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Antman

So, Taylor Moore....

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...the lad signed for not a small amount £1M+ and has spent one year of his 3 (?) year contract on loan, year 2 looking like it will be on loan, so why did we sign him?

he's not really featured in the friendlies, its not looking great with players in front of him in his main roles - just don't get why we spent that much.

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Just now, Derek from Nailsea said:

No chance of making it here as not up to scratch. Flattered to deceive at Bury even.

I thought he had a good spell with Bury based on the threads on their forum. Where have you heard/seen this?

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25 minutes ago, Antman said:

...the lad signed for not a small amount £1M+ and has spent one year of his 3 (?) year contract on loan, year 2 looking like it will be on loan, so why did we sign him?

he's not really featured in the friendlies, its not looking great with players in front of him in his main roles - just don't get why we spent that much.

Yep, let's stop his development and stick him in our first team, to play at a level that he's not ready for yet..! 

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We bought him as a prospect that was supposed to be knocking on the door but doesn't seem there yet.

People always draw on the value of the player -  Yes we want a return but not all transfers will come off well (even this may still do!) 

It happens all the time in football i.e. Omar Bogle, Tom Bradshaw ect. 

 

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27 minutes ago, Antman said:

...the lad signed for not a small amount £1M+ and has spent one year of his 3 (?) year contract on loan, year 2 looking like it will be on loan, so why did we sign him?

he's not really featured in the friendlies, its not looking great with players in front of him in his main roles - just don't get why we spent that much.

Paid market value for a promising young player? 

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The lad obviously has ability but it seems he's not yet upto Sky Bet Championship quality as yet. The loan at Bury will have given him crucial experience of men's league football.

Its up LJ and the coaching staff to decide when he's ready and given his tender years that might not be for a while yet so it makes perfect sense to let go out on loan again, possibly at a higher league than Bury to gain even more experience of league football.

When he returns City will have benefited by having a better and more experienced defender. On the books.

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Dont forget the club policy of buying players for 7 figure fees, not giving them a chance and then buying 2 or 3 replacements, until we have a squad of about 35. Eventually they find a player they like and its all fine, everyones a winner.

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31 minutes ago, Derek from Nailsea said:

No chance of making it here as not up to scratch. Flattered to deceive at Bury even.

This is unfair on Taylor. He spent quite a bit of time up there playing RWB, which he simply does not have the pace to do. That being said, he did show weaknesses that demonstrate he is not ready for this level yet. We must not write him off now, but rather we must send him on loan somewhere for the whole season instead of messing him about and then shipping him off to some team in January. I want him to do well, but he is not yet ready for this level and would benefit from playing his favoured CB position at a higher L1 club

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35 minutes ago, Robbored said:

The lad obviously has ability but it seems he's not yet upto Sky Bet Championship quality as yet. The loan at Bury will have given him crucial experience of men's league football.

Its up LJ and the coaching staff to decide when he's ready and given his tender years that might not be for a while yet so it makes perfect sense to let go out on loan again, possibly at a higher league than Bury to gain even more experience of league football.

When he returns City will have benefited by having a better and more experienced defender. On the books.

Just to be clear... Sky Bet Championship ?

that's   S  B  C  yeah? :) 

PS agree on Moore

.... as 'one for the future' all seems to be going to plan so far, slowly maturing and theres nothing to say he won't deserve another year or two extension if improvement continues - not a bad gamble. 

If he does make the grade here he'll be an asset, if he does 'so so' here and makes a few first team appearances before we move him on the chances are it'll then be for a profit... What have we got to lose?  percentage of a £million or so at worst, which won't amount to too much in football money these days..  And if the punt comes off and he really does well, we'll be mega quids in when the big clubs come knocking on our door ...  of course WE may be a BIG CLUB by then ourselves! :fingerscrossed:

 

Edited by WhistleHappy
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2 minutes ago, kivsy said:

And the Taylor Moore who is good enough to captain England under 20 s.  , but not good enough for a annually relegation threatened team ? 

