George Galloway

[solo1bc]

George Galloway on Sky News!

Go on George my son!

[Barrs Court Red]

The same Sky News you so deplore in your other posts?

[KevinC]

I have not had much time for George Galloway in the past, but he tells the truth about the situation. I was due to fly to Israel in a couple of months but am now not going. I have decided this not because I am afraid, as I have been in Israel in past times of conflict, but I will not go as I will not give my cash to a country which is desperate to avoid truth.

The Israelis are keeping very quiet about their losses and about the bombs falling in the north of their country. The media is severely censored and the citizens of the country have no idea what is going on, and instead have to tune in to foreign media to see a fuller picture (a friend who has just returned from Israel tells me that little is being reported on Israeli TV).

We have been distracted from what is going on in the Palestinian territories in recent weeks, and I am given to understand that Israeli forces have taken the opportunity to use the distraction to create mayhem there. It is all a little like the Soviets in 1956 who used the distraction of the Suez crisis to invade Hungary and the distraction of the Vietnam war and student crisis of 1968 to invade Czechoslovakia.

[barry_manc]

He's a goon Galloway, but I would love to see him in a rap.

Drop it like it's hooot.

[Redhyde]

I like George, i listen to his radio show most weeks.

He does himself no favours with his childish name calling and ranting though.

[solo1bc]

The same Sky News you so deplore in your other posts?

Um, yeah, did you watch the video?

I have not had much time for George Galloway in the past, but he tells the truth about the situation. I was due to fly to Israel in a couple of months but am now not going. I have decided this not because I am afraid, as I have been in Israel in past times of conflict, but I will not go as I will not give my cash to a country which is desperate to avoid truth.

The Israelis are keeping very quiet about their losses and about the bombs falling in the north of their country. The media is severely censored and the citizens of the country have no idea what is going on, and instead have to tune in to foreign media to see a fuller picture (a friend who has just returned from Israel tells me that little is being reported on Israeli TV).

We have been distracted from what is going on in the Palestinian territories in recent weeks, and I am given to understand that Israeli forces have taken the opportunity to use the distraction to create mayhem there. It is all a little like the Soviets in 1956 who used the distraction of the Suez crisis to invade Hungary and the distraction of the Vietnam war and student crisis of 1968 to invade Czechoslovakia.

I agree with the majority of Galloways opinions but I think he sometimes comes off as self promoting or on a bit of an ego trip. He certainly tells it as he sees it though and wouldn't it be nice if all (or any!) politicians did the same.

Regarding the media in Israel then are they covering up the number of Lebanese casualties as well as their own?

Here's a funny video from the brilliant Jon Stewart on the US reporting of the situation;

Brink of War?!

And here's a rather disturbing one about the Israel lobby and it's influence on the US media;

Peace, Propoganda & the Promised Land (torrent)

[Guest :^)bcfcjake]

...and remember when he was on big brother acting like a cat- classic!!

[hilltop red]

i'm sorry but i cant take this loon seriously.The arab world wants the state of israel destroyed. Hezbelloh crawled through tunnels into israeli territory to kidnap and kill israeli soldiers. Israel wont and shouldn't tolorate this and so has gone after the terroists.

The amount of civillian deaths is unacceptable, but the terroists are in civillian areas and so casulties are to be expected. Israel lives in a state of fear from terroist groups backed by muslim leaders. They have a right to crush these hezzbolah terriosts.

Why people listen to a fool that ponced around on big brother and was mates with saddam i will not understand. I would expect our leaders to go after groups that wanted to harm us. The destruction of roads and ports in lebonan is to stop the enemy from resupplying, unfortuntley as in all wars the innocent are being caught up in the middle.

[solo1bc]

i'm sorry but i cant take this loon seriously.The arab world wants the state of israel destroyed. Hezbelloh crawled through tunnels into israeli territory to kidnap and kill israeli soldiers. Israel wont and shouldn't tolorate this and so has gone after the terroists.

The amount of civillian deaths is unacceptable, but the terroists are in civillian areas and so casulties are to be expected. Israel lives in a state of fear from terroist groups backed by muslim leaders. They have a right to crush these hezzbolah terriosts.

Why people listen to a fool that ponced around on big brother and was mates with saddam i will not understand. I would expect our leaders to go after groups that wanted to harm us. The destruction of roads and ports in lebonan is to stop the enemy from resupplying, unfortuntley as in all wars the innocent are being caught up in the middle.

