Kalifa Cisse [merged]

[Red_Mat]

do not know a thing about this guy, and who cares what reading fans say about him? its what he does from now on that matters. trust Coppell and judge Cisse when he plays.

I think there may be an element of bitterness from some Reading fans; my friend is a Reading fan and his response was: "Good player. Great signing." I think they may regard him much as we did Marvin. Brilliant, and a fans' favourite to start, although has gone off the boil of late.

[Nugget]

I think this will prove to be a very wise signing by Mr. Coppell.

Agreed

[bristolcitysweden]

What people might be questioning is the need for another defensive central midfielder. Box to box players or not - they are hardly the exciting playmakers running the park.

What you need is 6-7 good footballers. Playing two donkeys in central midfield is not a good start. Neither will it fill the new stadium.

[Riaz]

Easy enough to find out - go back through your posting history.

Im off out now, no need to reply.

ooooooo look at the keyboard warrior

[Ryan_BCFC]

Welcome to the gate Cisse

not a bad signing, lets see what he can done !

[internetjef]

Wahey good to have new face on board.

Sounds like hes a bit of a legendary guy aswell from McDermotts write up.

Hopefully Coppel fancies him as a commanding centreback!

[chinapig]

What people might be questioning is the need for another defensive central midfielder. Box to box players or not - they are hardly the exciting playmakers running the park.

What you need is 6-7 seven good footballers. Playing two donkeys in central midfield is not a good start. Neither will it fill the new stadium.

Oh dear, not watched the World Cup then? When on earth are we going to catch up when fans are living as deep in the past as everybody else? Scandinavian football is of course based on old fashioned English "virtues" too! Try this:

http://www.guardian....ing-midfielders

[bristolcitysweden]

Oh dear, not watched the World Cup then? When on earth are we going to catch up when fans are living as deep in the past as everybody else? Scandinavian football is of course based on old fashioned English "virtues" too! Try this:

http://www.guardian....ing-midfielders

Call it whatever you like. In the end quality wins three times out of four.

[stroudy]

Welcome

[chinapig]

Call it whatever you like. In the end quality wins three times out of four.

So Spain, Germany and Holland have all got it wrong tactically? All play 2 deep midfield players and have np playmaker of the kind you mention. Xavi, Sneijder and Ozel all play just behind the striker(s). Not a Hollywood pass in sight, all about possession. Can't say it's exciting always but it sure seems to work. Even the old romantic Maradona got rid of Argentina's last playmaker Riquelme. In the meantime the English game has not moved on since Hungary thrashed us in 1953. All headless chicken wingers who can't cross and midfield players on £100k a week who give the ball away with monotonous regularity. Still we've got the World Cup Final referee.

[James]

Welcome aboard Kalifa, rest assured the second you pull that Jersey on you will have the successful side of Bristol firmly behind you!

[bristolcitysweden]

So Spain, Germany and Holland have all got it wrong tactically? All play 2 deep midfield players and have np playmaker of the kind you mention. Xavi, Sneijder and Ozel all play just behind the striker(s). Not a Hollywood pass in sight, all about possession. Can't say it's exciting always but it sure seems to work. Even the old romantic Maradona got rid of Argentina's last playmaker Riquelme. In the meantime the English game has not moved on since Hungary thrashed us in 1953. All headless chicken wingers who can't cross and midfield players on £100k a week who give the ball away with monotonous regularity. Still we've got the World Cup Final referee.

Are we talking about a City 4-4-2 or 3-5-1 formation?

[chinapig]

Are we talking about a City 4-4-2 or 3-5-1 formation?

I've no idea what Steve will choose; I suspect whatever suits the players he has best. I'm encouraged by him telling players not to think of themselves playing in a fixed position certainly. But none of the top World Cup sides plays anything like 3-5-1. Indeed nobody plays three at the back any more. Brazil used it for a while but Dunga reverted to a four but with the two deep midfield players the full backs had licence to attack. England are all the evidence I need of the flaws of 4-4-2, though I'm not sure Steve was ever that rigid at Reading. Baffling though that England's two "sophisticated" foreign coaches couldn't see beyond 4-4-2 and paid the price. Perhaps they felt English players couldn't cope with anything else without the foreign players that surround them in their club sides?

