Lee Johnson & Red Card [merged]

[dazza247]

Seems some people are looking for any excuse to criticise Lee Johnson! Ridiculous...just got up and thought I'd read lots of positive comments about how great City were last night to grind out a 2-1 win over a much more established, wealthy, ex-premiership club and surprise surprise there is a whole thread slagging off Lee Johnson!! Now I'm not one to accuse anyone but if Lee Johnson got banned for supposed simulation or reprimanded by the club then such posters would be appeased right by Johnson being removed from the team for a few games?!

No I didn't go to the game and see the incident but will make my conclusion after watching it on the highlights rather than prejudging in haste immediately after the game. Granted those that were offended by it may have been right next to the incident but as our own manager wished to see it on tv first before making a conclusion surely we can pay one of our players similar respect?! If Marvin Elliot had done the same would there be a similar thread on otib.co.uk?!?!

It sounds like the player deserved to be sent off....excellent. IF he raised his hands that's a red card in this day and age. And listening to the commentary we were completely under the cosh up to this point and then this signalled the end of the game near enough. We won 2-1....fantastic! Let's praise the boys for holding on and criticise the Southampton player for hitting one of our own not the other way around! Why do we need a witch-hunt? 2nd in the Championship...our best season in my lifetime........let's cheer up and be happy and make the most of an absolutely amazing time to be a Bristol City fan and smile at our blue-and-white neighbours who are dead jealous right now and willing our run to end.

[gazareth]

It was a Red card because the rules say it is!

But the rules also state that simulation is a booking, and there is no way that the pat on the head would knock a grown man (Or Johnson) to the floor, so he should have been booked for his reaction!

Actually this is a myth that has been oddly perpetuated by the media and by ignorant pundits. There is NOTHING in the laws of the game stating that raising hands to an opponent is a red card offence. The red card offence is VIOLENT CONDUCT, and when you apply that context to a lot of these 'raised hands' incidents then the red cards start to look particularly harsh.

Johnson cheated, and I was quite frankly embarassed by it.

(I was looking the wrong way when it happened, but saw it on SSN shortly after 10 and there is no doubt that it was simulation)

[Pete1975Legend]

I suggest a lot of people look at the incident on TV that was more than a slap. There was definetly a clenched fist and if you are hit on a soft part of the hand the immediate reaction is to go down. But tio be fair LJ was straight back up. No need to raise your arms at another player. Southampton player did this and got his just rewards.

[giles_23_bcfc]

I saw it again, properly on sky sports news when i got home. Never in a million years should he have been sent off! He barely touched Johnson. I hope he watches that back and is ashamed of how easily he went down and how easily he conned the referee.

[Belfastcityfan]

I thought it was pathetic, Johnson should have walked for that, there is nothing worse than seeing someone getting a fellow pro sent off. He must be so embarressed when he sees that !?

He had a good 1st half tonight but showed what a horrible little #### he can be.

I can remeber the friendly when he raked his studs down that yeovil players leg, no need, he suffers from small bloke syndrome !

On the game, what a cracking display in the 1st half and a goal of pure class from ivan, just seen it again on sky ports news

2nd half was a little one sided !!! - but fair play, we held on

Carey and Nobes were missed, hope they will be ok on saturday, although i hear louis has broken his nose ?

Then the guy shouldn't have raised his hand then! If he was stupid enough to do it in the first place more the fool him! These incidents even themselves out over the season.

Its not because he is the managers son is it??? If Elliot, Trundle or Carey had of did it, would you be saying the same thing....nope!

Don't get me wrong, I'm am against all forms of cheating in football but it jus seems like another oportunity to get at LJ

[zookeeper]

Bloody hell.

What a bunch of nice sporting people we are who have never done anything on the spur of the moment that wasn't the right thing to do!!!

Theres a big difference between barely touching and not touching and there is a hell of a difference from knowing something is happening and being caught unawares.

