage bill peaked at £35m in 2020-21.

Edited August 31, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous