the1stknowle

From memory, this guy is a Man U fan (that might be wrong), so maybe a pinch of salt needed. And i have seen similarly forceful threads the other way from well informed Man City fans, such as Slbsn. But, for those willing to get through this long thread, it lays out a lot of the salient info around the City charges.

Great post.

I genuinely don’t know this. Grassed on Wilson for what? I assume you don’t mean losing the play offs as.. that was on the tele and the owner was probably watching. What had Wilson done to be grassed on?

And if he does, ‘judged on Tinnion’ too?

He’s likely disappointed himself that he didn’t get to see it through as it was looking very positive. But career chances don’t always come along when you want them, or indeed, twice. So sometimes you have to be selfish. Hardly a morality issue. But fully understand the frustration from Oxford fans (search ‘Alex Scott’ ‘Bournemouth’ on OTIB).

Re support for Manning, I'd love that to be the case. Just not sure its 100% true going by the posts. Hopefully, he gets a good start so can diffuse the atmosphere a bit and move the club on. On Tinnion, if there is 'plenty of evidence' he is a back stabber - I haven't seen it and I think he deserves more respect. But we don't need to rehash arguments about Tinns that are well played out on other threads.

So many posts that feel like they are willing Manning to fail just so it confirms their blinkered, petty and snide views on Tinns. ‘I’ll give Manning my support but he’s a yes man and a patsy and will do what Tinns says and Tinns will basically be manager and did you know Manning was sacked by MK Dons?? But he has my support and I’ll give him a fair go. But if he doesn’t get into the playoffs then he has to be sacked because that is exactly what Lansdown said word for word. But he has my full support and I’m willing to give him a fair go. Until he inevitably fails.’

Fair enough but, if that really is the quote everyone is using to back up the 'promoted or sacked' posts, then that is pretty tenuous.

“We all wanted Nigel to achieve our ambition to be promoted but, with our recent results, feel that now is the time to make a change to give the club the best possible chance of success.” This quote?

He said the standard was that we have to get promoted? Genuine question. I've now see it repeated so many times on the forum but I cannot find the quote. Just the ones I mention in my original post.

I keep seeing this brought up but haven't seen the quote. I've seen a quote of 'challenging around playoffs' and 'outperforming our top 10 budget' and an ambition of promotion. But nowhere have I seen JL say 'we have to get promotion this season'. Where did our chairman say we have to get promotion this season?

I assume this is provable though, surely? A real simple stat like average distance run, while a bit crude, would show any big 'deconditioning' that occurred post-international break. Have something to hang the hat of this deconditioning concern on. From a pure football point of view, I'm really into the Manning appointment, if it happens. And, again from a football pov, I can see the argument for moving on from Nige - at minimum, there is a justification that exists. I've even appreciated the extra communication from leadership over last week that has been missing over last year. The lack of gratitude and acknowledgement of what Nige did for club and for connection with fans is galling. But where I'm still really struggling is exactly on this 'deconditioning' gossip that they have tried to seed with side comments and leaks. It lacks class, is malicious and either requires an explicit explanation of why you believe that with some statistical evidencing to back it up, or, if it is just a belief, you bury it completely and don't sully professional reputations with hints and underhand comments. Because as a fan looking with own two eyes, regardless of what you think of the football over last few years, it seems tough to argue that this is not the hardest running team we've ever had. You don't get on with Nige. Understandable. You think we can do better than 31% win ratio, even with circumstances over last few years, OK. But show some effin class in parting ways. It is possible to be honest and dignified at the same time.

I get it. Understand the scepticism. Depends what you mean by ‘had a hit at the thing we are stating as a minimum requirement.’ I would say getting promoted from championship with parachute and without are very different achievements. And there aren’t that many managers who have got a non parachute team promoted in recent years. Last year, of the 3 managers that got promoted from championship - none of them had been promoted before. Two were with parachute teams. The one that wasn’t had a manager that had been very successful in lower leagues - and not even league one. In the five years before that, the only managers I can think of to have done same trick are Bielsa, Farke and Wilder. Only one of those has subsequently been appointed to a role to try and repeat the trick (Wilder to Boro) and it was a failure (although I would add I think he’s a very good manager).