I really don't want to get in to this debate again as I'm sure the other posters on here are getting bored of it. My views are clear in other threads.

You so wrong though that it's a bit scary to be honest. I could rant and rave and 'try' to prove that to you but I'm learning that there are a few on here who have a right wing view and stick to it regardless of the facts or even common sense so I really can't be bothered. My apologies if your not one of those but you can see the other threads anyway.

Here is an article which I think everyone should read regardless of their political views.

Choosing the path of peace, justice & love

[bristolborn_and_red]

Mr Galloway conviently forgets why Israel was in Lebanon in the first place during the 18 year occupation. This is same man who sucked up to Saddam and when he was removed went scuttling to Assad of Syria This man was married to a Palestinian, no wonder he is anti-Israel. He is an odious creature.

[hilltop red]

I really don't want to get in to this debate again as I'm sure the other posters on here are getting bored of it. My views are clear in other threads.

You so wrong though that it's a bit scary to be honest. I could rant and rave and 'try' to prove that to you but I'm learning that there are a few on here who have a right wing view and stick to it regardless of the facts or even common sense so I really can't be bothered. My apologies if your not one of those but you can see the other threads anyway.

Here is an article which I think everyone should read regardless of their political views.

Choosing the path of peace, justice & love

which bits are wrong?

the arab world wanting to see israel wiped from the map? Hezbelloh tunnling into israel to kidnap and kill soldiers? hezzbolah hiding in civillian in areas? So far thats all true. george galloway being mates with saddam. true. george galloway poncing around in big brother. true. civillan deaths in war unavoidable. unfortunate but true.

A free sovergin state such as israel being able to defend itself against attacks terroists. is acceptable.

so where is i am so wrong it's scary is coming from, i don't know. Maybe your views are under attack from my post. maybe it is you, that wont move and listen to reason.

If a nation harboured terrosts, that were crossing the boarder attacking the uk i would expect are goverment to do something about it. Israel are doing what needs doing. All their neighbours would be quite happy to see them disappear, so israel undoubtley are going in strong. I have already said that the civvillan deaths are unacceptable, but so are terroist activites.

[solo1bc]

which bits are wrong?

the arab world wanting to see israel wiped from the map? Hezbelloh tunnling into israel to kidnap and kill soldiers? hezzbolah hiding in civillian in areas? So far thats all true. george galloway being mates with saddam. true. george galloway poncing around in big brother. true. civillan deaths in war unavoidable. unfortunate but true.

A free sovergin state such as israel being able to defend itself against attacks terroists. is acceptable.

so where is i am so wrong it's scary is coming from, i don't know. Maybe your views are under attack from my post. maybe it is you, that wont move and listen to reason.

If a nation harboured terrosts, that were crossing the boarder attacking the uk i would expect are goverment to do something about it. Israel are doing what needs doing. All their neighbours would be quite happy to see them disappear, so israel undoubtley are going in strong. I have already said that the civvillan deaths are unacceptable, but so are terroist activites.

I've answered all of these points on other threads mate and I really don't want to repeat myself. Someone I know was killed this evening and some of the views on the forum just belittle the situation in my opinion and aren't worth arguing. If you honestly believe that Israel is just 'defending itself' in this situation then you're too far gone anyway. Did you even read the article?

If you'd posted this a couple of days ago, I'd have been happy to disabuse you and if you read the other threads you'll have your answers anyway.

[hilltop red]

I've answered all of these points on other threads mate and I really don't want to repeat myself. Someone I know was killed this evening and some of the views on the forum just belittle the situation in my opinion and aren't worth arguing. If you honestly believe that Israel is just 'defending itself' in this situation then you're too far gone anyway. Did you even read the article?

If you'd posted this a couple of days ago, I'd have been happy to disabuse you and if you read the other threads you'll have your answers anyway.

You see this is where you jump to conclusions about things. I believe that israel was justified in their initial attacks, and our justified untill rockets stop landing in their terrotory. However the bombing of civvillians is totally unacceptable as I have already mentioned. The force is over the top. But why should they allow the rockets flying into northen israel, whilst an organisation has the means to do this the israilis should be allowed to go after them, untill a stabalising force from the un come s into the region.

