Crowd Today Concerning

[zookeeper]

Sweeping generalisation and very difficult to prove.If people prefer to play than watch they probably wouldn't come anyway and it's a bit tenuos to imagine that all those players are City fans.I'm sure if that could be proven we would be have done a Tranmere and moved home games to a Friday evening years ago

No that wouldn't have proved anything. All that would have done was replace the people who can't travel to the game on a friday with those that aren't restricted by football.

In my saturday team there are at least 5 or 6 of us who are city fans. Out of this 1 has a season ticket (because lots of games get called off , xmas and new year matches it actually makes sense) and the rest of us attend the few games that we can. A few players that have had to retire through injury now have season tickets at the gate.

In my experience those people that play on a saturday would also come and watch. It happens when games get called off and 4 or 5 of us go and watch.

[rayer]

Some people are right £16.25 is excellent value for a game and if this was the standard charge for POTD then we would have full houses every week. Unfortunately, this is not the case and to receive this offer you have to stump up all the £16.25 matches cash in one go.

So for the person who cant afford todays standard POTD price, I doubt they can afford splashing out 400 odd quid in one go for a season ticket, or going to go by the direct debit route with the interest.

If they cant afford to go, they cant go.

[Redtucks]

I took my 5 yr old with me to Cov, admission was £32 for the 2 of us, i took him in the Dolman with me on Saturday, admission was £44, 40% more than the far superior ricoh stadium, it doesn't take brain of britain to work out where the problem lies, £16 FOR A 5 YEAR OLD is a scandalous price, at the moment we are flying high in the league but i dread to think what the crowds will be on a cold winters day/night, when mid-table against colchester, barnsley etc,

Not a totally fair comparison.

You could have got into the lower Dolman (side view)for £33, advanced price for Adult £26, u16 £7.

The same price that you paid at Coventry for behind the goal (actually in the corner).

[Redtucks]

Some people are right £16.25 is excellent value for a game and if this was the standard charge for POTD then we would have full houses every week. Unfortunately, this is not the case and to receive this offer you have to stump up all the £16.25 matches cash in one go.

So for the person who cant afford todays standard POTD price, I doubt they can afford splashing out 400 odd quid in one go for a season ticket, or going to go by the direct debit route with the interest.

If they cant afford to go, they cant go.

As you say they don't have to stump up £400 in one go.

The interest charged using direct debit is less than a pound a game, which in my opinion still makes it pretty good value for money.

[rayer]

As you say they don't have to stump up £400 in one go.

The interest charged using direct debit is less than a pound a game, which in my opinion still makes it pretty good value for money.

but its still an additional direct debit being taken out of a familys income monthly. How much is it a month ?

Basically it boils down to, the club has upped the prices, if you can afford to go, you go, if you cant, you cant.

So last saturday, 14,000 of the population interested in the team thought the prices were good or could afford to go. All the rest didnt. (Not including those on hols/work etc)

Thats how it will stay i am afraid.

[punnett]

Not a totally fair comparison.

You could have got into the lower Dolman (side view)for £33, advanced price for Adult £26, u16 £7.

The same price that you paid at Coventry for behind the goal (actually in the corner).

What are you talking about, i was directly behind the goal at Cov', a great view, and personally i would not entertain paying £26 to be stuck in the corner of the lower Dolman, (which is more than that actually when paying by card) do you think £16 for a 5 year old is reasonable, twice in a week for a decent view of the game

[Red Robin]

As you say they don't have to stump up £400 in one go.

The interest charged using direct debit is less than a pound a game, which in my opinion still makes it pretty good value for money.

The installement sceme sceme was very fair for the man,woman,teenager who has to budget.

I'm sorry the bottom line is Bristol city are sitting very nicely in the championship and 12500 city fans turn up on saturday VERY VERY VERY POOR end of.

[Brizred]

No that wouldn't have proved anything. All that would have done was replace the people who can't travel to the game on a friday with those that aren't restricted by football.

In my saturday team there are at least 5 or 6 of us who are city fans. Out of this 1 has a season ticket (because lots of games get called off , xmas and new year matches it actually makes sense) and the rest of us attend the few games that we can. A few players that have had to retire through injury now have season tickets at the gate.

In my experience those people that play on a saturday would also come and watch. It happens when games get called off and 4 or 5 of us go and watch.

Thank you, someone who knows the non-league situation regarding fans playing for their own clubs. Regarding to replies to my posts, at no time did i say all these players would be City fans, i was referring to the support of professional football in Bristol, it helps to read the post. I thought people would have a tiny bit of common sense on here, but maybe not.

[rockin-robin]

The installement sceme sceme was very fair for the man,woman,teenager who has to budget.