[bristolcitysweden]

I've no idea what Steve will choose; I suspect whatever suits the players he has best. I'm encouraged by him telling players not to think of themselves playing in a fixed position certainly. But none of the top World Cup sides plays anything like 3-5-1. Indeed nobody plays three at the back any more. Brazil used it for a while but Dunga reverted to a four but with the two deep midfield players the full backs had licence to attack. England are all the evidence I need of the flaws of 4-4-2, though I'm not sure Steve was ever that rigid at Reading. Baffling though that England's two "sophisticated" foreign coaches couldn't see beyond 4-4-2 and paid the price. Perhaps they felt English players couldn't cope with anything else without the foreign players that surround them in their club sides?

Sorry, should be 4-5-1.

With three central midfielders I guess two can be "donkeys" but if they are just two in central midfield both can't be.

[Fatalist]

What people might be questioning is the need for another defensive central midfielder. Box to box players or not - they are hardly the exciting playmakers running the park.

What you need is 6-7 good footballers. Playing two donkeys in central midfield is not a good start. Neither will it fill the new stadium.

[Defensive midfielder? Can play centre half or even full back? Sounds like an African Cole Skuse.]

[chinapig]

Sorry, should be 4-5-1.

With three central midfielders I guess two can be "donkeys" but if they are just two in central midfield both can't be.

Again, the teams concerned don't play 4-5-1 either. I'm not sure they can be tied down that precisely but most have two deep midfield players, two attacking ones, though one may play further forward or wider than the other (viz. Iniesta and Xavi or Ozil and Muller). They may have one or two "strikers" but again one may not be orthodox (viz. Villa and Podolski playing from the left or Forlan playing deeper). This rather fits in with Sacchi's view that even the days of the out and out striker are numbered. Barely an orthodox winger can be found. Even Robben plays on the right so he can cut in onto his stronger foot. Now I don't expect such tactical sophistication from Championship players (indeed I don't expect it from England players!) but in general football is becoming much more flexible and it seems Steve expects flexibility from his players. If you have that precise formations are not such an issue. I very much look forward to seeing what Steve does but one thing is for sure, he is one of the more intelligent English Managers.I can see Nicky Maynard for instance learning a lot from him and really developing his game to the next level. Imagine him doing what Villa or Forlan do for instance; actually come to think of it his goal against Newcastle was very Villa-like and many of his long range goals have a touch of the Forlan about them.

All opinion of course, though I hope reasonably well informed I am no coach! Thanks for an interesting discussion though.

[chinapig]

What people might be questioning is the need for another defensive central midfielder. Box to box players or not - they are hardly the exciting playmakers running the park.

What you need is 6-7 good footballers. Playing two donkeys in central midfield is not a good start. Neither will it fill the new stadium.

[Defensive midfielder? Can play centre half or even full back? Sounds like an African Cole Skuse.]

I have a sneaking feeling that he might play centre half, given his arrival followed Boom's departure (though the timing doesn't prove anything of course). Big and strong but can use the ball also.

[bristolcitysweden]

Again, the teams concerned don't play 4-5-1 either. I'm not sure they can be tied down that precisely but most have two deep midfield players, two attacking ones, though one may play further forward or wider than the other (viz. Iniesta and Xavi or Ozil and Muller). They may have one or two "strikers" but again one may not be orthodox (viz. Villa and Podolski playing from the left or Forlan playing deeper). This rather fits in with Sacchi's view that even the days of the out and out striker are numbered. Barely an orthodox winger can be found. Even Robben plays on the right so he can cut in onto his stronger foot. Now I don't expect such tactical sophistication from Championship players (indeed I don't expect it from England players!) but in general football is becoming much more flexible and it seems Steve expects flexibility from his players. If you have that precise formations are not such an issue. I very much look forward to seeing what Steve does but one thing is for sure, he is one of the more intelligent English Managers.I can see Nicky Maynard for instance learning a lot from him and really developing his game to the next level. Imagine him doing what Villa or Forlan do for instance; actually come to think of it his goal against Newcastle was very Villa-like and many of his long range goals have a touch of the Forlan about them.

All opinion of course, though I hope reasonably well informed I am no coach! Thanks for an interesting discussion though.

My pleasure.

