Police Today?

[Dolman Block B]

I live in London. I also happen to live with a policeman who is joined to the TSG. He also happened to be working the game on Saturday. He told me the police actions on Saturday was totally OTT. He works a lot of grounds on Saturday's.......Millwall, Charlton, Chelsea, Tottenham. Apparently another group of TSG were pulled from the Tottenham v Man U game on Saturday as the potential for trouble at Loftus Road was far greater than White Hart Lane. He admitted he'd never seen his group out in such numbers and again agreed that a lot of the problems on Saturday were caused by the police.

Well thanks for posting that mucker.

I was speaking to a young officer on the way to the ground and reckon could be the same fellow.

He was sound and confirmed to me exactly what you have posted.

[i_am_red]

Outside the lower tier entrance i saw one copper push a city fan around and when asked why he replied "cus i can" and gave a stupid little smile, jumped up little idiot as well, it worries me that these people are paid to protect us!

[bringbacktherobin]

i_am_red, complain or it will happen again and again and again.

Write a full account to the: Metropolitan Police Service, Directorate of Professional Standards, Reception Desk, Jubilee House, 230-232 Putney Bridge Road, London, SW15 2PD; or

Write directly to: The Independent Police Complaints Commission, 90 High Holborn, London, WC1V 6XX or call them on 08453 002002.

Will only take a few minutes to type up a letter.

[Scroobs]

Well thanks for posting that mucker.

I was speaking to a young officer on the way to the ground and reckon could be the same fellow.

He was sound and confirmed to me exactly what you have posted.

He did say that he'd spoken with a couple of City supporters and said to them what he'd told me. Apparently they asked him who he supported........he in-fact supports Chelsea, but living in the same house as him over the years I have converted him to be also a Bristol City supporter. Also let me just say he is not your average Police Officer (meaning the thug type) he is joined to the TSG but is due to leave soon because and I quote "I can no longer put up with the TSG's thuggish behaviour" (the TSG are the officers that are dressed as if they're going to war). Says it all really - and I'll tell you he also comes home with some quite un-believable stories of the kind of things his colleagues get up too.

[Dolman Block B]

He did say that he'd spoken with a couple of City supporters and said to them what he'd told me. Apparently they asked him who he supported........he in-fact supports Chelsea, but living in the same house as him over the years I have converted him to be also a Bristol City supporter. Also let me just say he is not your average Police Officer (meaning the thug type) he is joined to the TSG but is due to leave soon because and I quote "I can no longer put up with the TSG's thuggish behaviour" (the TSG are the officers that are dressed as if they're going to war). Says it all really - and I'll tell you he also comes home with some quite un-believable stories of the kind of things his colleagues get up too.

Was the same guy Scroobs, really nice chap.

Sums it up if he wants to get out of it mate don't it.

[Scroobs]

Was the same guy Scroobs, really nice chap.

Sums it up if he wants to get out of it mate don't it.

Hey Arn, well for sure it definitely does sound like him (and yes he is a nice fella). He came home on Saturday soon after I got in from Loftus Road and told me all - btw, and for the record, the escort that you got from O'neils/Walkabout were the TSG that were drafted in from White Hart Lane. Apparently that particular team of the TSG (remembering they always work with the same team) are the biggest bunch of thugs to walk the earth...........that was his words.

[Portland Bill]

Exactly

(I assume we are talking about Oreily's or O'neils or O somat)

A lot of it was due to the twots we had inside the place, I was in there around 12.30 and it was rammed but good natured

Police were already in attendance but just a couple of vans outside asking those outside with drinks to go back in...fair enough

...by 1.30 it had become more packed and the attitude changing towards the old bill who of course requested back up (who wouldn't)

Then a the word must of got around about how we were "mobbed up" (I think the expression is) in that Pub and a few QPR decided to gather on the otherside of the road - hence more police and the ring of blue around the place

Those of us of with experience knew what was happening and going to happen (escort being prepared)so we left about 14.15 before getting trapped in the escort