Stop the witch hunt and enjoy the victory.

[giles_23_bcfc]

I thought it was pathetic, Johnson should have walked for that, there is nothing worse than seeing someone getting a fellow pro sent off. He must be so embarressed when he sees that !?

He had a good 1st half tonight but showed what a horrible little #### he can be.

I can remeber the friendly when he raked his studs down that yeovil players leg, no need, he suffers from small bloke syndrome !

**** me! This takes the whole "LJ only plays cos he's the manager's son" BS to a whole new level! LJ had one of, if not his best game of the season tonight, 1st half especially, and you bring up something that happened in JULY in a FRIENDLY! OK, he did over react and went down like he'd been shot which he shouldnt have done and i don't condone that.

But calling him a "horrible little ####"?!!! I think we all know that that word is supposed to be! There is absolutely no need to call a player who gives his all for this club that sort of abuse! And, quite frankly i think that your are a complete #### for the comments you made! Did you not see Jamie McCombe last night?!

"he suffers from small bloke syndrome" so he isnt the biggest of players. So what. Its not exactly his fault he's vertically challenged. Stop following everyone else like mindless sheep in criticising LJ. What are you going to say if he plays a blinder saturday but acidentally slips over as the ball is coming to him, and that leads to a stoke goal when we are already 3-0 up?! I can almost see it now.

[samo]

Um... wasn't at the game but have now caught the 'offence' on Sky Sports news a few times and all I can say to those 'holier than thou' individuals crucifying Johnson on here is to get a grip. Dida incident; are you TRYING to be labled Johnson haters?

It might not be the 1930 ideal of sportsman-like values to fall over when struck, but if Safri is going to hit LJ round the head about 5 yards from the ref I don't really think what Johnson does is important.

And as for this "getting a 'fellow pro' sent off" gubbins, maybe Safri should have shown him the same level of respect and not smacked him round the head. He got hi just deserts for letting his temper get the better of him. 'Fellow pro' my behind.

[Seend Red]

Whats all the fuss about? Everyone knows you don't raise your hands in football, to strike a player on the head is a red card offence, of course Johnson made the most of it and made himself look like a plum by diving to the floor but don't they all.

[Belfastcityfan]

Um... wasn't at the game but have now caught the 'offence' on Sky Sports news a few times and all I can say to those 'holier than thou' individuals crucifying Johnson on here is to get a grip. Dida incident; are you TRYING to be labled Johnson haters?

It might not be the 1930 ideal of sportsman-like values to fall over when struck, but if Safri is going to hit LJ round the head about 5 yards from the ref I don't really think what Johnson does is important.

And as for this "getting a 'fellow pro' sent off" gubbins, maybe Safri should have shown him the same level of respect and not smacked him round the head. He got hi just deserts for letting his temper get the better of him. 'Fellow pro' my behind.

Safri goes for the smallest man on the pitch.....way to go toughguy!

[Tunley Legend]

I'm not a "Lee Johnson Hater". I thought he was having a good game until Noble got taken off (no coincidence in my opinion). However, we pay our money to go to football therefore we are all entitled to our opinion. My opinion is that I will not enjoy watching City as much if we start making a meal of challenges to win penalties and get players sent off. There are people on here who criticise "Johnny Foreigner" for doing it as cheating, diving scum yet when Lee Johnson makes an ar$e of himself that is perfectly acceptable - hypocritical bull$h1t is what that is. The line between professionalism and cheating had been broken in my opinion. People say if "Marvin had done it you wouldn't be criticising" - the massive difference is that the likes of Elliott and Carey wouldn't do it in the first place.

Johnson needs to be given a talking to and told that the way he theatrically went to ground last night is unacceptable - nothing more, nothing less. I really enjoyed the game last night but I cannot say that I enjoyed that particular incident and I and many others, looking at the majority of posts, would be a lot happier if we do not see a repeat.

