Dave Lloyd Blogger...

[spudski]

I think a retraction or apology is in order.

Because of one mans careless blogging, our forum has become very emotive, and hostile.

Any other fan reading our forum of late, would be under the impression that Bristol City fans are Racist. We are not...

Every chant sang to opposition fans, in a derogatory nature, pointing out their, race, colour, descent, national or ethnic origin, is legally wrong in this country.

However...songs are sang at Football grounds around the Country, every week, in a derogatory fashion. Be it to the Welsh, the Scotish, Northeners, Cockneys etc,etc,etc. Yet there are never any complaints, because the majority are white.

As soon as an Asian reference is made, all hell breaks loose, because of the colour of their skin.

It's one rule for one and not for the other.

I am not a racist, but i do believe in the law being equal for everyone...and imho, the race card is used way too often nowadays, on behalf of ethnic minority.

The Blogger as far as i know has never pointed out the chants sang to other groups of fans, that may be termed 'racist' by law, so a bit of consistancy is needed.

As a Bristol City fan, I don't want to be tarred with that brush.

[Robbored]

At the risk of perpetuating the 'racist chants' thread, DaveL has nothing to apologise for.

[spudski]

Well he say's the Club are working hard for equality, then i suggest he starts thinking about 'Equality' in his blogs.

When i get two texts from Burnley fans, suggesting i'm a Racist for being a City fan, then you start to think.

People skim through these forums, put two and two together and make five.

Equality in Everything is needed.

[Guest AJ Sylvester]

1. DaveL has nothing to apologise for

2. This post is old ground and these issues have been debated in another thread where people continually claim it's no different to Welsh/Northern/Cockney jibes. However when the differences are pointed out, no-one has been able to reply.

3. A poll on here shows that 36% of people felt "Small Town in Asia" is a racist chant. Using that figure well over 5,000 peole would have been sat there on Saturday thinking it was racist. If 5,000 people at a football ground think they are hearing racist chanting (rightly or wrongly) DaveL has a duty to stand up to it. As I said before, you may get away with such songs/jokes in private but it's way too clumsy for a football stadium where you don't know the reaction of those listening to it. In private jokes and songs can be delivered accurately. In a football stadium it's about as delicate as a drunken eight year old stamping on ants.

4. The 36% figure may be even higher when you put it into the context of the other five songs including "England, England".

5. Why sing a song that offends 36% of your own fans!?! There are plenty of others to choose from and most of those will actually have something to do with backing our club.

[SJC]

When i get two texts from Burnley fans, suggesting i'm a Racist for being a City fan, then you start to think.

People skim through these forums, put two and two together and make five.

Equality in Everything is needed.

Are you not now displaying the oversensitivity that you seem so keen to dispel?

If any of my mates, or simply anyone I vaguely met on a single occasion, chose to text me to say 'you're a racist because you're a Bristol City fan', whatever experience they have had with however many Bristol City fans, I would either not dignify it with a response or laugh in the face of their attempted fishing trip.

White, Black, Asian, Man, Woman, Child, Rich, Poor - A Bristol City fan, indeed a football fan, covers all of those and more. To attempt to pigeon hole someone, suggest they are universally guilty of a crime simply by the football club they support is so laughable it is untrue.

Having not commented on the now locked thread, my opinion is the world has become overly sensitive however it is the duty of educated adults to use their discretion of what is appropriate and what is not.

I certainly wouldnt suggest that anyone who chanted 'small town in Asia' is a 'racist', however I dont feel it is appropriate behaviour and is certainly not something I personally would engage in. I absolutely accept, in most cases, it is banter, just like 'just a small town in Wales etc' - I actually find that rather amusing. However, and whilst I loathe to see the PC brigade grabbing a bone and running with it, I think there are boundries.

Everyone knows that 'small town in Wales' wont offend any or draw complaints, while 'small town in Asia' unneccesarily treds a very fine line between banter and causing offense. Therefore, as I said, I believe it is for the discretion of educated adults to not 'cross the line.' If you dont wish to offend someone or a group of people but think you might - within reason ('Christmas' is 'Christmas' not 'Festive red hatted santa gift man day'), then why invite it.

[Slave to the rhythm]

I think a retraction or apology is in order.

Because of one mans careless blogging, our forum has become very emotive, and hostile.

Any other fan reading our forum of late, would be under the impression that Bristol City fans are Racist. We are not...

Every chant sang to opposition fans, in a derogatory nature, pointing out their, race, colour, descent, national or ethnic origin, is legally wrong in this country.

However...songs are sang at Football grounds around the Country, every week, in a derogatory fashion. Be it to the Welsh, the Scotish, Northeners, Cockneys etc,etc,etc. Yet there are never any complaints, because the majority are white.

As soon as an Asian reference is made, all hell breaks loose, because of the colour of their skin.

It's one rule for one and not for the other.

I am not a racist, but i do believe in the law being equal for everyone...and imho, the race card is used way too often nowadays, on behalf of ethnic minority.

