Keep Bradley At Ashton Gate

[cheese]

I read what you said, but it's not relevant.

my point is why take a player to away game half way across the country, who's not going to be involved in the slightest and according to some, only likely to be a negative influence in the dressing room due to his allegend desperation to leave.

Why take him? Cos we're paying his bluddy wages that's why.

[kingswood red]

Why take him? Cos we're paying his bluddy wages that's why.

So, by the same token, bluddy play him then!

[cheese]

So, by the same token, bluddy play him then!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. For the reasons I've already outlined.

[kingswood red]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. For the reasons I've already outlined.

If Michael Owen declines the contract, that was offered to him yesterday, and declares he wants to leave, do you really think Joe Kinnear will do to him, what GJ is doing to BO?.

It's laughable to even contemplate it .

[cheese]

If Michael Owen declines the contract, that was offered to him yesterday, and declares he wants to leave, do you really think Joe Kinnear will do to him, what GJ is doing to BO?.

It's laughable to even contemplate it .

Hmm, that's Michael Owen, thye guy that scores for fun, who had been there done that and has the t-shirt? Or Bradley Orr who's err, done nuffin. And anyway, what's Kinnear ever won? One promotion with Luton?

[Rob k]

If Michael Owen declines the contract, that was offered to him yesterday, and declares he wants to leave, do you really think Joe Kinnear will do to him, what GJ is doing to BO?.

It's laughable to even contemplate it .

Theres a massive difference in that BO is not as important to City as Michael Owen is to Newcastle, and actually if GJ was the manager of Newcastle it would not surprise me one bit if GJ froze Michal Owen out as thats how he manages.

[easton boy]

GJ reitterated his position in evil post yesterday i.e. No Chance of him playing again.

http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/sport/Johns...il/article.html

Personally, I would take him on all away trips just for the buggeration factor. We're still paying his wages 3-5k a week, so, being an awkward sod I wouldn't let him sit on his arse at home playing PS3 or Xbox, I'd take him half way across the country.

[Robbored]

If Michael Owen declines the contract, that was offered to him yesterday, and declares he wants to leave, do you really think Joe Kinnear will do to him, what GJ is doing to BO?.

It's laughable to even contemplate it .

Your'e missing the point. Read what Johnson said regarding the Orr situation. You may not agree with his stance but there's not much you can do about it. Accept it and move on.

Its clear that Orr will not play for City again unless extreme circumstances occur - like a flu' bug that lays half the squad low.

Btw, if Owen doesn't sign a new deal at Newcastle then he'll be gone in the window so Kinnear won't be faced with the same situation as Johnson and Orr.

[MenBehavingBadly]

Bored with this now.

[easton boy]

Your'e missing the point. Read what Johnson said regarding the Orr situation. You may not agree with his stance but there's not much you can do about it. Accept it and move on.

Its clear that Orr will not play for City again unless extreme circumstances occur - like a flu' bug that lays half the squad low.

Btw, if Owen doesn't sign a new deal at Newcastle then he'll be gone in the window so Kinnear won't be faced with the same situation as Johnson and Orr.

Kinnear said yesterday that if Owen does not sign a new contract then he still won't be sold in January. £5m vs Prem League survival - better to let him go on a Bosnian.

[Mr Mosquito]

This is a baseless accusation - but i'd assume that he's already been guarenteed more money by his next employers. If he's genuinely taking the chance that he may end up with less he and his agent are stupid.

Agents aren't stupid, it'll be the agent that'll gain from this sad situation with Bradley Orr and Bristol City FC being the eventual financial losers. I've never seen anything less than total commitment from Bradley Orr while he's been wearing a BCFC shirt.

[Rob k]

Agents aren't stupid, it'll be the agent that'll gain from this sad situation with Bradley Orr and Bristol City FC being the eventual financial losers. I've never seen anything less than total commitment from Bradley Orr while he's been wearing a BCFC shirt.

don't say that anywhere near Richard "I'm worth more than that contract because my agent told me so and now i cant get in the 1st team at carlilse" Keogh

[Mr Mosquito]

don't say that anywhere near Richard "I'm worth more than that contract because my agent told me so and now i cant get in the 1st team at carlilse" Keogh

A fine example Sir, I regard football agents as con-artists. Richard Keogh was a good lad and seemed a happy chap while here so I'm surprised that the low life agent managed to talk him into leaving us.

[bully]

From what ive seen so far THIS season, as in the season that counts, i bet he would not even make the top 10 of championship right backs.

You're right it is this season that counts and I can't argue with your assessment - how many of our players in ANY position would be in the top 10 though?

City has again handled a situation in an amateurish manner - is that down to Sexstone? - with 12 months to go the contract should have been put to Bradley Orr with a time limit - and he signed, or was shipped out in the summer with a very good reputation, and matching transfer price.What we have now, is someone who is still the best of a moderate bunch at RB, costing us money but not being played by a man who wants to show he's in charge all the time regardless of his options and what that may mean to City.

