Davefevs

So Derby’s £81.1m (if just Stadium) is way over with “depreciation”.

My thoughts for a long time. One big club to go to the wall, or Sky / BT to start paying less. We are positioning ourselves sensibly. @Mr Popodopolous pretty sure Kelly will be in 18/19s accounts....and that’s not just because it happened on 18th May. Think the England u21 tournament was a reason for getting it done and dusted (not pending).

West Brom have suffered from cash flow issues, not FFP previously, but having not gone straight back up, this season will probably see pragmatism, hence the rumour if offering Rodriguez for £5m rising to £10m in season 2, probably to get him off the wage bill. Gayle was only loan wasn’t he, but they get Rondon back....probably to sell. So I think they will be starting to adjust, like Norwich did. Swansea had a huge wage bill, so Dan James sale will help compensate that. Think they’ll be ok, but they won’t be splashing loads either. The appointment of Cooper suggests they go back to their old formula. @Mr Popodopolous will give you a better answer.

Nah, it’s so he can’t influence anything that might benefit Derby as he’ll have a conflict of interest and not be allowed any decision making!. ?????

@Mr Popodopolous any idea what went on between Bryn and Jason on the Fishing Trip....otherwise known as the EFL Meeting in Portugal?

Your comments re the projected accounts submission id the big flaw in that rule and one we’ve speculated a lot on here. If Villa projected a big loss, then their FFP submission might include a footnote that they’ll sell Grealish before the end of of their accounts period to comply. And to be fair, there’s nothing wrong with that, hence the flaw in the projected accounts rule!

Out of interest @DerbyFan, what is your reason for joining our forum? I understand posters of other clubs forums, coming onto OTIB to discuss players / recruitment, or best pub to drink in type stuff....but I’ve never seen anyone join to post about FFP....that’s pretty niche!

@Mr Popodopolous and @Olé Their method of accounting is gonna bite them in the arse (if they do t get promoted), maybe not this year or the next, but at some point those players are gonna be worth eff all and their amortisation impairment is gonna be huge. Perhaps Morris can sell the player’s houses and lease them back. It’s a dangerous game not straight line depreciating. I can see Huddlestone being valued at £10m aged 57, continuing to get renewals just to keep Derby inside ffp!

Mr P - you on fire ?

I think this could be the pertinent point. EFL aware of Brum’s difficulties in May 2018. What did embargo and hand-holding them actually do to their accounts? Nothing! They ultimately post a loss in the ball-park they projected (you imagine). So the embargo and hand-holding is about trying to correct them going forwards....it can’t possibly resolve their annual accounts unless they sold Adams early last summer. That obviously didn’t happen....he’s still at Brum now. In effect, they let Burton and Barnsley be relegated whilst they sorted out the mess. That is what they’re now doing with Villa. Soft embargo whilst they sort out out their sale and lease-back, whilst privately hoping they get promoted...the Prem won’t deduct points, they’ll apply a fine at worst, which is covered by the £100m+. Had they lost to Derby, I’m pretty sure the ground deal would’ve been sped-up to fall into this year’s accounts and negate any further sanction. All in all, the projected accounts should be a trigger for taking action in the season, when all they are really being used for is a trigger for the EFL to start helping a club (depending on their size) to get around sanction.

The argument I get Re FFP on twitter from Villa fans is Christian Purslow wrote the FFP rules, so they’ll be alright. From what Copello states that probably enough for the EFL guys to not bother looking at Villa’s projected submission. What I do find worrying is talk that they are under soft embargo....that must mean they are in trouble, in which case why haven’t the EFL docked them points / stopped them going up?

Part of the reason FFP was brought in was Platini (great footballer - awful administrator) wanting to break England’s dominance of the Champions League, allowing a French team a chance. Spain then dominated, but it is going full-circle with English clubs again. Platini couldn’t stop Sky, and PSG fail again. The lower league versions in this country, I'm not convinced have been rigorously applied either, and it’s all becoming a bit of a farce. If Gibson’s lawsuit fails to have any impact on the rules and Villa’s ground sale swells their coffers, then I think it’s time to admit defeat, and either accept there are those taking advantage of the rules and there are those who aren’t. Not sure where SL will sit...unchanged I suspect, playing by the rules....but expect FFP to die a death.

According to Kieran Maguire, he thinks Villa have already sold their ground and leased it back.

5) where Ken Anderson is the Owner, he should get eff all, and his son too.

I wonder what Gibson’s motives / objections are: Fair play? Financial compensation for Boro and financial ruin for Derby (assume they might then sue valuer) Derby denied promotion should they achieve it Adjustment of Derby’s FFP submission, resulting in embargo, points deduction, etc Loophole closed

It will force the issue - and I reckon a next action against the EFL for not following their rules. The worm is turning.

I saw this on Twitter, refused to open it....almost puked at the thought.

I think this is a very clever move from Gibson. Start a legal action before Villa and Wednesday (and anyone else) try the same. Wonder how this will play out with the EFL. Suspect SL is right behind him.

All EFL and Prem clubs have to have an accounting year of End of May, June or July.

That was pretty much my point a few weeks ago. If Villa gave included a forecast sale of Grealish, then they should be bound by it imho. If they don’t sale (because they’ve gone up) then in effect there losses are bigger and they should be denied promotion.

That has been my point on this for a good while. I really hoped the projected accounts would make a difference to previous wrongdoings. Of course perhaps Villa included the forecast sale of Grealish? I don’t know. @Coppello - would that be allowed?

You have just answered the question the EFL guys should’ve been asking! It’s been hideously over-valued to make Derby stay within FFP.

Surely if the submission was wrong, there must be an option to adjust.

I think that is the angle Gibson and Lansdown are playing at. I see the good intentions of the projected accounts, but the implementation when both 1) club annual accounting periods finish after the end of the season and 2) the transfer window Re-opens before 1, is flawed. Villa will just sell Player X and / or Player Y for £Xm if they don’t go up. Perhaps in Gibson / Pulis / Boro’s case they showed their hand too early in cutting costs? Re Ground Sale, the EFL have already concluded Derby’s was fine....so have set the precedent....haven’t they? Bit late to say they are gonna investigate Wednesday, and Villa if they do the same.

I wonder whether Birmingham could be the salvation here, in terms of Villa’s flouting of FFP and finally getting done. Big wishful thinking on my part. We keep thinking about their 9 point deduction, but often forget that was for the 3 year period to 17/18. They are still gonna be in the shit for for the 3 year period to 18/19, so likely to be under embargo....and get a points deduction at some point in the 19/20 season, when the EFL finally act. They might show leniency if Adams is sold and brings some sanity back to their accounts. But compare to Villa, there 3 year period to 18/19, also gonna be a mess. Villa (if promoted) are gonna give the EFL the middle finger, but surely the EFL would need to request the Prem to apply similar treatment. If not....then the more likely scenario is that FFP is scrapped!