This post displays a clear lack of knowledge and understanding.

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1 minute ago, kivsy said:

And the Taylor Moore who is good enough to captain England under 20 s.  , but not good enough for a annually relegation threatened team ? 

Big difference in the opposition. U20s boys and the Sky Bet Championship is a massive step up In quality 

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its down to moore to prove himself. the money spent on him was always a risk when you buy a youngster but a calculated risk. they don't all work out but in this current market nobody is cheap and we done well to get him. you win some you lose some but you gotta be in it to win it...ala kodjia

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10 minutes ago, Londoner said:

This post displays a clear lack of knowledge and understanding.

Tell me about it.   "...a annually...."?!!  What next?  "... a academic"?

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Love the fact armchair fans writing off talyor-Moore without even seeing him play!!

Ive seen very little, you tube footage of him playing at lens and bits from his loan spell at bury and of course his limited appearances for city.

But how about we judge him after a run of games? He's clearly got talent. 

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27 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Big difference in the opposition. U20s boys and the Sky Bet Championship is a massive step up In quality 

Is saying "Sky Bet Championship" or the related acronym part of your trolling repertoire?

i can't think of any other reason a grown man would say such a thing. 

Edited by Fordy62
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Don't see the problem personally. Not quite ready for Championship football week in week out and will probably be a better player for another year out on loan in England. 

 

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7 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

Is saying "Sky Bet Championship" or the related acronym part of your trolling repertoire?

i can't think of any other reason a grown man would say such a thing. 

So you can't think of a reason why I post S B C?   

As you correctly say it's an acronym of the league City play in and is far easier and quicker to post that typing it.

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1 minute ago, Robbored said:

So you can't think of a reason why I post S B C?   

As you correctly say it's an acronym of the league City play in and is far easier and quicker to post that typing it.

Would you not just say Championship? 

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38 minutes ago, kivsy said:

There has been plenty of players aged 16 to 19. Who have made premier league , or championship debuts , done well, then possibly sold on , at bigger clubs than city  

How many of those players have been Taylor-Moore..?! 

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7 minutes ago, Agard Days Night said:

Would you not just say Championship? 

Too long.

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Of all the 'not quite ready' signings from last summer and I include Brownhill and Engvall to O'Dowda, Moore (himself) and Di Girolamo, I think Moore will go on to be the best.  That's difficult to quantify I know, especially when GE and COD have played full internationals, but England cap is a different kettle of fish.

Some of the comments above are interesting:

- no pace - not what I've seen or what I've heard, pace is one of his assets.

- didn't do much at Bury - their GiggLane forum were impressed with him, especially as he was played at RWB predominantly.  They were a struggling side in the relegation zone and without regurgitating stats I've posted previously, their points tally per game went up massively and goals conceded per game dropped significantly

He appears to have filled out over the summer too.  Centre Back is a difficult position to be trusted in as a youngster, especially a slight one.  Some 19 year olds are men at 19, some aren't.

We seem to be in an awful rush on this forum to make snap judgements on players.  I suspect some posters have never actually seen him play.  Those snap judgements are also black and white - 'best thing since sliced bread' or 'Downs `League at best'.  99% are somewhere in between.  I'll give you Bas Savage though! :P

Its gonna be tough for TM, but doors open unexpectedly.

Flint is off - let's assume.

Baker suspended for Barnsley, nor up to speed.

What if Wright or Magnússon or Hegeler have a 'mare or get injured, or suspended - all of a sudden he's in the frame.

Got 2 seasons left on his contract - why rush? 

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2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Of all the 'not quite ready' signings from last summer and I include Brownhill and Engvall to O'Dowda, Moore (himself) and Di Girolamo, I think Moore will go on to be the best.  That's difficult to quantify I know, especially when GE and COD have played full internationals, but England cap is a different kettle of fish.