I'm sorry the bottom line is Bristol city are sitting very nicely in the championship and 12500 city fans turn up on saturday VERY VERY VERY POOR end of.

Has anyone thought that City may not be that well supported?

City have about 7,500 "hardcore" fans (those who buy season tickets every season and travel to most away games regardless of division or team success) this has not changed since the late 80's where attendances were lower than they are today.

There is also a huge majority of the Bristol public who like to jump on the bandwaggon for big matches and are neither a hardcore City or Rovers supporters. Therefore, just because 40,000 turn out at the Millenium (or Wembley), this is a representation of our support - FALSE.

TRUE - People in Bristol are just not that interested in Football and would rather go to the Mall and spend £30 on Shite.

It is a sad fact but it is true.

[Brizred]

Has anyone thought that City may not be that well supported?

City have about 7,500 "hardcore" fans (those who buy season tickets every season and travel to most away games regardless of division or team success) this has not changed since the late 80's where attendances were lower than they are today.

There is also a huge majority of the Bristol public who like to jump on the bandwaggon for big matches and are neither a hardcore City or Rovers supporters. Therefore, just because 40,000 turn out at the Millenium (or Wembley), this is a representation of our support - FALSE.

TRUE - People in Bristol are just not that interested in Football and would rather go to the Mall and spend £30 on Shite.

It is a sad fact but it is true.

Good post, sounds like common sense to me!

[bh_red]

Has anyone thought that City may not be that well supported?

City have about 7,500 "hardcore" fans (those who buy season tickets every season and travel to most away games regardless of division or team success) this has not changed since the late 80's where attendances were lower than they are today.

There is also a huge majority of the Bristol public who like to jump on the bandwaggon for big matches and are neither a hardcore City or Rovers supporters. Therefore, just because 40,000 turn out at the Millenium (or Wembley), this is a representation of our support - FALSE.

TRUE - People in Bristol are just not that interested in Football and would rather go to the Mall and spend £30 on Shite.

It is a sad fact but it is true.

yep, that's the view I have, it doesn't really matter what the prices are or what league we are in the attendances are pretty much the same, despite me pointing this out a number of times,

I'm wrong, because everyone else is right

[City_pete1]

I had to miss the game, despite being a ST holder. Girlfriend booked a weekend in Nice without telling me the dates... Can't wait for the next game!

[Nibor]

it doesn't really matter what the prices are or what league we are in the attendances are pretty much the same

That's why you're wrong. Your view is in direct contradiction of the facts.

Go look at the crowds we got in the old first division.

How about in the fourth division.

How do you explain that if the league we're in has no affect on attendances?

When you compare attendances to those ten years ago, you have to take into account the shift in the whole football league otherwise it's pointless. Also worth noting that those attendances from 98/99 were turnstile counted not ticket sale counted.

We're actually drawing crap crowds compared to our last promotion despite everything about the club being on a high and the reason for it is not that Bristol is some unique anti football urban environment.

[Redtucks]

What are you talking about, i was directly behind the goal at Cov', a great view, and personally i would not entertain paying £26 to be stuck in the corner of the lower Dolman, (which is more than that actually when paying by card) do you think £16 for a 5 year old is reasonable, twice in a week for a decent view of the game

No I don't think it's good to pay £16 for a 5 year old, but the point I was making is that you don't have to pay £16. If money is a problem you can get your five year old in for £7.

You also don't have to pay by card, so that charge is optional.

You were lucky to be directly behind the goal with a great view at Coventry.

I was one of the first to buy tickets for that game and was near the back about 50 yards above the corner flag.

Yes a great view........... if you were long sighted!

[Bristol Boy]

No I don't think it's good to pay £16 for a 5 year old, but the point I was making is that you don't have to pay £16. If money is a problem you can get your five year old in for £7.

Unless you're talking about Prem Seating £16 is to expensive for a five year old anywhere at AG and if you have an ST somewhere you can hardly put the little chap in anothet stand!

You also don't have to pay by card, so that charge is optional.

No but it is far more convenient and Debit Cards at 5% is just a try on of the highest order

Throughout this thread people, City fans, are telling us why they're not coming/not coming regularly/all the time and it's primarily money related-They obviously feel, rightly or wrongly that the prices are to high so are voting with their feet.

16,500 WBA + 14,000 Burn = 30,500 -3,000 away fans 27,500 - 19,200 ST Holders = 8,300 POD over both games or 27%

Average Gates last season 12,800 - 7,600 ST Holders 500ish Away Fans = 4,700 or 36%

The upturn in the total ST Sales is purely down to POD fans buying ST's and even that was partly spoilt by 800 existing ST's walking away.