Basicaly you only have yourselves to blame for being total P+icks

The problem at the ground when escort arrived was the mix of fans within the escort - some had lower tier which was one entrance - others had upper tier which was a completley differnt entrance opposite side of ground - the Police just wanted to get everyone in first entrance they came to

One more point about our so called support at the moment

I went outside for a smoke and was appalled by some of our so called fans making Monkey noises out of the windows to local passers by (you don't need me to tell you why they were making these noises) even one of the doormen asked me if we always had racists #### like them

Get your facts right before you post such rubbish, for your imformation the" QPR who gathered on the other side of the rd" were NOT qpr, we were CITY and i was one of them. Most of the rest of your post is total CRAP. You HAVENT A CLUE WHAT HAPPENED between 2-30 and 3.30 because YOU werent there.

The fact YOU claim that the police tried to get everyone in the first entrance is just laughable, you know nothing.

[Andy082005]

Get your facts right before you post such rubbish, for your imformation the" QPR who gathered on the other side of the rd" were NOT qpr, we were CITY and i was one of them. Most of the rest of your post is total CRAP. You HAVENT A CLUE WHAT HAPPENED between 2-30 and 3.30 because YOU werent there.

The fact YOU claim that the police tried to get everyone in the first entrance is just laughable, you know nothing.

don't let them wind you up mate. At the end of the day, why do so many coppers volunteer to police football matches?? Ill tell you why, because they can get away with roughing people up, giving people a clout and generally acting the big I am.

In any other walk off life they are watched very closely, and cannot even lay a finger on a real criminal without the criminal pressing charges. It seems in recent years, football fans come with a "open ticket", and all these ####### coppers see it as a chance to show the world how tough they are! Nothing ever gets done about it, Avon & Somerset at the Mem last season, West Midlands Old Bill on the way back from Crewe last year, the Met at Millwall and now QPha....they are thugs. Simple as that.

The problem is, a football fan is what I call the "ba**ard race", no one likes us....so what can we do?

[Stand Up Sit Down]

The problem is, a football fan is what I call the "ba**ard race", no one likes us....so what can we do?

Four people have sent me detailed accounts of what happened over the weekend.

I'd encourage others to do so.

Nothing will change over night, or even in the next six months but if enough of us prepared to make our feelings known, we'll get there eventually.

I do sometimes wonder if football fans were a recognised minority whether we'd get the treatment we do...

Recently, after Chelsea played QPR in the Cup, a Chelsea supporter ended up with four broken ribs and a collapsed lung after being arrested for trying to protect his son from a police dog that had his jaws wrapped round his leg. His son got a black eye and fat lip..

I know this man and his boys. The dad, an ordinary bloke, a family man and his teenage sons kids you'd be proud to call your own. All them guilty of nothing more than being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

He has taken legal action and to be fair, the police are treating his complaint seriously.

At the same game, another teenage lad we know was there with his mates and a couple of their dads. Yes, there was trouble between Chelsea and QPR fans but it was the police they were trying to get away from as their batons were being swung at random.

As an ordinary person, I've respect for the police and know they struggle to do a job and are bound by red tape and a target culture. As a football supporter, I have zero respect for the police and have far more confidence in my fellow fans looking out for me than I do them. Sad, but true.

[Mr Mosquito]

Four people have sent me detailed accounts of what happened over the weekend.

I'd encourage others to do so.

Nothing will change over night, or even in the next six months but if enough of us prepared to make our feelings known, we'll get there eventually.

I do sometimes wonder if football fans were a recognised minority whether we'd get the treatment we do...

Recently, after Chelsea played QPR in the Cup, a Chelsea supporter ended up with four broken ribs and a collapsed lung after being arrested for trying to protect his son from a police dog that had his jaws wrapped round his leg. His son got a black eye and fat lip..

I know this man and his boys. The dad, an ordinary bloke, a family man and his teenage sons kids you'd be proud to call your own. All them guilty of nothing more than being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

He has taken legal action and to be fair, the police are treating his complaint seriously.

A German Shepherd Police dog no doubt.......

