Cambridge Batch Red Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Thing is, what if Bristol Rugby becomes bigger than Bristol City? Sale moved to Stockport and effectively ate Stockport up and spat them out into a non-league nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Great, in my eyes this means if we do get the new stadium it won't end up being our stadium at all, it'll being just as much the rugby teams. Call me selfish but I hate the idea of ground share as it never feels like "home" so to speak, feels tainted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFCfan Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 SL would not pay more than sainsburys are for the land/ground thats for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Colby-Tit Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 I've not read through the whole of this thread so apologies if this has already been mentioned. Is it not possible for SL to purchase the Memorial ground from Rovers to give Bristol thier rightful home back? I know they have an agreement to sell to Sainsbury's but surely Rovers would take a deal if more money was on offer. Not sure how Sainsbury's would feel about it mind. I just had a peek on the Bristol Rugby forum & there is a rumour flying around that he is prepared to better Sainsbury's offer for the Mem in order to keep the rugger buggers there. What's all this "C'mon Bris"? Has to be the most limp-wristed, cringe-inducing, rallying call ever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrs Court Red Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 It was a poor joke on the name. I've no idea what an i-pitch is like Ops I see it now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 The stadium is a separate entitiy as I understand it - the club doesn't "own" it now, it has a 100 year lease to play its football there. I suspect the same will apply for Ashton Vale. Yeah but even so, we're the only team who plays at the club so it feels like "our ground", the second we start sharing it just feels more and more like living with your parents... for the record I am not a fan of that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citynut54 Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 I've got a little concern over finances. I was under the impression that Steve Lansdown wants Bristol City football club to stand in it's own two feet. If we were to share with the Rugby club and seeing as Steve Lansdown owns both City and Bristol, and he owns the stadium, who does the stadium benefits go to? As far as I can see, all the benefits would go to Steve Lansdown, not BCFC and it would be up to him how those finances then get distributed to both clubs. In an ideal World, BCFC would own the stadium (but obviousy as a separate company to avoid administation etc) and then they'd soley earn all the non-match day profits, but with Bristol being on board, can we guarantee this would be the case? As far as I know, SL does not own Ashton Gate. It's owned by Ashton Gate Stadium Ltd which is part of Bristol City Holdings Ltd. This was done a few years back to seperate stadium generated revenue from football generated revenue, so your ideal world already exists Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 I just had a peek on the Bristol Rugby forum & there is a rumour flying around that he is prepared to better Sainsbury's offer for the Mem in order to keep the rugger buggers there. No way would SL be paying in excess of £15 million for the Mem, cheque payable to 'UWE Pirates'. Bristol Rugger will move to Ashton Vale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaverface Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 As far as I know, SL does not own Ashton Gate. It's owned by Ashton Gate Stadium Ltd which is part of Bristol City Holdings Ltd. This was done a few years back to seperate stadium generated revenue from football generated revenue, so your ideal world already exists Yes, but who will own the Stadium when the new one gets built? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citynut54 Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Yes, but who will own the Stadium when the new one gets built? I presume Ashton Gate Stadium Ltd would be replaced by Ashton Vale Stadium Ltd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipdawg Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Yes, but who will own the Stadium when the new one gets built? I think SL has said in the past tht it'll be owned by the club; hence why all stadium debts are covered by 'loans' from him and show up in the clubs financial returns. Then, when the club is selling out a shiny 30000 seat stadium and finishing in the top 10 of the Premier League, SL can have his loans repaid whilst leaving the club on a firm financial footing. In theory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Yes, but who will own the Stadium when the new one gets built? Bristol City Holdings Ltd will own the new ground (BCHL is owed by Lansdown) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaverface Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Bristol City Holdings Ltd will own the new ground (BCHL is owed by Lansdown) My fear is Steve Lansdown (as owner of BCHL) having two interests might be tempted to start splitting the revenue between the two clubs, which in my eyes defeats the whole point of us having a new stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 My fear is Steve Lansdown (as owner of BCHL) having two interests might be tempted to start splitting the revenue between the two clubs, which in my eyes defeats the whole point of us having a new stadium. They would'nt split revenues. Each team would have their own ticket sales etc. Whether BRC becomes a tenant or splits costs of running the stadium - it can only be a good thing, if it did happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaverface Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 They would'nt split revenues. Each team would have their own ticket sales etc. Whether BRC becomes a tenant or splits costs of running the stadium - it can only be a good thing, if it did happen I'm on about non-match day revenue, you know, things like conferences, banqueting, meetings, open days etc... If Bristol Rugby have joint ownership of the running costs, then they'd expect equal profits from non match day events, which negates the reason for leaving Ashton Gate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 I'm on about non-match day revenue, you know, things like conferences, banqueting, meetings, open days etc... If Bristol Rugby have joint ownership of the running costs, then they'd expect equal profits from non match day events, which negates the reason for leaving Ashton Gate. That would only happen if the ground was joint owned. I doubt they would jointly own the ground - though I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaverface Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 That