[maidenheadred]

Um... wasn't at the game but have now caught the 'offence' on Sky Sports news a few times and all I can say to those 'holier than thou' individuals crucifying Johnson on here is to get a grip. Dida incident; are you TRYING to be labled Johnson haters?

It might not be the 1930 ideal of sportsman-like values to fall over when struck, but if Safri is going to hit LJ round the head about 5 yards from the ref I don't really think what Johnson does is important.

And as for this "getting a 'fellow pro' sent off" gubbins, maybe Safri should have shown him the same level of respect and not smacked him round the head. He got hi just deserts for letting his temper get the better of him. 'Fellow pro' my behind.

havent seen the reply but saw enough when it happened live.

Johnson was tapped on the head, and he made a meal of it - to get a fellow pro sent off, and to waste some time.

There are tolerable levels of gamesmanship (basso wasting time for example), but that stepped over the line. Lee was wrong - and in my opinion any attempt to defend him is wrong as well. We would go MAD if any saints player had done that to one of our players... imagine what we'd be saying now if Marv was looking at a 3 match ban!?

GJ deflected it gracefully on the radio, but I have now some hope that he and backroom staff will have a word with Lee, and tell him and the squad that's not how we want to win. And i hope anyone above who even partly defends Lee for getting a fellow pro sent off also come to the same conclusions themselves..!

[brady bunch]

I actually thought it was quite clever, we were hanging on by the skin of our teeth and Johnson probably bought us a minute in injury time.

I am no fan of LJ, but yours is the best comment todate, he was not trying to get the bloke sent off, he was "WASTING TIME" for the sake of the team, just as Basso did everytime the ball went back to him. There is no way Lee thought about getting him sent off, just that it would waste a few more seconds (that we badly needed as our backs were to the wall).

I do not agree in the cold light of day and Lee will probably reflect on it and think the same, but in the heat of the moment going down and wasting time was just what we needed.

[samo]

havent seen the reply but saw enough when it happened live.

Johnson was tapped on the head, and he made a meal of it - to get a fellow pro sent off, and to waste some time.

There are tolerable levels of gamesmanship (basso wasting time for example), but that stepped over the line. Lee was wrong - and in my opinion any attempt to defend him is wrong as well. We would go MAD if any saints player had done that to one of our players... imagine what we'd be saying now if Marv was looking at a 3 match ban!?

GJ deflected it gracefully on the radio, but I have now some hope that he and backroom staff will have a word with Lee, and tell him and the squad that's not how we want to win. And i hope anyone above who even partly defends Lee for getting a fellow pro sent off also come to the same conclusions themselves..!

Don't get me wrong; he did make a meal of it, there is no denying that at all. But after seeing it a few times (and I made sure to see it at least three times before passing commnent) I really think saying it was our 'Dida at Celtic' moment is farcical.

GJ will most likely have a word and that should be the end of it, but LJ has reacted to what was a red-card offecence, not created controversy like Rivaldo versus Turkey in the World Cup a few years back or the afformentioned Dida incident. If it was Marvin Elliot I would be upset, but he would have been sent off for raising his hands anyway, so I'd be pssed that he lost his temper like that because that isn't professional. Safri committed violent conduct and got sent and any City player doing what he did should expect the same.

I like the fact I am (to quote you're post) "wrong" to put my view on the incident. Sorry if you disagree with my reading f the situation, but I don't think it's fair to jump all over one of our players for next to nothing when a Southampton player was the primary antagonist.

[maidenheadred]

I am no fan of LJ, but yours is the best comment todate, he was not trying to get the bloke sent off, he was "WASTING TIME" for the sake of the team, just as Basso did everytime the ball went back to him. There is no way Lee thought about getting him sent off, just that it would waste a few more seconds (that we badly needed as our backs were to the wall).

