Section 82. Yes or No?

[Phileas Fogg]

12 minutes ago, JM91 said:

I think it's more a difference in perception.  you (and undoubtedly others too) would describe it this way and it's not an unfair way to describe it, but if you look at the shoe on the other foot, they are the only fans the club has really gone out of their way to get a designated area for with the exception of the family zone.  Fans in the lower Dolman and Williams stands didn't get this preferential treatment, nor did they manage to get discounted prices for having to move.

I think some grievances are misplaced too, the standing for example, it really isnt up to the club.  Its the Taylor report and the government who prevent standing in the top two divisions.  There is no doubt in my mind that Bristol Sport would love safe standing, they spent money installing it in that small art of the Atyeo (or Williams?) behind the old shop in order to showcase and try to make a case for it being introduced.  Along with the rugby club moving in it just makes sense for safe standing.

My most logical reasoning is that everyone goes to football for different reasons, if a group (in this case the section 82 fans) doesn't respect that some in the Dolman aren't there to sing/shout then how can they then expect anyone else to respect their reasons for going?

Good points. I really feel like the club had a blank canvas to suit all 'types' of supporter, it feels like they didn't fulfil the potential of this and as a result the atmosphere isn't as good as it could be, and there's the extra issues with segregation in the Atyeo. All of these could have been avoided in my eyes.

[WTMS]

10 minutes ago, Spoons said:

Simply that section 82 is not a suitable area for children to be linked to in any way. Particularly behaviour , language etc. As the Sc&t have links to club they really should avoid section 82 at all costs as it divides opinion massively and when you have one set of fans calling others cu-- it isn't good for that to be linked to the SC&T.

There is constant profane language in the Dolman stand.

The Supporters Club & Trust role is to have links with all fans - Check their aims. 

Have this loose small group of fans you freely malign called you anything?  

In your earlier post you implied this loose small group of fans could be linked to criminality. Can you articulate that further?

Simply that section 82 is not a suitable area for children to be linked to in any way .. Why? That appears to be prejuidiced nonsense regarding a small group of well meaning supporters. Supporters including parents you know nothing about, and are blameless of anything beyond wanting to do something worthwhile in support of Bristol City.

[Spoons]

2 minutes ago, WTMS said:

There is constant profane language in the Dolman stand.

The Supporters Club & Trust role is to have links with all fans - Check their aims. 

Have this loose small group of fans you freely malign called you anything?  

In your earlier post you implied this loose small group of fans could be linked to criminality. Can you articulate that further?

Simply that section 82 is not a suitable area for children to be linked to in any way .. Why? That appears to be prejuidiced nonsense regarding a small group of well meaning supporters. Supporters including parents you know nothing about, and are blameless of anything beyond wanting to do something worthwhile in support of Bristol City.

Would you take your kids into section 82? I know I wouldn't .

[Red Army 75]

I take my child in their.

[Spoons]

2 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

I take my child in their.

Wow

[JM91]

8 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Good points. I really feel like the club had a blank canvas to suit all 'types' of supporter, it feels like they didn't fulfil the potential of this and as a result the atmosphere isn't as good as it could be, and there's the extra issues with segregation in the Atyeo. All of these could have been avoided in my eyes.

I do agree, for me I think they should have prioritised having sections sorted at the end of the stadium building process.  But what they have done is focus on the interim and made it quite difficult now that the stadium is almost complete.  I'd sooner have an inconvenient two seasons followed by a well-thought out finished article than what we have at the moment which seems like a poor compromise for all to be honest.

I think it would have been logical for a family stand in the new Williams lower (near the dugouts is pretty much the norm for most clubs for autographs etc.) and a singing section in the South Stand.  Trying to reduce the level of inconvenience in the two seasons in between shouldnt have taken priority over this.

[Red Army 75]

1 minute ago, Spoons said:

Wow

Wow what

[WTMS]

Spoons if you are referring to the Atyeo stand the answer is yes.

Here is one you missed earlier.

There is constant profane language in the Dolman stand.

The Supporters Club & Trust role is to have links with all fans - Check their aims. 

Have this loose small group of fans you freely malign called you anything?  

In your earlier post you implied this loose small group of fans could be linked to criminality. Can you articulate that further?