The club can either react now or start panicing when a few results go the wrong way and it's to late.

What ever happens I'll be there but I'm afraid there just aren't enough of us to fill the place up, even given a massive hike in % terms in the average number of away fans at AG.

[punnett]

No I don't think it's good to pay £16 for a 5 year old, but the point I was making is that you don't have to pay £16. If money is a problem you can get your five year old in for £7.

You also don't have to pay by card, so that charge is optional.

You were lucky to be directly behind the goal with a great view at Coventry.

I was one of the first to buy tickets for that game and was near the back about 50 yards above the corner flag.

Yes a great view........... if you were long sighted!

Whatever way you look at it the sole reason we didnt sell out against man city & wba is the cost, i know so many that went to the Cov game but not the above 2 home games purely because of that reason (i'm not paying £30 for that, maybe its a mental thing when the price hits £30) i'd like to know where your threshold would be for entrance to AG but for me it is far to high (i did renew my 13 yr old boys ST in the dolman, which was good value) we can go on & on about this for the next 6 months as we have for the last 6 but it seems that the vast majority seem to agree that the prices are far to high, as i have stated before, as someone that has followed city allover the country in the last 35 years to many holes & dumps that aren't even there any more i feel let down by these prices, why cant you apologists see that, for some, "great, i can afford it," that for others it is a kick in the teeth after more years than i care to remember of utter rubbish, the thing is if the bad times return and god help us we find ourselves in the basement in front of 3000 fans i shall be on of the 3000, where will the other 11000 be?

[Redtucks]

Whatever way you look at it the sole reason we didnt sell out against man city & wba is the cost, i know so many that went to the Cov game but not the above 2 home games purely because of that reason (i'm not paying £30 for that, maybe its a mental thing when the price hits £30) i'd like to know where your threshold would be for entrance to AG but for me it is far to high (i did renew my 13 yr old boys ST in the dolman, which was good value) we can go on & on about this for the next 6 months as we have for the last 6 but it seems that the vast majority seem to agree that the prices are far to high, as i have stated before, as someone that has followed city allover the country in the last 35 years to many holes & dumps that aren't even there any more i feel let down by these prices, why cant you apologists see that, for some, "great, i can afford it," that for others it is a kick in the teeth after more years than i care to remember of utter rubbish, the thing is if the bad times return and god help us we find ourselves in the basement in front of 3000 fans i shall be on of the 3000, where will the other 11000 be?

You and many others may well believe that prices are far too high.

Nobody likes price rises and the fact that they rose by 30% accentuates the fact.

However, as someone who prefers to sit behind the goal, my choice at home is the Atyeo.

Whilst I get admission for approx £16 per game with a season ticket, £23 for a non-season ticket holder is very comparable with the price for away fans (normally behind the goal) at most other Championship grounds.

A check on the football grounds website shows the following prices for away fans:

Coventry £23

Preston £25

Barnsley £20

Norwich £22

QPR £22

Ipswich £26.50

WBA £23

Cardiff £23

Southampton £26

Plymouth £22

Crystal Palace £30/£25/£20 (depending on game category)

Watford £35/£25/£20 (depending on game category)

Wolves £23/£27

Looking at these prices, I find it hard to agree that Citys prices are excessive.

Prices are obviously higher for a side view in the Williams or Dolman, but then again this also applies at all other grounds.

[Frome Valley]

You and many others may well believe that prices are far too high.

Nobody likes price rises and the fact that they rose by 30% accentuates the fact.

However, as someone who prefers to sit behind the goal, my choice at home is the Atyeo.

Whilst I get admission for approx £16 per game with a season ticket, £23 for a non-season ticket holder is very comparable with the price for away fans (normally behind the goal) at most other Championship grounds.

A check on the football grounds website shows the following prices for away fans:

Coventry £23

Preston £25

Barnsley £20

Norwich £22

QPR £22

Ipswich £26.50

WBA £23

Cardiff £23

Southampton £26

Plymouth £22

Crystal Palace £30/£25/£20 (depending on game category)

Watford £35/£25/£20 (depending on game category)

Wolves £23/£27

Looking at these prices, I find it hard to agree that Citys prices are excessive.

Prices are obviously higher for a side view in the Williams or Dolman, but then again this also applies at all other grounds.

The prices you have quoted are not the lowest prices at some of the clubs listed. Plymouth and Cardiff are well below the figures you have used. Mayflower stand at Argyle is £18.

[Redtucks]

The prices you have quoted are not the lowest prices at some of the clubs listed. Plymouth and Cardiff are well below the figures you have used. Mayflower stand at Argyle is £18.