The Blogger as far as i know has never pointed out the chants sang to other groups of fans, that may be termed 'racist' by law, so a bit of consistancy is needed.

As a Bristol City fan, I don't want to be tarred with that brush.

Mate, DaveL has nothing to apologise for, and your entire post reads like one long rant about how it's unfair that you can't sing abusive songs any more! Well, tough titty.

Some of you need to realise that we don't live in the 1970's any more. Eddie Booth's heyday was a long time ago............

Peace and love to all.

[The Gasbuster]

1. DaveL has nothing to apologise for

2. This post is old ground and these issues have been debated in another thread where people continually claim it's no different to Welsh/Northern/Cockney jibes. However when the differences are pointed out, no-one has been able to reply.

3. A poll on here shows that 36% of people felt "Small Town in Asia" is a racist chant. Using that figure well over 5,000 peole would have been sat there on Saturday thinking it was racist. If 5,000 people at a football ground think they are hearing racist chanting (rightly or wrongly) DaveL has a duty to stand up to it. As I said before, you may get away with such songs/jokes in private but it's way too clumsy for a football stadium where you don't know the reaction of those listening to it. In private jokes and songs can be delivered accurately. In a football stadium it's about as delicate as a drunken eight year old stamping on ants.

4. The 36% figure may be even higher when you put it into the context of the other five songs including "England, England".

5. Why sing a song that offends 36% of your own fans!?! There are plenty of others to choose from and most of those will actually have something to do with backing our club.

"England, England" was only sung in response to Leicesters' fans claiming we were from Wales.

[old parkender]

What twaddle,36% were offended.I expect just as many are offended by the Jill dando

Song or smell my fingers or the chants with foul language.as for singing england so what?? I went to an England Pakistan cricket

Match,they were chanting Pakistan throughout despite being english of Asian

Descent,again so what? Nobody was offended and nobody complained.

Spose there's no right on kudos to be gained

Though is there?

[Guest]

Just read the blog.

One paragraph with no detail.

Paying lip service to the 'meeting the Equality Standard'.

For someone who has earned a living in the media I would expect better.

[Randy Marsh]

Awful blog anyway which seems to cause more problems than it's worth in my opinion.

[ian88]

Anybody who uses the phrase "I'm no racist but", is definitely racist.

[Guest AJ Sylvester]

"England, England" was only sung in response to Leicesters' fans claiming we were from Wales.

Hmm...the youtube video someone posted had that chant coming right after "small town in Asia". Sounds linked to that song to me as it then went on to "naan bread" etc.

Even IF you are right (and sadly, I don't think it was sung purely in response to any Welsh songs) it goes to show again how clumsy such chants are and why they aren't suitable to a football stadium.

[spudski]

Anybody who uses the phrase "I'm no racist but", is definitely racist.

Are you calling me a Racist?

[spudski]

double post

[Redcliffe 78]

Hmm...the youtube video someone posted had that chant coming right after "small town in Asia". Sounds linked to that song to me as it then went on to "naan bread" etc.

Even IF you are right (and sadly, I don't think it was sung purely in response to any Welsh songs) it goes to show again how clumsy such chants are and why they aren't suitable to a football stadium.

Can you tell me whats suitable chanting for tomorrow please. I dont want to offend 36% of the ground.

[Guest AJ Sylvester]

Can you tell me whats suitable chanting for tomorrow please. I dont want to offend 36% of the ground.

It's not about offending 36% as such, it's about offending them on such a potentially sensitive issue.

But as you asked:

- Keep The Red Flag Flying High

- Come On You Reds

- I Am A Cider Drinker

- Drink Up Thy Zider

- We Always Believe

- Come on City

- We All Follow the City

- Give me a C, I T, Y

- We Are the City Boys

- West Country la la la

etc etc etc etc etc etc etc

and yes, some songs contain swear words others don't like and the odd one may offend a few people. But not on such a highly sensitive issue

[Redcliffe 78]

It's not about offending 36% as such, it's about offending them on such a potentially sensitive issue.

But as you asked:

- Keep The Red Flag Flying High

- Come On You Reds

- I Am A Cider Drinker

- Drink Up Thy Zider

- We Always Believe

- Come on City

- We All Follow the City

- Give me a C, I T, Y

- We Are the City Boys

- West Country la la la

etc etc etc etc etc etc etc

and yes, some songs contain swear words others don't like and the odd one may offend a few people. But not on such a highly sensitive issue

Cool.

[Donald]

Awful blog anyway which seems to cause more problems than it's worth in my opinion.

yep.

Without doubt, all he has done is highlight something which if not mentioned barely anyone would have noticed or even known about.

Some people should think before they post. davel should think before he blogs.

[screech]

It's not about offending 36% as such, it's about offending them on such a potentially sensitive issue.

But as you asked:

- Keep The Red Flag Flying High and low we don't wish to offend the people with short arms or no arms

- Come On You Reds , don't forget the yellow, the black and the white man, we are all in this together.

- I Am A Cider Drinker and occasional lager, spirit and soft drinker.