Police dog handlers are now learning to give orders to their animals in German. Derbyshire Police Kommandants decided to import Alsatians because of a shortage of suitable animals here. The imports cannot understand commands in English, the Daily Telegraph said. "If you say, 'let go' in English, they just look at you like you are crazy," one dog handler told the newspaper. A trial of the German dogs by Derbyshire Police has been deemed a success, prompting 16 other forces to recruit the canines at £2,000 each. Have the Metropolitan Police bought these dogs as well? These dogs are bred from the same lineage as used by NAZI Germany's SS Gestapo Police.

Handlers have had to learn a series of orders in German, including "sitz" (sit), "platz" (down), "aus" (let go), "holen" (fetch) and "bissen" (bite).

http://www.dogsey.com/showthread.php?p=1239597#post1239597

[Tb yeovil]

I have this thread with great interest and it makes me wonder sometimes why we are football fans. We pay at least double the equivalent ticket prices in an equivalent football division to the rest of Europe, terraces are disappearing and we get treated like shit.

Luckily, being a Yeovil fan, our reputation as the '6-fingeredvillage idiots' gets us at most a few coppers, but having travelled with other clubs with bad reputations (done quite a few matches away from home with Birmingham when they were in the championship), the experience is very scary.

The worse thing is there is nothing you can do.

You can't react because it will give them an excuse to batter you

You can't help out a mate in difficulty.

You can't even reason talk to them, because any sort of intelligent reasoning with these muppets is considered as 'cocky behaviour', largely because they are thugs with no intelect with a few brains between the lot of them and all they do in their sad little lives is to take pleasure in battering people.

On a general level, I find the police are just a worse version of the stewards, because dangerously they have authority and the law on their side to make their actions 'legitimate'.

Anyway my point is is it maybe possible for people to take some secret footage when they are in the escort, in the ground or anywhere significant to demonstrate some of the actions of the coppers?

A collection of eye-opening videos on youtube or even better a documentary that proves the appalling police attitude might really be a wake up call to football fans and even more importantly, the police themselves.

We then might start seing our treatment at away matches particulary change.

Thoughts?

[Dolman Block B]

I have this thread with great interest and it makes me wonder sometimes why we are football fans. We pay at least double the equivalent ticket prices in an equivalent football division to the rest of Europe, terraces are disappearing and we get treated like shit.

Luckily, being a Yeovil fan, our reputation as the '6-fingeredvillage idiots' gets us at most a few coppers, but having travelled with other clubs with bad reputations (done quite a few matches away from home with Birmingham when they were in the championship), the experience is very scary.

The worse thing is there is nothing you can do.

You can't react because it will give them an excuse to batter you

You can't help out a mate in difficulty.

You can't even reason talk to them, because any sort of intelligent reasoning with these muppets is considered as 'cocky behaviour', largely because they are thugs with no intelect with a few brains between the lot of them and all they do in their sad little lives is to take pleasure in battering people.

On a general level, I find the police are just a worse version of the stewards, because dangerously they have authority and the law on their side to make their actions 'legitimate'.

Anyway my point is is it maybe possible for people to take some secret footage when they are in the escort, in the ground or anywhere significant to demonstrate some of the actions of the coppers?

A collection of eye-opening videos on youtube or even better a documentary that proves the appalling police attitude might really be a wake up call to football fans and even more importantly, the police themselves.

We then might start seing our treatment at away matches particulary change.

Thoughts?

I did see a couple of lads trying to film what was going on, on their mobiles, but the old bill soon put a stop to that.

I think they may of got knicked if they continued.

Sadly, the police had loads of cameras on the go.

[Mr Mosquito]

I have this thread with great interest and it makes me wonder sometimes why we are football fans. We pay at least double the equivalent ticket prices in an equivalent football division to the rest of Europe, terraces are disappearing and we get treated like shit.

Luckily, being a Yeovil fan, our reputation as the '6-fingeredvillage idiots' gets us at most a few coppers, but having travelled with other clubs with bad reputations (done quite a few matches away from home with Birmingham when they were in the championship), the experience is very scary.

The worse thing is there is nothing you can do.

You can't react because it will give them an excuse to batter you

You can't help out a mate in difficulty.