[arpaul]

If he can play as well as he did at Ashton Gate 2 seasons ago consistantly, we have a good player on board.

We were ran ragged that afternoon, and as I recall Cisse was absolutely everywhere.

Now, I'm not one for reading papers or gossip columns, or the ridiculous rumours that sometimes find their way onto this forum, and I don't even know if they are available, BUT, maybe if Harper and Kitson could follow...............................

[Cisse's Former Neighbour]

Evenin' all. The username is entirely accurate - I can see Kalifa Cisse's 3-storey house from my living room window. Lived next door to Jimmy Kebe and just over the road from Andre Bikey was here within the realms of the RG postcode.

Anyway, I'm a long-term STH at the Madejski. I think I'm reasonably well qualified to speak about the man as well as the player having spoken to him on a number of occasions, as well as having seen every minute of his Reading career. Signed for Reading in 2007 and was viewed by fans as being a direct replacement of Steve Sidwell. His 07/08 Premier League season was patchy at best, making 11 starts and 11 subs. His first start, and indeed his debut, was a baptism of fire against Chelsea where he absolutely dominated his predecessor, so much in fact that Sidwell was subbed at half time. Unfortunately for Cisse, he was sent off later in the game with Reading 2-1 down. From then on it was a struggle in a relegation-bound team. His midfield performances, in my opinion, were somewhat nondescript. Too slow to get the ball under control, overpowered in the air, easily muscled off the ball, suspect passing ability being the main problems, or in other words, pretty much everything needed to be a successful central midfielder. However in early 2008 a defensive shortage meant he was drafted to play there, and to be perfectly honest his performance against Manchester United (resulting in an unfortunate 2-0 defeat) was almost flawless. He continued to play there but unfortunately for him this coincided with a club record run of eight defeats on the spin and from then on only started 2 games (a 3-0 defeat to Newcastle United when he replaced Matejovsky who was sent off the week before against Blackburn), and a 2-0 defeat to Arsenal in a team that was massively altered - much to the bemusement and annoyance of fans who felt it was abject surrender before the match had even started. All of his other appearances from the beginning of March were late sub appearances. He scored once at White Hart Lane in our 6-4 defeat there, nut in short, he couldn't cut the mustard at Premier League level.

I have to say that I expected more from him in 08/09 and whilst it happened in patches it didn't happen consistently, and more importantly it only happened when the players around him were playing well. That could be taken two ways - that he drove the players to reach his heights, or that the other players made it easier for him to shine. He excelled in the period around October to December when the rest of the team was playing out of their skins when we dicked most opposition out of sight, but the competition he had in the form of Brynjar Gunnarsson and Jem Karacan also played extremely well in this period when called upon. His performance at Ashton Gate in particular was arguably his best performance in midfield in a Reading shirt, closely matched by his performance in our 3-1 win at St Andrews. But from that game on both the team and Cisse started to underperform and Cisse isn't the sort of player who can drag a team up by the scruff of it's neck. He started 24 games that season, or in other words almost half of the games, and was sub in 12 others. He scored five goals at Molineux, Ashton Gate, Bramall Lane, St Andrews, and once at home to Coventry, but at the same time he was also unable to nail down a starting space where he was the first name on the sheet.

Last season, well the Rodgers Revolution just didn't suit him. Rodgers masterplan was to install a system and fit players into it, a recipe that was doomed to failure from the start. Rodgers wasn't popular with fans or, as it turns out, players. Cisse fitted into this somewhere, mainly when Rodgers played a 4-4-2 diamond ( a system which requires 4 central midfielders) but the Rodgers passing game didn't suit him at all. Of course, Rodgers also had a massively annoying habit of changing the team and formation with every passing game so not one single player got a consistent run in the team with him in charge until around the end of October when he found a formula which appeared to show signs of working and Cisse wasn't a part of that formation. When he was drafted back into the team we beat a dreadful Sheffield Wednesday 2-0, and then when coming up against teams with more about them lost 4-2 at home to Crystal Palace and drew 1-1 at home to S****horpe United (admittedly a game we should have won by six goals). Rodgers was then sacked, and in came McDermott. He started McDermott's first six games in charge, a period which entailed results at both ends of the emotional spectrum - a 4-1 defeat at Plymouth Argyle and the 2-1 win at Liverpool. He generally did ok, but no better than that. In all honesty I think what McDermott thought of him is proven by the fact that the last two starts, and indeed appearances, he was substituted at half time when we were 2-0 down in both away games at Nottingham Forest and Sheffield United. He didn't make an appearance from the end of January onwards, mainly due to injury but I have no doubt that Cisse wouldn't have played unless we had an injury crisis in the middle.