Simply that section 82 is not a suitable area for children to be linked to in any way .. Why? That appears to be prejudiced nonsense regarding a small group of well meaning supporters. Supporters including parents you know nothing about, and are blameless of anything beyond wanting to do something worthwhile in support of Bristol City.

[Dave]

I suspect the Club will be asking some questions about what behaviour will be deemed acceptable in the Atyeo based supporters bar. 

As I am sure the standing/singing/unreserved area, was not expected to result in paying City supporting customers being called unpleasant things in the name of banter.

Behaviour of this ilk in the new bar, will lead to problems and publicity the Club will not want.

[Red Exile]

5 minutes ago, JM91 said:

I do agree, for me I think they should have prioritised having sections sorted at the end of the stadium building process.  But what they have done is focus on the interim and made it quite difficult now that the stadium is almost complete.  I'd sooner have an inconvenient two seasons followed by a well-thought out finished article than what we have at the moment which seems like a poor compromise for all to be honest.

I think it would have been logical for a family stand in the new Williams lower (near the dugouts is pretty much the norm for most clubs for autographs etc.) and a singing section in the South Stand.  Trying to reduce the level of inconvenience in the two seasons in between shouldnt have taken priority over this.

A more Machiavellian view might be that the club has managed to isolate a group of supporters who don't want to sit down and behave in the same way as everyone else. They've popped them into the grottiest corner of the ground away from access to any of the swanky new facilities - assuming that the same access restrictions are maintained next year. And they've reduced their numbers. And better still these fans are delighted with the arrangement. In time all that's needed is to increase the number of tickets available to away supporters, or to give away fans the whole end, and then the current Atyeo fans are left to make their own arrangements, scattered all over the ground and broken up.

Which would be relatively painless from the club's point of view.

[Dollymarie]

14 minutes ago, Spoons said:

Would you take your kids into section 82? I know I wouldn't .

I've taken children into the Atyeo/unreserved areas for years. They got told by me before they went to football that they might hear some words that were colourful. If they use those words outside of football then they don't get to go again. As far as I'm aware there haven't been any issues with them using words they might hear at football away from the ground. We sit down towards the front of the area so that they don't have to have their view blocked by those that choose to stand. I at times, if I haven't had kids with me, have gone and stood with other friends. The language used makes up a very tiny point of our match day experience.

Its worth saying that our very own Oskar wanted to sit in front of the Atyeo this season when he could have gone in the shiny new areas, because he wanted to be near the noisy more colourful language using areas. 

Also for what it's worth I hate the c word and don't like it being used towards our own fans, but there are bigger things in the world that I could get my knickers in a twist about. 

Plus, as a board member of the SC&T it is our role to interact with/try and represent all different types/groups of fans.

And one last thing, I've helped out on many occasions this season with setting up/putting away some of the displays in the Atyeo, and have been happy to do so. 

[Nomad]

I recall sections of OTIB calling Palace fans Nigel's and generally taking the p1ss out of them. If they witnessed S82 they'd no doubt be p1ssing themselves until the start of next season. 

From what I see the Palace's 'Ultra's' or whatever you want to call them are way more inclusive with the rest of their supporters than S82 who appear to enjoy the notoriety of being the outcasts of AG. Just my opinion mind. 

 

[cider head]

More concerned with the behaviour of paid staff supposed to look after fans but starting problems off by being very unprofessional in their approach to their work but lets not bother people with the truth when a good story is in full spin eh!.

I was stood there and seen it.

Young lad stood on a seat rightly or wrongly gets told to get off the seat by a steward (fair enough) but the steward went very hands on and almost taking the lads head off with and attempted grap at the neck, fans tell steward to back off as did the stewards colleagues who said he was out of order and could have made things a lot worse, even the police told the steward to back off and the police never spoke to or arrested any fans.

No fighting, now mass pushing or touching stewards or each other just one over excited kid stood on a seat and a steward and all dealt with properly and if you blinked you would have missed it.... It may have looked worse than it was due to being near full time and fans making their way to the front of the stand and a few fans stood in the gang way steps,, self policed it was and the lad by his own fans said enough now fella off the seats and he did.

As i said nothing really happened not what the scale some on here in two threads are saying.

