mozo Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Let's get this straight: I don't particularly rate Ivan as a Championship player. I certainly wouldn't promote him from the subs bench at this given time. BUT the way fans talk about him is nothing short of ridiculous. There is a nasty side to football supporters that no doubt made Lee Johnson - an honest footballer, and apparently very nice man - very miserable. Is Ivan Sproule the next to be booed I wonder? So, let's get Ivan's faults out of the way right now: yes he's frustrating because his final ball is lacking. He doesn't have the sense a lot of the time to keep a level head when his legs are bombing him down the wing. Defensively, he can't tackle (but his pace has often saved us when defending counter-attacks). But to his credit, his pace terrifies defenders. And he beats players. Against QPR, at one point, he bombed down the wing to the by-line as he does, then cut in, beat two players and drilled a low ball across a busy six-yard box, which I think Maynard couldn't connect with. This didn't get mentioned when everyone was slagging him off after the game. But best of all, Ivan is passionate when he plays for City. I love it when he wins a corner late on in tight games and raises his fist to the roaring Atyeo. So I saw Robbored on another thread comment on another poster's labelling Sproule as a 'sham' of a player, and it struck me that Ivan gets a raw deal. He might not be what we want him to be, but you can't criticise his commitment to the cause, and perhaps he derserves more respect than he gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 The guy just isn't good enough. Doesn't mean I don't support him when he plays- he is most useful off the bench with 10 mins to go but even then doesn't make the most of his limited ability. I think people are just very frustrated as he is our only winger yet he isn't very good. He certainly hasn't been booed or been made a scapegoat from what I've seen and nor do I expect him to become one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Boy Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 You answered your point in the thread title! Yes he will probably be the scapegoat for this season, probably doesn't deserve it but unfortunately thats the way things are going at the moment. To be fair he is more frustrating than poor on the basis you sense he could be very very good but has never quite realised his potential! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fka dagest Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I agree. He's far from perfect. However, I don't see the need for anyone to get on his back. I've never been given cause to question his commitment as long as he's giving it his best, that's as much as anyone can ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurrayLives Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Great post. Couldn't agree more, while Ivan is in the squad he gets my full backing and support. He's not first XI material for me but a good squad player. Constantly slating the guy won't improve performances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tunley Legend Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Spot on Mozo. Some of our support are never happy unless there is a fall guy to run down. Sproule, as you say, is full of effort and lacking a bit in ability. That seemed to be the trademark Gary Johnson player up until recently where we have now started adding quality to the squad. In other words Sproule didn't sign himself - GJ signed him. I am sure that Dean Gerken was being lined up as the fall guy but, luckily for him, his solid and impressive performances to date have rammed the criticisms back down the throats of the fall guy merchants before they could even get them out!! Therefore these supporters need someone else to pick on and Ivan Sproule is the easy target at present. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leobcfc1 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Let's get this straight: I don't particularly rate Ivan as a Championship player. I certainly wouldn't promote him from the subs bench at this given time. BUT the way fans talk about him is nothing short of ridiculous. There is a nasty side to football supporters that no doubt made Lee Johnson - an honest footballer, and apparently very nice man - very miserable. Is Ivan Sproule the next to be booed I wonder? So, let's get Ivan's faults out of the way right now: yes he's frustrating because his final ball is lacking. He doesn't have the sense a lot of the time to keep a level head when his legs are bombing him down the wing. Defensively, he can't tackle (but his pace has often saved us when defending counter-attacks). But to his credit, his pace terrifies defenders. And he beats players. Against QPR, at one point, he bombed down the wing to the by-line as he does, then cut in, beat two players and drilled a low ball across a busy six-yard box, which I think Maynard couldn't connect with. This didn't get mentioned when everyone was slagging him off after the game. But best of all, Ivan is passionate when he plays for City. I love it when he wins a corner late on in tight games and raises his fist to the roaring Atyeo. So I saw Robbored on another thread comment on another poster's labelling Sproule as a 'sham' of a player, and it struck me that Ivan gets a raw deal. He might not be what we want him to be, but you can't criticise his commitment to the cause, and perhaps he derserves more respect than he gets. I think Ivan Sproule's the most frustrating footballer I've ever seen play. The simple things that most footballers can do without thinking about it requires Ivan to think twice as hard for himself. He doesn't have a footballing brain, when he goes past players he looks lost and sometimes just runs the ball out of play only because he isn't a natural footballer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tunley Legend Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I think Ivan Sproule's the most frustrating footballer I've ever seen play. The simple things that most footballers can do without thinking about requires Ivan to think twice as hard for himself. He doesn't have a footballing brain, when he goes past players he looks lost and sometimes just runs the ball out of play. And yet for all these basic faults, Gary Johnson signed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leobcfc1 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 And yet for all these basic faults, Gary Johnson signed him. I think he's one of the worst players to wear the shirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tunley Legend Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I think he's one of the worst players to wear the shirt. What you are basically saying is that Gary Johnson is a terrible judge of a player then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinman-is-god Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Whilst Sproule wears a Bristol City shirt he will receive my full support. But in terms of analysing the player, he's truely shite. As a winger, he can't shoot, cross or pass accuaretly. His pace is terrifying but rarely results in a clear cut chance or goal, and his lack of intelligence in not making any decent runs is frustrating too. Worth having on the bench to run the clock down and tire out defenders, but past that he's pretty useless IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Sproule is very one-dimensional with not much else to his game than pure pace. He doesn't fill many with anticipation when he gets the ball like previous wingers Walsh, Smith, Gavin and Murray used to because experience has shown us fans that he rarely produces an end product. That said he tries hard, gives everything and has a passionate attitude. Just watch his reactions when a decision goes against him. The only time a players deserves the level of stick that Sproule gets is when they don't put in the effort and thats not something that can be said about Sproule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leobcfc1 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 What you are basically saying is that Gary Johnson is a terrible judge of a player then. I haven't said that