In short, a honest tryer, he'll put in 100% every game but sadly he lacks any consistent quality to be considered anything more than a mediocre Championship player in my opinion. I'm sad he's leaving because he provided a couple of great moments, but sadly his mediocrity was there in abundance and it is this latter aspect that makes me happy to have him off the wage bill. And if we got the rumoured £500k for him, well quite frankly we're laughing all the way to the bank.

[Red Robin]

Evenin' all. The username is entirely accurate - I can see Kalifa Cisse's 3-storey house from my living room window. Lived next door to Jimmy Kebe and just over the road from Andre Bikey was here within the realms of the RG postcode.

Anyway, I'm a long-term STH at the Madejski. I think I'm reasonably well qualified to speak about the man as well as the player having spoken to him on a number of occasions, as well as having seen every minute of his Reading career. Signed for Reading in 2007 and was viewed by fans as being a direct replacement of Steve Sidwell. His 07/08 Premier League season was patchy at best, making 11 starts and 11 subs. His first start, and indeed his debut, was a baptism of fire against Chelsea where he absolutely dominated his predecessor, so much in fact that Sidwell was subbed at half time. Unfortunately for Cisse, he was sent off later in the game with Reading 2-1 down. From then on it was a struggle in a relegation-bound team. His midfield performances, in my opinion, were somewhat nondescript. Too slow to get the ball under control, overpowered in the air, easily muscled off the ball, suspect passing ability being the main problems, or in other words, pretty much everything needed to be a successful central midfielder. However in early 2008 a defensive shortage meant he was drafted to play there, and to be perfectly honest his performance against Manchester United (resulting in an unfortunate 2-0 defeat) was almost flawless. He continued to play there but unfortunately for him this coincided with a club record run of eight defeats on the spin and from then on only started 2 games (a 3-0 defeat to Newcastle United when he replaced Matejovsky who was sent off the week before against Blackburn), and a 2-0 defeat to Arsenal in a team that was massively altered - much to the bemusement and annoyance of fans who felt it was abject surrender before the match had even started. All of his other appearances from the beginning of March were late sub appearances. He scored once at White Hart Lane in our 6-4 defeat there, nut in short, he couldn't cut the mustard at Premier League level.

I have to say that I expected more from him in 08/09 and whilst it happened in patches it didn't happen consistently, and more importantly it only happened when the players around him were playing well. That could be taken two ways - that he drove the players to reach his heights, or that the other players made it easier for him to shine. He excelled in the period around October to December when the rest of the team was playing out of their skins when we dicked most opposition out of sight, but the competition he had in the form of Brynjar Gunnarsson and Jem Karacan also played extremely well in this period when called upon. His performance at Ashton Gate in particular was arguably his best performance in midfield in a Reading shirt, closely matched by his performance in our 3-1 win at St Andrews. But from that game on both the team and Cisse started to underperform and Cisse isn't the sort of player who can drag a team up by the scruff of it's neck. He started 24 games that season, or in other words almost half of the games, and was sub in 12 others. He scored five goals at Molineux, Ashton Gate, Bramall Lane, St Andrews, and once at home to Coventry, but at the same time he was also unable to nail down a starting space where he was the first name on the sheet.