You can't even reason talk to them, because any sort of intelligent reasoning with these muppets is considered as 'cocky behaviour', largely because they are thugs with no intelect with a few brains between the lot of them and all they do in their sad little lives is to take pleasure in battering people.

On a general level, I find the police are just a worse version of the stewards, because dangerously they have authority and the law on their side to make their actions 'legitimate'.

Anyway my point is is it maybe possible for people to take some secret footage when they are in the escort, in the ground or anywhere significant to demonstrate some of the actions of the coppers?

A collection of eye-opening videos on youtube or even better a documentary that proves the appalling police attitude might really be a wake up call to football fans and even more importantly, the police themselves.

We then might start seing our treatment at away matches particulary change.

Thoughts?

Some excellent points there Tb yeovil, mobile 'phone footage of Police actions against supporters posted on youtube plus piccies of Police brutality posted on various websites alerts the wider world to the true nature of our corrupt Police - excellent !!!!!

The reputation of the '6-fingeredvillage idiots' certainly belongs to the 'brains' behind our Police i.e. the often hopelessly inbred and corrupt and overpaid toff/snob Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) lawyers that bring charges against our fellow football supporters for the most minor misdemeanors. You'll very often not be able to beat the Police with their corrupt CPS lawyer back up in the courtroom so beat them on the Internet. A level playing field where you can beat them and show them up for what they really are.

[Maesknoll Red]

A German Shepherd Police dog no doubt.......

Police dog handlers are now learning to give orders to their animals in German. Derbyshire Police Kommandants decided to import Alsatians because of a shortage of suitable animals here. The imports cannot understand commands in English, the Daily Telegraph said. "If you say, 'let go' in English, they just look at you like you are crazy," one dog handler told the newspaper. A trial of the German dogs by Derbyshire Police has been deemed a success, prompting 16 other forces to recruit the canines at £2,000 each. Have the Metropolitan Police bought these dogs as well? These dogs are bred from the same lineage as used by NAZI Germany's SS Gestapo Police.

Handlers have had to learn a series of orders in German, including "sitz" (sit), "platz" (down), "aus" (let go), "holen" (fetch) and "bissen" (bite).

http://www.dogsey.com/showthread.php?p=1239597#post1239597

I'd take all of that with a large pinch of salt, as anything written in the press. An an ex chairman of a dog club which has close ties to many of the top working GSD breeders in this country and europe, I know that many dogs bred in this country are now used by the police, because they have the correct temperment, the drives necessary to track and undertake manwork. Since the pet passport scheme it has been a lot easier to bring european lines into British breeding programmes.

If they have gone to Germany for dogs, it makes sense as the Schaferhund Verien (German Shepherd Dog Club) have kept a close control on the GSD in Germay, ensuring that they are graded for confirmation and working qualities before being bred from. Those same lines are now regularly coming to the UK.

Just be grateful that the police haven't started using the Malinois, as many european forces have, quicker, and with very high drives and courage, I've seen some awesome film of Malinois trials, where the dog will not let go, no matter what the 'criminal' does.

None of which should offer any smoke screen to the piss poor attitude of the police when it comes to football fans, lumping us all into the same category.

[Guest DanC]

I did see a couple of lads trying to film what was going on, on their mobiles, but the old bill soon put a stop to that.

I think they may of got knicked if they continued.

Sadly, the police had loads of cameras on the go.

There allowed to film us to use as possible evidence but were not allowed to film them to use as potential evidence. That stinks.

[Mr Mosquito]

There allowed to film us to use as possible evidence but were not allowed to film them to use as potential evidence. That stinks.

That's the nature of the most corrupt and class based criminal justice system in Western Europe - our very own Police and toff/snob ridden Court Services.

[Mr Mosquito]

Just be grateful that the police haven't started using the Malinois, as many european forces have, quicker, and with very high drives and courage, I've seen some awesome film of Malinois trials, where the dog will not let go, no matter what the 'criminal' does.

It's probably easier written than done but when being mauled by an attack dog that wont let go try getting on the back of the blasted thing and pulling the front legs apart - should crack the dog's rib cage.