Not part of this thread i know, but i do think the palastinians should have their free state and all israli forces leave that area.

don't reply there is no point, i know and have read your views on the situation, your views are not neccesarly the answers as you proclaim.

Also, sorry for your loss this evening.

[solo1bc]

You see this is where you jump to conclusions about things. I believe that israel was justified in their initial attacks, and our justified untill rockets stop landing in their terrotory. However the bombing of civvillians is totally unacceptable as I have already mentioned. The force is over the top. But why should they allow the rockets flying into northen israel, whilst an organisation has the means to do this the israilis should be allowed to go after them, untill a stabalising force from the un come s into the region.

Not part of this thread i know, but i do think the palastinians should have their free state and all israli forces leave that area.

don't reply there is no point, i know and have read your views on the situation, your views are not neccesarly the answers as you proclaim.

Also, sorry for your loss this evening.

Thank you hilltop and we'll agree to disagree for now.

[Spud55]

George Galloway on Sky News!

Go on George my son!

Telling it like it is ? Or conviniently forgetting history for his own agenda ? I know which one i think he is doing.

Ranting on about how the israelis started it with their occupation but conviniently forgets that this all started 48 hours after the creation of Israel, when the arab nations around decided to attack it unprovoked to try to drive the Israeli nation into the sea.

The sooner these barbarians like Hezbollah are killed the better, if the Israelis can't do it then well hopefully the rest of the world can.

I have very little time for either side, but every single death in this particular conflict is on the hands of hezbollah, they attacked Israel and so they and the lebanese people shall reap the whirlwind, if the lebanese people really want this to stop then mabye they should stop hezbollah, until they passively support them by doing nothing then sorry but they will die and they will have nobody to blame but hezbollah. Israel does sometimes go over the top but mabye if the Arabs hadn't from the off gone out with the intention to wipe them out and force them into a war of extermination, which it is then mabye Israel wouldn't react like this.

[solo1bc]

Telling it like it is ? Or conviniently forgetting history for his own agenda ? I know which one i think he is doing.

Ranting on about how the israelis started it with their occupation but conviniently forgets that this all started 48 hours after the creation of Israel, when the arab nations around decided to attack it unprovoked to try to drive the Israeli nation into the sea.

The sooner these barbarians like Hezbollah are killed the better, if the Israelis can't do it then well hopefully the rest of the world can.

I have very little time for either side, but every single death in this particular conflict is on the hands of hezbollah, they attacked Israel and so they and the lebanese people shall reap the whirlwind, if the lebanese people really want this to stop then mabye they should stop hezbollah, until they passively support them by doing nothing then sorry but they will die and they will have nobody to blame but hezbollah. Israel does sometimes go over the top but mabye if the Arabs hadn't from the off gone out with the intention to wipe them out and force them into a war of extermination, which it is then mabye Israel wouldn't react like this.

Nice bit of revisionist history. Well done.

For your information, the first Jews to arrive in Palestine after WW2 BOUGHT their land from Palestinians. Only in the 1960's did they start to arm themselves and try to take more land including most of Palestine and parts of Jordan and Lebanon. This is when the arab states fought back against Israel and 'tried to push them into the sea'. This is fact!

It's the war of 1967 mate so unless your reading a different history book, I don't know what your talking about.

Why does nobody ask the correct questions when talking about these subjects? It drives me crazy! Why would the arab states want to destory Israel? Why would fundamentalist muslims want to attack America or the UK? Why does NOBODY ever ask these questions?

Nobody to blame but Hezbollah?! Are you serious? I've not argued that Hezbollah didn't 'start this' (although I could argue the continual occupation of Lebanese territory, brutal occupation of palestine and continual detention of thousands of political prisoners is 'starting it' as well) but how on earth can Hezbollah be responsible for this insane reaction from Israel?

I'm sorry spud but that smacks of racism in my opinion. Israel has a right to defend itself but the destruction of a country, killing of over 1000 civilians (1/3 of which are children under the age of 12!) IS NOT DEFENDING YOURSELF!!

If they want to attack Hezbollah then let them send the infantry in as they are now. Why have they destroyed the countries infrastructure and flattened entire suburbs of Beirut? Why have they targetted aid convoys and ambulances? Why have they deliberatly created oil spills on Lebanons coast? Why have they bombed Christian areas?