Last season, well the Rodgers Revolution just didn't suit him. Rodgers masterplan was to install a system and fit players into it, a recipe that was doomed to failure from the start. Rodgers wasn't popular with fans or, as it turns out, players. Cisse fitted into this somewhere, mainly when Rodgers played a 4-4-2 diamond ( a system which requires 4 central midfielders) but the Rodgers passing game didn't suit him at all. Of course, Rodgers also had a massively annoying habit of changing the team and formation with every passing game so not one single player got a consistent run in the team with him in charge until around the end of October when he found a formula which appeared to show signs of working and Cisse wasn't a part of that formation. When he was drafted back into the team we beat a dreadful Sheffield Wednesday 2-0, and then when coming up against teams with more about them lost 4-2 at home to Crystal Palace and drew 1-1 at home to S****horpe United (admittedly a game we should have won by six goals). Rodgers was then sacked, and in came McDermott. He started McDermott's first six games in charge, a period which entailed results at both ends of the emotional spectrum - a 4-1 defeat at Plymouth Argyle and the 2-1 win at Liverpool. He generally did ok, but no better than that. In all honesty I think what McDermott thought of him is proven by the fact that the last two starts, and indeed appearances, he was substituted at half time when we were 2-0 down in both away games at Nottingham Forest and Sheffield United. He didn't make an appearance from the end of January onwards, mainly due to injury but I have no doubt that Cisse wouldn't have played unless we had an injury crisis in the middle.

In short, a honest tryer, he'll put in 100% every game but sadly he lacks any consistent quality to be considered anything more than a mediocre Championship player in my opinion. I'm sad he's leaving because he provided a couple of great moments, but sadly his mediocrity was there in abundance and it is this latter aspect that makes me happy to have him off the wage bill. And if we got the rumoured £500k for him, well quite frankly we're laughing all the way to the bank.

millwall fans did not rate elliott when he joined us, but he proved his worth.

You guys do not rate cisse,what worries me coppell has not bought him to sit on the bench,however is he better than our current midfield players.

either he has him lined up for central defence and a midfield back up.

possibly one of our major midfield players are off.

[arpaul]

Blimey that's "in depth" enough to warrant status of "Curtain twitcher"

But thanks anyway.

But as is always the case, You can't change your past,, but the you CAN shape your future.

[Cisse's Former Neighbour]

Blimey that's "in depth" enough to warrant status of "Curtain twitcher"

But thanks anyway.

But as is always the case, You can't change your past,, but the you CAN shape your future.

I don't dispute that. But having played under Coppell before and rarely excelled, I very much doubt he'll excel under him again

I've no idea what Steve will choose; I suspect whatever suits the players he has best. I'm encouraged by him telling players not to think of themselves playing in a fixed position certainly. But none of the top World Cup sides plays anything like 3-5-1. Indeed nobody plays three at the back any more. Brazil used it for a while but Dunga reverted to a four but with the two deep midfield players the full backs had licence to attack. England are all the evidence I need of the flaws of 4-4-2, though I'm not sure Steve was ever that rigid at Reading. Baffling though that England's two "sophisticated" foreign coaches couldn't see beyond 4-4-2 and paid the price. Perhaps they felt English players couldn't cope with anything else without the foreign players that surround them in their club sides?

Unless Coppell has altered his decades-held principles of playing 4-4-2 with out and out wingers over the last year, you can rest assured that he will play 4-4-2.

[bristolcitysweden]

Evenin' all. The username is entirely accurate - I can see Kalifa Cisse's 3-storey house from my living room window. Lived next door to Jimmy Kebe and just over the road from Andre Bikey was here within the realms of the RG postcode.

Anyway, I'm a long-term STH at the Madejski. I think I'm reasonably well qualified to speak about the man as well as the player having spoken to him on a number of occasions, as well as having seen every minute of his Reading career. Signed for Reading in 2007 and was viewed by fans as being a direct replacement of Steve Sidwell. His 07/08 Premier League season was patchy at best, making 11 starts and 11 subs. His first start, and indeed his debut, was a baptism of fire against Chelsea where he absolutely dominated his predecessor, so much in fact that Sidwell was subbed at half time. Unfortunately for Cisse, he was sent off later in the game with Reading 2-1 down. From then on it was a struggle in a relegation-bound team. His midfield performances, in my opinion, were somewhat nondescript. Too slow to get the ball under control, overpowered in the air, easily muscled off the ball, suspect passing ability being the main problems, or in other words, pretty much everything needed to be a successful central midfielder. However in early 2008 a defensive shortage meant he was drafted to play there, and to be perfectly honest his performance against Manchester United (resulting in an unfortunate 2-0 defeat) was almost flawless. He continued to play there but unfortunately for him this coincided with a club record run of eight defeats on the spin and from then on only started 2 games (a 3-0 defeat to Newcastle United when he replaced Matejovsky who was sent off the week before against Blackburn), and a 2-0 defeat to Arsenal in a team that was massively altered - much to the bemusement and annoyance of fans who felt it was abject surrender before the match had even started. All of his other appearances from the beginning of March were late sub appearances. He scored once at White Hart Lane in our 6-4 defeat there, nut in short, he couldn't cut the mustard at Premier League level.