They are also not the highest.

I was just trying to compare like for like, i.e. behind the goal, as that's where I sit.

Prices for Cardiff and Plymouth are:

Cardiff City

Home Fans:

Grandstand Upper Centre: Adults £30*, OAP's/Under 16's £22

Grandstand Upper Wings: Adults £25*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

Grandstand Lower: Adults £24*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

Popular Bank Seating Centre: Adults £25*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

Popular Bank Seating Wings: Adults £24*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

Popular Bank Terrace: Adults £16, OAP's/Under 16's £10

John Smiths Grange End Terrace: Adults £22, No Concessions

Spar Family Stand: Adults £18, OAP's £10, Under 16's £5

Away Fans:

John Smiths Grange End (Seating): Adults £25*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

John Smiths Grange End (Terrace): Adults £22, OAP's/Under 16's £15

* A discount of £2 is available on these ticket prices, if purchased prior to matchday.

Plymouth Argyle

All Fans*

Tickets purchased prior to matchday:

Adults £22, Concessions £15, Children £6

Matchday Prices:

Adults £24, Concessions £17, Children £6

* Home fans wanting to sit in the Grandstand lower tier, will be charged £18 for an adult ticket whenever purchased.

[rockin-robin]

They are also not the highest.

I was just trying to compare like for like, i.e. behind the goal, as that's where I sit.

Prices for Cardiff and Plymouth are:

Cardiff City

Home Fans:

Grandstand Upper Centre: Adults £30*, OAP's/Under 16's £22

Grandstand Upper Wings: Adults £25*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

Grandstand Lower: Adults £24*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

Popular Bank Seating Centre: Adults £25*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

Popular Bank Seating Wings: Adults £24*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

Popular Bank Terrace: Adults £16, OAP's/Under 16's £10

John Smiths Grange End Terrace: Adults £22, No Concessions

Spar Family Stand: Adults £18, OAP's £10, Under 16's £5

Away Fans:

John Smiths Grange End (Seating): Adults £25*, OAP's/Under 16's £15

John Smiths Grange End (Terrace): Adults £22, OAP's/Under 16's £15

* A discount of £2 is available on these ticket prices, if purchased prior to matchday.

Plymouth Argyle

All Fans*

Tickets purchased prior to matchday:

Adults £22, Concessions £15, Children £6

Matchday Prices:

Adults £24, Concessions £17, Children £6

* Home fans wanting to sit in the Grandstand lower tier, will be charged £18 for an adult ticket whenever purchased.

The prices for POD are comparable to other clubs and I believe that the prices at AG are not as bad as people like to make out.

The thing that gets those that I know who POD, is the 5% charge for using a card - on each ticket!

City have got onto a good thing in that they know people in general don't carry large amounts of cash anymore.

[Frome Valley]

[Frome Valley]

The prices for POD are comparable to other clubs and I believe that the prices at AG are not as bad as people like to make out.

The thing that gets those that I know who POD, is the 5% charge for using a card - on each ticket!

City have got onto a good thing in that they know people in general don't carry large amounts of cash anymore.

Check the lowest price clubs offer then it quickly becomes apparent that Citys cheapest price for adults is above average.

[punnett]

The prices for POD are comparable to other clubs and I believe that the prices at AG are not as bad as people like to make out.

The thing that gets those that I know who POD, is the 5% charge for using a card - on each ticket!

City have got onto a good thing in that they know people in general don't carry large amounts of cash anymore.

A very interresting quote in todays paper by Arsenal chairman Dennis Hill-Wood in relation to his team "our fan-base probably started in the thirties and its been handed down from father to son and so forth. It takes 100 years to build and about 100 minutes to destroy, you've got to be careful you don't destroy it". There is so much bad feeling amongst fans that the club are constantly trying to rip them off, why couldn't they reduce the prices for the Man City game? why are the prices so extortionate for kids? Why do the club add on a 5% charge for c/card transactions? Why do they they charge £1.70 for a warm bottle of water? I can go on and on. You mention that City are on a good thing, they are at the moment and i hope it lasts for many years but being a city fan for so many years we just know that bad days could return very very easily and people will have long memories and long pockets

[zookeeper]

A very interresting quote in todays paper by Arsenal chairman Dennis Hill-Wood in relation to his team "our fan-base probably started in the thirties and its been handed down from father to son and so forth. It takes 100 years to build and about 100 minutes to destroy, you've got to be careful you don't destroy it". There is so much bad feeling amongst fans that the club are constantly trying to rip them off, why couldn't they reduce the prices for the Man City game? why are the prices so extortionate for kids? Why do the club add on a 5% charge for c/card transactions? Why do they they charge £1.70 for a warm bottle of water? I can go on and on. You mention that City are on a good thing, they are at the moment and i hope it lasts for many years but being a city fan for so many years we just know that bad days could return very very easily and people will have long memories and long pockets

Who profits from the money though? The vast majority of it goes on the playing staff and the idea being that more money equals better football. That's very simplistic but you would hope to pay for what you get.