[bully]

[cheese]

by a man who wants to show he's in charge ...

Well, he is. Would you prefer he lets the playes decide?

[cheese]

I don't care if Bradley Orr goes or not, but we are not flush with options in that position at present, and when GJ says he won't play again, then I believe him, even if it means he will weaken the side by moving people out of position, or bring in untried youngsters.

GJ makes a policy decision - what's more important - the policy or the player? And if players (and the club) are able to ride roughshod over a managers stated policy decision where does that leave the authority of the manager? And if the authority of the manager is undermined you surely must agree that that is more damaging to the club than by sticking to the policy?

[Pederho ll]

GJ makes a policy decision - what's more important - the policy or the player? And if players (and the club) are able to ride roughshod over a managers stated policy decision where does that leave the authority of the manager? And if the authority of the manager is undermined you surely must agree that that is more damaging to the club than by sticking to the policy?

But what if sticking by policy means you get relegated?

[William Stand]

But what if sticking by policy means you get relegated?

You can argue it both ways. However Orr has been nowhere near his best form this season & I'm not sure we're doing any worse now than we were when he was in the side.

Comparing it to the Michael Owen situation is wrong..... a striker that pretty much guarantees you goals at prem level is like gold dust..... a very good right back (which an on form Orr is), isn't.

[cheese]

But what if sticking by policy means you get relegated?

But what if undermining the manager gets you relegated? Added to which the players then get it into their heads that they hold the power - and that could set you back years.

[bully]

GJ makes a policy decision - what's more important - the policy or the player? And if players (and the club) are able to ride roughshod over a managers stated policy decision where does that leave the authority of the manager? And if the authority of the manager is undermined you surely must agree that that is more damaging to the club than by sticking to the policy?

Whats MOST important is the result - I suspect to GJ its not in this instance which is wrong in my view.

Orr has not ridden roughshod over a managers stated policy decision, he has simply said he won't sign up to the new contract offered and will part company at contract end if not sooner. He is however, fit , arguably still the best RB in the club, and most tellingly, costing the club money for doing nothing at present.

We will see if GJ is a man of his word and keeps Orr in the cold regardless of results or options available to him - don't be surprised to see midfielders put into the RB slot which will weaken a team which has started to be competitive in that area of the park.

[bully]

Well, he is. Would you prefer he lets the playes decide?

My full response was edited and I have been warned as to my future conduct - you must have some friends cheese although not on Ziderheads as I recall.

To provide a more polite response, please do not take half of a sentence out of context to make a point - all you do (with your reputation) is encourage people to read the post you are quoting from, to see what you have done.

[bh_red]

The thing is for me, I can perfectly understand the reasoning for not playing Orr, however there has to be limits and a time when you say....ok we need him.

It's fair enough when you have a decent alternative in Brian Wilson who is a player who is capable of playing right back as an alternative to Orr.

Fair Enough. However there has to be a time for the sake of results where if Wilson is going to miss a game like Saturday, then a player such as Orr will come into the team. If there is another right back. Fine play him.

But I find it stubborn and silly to move players out of positions in which they are playing well and are important to the team to fill in for a position that can easily be filled, such as what happened to Skuse and Elliott on Saturday.

I can see Gary's point in that Orr doens't see his long term future here so why play him, however it needs to remembered that by him not playing now, It's only lessen the transfer fee we will get for him in Jan, if he goes.

For me, Orr should simply have been told, fine, you don't want to stay, but your no longer going to be a first team regular, however in event of injuries/suspensions you'll play if you have shown the right attitude in training.

Orr is going to be trying his best to get the best club he can in Jan and is playing for his long term future, despite the fact it's elsewhere. not giving 110% in a game for City, is only going to weaken his own personal position in getting a decent club.

Surely that's to the benefit of the team and the club that if others are injured/banned.......he plays.

[kingswood red]

You can argue it both ways. However Orr has been nowhere near his best form this season & I'm not sure we're doing any worse now than we were when he was in the side.

Comparing it to the Michael Owen situation is wrong..... a striker that pretty much guarantees you goals at prem level is like gold dust..... a very good right back (which an on form Orr is), isn't.

So the further down the pecking order of talent you are, allows a club treat you differently?. That's sure to breed team unity!.

There could be a few more in Orrs position sooner rather than later, because Orr is a better player than some others who will play on Sat.

[cheese]

Whats MOST important is the result - I suspect to GJ its not in this instance which is wrong in my view.

Orr has not ridden roughshod over a managers stated policy decision, he has simply said he won't sign up to the new contract offered and will part company at contract end if not sooner. He is however, fit , arguably still the best RB in the club, and most tellingly, costing the club money for doing nothing at present.