I do not agree in the cold light of day and Lee will probably reflect on it and think the same, but in the heat of the moment going down and wasting time was just what we needed.

i am a fan of LJ, and think people who expect a 5'8" £50k, £2.5k a week footballer to do any better than he is now are delluded (but that's an another argument..!)

but that wasnt act of time wasting, that was an act of simulation, and every footballer knows that risks getting a fellow pro sent off.

Hopefully management and lee realise that this morning.

[sodburyred]

NOw if it was david noble or elliot who had gone down would he be getting all this stick? I think not!!

[OnCider]

I saw the incident pretty well from half-way up block C of the Dolman although I haven't seen the replay on TV yet. The Saints player seemed to hit him right in the back of the neck and I would imagine - like Madger said above - that the surprise of being hit on the back of the head with any force would probably make you go over.

Its illegal in boxing isn't it?

Anyway Safri was an idiot for doing it and deserved to be sent off.

[Nibor]

NOw if it was david noble or elliot who had gone down would he be getting all this stick? I think not!!

I'd feel exactly the same about it.

LJ wasn't floored. He got tapped, the opportunity occurred to him a second or two later and he chose to go down. He got up immediately the red card was shown with no ill effects whatsoever.

It was poor behaviour IMO and I don't find it surprising he's getting criticism for it.

This whole Johnson-hater b***ocks is laughable. Any player would have got the same reaction from me and I'm sure other posters too. I can even remember posting something similar when Cotterill took a dive a couple of seasons ago.

[gazareth]

[Nibor]

Note, no mention of "raising hands". I hardly think that a gentle clip round the back of the head counts as "violent conduct".

I'm pretty sure the FA instruct refs that raised hands to an opponent's head IS violent conduct.

Regardless he was going because he was getting booked for the challenge, in fact he was lucky not to be shown a yellow twice.

[gazareth]

I'm pretty sure the FA instruct refs that raised hands to an opponent's head IS violent conduct.

I'd like to see the FA or a referee clarify this. There's a good column from a ref's perspective every week on football365 and I remember a whole diatribe about the "raising hands" thing some time last season.

[Nibor]

I'd like to see the FA or a referee clarify this. There's a good column from a ref's perspective every week on football365 and I remember a whole diatribe about the "raising hands" thing some time last season.

I'd be interested to see what a ref has to say too. I get the impression they are instructed that way from Sky/MOTD pundits saying so but that doesn't mean it's accurate.

[samo]

I'd be interested to see what a ref has to say too. I get the impression they are instructed that way from Sky/MOTD pundits saying so but that doesn't mean it's accurate.

Hang about, have you seen the incident again? Because in my view the guy pushed LJ in the head after he went down under a bad challenge (no one is saying its a punch, but that doesn't mean players can go around clipping other players around the ear). Now that is violent conduct.

Saying the rules do not specify "raising hands" is like saying that it does not specify a punch being thrown and missing or a kick being aimed and not connecting. Both are classed as violent conduct and should result in a sending off. What if Safri did the same as he did, but in LJ's face (ie put his hands in his face)? I don't think this debate would exist because we'd all see it as unacceptable. Safri was wrong and, yes, LJ fell easily. But if Safri wasn't a fool and had just let it go he'd not have been sent, LJ's conduct is hardly the real issue.

I agree it's not nice to see 'codding' and hope LJ will think twice in future, but I also think violent conduct and unprofessional behaviour is totally out of order and I have even less time for it. I used to coach kids and if I thought one was diving about and trying to con the ref I'd have a word in private to warn him off it, because they should play good enough not to need to do it. But I always warned them that if they lost their temper, got violent or simply let their fustration get the better of them they'd be off my team, end of. That's my position.

Anyway, how do we know LJ wasn't just trying to waste more time rather than get the man sent? We don't; people just presume the worst about the bloke.

[Ian M]

From http://www.thefa.com/TheFA/RulesAndRegulat...02/05/12117.htm

Note, no mention of "raising hands". I hardly think that a gentle clip round the back of the head counts as "violent conduct".