Some of the comments above are interesting:

- no pace - not what I've seen or what I've heard, pace is one of his assets.

- didn't do much at Bury - their GiggLane forum were impressed with him, especially as he was played at RWB predominantly.  They were a struggling side in the relegation zone and without regurgitating stats I've posted previously, their points tally per game went up massively and goals conceded per game dropped significantly

He appears to have filled out over the summer too.  Centre Back is a difficult position to be trusted in as a youngster, especially a slight one.  Some 19 year olds are men at 19, some aren't.

We seem to be in an awful rush on this forum to make snap judgements on players.  I suspect some posters have never actually seen him play.  Those snap judgements are also black and white - 'best thing since sliced bread' or 'Downs `League at best'.  99% are somewhere in between.  I'll give you Bas Savage though! :P

Its gonna be tough for TM, but doors open unexpectedly.

Flint is off - let's assume.

Baker suspended for Barnsley, nor up to speed.

What if Wright or Magnússon or Hegeler have a 'mare or get injured, or suspended - all of a sudden he's in the frame.

Got 2 seasons left on his contract - why rush? 

Interesting post but a big call saying he'll go on to be the best considering we've barely had a chance to watch him. 

For what it's worth I think Brownhill will go onto he the best but based on last night I think O'Dowda will have a good season.

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4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Of all the 'not quite ready' signings from last summer and I include Brownhill and Engvall to O'Dowda, Moore (himself) and Di Girolamo, I think Moore will go on to be the best.  That's difficult to quantify I know, especially when GE and COD have played full internationals, but England cap is a different kettle of fish.

Some of the comments above are interesting:

- no pace - not what I've seen or what I've heard, pace is one of his assets.

- didn't do much at Bury - their GiggLane forum were impressed with him, especially as he was played at RWB predominantly.  They were a struggling side in the relegation zone and without regurgitating stats I've posted previously, their points tally per game went up massively and goals conceded per game dropped significantly

He appears to have filled out over the summer too.  Centre Back is a difficult position to be trusted in as a youngster, especially a slight one.  Some 19 year olds are men at 19, some aren't.

We seem to be in an awful rush on this forum to make snap judgements on players.  I suspect some posters have never actually seen him play.  Those snap judgements are also black and white - 'best thing since sliced bread' or 'Downs `League at best'.  99% are somewhere in between.  I'll give you Bas Savage though! :P

Its gonna be tough for TM, but doors open unexpectedly.

Flint is off - let's assume.

Baker suspended for Barnsley, nor up to speed.

What if Wright or Magnússon or Hegeler have a 'mare or get injured, or suspended - all of a sudden he's in the frame.

Got 2 seasons left on his contract - why rush? 

That kind of thought process doesn't leave much room for a dig at LJ though, does it..!

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4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Of all the 'not quite ready' signings from last summer and I include Brownhill and Engvall to O'Dowda, Moore (himself) and Di Girolamo, I think Moore will go on to be the best.  That's difficult to quantify I know, especially when GE and COD have played full internationals, but England cap is a different kettle of fish.

Some of the comments above are interesting:

- no pace - not what I've seen or what I've heard, pace is one of his assets.

- didn't do much at Bury - their GiggLane forum were impressed with him, especially as he was played at RWB predominantly.  They were a struggling side in the relegation zone and without regurgitating stats I've posted previously, their points tally per game went up massively and goals conceded per game dropped significantly

He appears to have filled out over the summer too.  Centre Back is a difficult position to be trusted in as a youngster, especially a slight one.  Some 19 year olds are men at 19, some aren't.

We seem to be in an awful rush on this forum to make snap judgements on players.  I suspect some posters have never actually seen him play.  Those snap judgements are also black and white - 'best thing since sliced bread' or 'Downs `League at best'.  99% are somewhere in between.  I'll give you Bas Savage though! :P

Its gonna be tough for TM, but doors open unexpectedly.

Flint is off - let's assume.

Baker suspended for Barnsley, nor up to speed.