I have to say that I expected more from him in 08/09 and whilst it happened in patches it didn't happen consistently, and more importantly it only happened when the players around him were playing well. That could be taken two ways - that he drove the players to reach his heights, or that the other players made it easier for him to shine. He excelled in the period around October to December when the rest of the team was playing out of their skins when we dicked most opposition out of sight, but the competition he had in the form of Brynjar Gunnarsson and Jem Karacan also played extremely well in this period when called upon. His performance at Ashton Gate in particular was arguably his best performance in midfield in a Reading shirt, closely matched by his performance in our 3-1 win at St Andrews. But from that game on both the team and Cisse started to underperform and Cisse isn't the sort of player who can drag a team up by the scruff of it's neck. He started 24 games that season, or in other words almost half of the games, and was sub in 12 others. He scored five goals at Molineux, Ashton Gate, Bramall Lane, St Andrews, and once at home to Coventry, but at the same time he was also unable to nail down a starting space where he was the first name on the sheet.

Last season, well the Rodgers Revolution just didn't suit him. Rodgers masterplan was to install a system and fit players into it, a recipe that was doomed to failure from the start. Rodgers wasn't popular with fans or, as it turns out, players. Cisse fitted into this somewhere, mainly when Rodgers played a 4-4-2 diamond ( a system which requires 4 central midfielders) but the Rodgers passing game didn't suit him at all. Of course, Rodgers also had a massively annoying habit of changing the team and formation with every passing game so not one single player got a consistent run in the team with him in charge until around the end of October when he found a formula which appeared to show signs of working and Cisse wasn't a part of that formation. When he was drafted back into the team we beat a dreadful Sheffield Wednesday 2-0, and then when coming up against teams with more about them lost 4-2 at home to Crystal Palace and drew 1-1 at home to S****horpe United (admittedly a game we should have won by six goals). Rodgers was then sacked, and in came McDermott. He started McDermott's first six games in charge, a period which entailed results at both ends of the emotional spectrum - a 4-1 defeat at Plymouth Argyle and the 2-1 win at Liverpool. He generally did ok, but no better than that. In all honesty I think what McDermott thought of him is proven by the fact that the last two starts, and indeed appearances, he was substituted at half time when we were 2-0 down in both away games at Nottingham Forest and Sheffield United. He didn't make an appearance from the end of January onwards, mainly due to injury but I have no doubt that Cisse wouldn't have played unless we had an injury crisis in the middle.

In short, a honest tryer, he'll put in 100% every game but sadly he lacks any consistent quality to be considered anything more than a mediocre Championship player in my opinion. I'm sad he's leaving because he provided a couple of great moments, but sadly his mediocrity was there in abundance and it is this latter aspect that makes me happy to have him off the wage bill. And if we got the rumoured £500k for him, well quite frankly we're laughing all the way to the bank.

Thank's for the assessment.

[Chappers]

Some interesting stuff, I must admit that I have read a few reports suggesting that this may be a risky signing. It could be inspired, or it could be a Trundle, I will reserve judgement on this one. It's not a case of being negative, just realism after watching City for over 30 years.

Fingers crossed!

[Cisse's Former Neighbour]

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xctmth_cisse-s-goal-at-ashton-gate-01-11-2_sport

One of his finest moments...

[dezgimed]

Dont remember him scoring 5 at the Gate, but scoring 5 at Molineux is decent. Goalscorer.

[bristolcitysweden]

Been to Sweden with Reading mate?

[Avalonred]

http://www.dailymoti...e-01-11-2_sport

One of his finest moments...

Shame it's completely unviewable! ( apart from the terrace where I spent many a saturday afternoon and tuesday eve when I were a lad)

[Cisse's Former Neighbour]

Been to Sweden with Reading mate?

Afraid not. I know 7 or 8 who did go on some of the trips, all said it was well worth it.