It's not like the money is really going to line the shareholders pockets.

I can't and won't try to back up the club for the children's prices nor the fact that they can't provide cold drinks and hot food and a charge to use a card where really they should only get charged 2% is ridiculous. I can't think of another company that tries to profit in this way and it's disgraceful. If we all turned up and paid with cash they would struggle.

Maybe that's what we should organise. 3000 people turning up to pay £25 each in cash. £75k in cash taken on a day when there are no banks open, losing 2 days interest and with the increased risk associated with cash handling. If we did Sexstone would have a lot of egg on his face.

[punnett]

Who profits from the money though? The vast majority of it goes on the playing staff and the idea being that more money equals better football. That's very simplistic but you would hope to pay for what you get.

It's not like the money is really going to line the shareholders pockets.

I can't and won't try to back up the club for the children's prices nor the fact that they can't provide cold drinks and hot food and a charge to use a card where really they should only get charged 2% is ridiculous. I can't think of another company that tries to profit in this way and it's disgraceful. If we all turned up and paid with cash they would struggle.

Maybe that's what we should organise. 3000 people turning up to pay £25 each in cash. £75k in cash taken on a day when there are no banks open, losing 2 days interest and with the increased risk associated with cash handling. If we did Sexstone would have a lot of egg on his face.

The thing is with that though is if you potd with cash they will charge you £2 more than if you bought your ticket in advance, why,(yet another way of ripping off fans?)

[zookeeper]

The thing is with that though is if you potd with cash they will charge you £2 more than if you bought your ticket in advance, why,(yet another way of ripping off fans?)

So you have Hobson's choice. You either pay £1.25 on a £25 quid ticket by paying in advance or £2 on the day. Hmmmm!

I personally believe that a substantial increase in the face value of tickets was financialy justifiable and will increase bottom line income. I'm not too sure why the club then tries to charge the fans more. I'd be quite interested in knowing how they costed up 5%.

There is no incentive to pay in advance!

[Portland Bill]

Who cares?!?!? I couldnt give a <removed> if i was the only person there as long as City are doing well!!!!!!

Your not at all full of yourself are you

[rayer]

Our season tickets are also set above 60% at least of the division, no loyalty discount, it wears fans goodwill away.

This is the point where I threw in the towel after years and years of buying season tickets. Every year I was asked to 'show my loyalty' by purchasing a season ticket to help the team get promotion.

When we FINALLY acheived this goal, I was expecting to have a little bit of loyalty back and at least get an early bird price. When this didnt happen, I was a bit peeved to say the least, so I have now just walked away.

[Redtucks]

Check the lowest price clubs offer then it quickly becomes apparent that Citys cheapest price for adults is above average.

That may well be the case.

We can argue about individual comparisons forever.

However my view is that in general City's prices are not dissimilar to most other clubs at this level, and in that respect are not excessive.

The fact is that we would all like to pay less, but if we are going to compete with clubs at this level it's not surprising that we have to charge broadly similar prices.

It's right that loyal fans are rewarded, and the fact that I save almost £7 per match with a season ticket does just that.

Many of the POTD customers only turn up when it's dry, when they haven't anything else to do, or for the glory games do not show the same commitment and therefore do not deserve the same prices.

[Frome Valley]

That may well be the case.

We can argue about individual comparisons forever.

However my view is that in general City's prices are not dissimilar to most other clubs at this level, and in that respect are not excessive.

The fact is that we would all like to pay less, but if we are going to compete with clubs at this level it's not surprising that we have to charge broadly similar prices.

It's right that loyal fans are rewarded, and the fact that I save almost £7 per match with a season ticket does just that.

Many of the POTD customers only turn up when it's dry, when they haven't anything else to do, or for the glory games do not show the same commitment and therefore do not deserve the same prices.

Citys lowest prices are higher than the majority of the division, Citys season ticket prices are above the majority of the division, broadly Citys prices are above the division after just one season there was no discount [reward] for loyalty and CITY WERE THE ONLY CLUB IN THE DIVISION WHO DID NOT DO THIS, many fans could not afford a 40% hike, some fans paying on the day show as much commitment financially as season ticket holders and do not deserve the prices they get just because the put kids, mortgages, food before football.

I think you are also trying to blame the weather........!