What if Wright or Magnússon or Hegeler have a 'mare or get injured, or suspended - all of a sudden he's in the frame.

Got 2 seasons left on his contract - why rush? 

I agree with you though I'd probably loan him out again. L1 somewhere they'll play him 46 games at CB. That would be my preference anyway. Or do the half year loan for him then half year loan for Vyner. Either way, he's a clear talent(in my mind) but you don't get many CBs in the championship that are 20 years old. I'd like to see him get a handful of appearances though but it may not be possible so a loan would be ideal. Do Portsmouth or Plymouth need a CB? That would be the ideal loan for me 

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If the long term goal is to play him at right back, is Pisano's age not perfect to phase him out and Moore in the next few years?

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9 minutes ago, Agard Days Night said:

But shorter than Sky Bet Championship? 

I used S. B. c as a short cut. No other reason.

Now, like my z z z z z z z s the acronym has been autocorrected.

Shame imv.

Edited by Robbored

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59 minutes ago, kivsy said:

There has been plenty of players aged 16 to 19. Who have made premier league , or championship debuts , done well, then possibly sold on , at bigger clubs than city  

Indeed CAULKER was 18 when he played for us and walked the player of the year award so if you're good enough...

Like Morrell at Cheltenham - he ran the show.

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@JoeAman08 - half season loan to a Lg1 team would be good, and yes at CB. So, yes, agree.

@Phileas Fogg - yep, from the brief watches at RB and Hull at CB I saw calmness, composure.....and pace, as well as good awareness of danger in central positions in the Hull game.  I thought he anticipated danger in behind Flint, even though Flint won the ball.  That is a good attribute.  Some CBs only see danger when it's happened.  By then its often too late, or you expose yourself into making last ditch tackles. I don't see him as a ball winning CB, but the one who drops off.

@Derek from Nailsea - Caulker - a fully developed man at 18, see below...looks 22/23 imho

IMG_1079.JPG

Edited by Davefevs
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49 minutes ago, Spoons said:

Love the fact armchair fans writing off talyor-Moore without even seeing him play!!

Ive seen very little, you tube footage of him playing at lens and bits from his loan spell at bury and of course his limited appearances for city.

But how about we judge him after a run of games? He's clearly got talent. 

Didn't do a lot in his 25 mins at Cheltenham whereas Lloyd Kelly was pretty decent on the left.

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13 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

I agree with you though I'd probably loan him out again. L1 somewhere they'll play him 46 games at CB. That would be my preference anyway. Or do the half year loan for him then half year loan for Vyner. Either way, he's a clear talent(in my mind) but you don't get many CBs in the championship that are 20 years old. I'd like to see him get a handful of appearances though but it may not be possible so a loan would be ideal. Do Portsmouth or Plymouth need a CB? That would be the ideal loan for me 

Half year loan makes sense in case he isn't playing,as for Pompey and Plymouth they are clubs who will be looking to push forward so wouldn't be able to guarantee him games,guess a Newport or Cheltenham as per normal 

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It's absolutely crucial that we always make sure that  we sign  talented youngsters and play him in the first team in order to prove he was never good enough at this level and meanwhile sign expensive experience in order to criticise the club's waste of time and money signing young potential .

Is there anyfink I've missed?

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2 minutes ago, Derek from Nailsea said:

Didn't do a lot in his 25 mins at Cheltenham whereas Lloyd Kelly was pretty decent on the left.

And that's an unrealistically tiny sample size 

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3 minutes ago, Derek from Nailsea said:

Didn't do a lot in his 25 mins at Cheltenham whereas Lloyd Kelly was pretty decent on the left.

Ah yeah, 25 minutes in a friendly is the perfect amount of time to judge a player.

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4 minutes ago, Derek from Nailsea said:

Didn't do a lot in his 25 mins at Cheltenham whereas Lloyd Kelly was pretty decent on the left.

I'm guessing that he wasn't up against much. 

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