People on this forum seem to be falling over themselves to defend Safri. His hit has been described as a friendly tap or a gentle clip when if you watch it back on SSN it's more like the action you would take to knock on a door.

Johnson (facing the other way) won't have known what type of hit it was, he just walks past the player when all of a sudden he feels a sharp pain to the back of his head, it's only a second or two later that he would realise it didn't actually hurt that much, by which time he's on his way down. Get a mate to do it to you (obviously you will be expecting it though) and you'll see what I mean.

[Nibor]

Hang about, have you seen the incident again? Because in my view the guy pushed LJ in the head after he went down under a bad challenge (no one is saying its a punch, but that doesn't mean players can go around clipping other players around the ear). Now that is violent conduct.

Saying the rules do not specify "raising hands" is like saying that it does not specify a punch being thrown and missing or a kick being aimed and not connecting. Both are classed as violent conduct and should result in a sending off. What if Safri did the same as he did, but in LJ's face (ie put his hands in his face)? I don't think this debate would exist because we'd all see it as unacceptable. Safri was wrong and, yes, LJ fell easily. But if Safri wasn't a fool and had just let it go he'd not have been sent, LJ's conduct is hardly the real issue.

I agree it's not nice to see 'codding' and hope LJ will think twice in future, but I also think violent conduct and unprofessional behaviour is totally out of order and I have even less time for it. I used to coach kids and if I thought one was diving about and trying to con the ref I'd have a word in private to warn him off it, because they should play good enough not to need to do it. But I always warned them that if they lost their temper, got violent or simply let their fustration get the better of them they'd be off my team, end of. That's my position.

Anyway, how do we know LJ wasn't just trying to waste more time rather than get the man sent? We don't; people just presume the worst about the bloke.

I haven't seen a replay. If I do and it looks different then maybe I'll think differently about it but frankly it was pretty clear.

I don't dispute that what Safri did was wrong and he deserved to go, I've said that all along.

There is no way on earth that what Safri did was enough to make LJ go down involuntarily. It was a choice he made and that was clear from the time it took him to make the decision. Spur of the moment, sure but still.

If it had been in the face I'd think the same. It takes quite a bit to knock someone on their ass and that was absolutely nowhere near it.

If LJ was wasting time he'd have stayed down, but instead he jumped back up as soon as the red card was out.

I'm not thinking the worst just for the hell of it and I've got no anti-LJ agenda at all (and frankly that argument is just a poor excuse), it was definitely cheating and I don't like that from a City player.

[samo]

I haven't seen a replay. If I do and it looks different then maybe I'll think differently about it but frankly it was pretty clear.

I don't dispute that what Safri did was wrong and he deserved to go, I've said that all along.

There is no way on earth that what Safri did was enough to make LJ go down involuntarily. It was a choice he made and that was clear from the time it took him to make the decision. Spur of the moment, sure but still.

If it had been in the face I'd think the same. It takes quite a bit to knock someone on their ass and that was absolutely nowhere near it.

If LJ was wasting time he'd have stayed down, but instead he jumped back up as soon as the red card was out.

I'm not thinking the worst just for the hell of it and I've got no anti-LJ agenda at all (and frankly that argument is just a poor excuse), it was definitely cheating and I don't like that from a City player.

Fair play, but wait until you've seen a replay at least before making what basically sound like assumptions.

He might not have been sparked out and the decision to fall might have been Johnson's but Safri didn't give him a friendly pat on the back of the head, he struck him. Open handed slap, kick to the head or Glasgow kiss, doesn't matter how the opposition takes the blow; you are off in any decent refs book. The offical was too close to the incident to be 'influncened' IMHO, he'll have had a good enough view whatever happened regardless of LJ's reaction.

[Spud55]

If he hadn't of gone down would the referee/linesman have done anything about it? There's a difference between diving and exaggerating. Lee Johnson exaggerated by the sounds of things. To gain us an advantage, he didn't cheat, he just made sure that Safri got the deserved punishment.