- Drink Up Thy Zider see above.

- We Always Believe and sometimes we are let down but we always try to remain positive.

- Come on City town and small villages, lets keep our community spirit shall we.

- We All Follow the City not all of us, but we will tolerate each others differences.

- We Are the City Boys and girls, and a few may be looking at change.

- West Country la la la, RACIST!!!!

and yes, some songs contain swear words others don't like and the odd one may offend a few people. But not on such a highly sensitive issue

[CiderArmyy]

Don't forget our bouncing up and down, some are in wheel chairs.

[Economou]

I think a retraction or apology is in order.

Because of one mans careless blogging, our forum has become very emotive, and hostile.

Any other fan reading our forum of late, would be under the impression that Bristol City fans are Racist. We are not...

Every chant sang to opposition fans, in a derogatory nature, pointing out their, race, colour, descent, national or ethnic origin, is legally wrong in this country.

However...songs are sang at Football grounds around the Country, every week, in a derogatory fashion. Be it to the Welsh, the Scotish, Northeners, Cockneys etc,etc,etc. Yet there are never any complaints, because the majority are white.

As soon as an Asian reference is made, all hell breaks loose, because of the colour of their skin.

It's one rule for one and not for the other.

I am not a racist, but i do believe in the law being equal for everyone...and imho, the race card is used way too often nowadays, on behalf of ethnic minority.

The Blogger as far as i know has never pointed out the chants sang to other groups of fans, that may be termed 'racist' by law, so a bit of consistancy is needed.

As a Bristol City fan, I don't want to be tarred with that brush.

Well in my book racism is intrinsically about discriminating etc against people because of the colour of their skin.

I find it hard to believe you're equating chanting about Northerners/Cockneys with chanting about Asians.

Dave Lloyd is a decent individual and if he felt the chanting warranted a comment fair enough, no retraction req'd.

[kevinmabbuttshair]

[dezgimed]

The point I made that was so conveniently ignored by most, is that by rolling out the clubs charter, I fully expect a blog in future when there are chants about sexism, sexuality, region, and any other prejudice.

Consistency or less drama over nothing please Dave.

[spudski]

Well in my book racism is intrinsically about discriminating etc against people because of the colour of their skin.

I find it hard to believe you're equating chanting about Northerners/Cockneys with chanting about Asians.

Dave Lloyd is a decent individual and if he felt the chanting warranted a comment fair enough, no retraction req'd.

What you think, doesn't come into it. The law of the land, decree both are the same.

I'm not saying what was sung is right, or wrong in my book. I'm pointing out what is law.

Equality is needed.

TBH...the whole thing doesn't bother me. What bothers me, is if someone is going to mention it in a blog, then don't do it when it's just an Asian or coloured issue. Be consistant and equal...Across the board.

[old parkender]

I'm puzzled as to why some people feel the need to be offended on behalf of others,has anybody from Leicester made a complaint?

Has any British/Asian city fans made a complaint?

[spudski]

The point I made that was so conveniently ignored by most, is that by rolling out the clubs charter, I fully expect a blog in future when there are chants about sexism, sexuality, region, and any other prejudice.

Consistency or less drama over nothing please Dave.

Exactly my point.

[Redcliffe 78]

Exactly my point.

It has been the majorities point and alot of the frustration i think is the response of its not the same which most people on here cant get the head around me included.

[TobysDad]

What's the fascination with blogs, Facebook, Twitter et al.

Who really cares what someone else thinks if the best way they can air those thoughts is in one of these modern, cyberspace ways?

I can see that it gets a message to the masses, but is it the best way?

For instance my boss sent one today. Praising a colleague who won some new business from a competitor. By dogging apparently! She's a lesbian. Do lesbians do dogging? Or did his fat fingers hit an O rather than an I.

I think he meant digging.

What a dock......

Anyway the wonders of blogging before thinking.

And do lesbians go dogging? Just an intriguing thought......

[II Wurzel II]

What is football coming too...cant drink, cant smoke, cant stand up and now we cant sing without people moaning.

[City Rocker]

Can't believe this thread.

I don't know the fella Dave Lloyd, but I do know that since he took over as fans' liaison or whatever his job is, there seems to have been a far closer feeling and understanding between the club and the supporters. Being a regular at the Gate for 35 years, I have to say our 'front of house' presentation is a million miles better since he took over as front man.

And while the crossbar challenge thing is indeed a bit shite, remember the depth of dissatisfaction with the previous bloke and his embarrassing, cringeworthy pre-match routine which would frequently have away fans laughing up their sleeves. At least we have football competitions at half time now, as everyone demanded.

Someone in another thread mentioned Sam Mason; well ironically I do know Sam personally (at least in a drinking environment...) and I think even she would agree we don't want to return to that level of amateurism, ever.

I reckon we'd be better off if we didn't drive Dave L away (although no doubt he won't give a **** about this little outburst anyway) and to be fair no apology is required as he made a reasonable comment on some chants which from my perspective were not offensive but were a little embarrassing.