[tin]

I'd like to add the following statement to this debate from a neutral friend of mine who I know from following England. Feel free to add this to your collection of witness account's Amanda

I travelled to the game as a guest of the 'tin'. I am a Charlton Season ticket holder and have also travelled a few times to see England away and in 15 years have never known anything like it. We were doing nothing wrong when they grabbed him and the only reason I was left alone was due to being a Londoner so they thought I was just an onlooker.

All the way to the ground I was complaining that it was disgraceful behaviour on their part and that I was ashamed to say that they were MY local police force.

Then outside the ground when a big lad was getting tugged for pushing a car about half a yard, the rozzers went wading in lashing out. I took a blow to the spine (which they're lucky has not bruised otherwise they'd have had a serious complaint on their hands for brutality) when I turned round I saw a WPC with her baton drawn so asked why she did it and she claimed to have told me to move, I did not hear this and told her she was a disgrace and that if she had asked me to move I would have done.

This unsavoury bunch of incidents ruined what was an otherwise enjoyable day with no sign of trouble until the escort.

I am emailing this to QPR for answers and to find out who was in charge as they would/ should know this.

[zidereddy]

This was the most over the top policing i have ever seen at a match in my life,i got the impression they wer out for some kind of revenge for the 'disturbance' at palace and they wer only to willing to volenteer for this match to get there own back on city fans, hooligans or not didnt matter to them we wer all in the same boat.(I KNOW FOR A FACT AT LEAST TWO WANTED TO POLICE THIS GAME FOR THE ABOVE REASONS ONLY FOUND OUT SINCE FROM CONTACT IN THE MET)

i used the tactic of just keepeing quiet as it was obvious they wer gagging to batter people any chance they got total priqs

[Stand Up Sit Down]

Thanks Tin. At the risk of being pedantic, could she please email me directly? Better personally received emails than cut and pastes from forums. I'd like to get in touch with her re her contact with QPR as well.

I'd also advise her - bruise or no bruise - that she should make a formal complaint anyway.

ajm22769@yahoo.co.uk

Also, I've got a contact at the Evening Standard paper. If they're interested in the story, would any of you be prepared to talk him directly?

[tin]

Thanks Tin. At the risk of being pedantic, could she please email me directly? Better personally received emails than cut and pastes from forums. I'd like to get in touch with her re her contact with QPR as well.

I'd also advise her - bruise or no bruise - that she should make a formal complaint anyway.

ajm22769@yahoo.co.uk

Also, I've got a contact at the Evening Standard paper. If they're interested in the story, would any of you be prepared to talk him directly?

I'm e-mailing you as we speak. I've told my mate to get in touch as well but note he is he, not a she!

[Mr Mosquito]

Thanks Tin. At the risk of being pedantic, could she please email me directly? Better personally received emails than cut and pastes from forums. I'd like to get in touch with her re her contact with QPR as well.

I'd also advise her - bruise or no bruise - that she should make a formal complaint anyway.

ajm22769@yahoo.co.uk

Also, I've got a contact at the Evening Standard paper. If they're interested in the story, would any of you be prepared to talk him directly?

WOW !!!!! I often read the online version of the London Evening Standard. Please let us know if/when a story may be published.

[phantom]

Just when you think that it can't get any worse A CITY FAN WRITES THIS, obviously the person who wrote this has not seen this thread !

Would be a good thing to delete that rubbish before to many people get the wrong end of the FULL STORY from one person !

[gamon]

Just when you think that it can't get any worse A CITY FAN WRITES THIS, obviously the person who wrote this has not seen this thread !

Would be a good thing to delete that rubbish before to many people get the wrong end of the FULL STORY from one person !

Its just his opinon.

Totally wrong mind, but his opinion nonetheless.

I didn't actually see any racist abuse at those lads in the park playing football.

From what I recall a chant of "En-ger-land" went up and these lads in the park applauded?

I wasn't singing mind, I was trying to avoid all the pushing and shoving by sticking to the side of the excort out the way of all the excited young uns trying to storm free.