Why are Safri's hands up there, what was he doing with them? LJ isn't the perpetrator in this matter. I'm sure GJ will take this up with LJ, and i'm sure the rest of the lads will take the mick in training. Punishment enough really.

Sounds like some of you want Lee Johnson to be banned to me. Not for the sanctity of the game but because it's LJ.

I agree with that. The reason you see all this over exaggerating of things like that in football today and it'e because unless you mkae it blatently obvious then half the time Refs wont give anything, much like why there are so many players going down at the drop of a hat in the box, because half the time if they do try and be honest and stay on their feet and fail they are denied the penalty that should have been given and would have if they'd gone down like they'd been shot. Remember up at the Britania a few years ago when Murray was taken from behind but tried to be honest and stay on his feet and score, but didn't and all he got instead of the rightful pen was a second booking and a red card.

All this play acting in football is terrible but frankly i lay the blame for it almost solely at the feet of the officials.

[maidenheadred]

I'd feel exactly the same about it.

LJ wasn't floored. He got tapped, the opportunity occurred to him a second or two later and he chose to go down. He got up immediately the red card was shown with no ill effects whatsoever.

It was poor behaviour IMO and I don't find it surprising he's getting criticism for it.

This whole Johnson-hater b***ocks is laughable. Any player would have got the same reaction from me and I'm sure other posters too. I can even remember posting something similar when Cotterill took a dive a couple of seasons ago.

i'm a Johnson fan, and i too would criticise any player who acts like that.

i did so when Matt Hill feigned injury from a headbutt that never was against Stockport years and years ago. "noo, our Matt isnt like that" the forum or citylist (Cant remember which) said.... then we saw the replays!

[Ian M]

I haven't seen a replay. If I do and it looks different then maybe I'll think differently about it but frankly it was pretty clear.

I don't dispute that what Safri did was wrong and he deserved to go, I've said that all along.

There is no way on earth that what Safri did was enough to make LJ go down involuntarily. It was a choice he made and that was clear from the time it took him to make the decision. Spur of the moment, sure but still.

If it had been in the face I'd think the same. It takes quite a bit to knock someone on their ass and that was absolutely nowhere near it.

If LJ was wasting time he'd have stayed down, but instead he jumped back up as soon as the red card was out.

I'm not thinking the worst just for the hell of it and I've got no anti-LJ agenda at all (and frankly that argument is just a poor excuse), it was definitely cheating and I don't like that from a City player.

He was actually back on his feet by the time the red card was out.

[maidenheadred]

Seems some people are looking for any excuse to criticise Lee Johnson! Ridiculous...just got up and thought I'd read lots of positive comments about how great City were last night to grind out a 2-1 win over a much more established, wealthy, ex-premiership club and surprise surprise there is a whole thread slagging off Lee Johnson!! Now I'm not one to accuse anyone but if Lee Johnson got banned for supposed simulation or reprimanded by the club then such posters would be appeased right by Johnson being removed from the team for a few games?!

No I didn't go to the game and see the incident but will make my conclusion after watching it on the highlights rather than prejudging in haste immediately after the game. Granted those that were offended by it may have been right next to the incident but as our own manager wished to see it on tv first before making a conclusion surely we can pay one of our players similar respect?! If Marvin Elliot had done the same would there be a similar thread on otib.co.uk?!?!

It sounds like the player deserved to be sent off....excellent. IF he raised his hands that's a red card in this day and age. And listening to the commentary we were completely under the cosh up to this point and then this signalled the end of the game near enough. We won 2-1....fantastic! Let's praise the boys for holding on and criticise the Southampton player for hitting one of our own not the other way around! Why do we need a witch-hunt? 2nd in the Championship...our best season in my lifetime........let's cheer up and be happy and make the most of an absolutely amazing time to be a Bristol City fan and smile at our blue-and-white neighbours who are dead jealous right now and willing our run to end.