We will see if GJ is a man of his word and keeps Orr in the cold regardless of results or options available to him - don't be surprised to see midfielders put into the RB slot which will weaken a team which has started to be competitive in that area of the park.

That's fine if you think GJ is wrong - clearly you wouldn't have made the same policy decision (I'd be interested to know whether you agreed with him on Keogh). But, having made the decision that players refusing to sign new contracts will not play, I don't think there's any sense in making an exception unless there are exceptional circumstances (ie only 11 fit players or somesuch). It can only disrupt another part of the team.

[bully]

That's fine if you think GJ is wrong - clearly you wouldn't have made the same policy decision (I'd be interested to know whether you agreed with him on Keogh). But, having made the decision that players refusing to sign new contracts will not play, I don't think there's any sense in making an exception unless there are exceptional circumstances (ie only 11 fit players or somesuch). It can only disrupt another part of the team.

I think the club should play its best players when fit - the results are what count.

If Orr was simply not picked because others were playing better then that's fine - we can all agree/disagree on who is better than who, but to say he won't play no matter what is simply not in the best interests of the club .

My concern is that the disruption to other parts of the team you refer to Cheese, will occur if and when GJ moves Marvin out of midfield to cover in at RB.

[Geoff65]

Orr certainly didnt deserve his place in the team when he was dropped - we had Wilson playing left back for a few weeks, had Fontaine been available to replace McAllister then Wilson would have got on the team ahead of Orr on the fact that he would have played better at right back than Orr - who was having his worse run of games for a while, how many times did you groan each time the ball was passed to him on the right hand side knowing that he would either shoot and send the ball over the bar, cross leading to a goal kick, not getting past the first defender etc... He was lucky to be in the side in the first place and everyone calling him the best right back we had may have had a point last year but this season he was bloody awful.

Orr needs replacing and doesnt deserde to be in the team on form when he was dropped and doesnt deserve to be in the team due to his choice of not wanting to play for the team in the future.

Take the blinkers off and look at his performances this season, what a relief we havent got to put up with him for another two years...

Good in the past but the past is the past. Without a game for ages you could argue that he isnt match fit either.

Finally if we want to improve as a whole then we need to improve the right back position which also means that Wilson is probably going to have to go too or continue as a squad player as he isnt the answer too.

[Roger Red Hat]

Orr certainly didnt deserve his place in the team when he was dropped - we had Wilson playing left back for a few weeks, had Fontaine been available to replace McAllister then Wilson would have got on the team ahead of Orr on the fact that he would have played better at right back than Orr - who was having his worse run of games for a while, how many times did you groan each time the ball was passed to him on the right hand side knowing that he would either shoot and send the ball over the bar, cross leading to a goal kick, not getting past the first defender etc... He was lucky to be in the side in the first place and everyone calling him the best right back we had may have had a point last year but this season he was bloody awful.

Orr needs replacing and doesnt deserde to be in the team on form when he was dropped and doesnt deserve to be in the team due to his choice of not wanting to play for the team in the future.

Take the blinkers off and look at his performances this season, what a relief we havent got to put up with him for another two years...

Good in the past but the past is the past. Without a game for ages you could argue that he isnt match fit either.

Finally if we want to improve as a whole then we need to improve the right back position which also means that Wilson is probably going to have to go too or continue as a squad player as he isnt the answer too.

Very good summary of the situation there, Geoff.

[Guest RobbieTurner]

Seconded!. Until we get an adequate replacement, he plays.

Quite clearly he doesn't.

No commitment to BCFC = No commitment in return = Exit door.

Sometimes there is a principle involved. Pay him extra and give in - what happens then when the next player comes back with higher wage demands - we give in again ?

Cant work like that mate.

[bully]

Orr certainly didnt deserve his place in the team when he was dropped - we had Wilson playing left back for a few weeks, had Fontaine been available to replace McAllister then Wilson would have got on the team ahead of Orr on the fact that he would have played better at right back than Orr - who was having his worse run of games for a while, how many times did you groan each time the ball was passed to him on the right hand side knowing that he would either shoot and send the ball over the bar, cross leading to a goal kick, not getting past the first defender etc... He was lucky to be in the side in the first place and everyone calling him the best right back we had may have had a point last year but this season he was bloody awful.

Orr needs replacing and doesnt deserde to be in the team on form when he was dropped and doesnt deserve to be in the team due to his choice of not wanting to play for the team in the future.

Take the blinkers off and look at his performances this season, what a relief we havent got to put up with him for another two years...

Good in the past but the past is the past. Without a game for ages you could argue that he isnt match fit either.

Finally if we want to improve as a whole then we need to improve the right back position which also means that Wilson is probably going to have to go too or continue as a squad player as he isnt the answer too.

I can't argue with any of your points - mine is simply that if we have him, we should play him if he's the best available option.

If there's full backs available who are playing better then no problem - moving someone from midfield to make a point is a problem I think if the team overall suffers.

Hope it won't arise.