[Andy Horsman]

I am the dangerous hooligan who got apprehended and roughed up for pushing the car. After all the delays and tension, whilst waiting outside the away end entrance in Bloemfontein Road, it became apparant that a silver car had been parked, with the handbrake left off.This was only discovered by lads pushed into it by the crowd which was manipulated by the increasingly hostile and belligerent police escort. (Incidentally, I had been in O'Neills since 12.30 and the atmosphere was generally amiable and jovial until the Met intervened.) I started pushing the front bumper of the aforementioned vehicle, backwards, using my calves, walking backwards, with no other intent than to have a laugh and lighten the mood.Oh boy was I mistaken!!!I was forcibly removed by two policemen whose colleagues then got bat happy with concerned City fans around me, and shoved against a wall. All the while I was trying to keep talking, telling them that I was only messing about , and they were being OTT.I was informed that I should f*ckin shut up and follow them around the corner.At this point a younger copper came over and said something along the lines of 'He's been mouthing off about our policing and payrise!!', which is true, but hardly constitutes criminal behaiour! The upshot was a £50 fixed penalty notice,which wasn't as bad as a kicking and a night in the cells, but still highly punative considering my misdemeanour, a virginal match ticket and being let out in the middle of White City wearing my 1973 Toffs City shirt to find my own way back to Hammersmith.

I was lucky, reading about Tins and DanC's experiences.

Don't expect me to contribute to the police benevolence fund....

[Uncle Ern]

What's yellow and bent ??

The Metropolitan Police Force

[Mr Mosquito]

What's yellow and bent ??

The Metropolitan Police Force

A van-load of wigs were stolen in London yesterday. The Met Police are combing London for clues.

&

A Met policeman pulls a man over for speeding and asks him to get out of the car. After looking the man over he says, "Oi, I notice your eyes are bloodshot. How much have you been drinking?"

The man also gets really indignant and says, "Officer, I couldn't help but notice your eyes are glazed. How many doughnuts have you eaten?"

[Guest WellyCiderHead]

I am the dangerous hooligan who got apprehended and roughed up for pushing the car. After all the delays and tension, whilst waiting outside the away end entrance in Bloemfontein Road, it became apparant that a silver car had been parked, with the handbrake left off.This was only discovered by lads pushed into it by the crowd which was manipulated by the increasingly hostile and belligerent police escort. (Incidentally, I had been in O'Neills since 12.30 and the atmosphere was generally amiable and jovial until the Met intervened.) I started pushing the front bumper of the aforementioned vehicle, backwards, using my calves, walking backwards, with no other intent than to have a laugh and lighten the mood.Oh boy was I mistaken!!!I was forcibly removed by two policemen whose colleagues then got bat happy with concerned City fans around me, and shoved against a wall. All the while I was trying to keep talking, telling them that I was only messing about , and they were being OTT.I was informed that I should f*ckin shut up and follow them around the corner.At this point a younger copper came over and said something along the lines of 'He's been mouthing off about our policing and payrise!!', which is true, but hardly constitutes criminal behaiour! The upshot was a £50 fixed penalty notice,which wasn't as bad as a kicking and a night in the cells, but still highly punative considering my misdemeanour, a virginal match ticket and being let out in the middle of White City wearing my 1973 Toffs City shirt to find my own way back to Hammersmith.

I was lucky, reading about Tins and DanC's experiences.

Don't expect me to contribute to the police benevolence fund....

Tut Tut Andy, u r supposed to show an example to us youngsters!

[Dolman Block B]

To all of you who were witness to the old bill actions on saturday, i have recieved a email from Standupaitdown today saying all our emails are being forward on with letters of copmplaints.

Fair play to her, she is as fed up as all of us on how we were treated and is trying her upmost to get a letter of apology

[tin]

To all of you who were witness to the old bill actions on saturday, i have recieved a email from Standupaitdown today saying all our emails are being forward on with letters of copmplaints.

Fair play to her, she is as fed up as all of us on how we were treated and is trying her upmost to get a letter of apology

My mate Mr. Davenport also had a brief interview with a journalist from the Eveing Standard yesterday so it looks like that's being followed up as well so watch this space...