What is the paradigm appointment time that doesn’t have the similar hit/miss rate you describe? Internal appointment? Foreign manager? Experienced hand? Someone that has won something? Every appointment type you can point to will have hits a misses. My argument is that just saying good league one managers is what good league one teams have is facile.

You know who had a good league one manager who had never managed in the Championship? Ipswich.

More feelings and hot takes; less facts and statistics. This is what OTIB needs.

You really can argue that. This is a wild take.

The players are the continuity. I don't think the kind of continuity in lead coaching teams is part of any established recipe for success at other clubs. Its normal to get rid of the roles they have in any coaching set up change. Say it is a success (you're setting a high bar for measuring that, but let's see) will you be holding hands up and saying right call (handled badly)? Agree that everyone will get behind team now, but also feel like there are lots on this forum ready to hit Itoldyouso as soon as possible so I'm interested whether there might be a bit of credit given if this does work out. Agree on the flip flopping and shifting plan. But that is exactly why I am slightly encouraged by this. As it does feel like following through on a clear plan. Think we all agree the Nige departure was abysmally handled and the messaging has been a bit floundering. And the lack of thanks given to him lack class and is a misstep. But, looking forward, this is first appointment in a while where they have set out with an idea of what they want and stuck to that and the external messaging matches the appointment. Again, whether it works out, let's see. We all hope so - and wouldn't it be nice to see some attractive football at the Gate. Been a while.

Yeah, exactly. Everyone needs to start somewhere, right. What is the correct career path for a coach of Bristol City? Just someone on the Championship roundabout? A foreign manager with experience of lower leagues abroad? Someone already inside Bristol City coaching set up getting promoted? Or one of the most promising managers at the top of the league below? Whatever people think about the appointment, this smacks of having a clear plan which has been a persistent critique of the leadership over the last week and bit. It's consistent with what they said they were looking for. Easy to mock appointing a lower league manager (if it happens) but I actually do think this is an exciting appointment very different from some of the appointments used as a reference point by some commenters. Think this isn't a case of 'they don't know what they're doing' but suggests they know exactly what they're doing. Whether that clear plan proves correct, let's see. Hopefully everyone gets on board, because the strong platform Nige leaves behind will mean nothing if fans don't get behind appointment from beginning. I'm optimistic if this happens.

Let’s see on that.

Do you not think he’s done really well with that second chance, at least up until last few weeks?

Because if they go down, so do the sell on values of Scott and (it’s looking more of a possibility now) Semenyo. You want Scott to get sold for more than he cost Bournemouth, they need to be in the PL. So, even if you aren’t bothered about the success of our homegrown players (I am), self interest says we want Bournemouth to smash it.

I think the point is his top flight, possible European football job that he is currently being very successful at is a much better stepping stone to the Premier League (if that is what he wanted) than weirdly moving to Bristol City.

Meh -bit damned if you do, damned if you don't on this. My memory of the Derek McInnes sacking was SL really fronting up in a way that would have been welcome here. (Both results and football were terrible and the player culture out of control at that point so maybe it was a lot more straightforward to be upfront.)

On the recruitment point, is that a bad thing? (Asking genuinely). My understanding was for a while now, the club have been open that recruitment isn't a single person decision but that no one will be brought in without the manager's sign off. At the very least, there must be occasions when Nige led the recruitment process, or Matty James and Andy King are very coincidental choices by the recruitment team. You will know much more than me on this. On the physio point - completely agree. Hinting around this thing about conditioning and training is absolutely unacceptable and if there is an issue it needs to be explicitly addressed as a major reason for the changes or completely buried. These hints and passing comments are the worst of both worlds.