As for the C word i don't sing it or like it but i know a hell of a lot of fans sat up in the Dolman A & B blocks who i have been in the EE and williams with (subbers) would have laughed it off as banter, other don't like it fair enough but to brand everyone with the same brush is wrong, there was some good interaction between both stands on Saturday and doing the bounce around together at times and i feel things are not as bad as being posted but i'm seeing this as some have personal issues with others on here.

Things will be looked at and SAT DOWN FACE TO FACE with the club to see what can be done instead accusations, insults and story telling on forums.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

10 minutes ago, Nomad said:

I recall sections of OTIB calling Palace fans Nigel's and generally taking the p1ss out of them. If they witnessed S82 they'd no doubt be p1ssing themselves until the start of next season. 

From what I see the Palace's 'Ultra's' or whatever you want to call them are way more inclusive with the rest of their supporters than S82 who appear to enjoy the notoriety of being the outcasts of AG. Just my opinion mind. 

 

Inclusion is difficult if they are given that tiny area by the club of only 1000 season tickets in the worst stand away from everyone else. Put them in the SS as originally proposed and you have loads of space, better acoustics and more opportunities for anyone who wants to to buy tickets in the SS to join in.

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

48 minutes ago, Spoons said:

Simply that section 82 is not a suitable area for children to be linked to in any way. Particularly behaviour , language etc. As the Sc&t have links to club they really should avoid section 82 at all costs as it divides opinion massively and when you have one set of fans calling others cu-- it isn't good for that to be linked to the SC&T.

My dad started taking me to home (and some away matches including Cardiff) in the mid 80s....I don't think my kids would be scarred for life by the activities of Section 82 somehow.

Do you honestly believe that kids don't eff n Jeff in the playground at school anyway? 

 

 

[Spoons]

28 minutes ago, Dollymarie said:

I've taken children into the Atyeo/unreserved areas for years. They got told by me before they went to football that they might hear some words that were colourful. If they use those words outside of football then they don't get to go again. As far as I'm aware there haven't been any issues with them using words they might hear at football away from the ground. We sit down towards the front of the area so that they don't have to have their view blocked by those that choose to stand. I at times, if I haven't had kids with me, have gone and stood with other friends. The language used makes up a very tiny point of our match day experience.

Its worth saying that our very own Oskar wanted to sit in front of the Atyeo this season when he could have gone in the shiny new areas, because he wanted to be near the noisy more colourful language using areas. 

Also for what it's worth I hate the c word and don't like it being used towards our own fans, but there are bigger things in the world that I could get my knickers in a twist about. 

Plus, as a board member of the SC&T it is our role to interact with/try and represent all different types/groups of fans.

And one last thing, I've helped out on many occasions this season with setting up/putting away some of the displays in the Atyeo, and have been happy to do so. 

I couldn't disagree more

[Spoons]

14 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

My dad started taking me to home (and some away matches including Cardiff) in the mid 80s....I don't think my kids would be scarred for life by the activities of Section 82 somehow.

Do you honestly believe that kids don't eff n Jeff in the playground at school anyway? 

 

 

Agree to disagree

[Andy082005]

100% keep them

100% they should be moved

100% they should stop acting like complete bellends 

[Phileas Fogg]

4 minutes ago, Spoons said:

Agree to disagree

That's a bit of a cop out.

I notice you haven't actually divulged what it is in Dollymarie's long post to you that you disagree with in your one line reply?

[Spoons]

3 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

That's a bit of a cop out.

I notice you haven't actually divulged what it is in Dollymarie's long post to you that you disagree with?

All of it!! Any half decent parent wouldn't take a kid say 12 and under in section 82. Simple

[Phileas Fogg]

4 minutes ago, Spoons said:

All of it!! Any half decent parent wouldn't take a kid say 12 and under in section 82. Simple

Don't think that's very fair, surely it's up to the parent. Your implication that choice about exposing them to swearing stops them being a 'half decent parent' is actually quite offensive.

It's surely up to the parent to decide whether their child is mature enough to be exposed to that sort of thing and know that it shouldn't be repeated.

Swearing isn't JUST done in the Atyeo, its prevalent throughout the ground and you should expect to hear it - perhaps with the exception of the designated family area.