Some of these questions are for hilltops post as well? I'm not denying Israels right to defend itself but their actions do not constitute 'defense'.

Theres really no point arguing the politics of the whole region as we obviousely won't agree on that but the only way you can possibly see this as Israel only 'going a little over the top' is as Galloway says you see Israeli blood as more valuable than Arab blood and that sickens me to my stomach.

Oh, and by the way... your opinion that the Lebanese are responsible for 'passively supporting' Hezbollah is exactly the same nonsense that the fundamentalist 'real' terrorists use to justify attacks on western civlians! We passively support Israel & our government policies so we are responsible and 'sorry but we will die' as you so nicely put it.

[Barrs Court Red]

[hilltop red]

Nice bit of revisionist history. Well done.

For your information, the first Jews to arrive in Palestine after WW2 BOUGHT their land from Palestinians. Only in the 1960's did they start to arm themselves and try to take more land including most of Palestine and parts of Jordan and Lebanon. This is when the arab states fought back against Israel and 'tried to push them into the sea'. This is fact!

It's the war of 1967 mate so unless your reading a different history book, I don't know what your talking about.

Why does nobody ask the correct questions when talking about these subjects? It drives me crazy! Why would the arab states want to destory Israel? Why would fundamentalist muslims want to attack America or the UK? Why does NOBODY ever ask these questions?

Nobody to blame but Hezbollah?! Are you serious? I've not argued that Hezbollah didn't 'start this' (although I could argue the continual occupation of Lebanese territory, brutal occupation of palestine and continual detention of thousands of political prisoners is 'starting it' as well) but how on earth can Hezbollah be responsible for this insane reaction from Israel?

I'm sorry spud but that smacks of racism in my opinion. Israel has a right to defend itself but the destruction of a country, killing of over 1000 civilians (1/3 of which are children under the age of 12!) IS NOT DEFENDING YOURSELF!!

If they want to attack Hezbollah then let them send the infantry in as they are now. Why have they destroyed the countries infrastructure and flattened entire suburbs of Beirut? Why have they targetted aid convoys and ambulances? Why have they deliberatly created oil spills on Lebanons coast? Why have they bombed Christian areas?

Some of these questions are for hilltops post as well? I'm not denying Israels right to defend itself but their actions do not constitute 'defense'.

Theres really no point arguing the politics of the whole region as we obviousely won't agree on that but the only way you can possibly see this as Israel only 'going a little over the top' is as Galloway says you see Israeli blood as more valuable than Arab blood and that sickens me to my stomach.

Oh, and by the way... your opinion that the Lebanese are responsible for 'passively supporting' Hezbollah is exactly the same nonsense that the fundamentalist 'real' terrorists use to justify attacks on western civlians! We passively support Israel & our government policies so we are responsible and 'sorry but we will die' as you so nicely put it.

Israel have been over the top as have already said. Air-strikes into civillian areas are unacceptable, and a ground invasion would be considerd a better strategy. Would it of worked, nobody knows. Hezzbollah rockets are still landing in israeli terrotory, untill this stops israel are justified to go after the militants to stop this from happening. The air strikes into the cities now needs to stop.

Aid to southren lebonan is being stopped by both israel and hezzbolah, both are guilty of a humanaterian disater. I am not neccesarly an israel supporter the treatment of palastine is despicable, but i do understand why they need to get rid of hezzbolah.

[solo1bc]

Israel have been over the top as have already said. Air-strikes into civillian areas are unacceptable, and a ground invasion would be considerd a better strategy. Would it of worked, nobody knows. Hezzbollah rockets are still landing in israeli terrotory, untill this stops israel are justified to go after the militants to stop this from happening. The air strikes into the cities now needs to stop.

Aid to southren lebonan is being stopped by both israel and hezzbolah, both are guilty of a humanaterian disater. I am not neccesarly an israel supporter the treatment of palastine is despicable, but i do understand why they need to get rid of hezzbolah.

Fair enough hilltop. At least your view is balanced. I don't agree with it but at least you can see the human tragedy that is happening.

I've said from the start that Hezbollah are no angels and have to take some responsibility for this crisis but this reaction from Israel is just another war crime in a very long list of war crimes. And before people start saying that I have a biased view, Israel has more UN resolutions against it than ANY OTHER COUNTRY since the UN's inception so it's the view of the majority of our planet as well.

The link below show a list of the UN resolutions that Israel has simply ignored with the support of the US.