at all. I'm saying that Gary Johnson has made one bad signing since we've been in the Championship and that's Ivan Sproule. Every manager in the world will make a few bad signings and Gary's no exception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zookeeper Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I think he's one of the worst players to wear the shirt. Obviously your new to city. We've had lots of worse players. He's just our modern day Junior Bent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 So, let's get Ivan's faults out of the way right now: yes he's frustrating because his final ball is lacking. He doesn't have the sense a lot of the time to keep a level head when his legs are bombing him down the wing. Defensively, he can't tackle (but his pace has often saved us when defending counter-attacks). What you're saying is Ivan is not Championship standard. But best of all, Ivan is passionate when he plays for City. I love it when he wins a corner late on in tight games and raises his fist to the roaring Atyeo. Sproule won't get booed, however as you say his predictable lack of a final ball is increasingly frustrating - he's been doing it for more than 2 years now and there's never been any sign that coaching would, or could, improve him. Naturally there will be groans from the crowd - he's a very limited player at this level but it's unlikely he'll be on the pitch long enough at any one time for collective crowd sighs of disappointment to turn into boos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leobcfc1 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Obviously your new to city. We've had lots of worse players. He's just our modern day Junior Bent. My first game was in 96 when we lost 6-1 in a friendly match against Wolves. I don't know about Junior Bent but from what I've seen from Ivan Sproule I think that any player that has pace can do what he does with the ball at his feet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I haven't said that at all. I'm saying that Gary Johnson has made one bad signing since we've been in the Championship and that's Ivan Sproule. Every manager in the world will make a few bad signings and Gary's no exception. You could add Trundle to the list. 7 goals in two seasons for a million quid says it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leobcfc1 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 You could add Trundle to the list. 7 goals in two seasons for a million quid says it all. The reason I didn't include Trundle is because he arguably scored the most important goal for us that season against Crystal Palace. That goal was worth a lot of his transfer fee alone and it set us up for one of the biggest games in our history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 You could add Trundle to the list. 7 goals in two seasons for a million quid says it all. Bad signing or badly used? That debate will certainly go on. Styvar though there can be no debate about at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK47 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Obviously your new to city. We've had lots of worse players. He's just our modern day Junior Bent. Junior was great always played with a smile, now Gus Ceaser was truly bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Red Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 I think he's one of the worst players to wear the shirt. What a ridiculous comment! You obviously didnt see the goal he scored against Southampton in 2007, IMO that was one of the best runs and finishes i have seen at AG for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leobcfc1 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 What a ridicolous comment! You obviously didnt see the goal he scored against Southampton in 2007, IMO that was one of the best runs and finishes i have seen at AG for a long time. I did see it and to be honest it was only his pace and the fact the crowd urged him on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinman-is-god Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 What a ridiculous comment! You obviously didnt see the goal he scored against Southampton in 2007, IMO that was one of the best runs and finishes i have seen at AG for a long time. The fact that he scored that one goal doesn't mean a lot when in his other 40 games that season he produced almost nothing in assists or goals. One great goal (which it was) doesn't hide the fact that he is arguably the worst first teamer we have. Didn't Danny Cadamateri score a screamer against Liverpool in the Prem for Everton? Doesn't change the fact that my nan is better at football than him, it was a one-off, random event which only means something if it is done to a consistent level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Bad signing or badly used? That debate will certainly go on. Styvar though there can be no debate about at all. Johnson must have known what type of player Trundle was. You dont spend a million on a player if you haven't done your homework. Johnson got it wrong when he thought he could change Trundle's game thats all. As for Styvar. He played his first two games aginst PL Pompey then got injured/ill. Imo Styvar never really had chance to show what he could do. Players need a run of games and Styvar never got that opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4eveREDDy Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Bad signing or badly used? That debate will certainly go on. Styvar though there can be no debate about at all. Yes but he was a different sort of striker, a predator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Obi Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Sproule is an impact player for me, not a regular starter. His pace can change a game late on in a game. If he was playing against us i would actually be quite a bit worried about him. Decent squad player that does not deserve the crap he gets from some on here imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leobcfc1 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 The fact that he scored that one goal doesn't mean a lot when in his other 40 games that season he produced almost nothing in assists or goals. One great goal (which it was) doesn't hide the fact that he is arguably the worst first teamer we have. Didn't Danny Cadamateri score a screamer against Liverpool in the Prem for Everton? Doesn't change the fact that my nan is better at football than him, it was a one-off, random event which only means something if it is done to a consistent level. I get the feeling from one of Gary's recent interviews that he's only kept Sproule on as a reward for being part of the squad that did so well last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolman_Stand Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Every club in country will have one or two players which the fans criticise we will never be any different, Sproule and Lee Johnson happen to be ours. I actually think LJ is an overall better player than Ivan however neither should be first team regulars and to be honest Sproule should never have been offered a new contract. As we naturally progress I would imagine these two will be moved on with more able replacements brought in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zookeeper Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 Junior was great always played with a smile, now Gus Ceaser was truly bad Junior had pace and was exciting to watch but some of the misses were truly awful. I did see it and to be honest it was only his pace and the fact the crowd urged him on. There aren't that many players who have his pace and players with that pace and know what to do with it play in the Champions league! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leobcfc1 Posted September 5, 2009 Report Share Posted September 5, 2009 What a ridiculous comment! I'd expect at least five goals from a good winger at this level, Ivan managed just two goals which for me is simply not good enough. He wouldn't be so bad if he contributed a few assists to the cause but he couldn't achieve that so for me he's fairly useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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