[Bristol Rob]

8 minutes ago, Andy082005 said:

100% keep them

100% they should be moved

100% they should stop acting like complete bellends 

Pretty sure they were singing that they 'would NOT be moved' on the weekend. 

It's these mixed messages that are causing all manner of confusion.

[Spoons]

1 minute ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Don't think that's very fair, surely it's up to the parent. Your implication that choice about exposing them to swearing doesn't make them a bad parent is actually quite offensive.

It's surely up to the parent to decide whether their child is mature enough to be exposed to that sort of thing and know that it shouldn't be repeated.

Agreed there will be swearing all over ground but there will be less of a risk away from section 82. I take my 5 year old daughter to home games so I know. Also agree people have different levels of what's except able for there kids, mine are higher than some on here I seem to get the feeling. 

[42nite]

I don't think the South Stand would welcome some of the S82 individuals into their fold willingly.

They seem to be doing ok as they are.

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

5 minutes ago, Spoons said:

Agreed there will be swearing all over ground but there will be less of a risk away from section 82. I take my 5 year old daughter to home games so I know. Also agree people have different levels of what's except able for there kids, mine are higher than some on here I seem to get the feeling. 

What are you trying to say 'Spoons'?

[Carey 6]

2 hours ago, Red Exile said:

On Saturday my son and I were sat, as we have all season, at the front of the Atyeo. We were joined, after kick-off, by a group who'd all been to the pub, who scattered themselves around the available seats, ignored the game and loudly continued the conversation they'd been having. And when that got boring they screwed up bits of steamer and threw them at each other, hitting people sat around them. These were middle aged men. It was like sitting with group of toddlers who'd not learned appropriate behaviour.

Laughable complaining about a few people having loud conversations. It's a football ground not a library. Also, so what if people were chucking the streamers, that is what they are there for, and is that going to hurt somebody? Overreaction.  

5 hours ago, Spoons said:

I did think about doing it Saturday, especially to Charlie the benefits chav in the white coat who would struggle to name any city player let alone think he can call me a c u next Tuesday!

This comment is also quite funny, what did this 'benefits chav' do to upset you so much? All I saw him do on Saturday was have a good time and enjoy himself like 99% of the others in the stand.

[WTMS]

21 minutes ago, Andy082005 said:

100% keep them

100% they should be moved

100% they should stop acting like complete bellends 

Who are you referring to and what have they done that you find objectionable?

Knowing individuals in the stand who have made significant effort to raise money etc It is hard to see what people are so adamant about.

 

[Red Army 75]

15 minutes ago, Spoons said:

All of it!! Any half decent parent wouldn't take a kid say 12 and under in section 82. Simple

So because I take my child in the atyeo your saying im a bad parent. The minority used the c word towards the dolman totally unacceptable. So everyone in that stand in your eyes are the same. U don't know me or my child and for Wat it is worth my son is doing very well in school. He donated all his old city's shirts to children in Botswana and gave some of his pocket money to a certain someone who needed help . Oh and both his parents work hard . But u judge away if it makes u feel better . Your no different to the idiots who used the c word 

[M_Porter]

Interesting thread:

And one I'm going to sit on the fence with.

But I would like to point out that over the last decade I have sat in all the area's of the ground, and have witnessed fans beating other fans, police beating fans, fans beating police and stewards invading the pitch, and then I have heard racist chanting and chants so bad they dont even have section to put them in.

In short I have seen it and heard it in every part of the ground, and in every case its all ways been the MINORITY not the MAJORITY so its a little unfair to blame the majority for the minority don't you think.

I have bought Season tickets and sat next to right idiots, but my philosophy on this is that they have paid there money and entitled to their opinion and their own match day experience.

One thing for sure though if someone dosn't get a grip on this Section82  then I fear the club will try and disband it.

I know nothing about the section do they have a hierarchy or  an official member base ? perhaps if not that may be the way forward, form a committee or similar and have a member base and self police, if people have something to lose ie  membership, and or access to a specific part of the ground their attitude may change, who knows.

Anyway I'm moving again next season to the family area as another Porter gets his first season ticket

 

COYR

[Spoons]

9 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

What are you trying to say 'Spoons'?

I'm trying to say as a parent why would u take your kids in to section 82, strange for me to understand the thinking behind why u would do that