Israel UN Resolutions

Hopefully this will help you understand why I get upset that Hezbollah are labelled as simply 'terrorists' while Israel is the victim 'defending itself'

[solo1bc]

So are we to ignore the events of 1948 then?

No, your quite right Moomin... I plead temporary insanity and stupidity!

[bristolborn_and_red]

Nice bit of revisionist history. Well done.

For your information, the first Jews to arrive in Palestine after WW2 BOUGHT their land from Palestinians. Only in the 1960's did they start to arm themselves and try to take more land including most of Palestine and parts of Jordan and Lebanon. This is when the arab states fought back against Israel and 'tried to push them into the sea'. This is fact!

It's the war of 1967 mate so unless your reading a different history book, I don't know what your talking about.

Why does nobody ask the correct questions when talking about these subjects? It drives me crazy! Why would the arab states want to destory Israel? Why would fundamentalist muslims want to attack America or the UK? Why does NOBODY ever ask these questions?

Nobody to blame but Hezbollah?! Are you serious? I've not argued that Hezbollah didn't 'start this' (although I could argue the continual occupation of Lebanese territory, brutal occupation of palestine and continual detention of thousands of political prisoners is 'starting it' as well) but how on earth can Hezbollah be responsible for this insane reaction from Israel?

I'm sorry spud but that smacks of racism in my opinion. Israel has a right to defend itself but the destruction of a country, killing of over 1000 civilians (1/3 of which are children under the age of 12!) IS NOT DEFENDING YOURSELF!!

If they want to attack Hezbollah then let them send the infantry in as they are now. Why have they destroyed the countries infrastructure and flattened entire suburbs of Beirut? Why have they targetted aid convoys and ambulances? Why have they deliberatly created oil spills on Lebanons coast? Why have they bombed Christian areas?

Some of these questions are for hilltops post as well? I'm not denying Israels right to defend itself but their actions do not constitute 'defense'.

Theres really no point arguing the politics of the whole region as we obviousely won't agree on that but the only way you can possibly see this as Israel only 'going a little over the top' is as Galloway says you see Israeli blood as more valuable than Arab blood and that sickens me to my stomach.

Oh, and by the way... your opinion that the Lebanese are responsible for 'passively supporting' Hezbollah is exactly the same nonsense that the fundamentalist 'real' terrorists use to justify attacks on western civlians! We passively support Israel & our government policies so we are responsible and 'sorry but we will die' as you so nicely put it.

For your information, the first Jews to arrive in Palestine after WW2 BOUGHT their land from Palestinians. Only in the 1960's did they start to arm themselves and try to take more land including most of Palestine and parts of Jordan and Lebanon. This is when the arab states fought back against Israel and 'tried to push them into the sea'. This is fact!

This is Bollox. There were many jews buying up land from the arabs pre world war 2. Indeed, even the king of Transjordon sold them land and was quite happy to do so as the land was then barren. In 1948, Israel was attacked by the arab states and the the West Bank invaded by Transjordon (why was there never any outrage about this occupation?). Israel survived.

You accuse spud of revisionist history then make up the most laughable re-write of the six day war in 1967. This is when Syria, Jordan, and the main player, Egypt were massing on Israel's borders. Lets not forget the rhetoric of Nasser of Egypt and his desire to eliminate Israel. Israel kicked ass and the arabs lost their land. If they hadn't been the aggressors, they wouldn't have lost that land. If you threaten or start a war and lose; expect to lose some land. Is that simple enought for you?

Israel has since given back the Sinai and Gaza yet the attacks still continue. In my mind, Israel is at the end of its tether and has had enough. It's quite simple, if the arabs leave Israel alone then Israel will leave them alone. The arabs will also get the West Bank in the bargain.

Now these are the facts. Not lies and half-truths.

Why does nobody ask the correct questions when talking about these subjects? It drives me crazy! Why would the arab states want to destory Israel? Why would fundamentalist muslims want to attack America or the UK? Why does NOBODY ever ask these questions?

The questions have been asked and i have answered on many occasions. Yet another lie.

I'm sorry spud but that smacks of racism in my opinion.

Oh i see you've resorted to your tired old game of accusing someone of racism. Not surprising.

The question that should be asked is " why is all the media attention on this war and the arab civilian deaths whilst in the same time sphere, thousands more are dying in Iraq and Darfur. I think the answer is instituitionalised anti-semitism.

[KevinC]

Bear in mind that the Stern Gang, headed by unsavoury characters such as Menachem Begin (later Prime Minister of Israel) terrorised both the British administration of Palestine and local Arab populations right up until May 1948 when the British left in a hurry and the State of Israel was declared.

All in all it has been a messy business with terrorist groups on all sides who have bombed and shot their way to getting what they want. No one comes out of the history of the Middle East in the 20th Century without blood on their hands, including the USA and UK who have supplied weapons and technology whenever it suited their political purposes.

[Flaxbourton Red]

Whats that flag all about Rev Kev?

[KevinC]

Whats that flag all about Rev Kev?

Just fancied a change of avatar

[Dorset_Cider]

It is a great pity that we can not find a solution rather than say one side is right and the other is wrong?

Big help George....... thanks for that....... ?

[reddoh]

when some of the Germans went to fight in the first crusade the first thing they did was murder some Jews in Europe.

the Jews used to be the intermediaries between the arabs and the crusaders

where did it all go wrong ? try britain and america trying to sort the world out after the 2nd world war politicians who did not listen to people who knew the situation but felt they new best

nothing has changed

[KevinC]

when some of the Germans went to fight in the first crusade the first thing they did was murder some Jews in Europe.

the Jews used to be the intermediaries between the arabs and the crusaders

where did it all go wrong ? try britain and america trying to sort the world out after the 2nd world war politicians who did not listen to people who knew the situation but felt they new best

nothing has changed

Prior to the First World War there were Jewish communities living side by side with their Arab neighbours - Christian and Muslim - in Palestine. They often attended one another's communal celebrations and rites of passage, and people got on by working the land side by side.

The arrival of mass migration of Jews fleeing pogroms in eastern Europe, and later from the nazis, and later still following WW2 led to a huge shift in the balance of communities, not helped by western powers (most notably Britain and the USA) trying to impliment plans which helped no one, and leading to extremism and terrorism on all sides culminating in the establishment of the Jewish State in 1948.

Arabs were shot or forcibly removed from their ancestral communities and ended up in refugee camps in Lebanon, Egypt and Jordan, the latter two areas being taken over by Israel after the 1967 Six Day War.

Israeli resentment was fuelled by constant attacks from Arab geurillas based in neighbouring countries, and the rest, as they say, is history.

[Dorset_Cider]

Prior to the First World War there were Jewish communities living side by side with their Arab neighbours - Christian and Muslim - in Palestine. They often attended one another's communal celebrations and rites of passage, and people got on by working the land side by side.

The arrival of mass migration of Jews fleeing pogroms in eastern Europe, and later from the nazis, and later still following WW2 led to a huge shift in the balance of communities, not helped by western powers (most notably Britain and the USA) trying to impliment plans which helped no one, and leading to extremism and terrorism on all sides culminating in the establishment of the Jewish State in 1948.

Arabs were shot or forcibly removed from their ancestral communities and ended up in refugee camps in Lebanon, Egypt and Jordan, the latter two areas being taken over by Israel after the 1967 Six Day War.

Israeli resentment was fuelled by constant attacks from Arab geurillas based in neighbouring countries, and the rest, as they say, is history.

I should have paid more attention, but I had a very interesting discussion regarding an oil pipeline and Lebanon & Israel.......... and some matter of it not being mentioned with regard to the fighting now........ can any histohead cast some light on this?

[solo1bc]

I should have paid more attention, but I had a very interesting discussion regarding an oil pipeline and Lebanon & Israel.......... and some matter of it not being mentioned with regard to the fighting now........ can any histohead cast some light on this?

Here we go mate!War for Israel

[hilltop red]

Here we go mate!War for Israel

Thats the quickest route to the west anyway, unless you go through syria!

a conspiriests(sp) wet dream that one.

Pipelines flow all the way through the region to the medeterrian sea, to be transported through to europe, anyway.

are yo really going to belive a site that states israel ahas the fourth largest army in the world.

Hve they seen the number of troops lined up by the south and north koreans, chinese, indians russians. I understand that israel can call up a very large number of reserves, but fourth largest army in the world?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...of_armed_forces

only wikepedia, but they still rank very low. Maybe a very sophisticated one, but certantly not the fourth largest!