would only happen if the ground was joint owned. I doubt they would jointly own the ground - though I could be wrong. Again, this is my worry. If Steve Lansdown owns both clubs, why wouldn't he share ownership of the ground and thus take revenue away from BCFC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Again, this is my worry. If Steve Lansdown owns both clubs, why wouldn't he share ownership of the ground and thus take revenue away from BCFC? But why would he? what benefit would there be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaverface Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 But why would he? what benefit would there be? To prop (excuse the pun) up Bristol Rugby?! I honestly don't know, all I do know is that as joint owner he can do what he likes with any of the profits he makes, BCFC wouldn't have a say in it. The whole point of BCFC moving to a new stadium would be to benefit 100% from all the non-matchday money that can be made. Having Bristol Rugby on board would be no different to ground sharing with the Rovers - we'd have to split the non-matchday earnings :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 To prop (excuse the pun) up Bristol Rugby?! I honestly don't know, all I do know is that as joint owner he can do what he likes with any of the profits he makes, BCFC wouldn't have a say in it. The whole point of BCFC moving to a new stadium would be to benefit 100% from all the non-matchday money that can be made. Having Bristol Rugby on board would be no different to ground sharing with the Rovers - we'd have to split the non-matchday earnings :-( I seriously doubt it. Theres no point.... as I say, I could be wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 I seriously doubt it. Theres no point.... as I say, I could be wrong so how do you propose he bank roles them, then makes bristol self sufficient? At the end of the day they may not even come to Ashton gate or Ashton vale, but if they do then a certain amount of profit that would have headed to city will have to head to bristol. As Steve owns bristol city holdings, there would be little point in charging bristol rent as he would be paying it himself before they came self sufficient, so city would be making on the face of it little to no profit from bristol playing at the stadium every other week. Very strange, I can't see how you can make it work financially purely from a city perspective, from a joint perspective yes, but the profits for city would drop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 so how do you propose he bank roles them, then makes bristol self sufficient? At the end of the day they may not even come to Ashton gate or Ashton vale, but if they do then a certain amount of profit that would have headed to city will have to head to bristol. As Steve owns bristol city holdings, there would be little point in charging bristol rent as he would be paying it himself before they came self sufficient, so city would be making on the face of it little to no profit from bristol playing at the stadium every other week. Very strange, I can't see how you can make it work financially purely from a city perspective, from a joint perspective yes, but the profits for city would drop. Bristol Rugby will just pay a cheap rent?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 As I understand it, all non-match day profits goes to the stadium company not the football club. The football club gets match day income. If the stadium company goes tits up, it doesn't affect the football club and vice versa. The stadium company and the football club are part of the same group under Bristol City Holdings effectively owned by SL. If Bristol Rugby came to Aston Vale they would be tennents and rent would be paid to Bristol City Holding Company, as would all conferences concerts etc, this would cover the stadium running costs (about 2 million a season at ashton gate) what it would is free up both clubs to spend ticket money, tv money, prize money on players and wages instead of having to pay for the ground as well, In effect Steves rugby club and football club will be paying steves holding company rent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 so how do you propose he bank roles them, then makes bristol self sufficient? At the end of the day they may not even come to Ashton gate or Ashton vale, but if they do then a certain amount of profit that would have headed to city will have to head to bristol. As Steve owns bristol city holdings, there would be little point in charging bristol rent as he would be paying it himself before they came self sufficient, so city would be making on the face of it little to no profit from bristol playing at the stadium every other week. Very strange, I can't see how you can make it work financially purely from a city perspective, from a joint perspective yes, but the profits for city would drop. he bank rolls them with his personal fortune of 750 million the intrest alone is enough to bankroll both clubs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipdawg Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 so how do you propose he bank roles them, then makes bristol self sufficient? At the end of the day they may not even come to Ashton gate or Ashton vale, but if they do then a certain amount of profit that would have headed to city will have to head to bristol. As Steve owns bristol city holdings, there would be little point in charging bristol rent as he would be paying it himself before they came self sufficient, so city would be making on the face of it little to no profit from bristol playing at the stadium every other week. Very strange, I can't see how you can make it work financially purely from a city perspective, from a joint perspective yes, but the profits for city would drop. What he might do is allow Bristol Rugby to play there for free, then City will take a proportion of the gates and the hospitality. Or they could pay us rent and get all the match-day profits. The rugby club and the football club are not on an equal footing as far as finance is concerned, the running costs for City will be far in excess of those of the rugby club. At the end of the day, SL has far more money invested in the success of city than he eer will in the rugby club so he's not going to jeopardise our future for theirs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loderingo Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Hopefully sharing Ashton Vale would work well for both clubs. One benefit might be to encourage them to put together a proper matchday bus network like they have in Reading to the Mad Stad. http://www.readingfc.co.uk/staticFiles/97/89/0,,10306~166295,00.pdf Don't know why they don't do this already - would take more cars off the road and reduce parking problems whilst allowing more people to have a drink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Hopefully sharing Ashton Vale would work well for both clubs. One benefit might be to encourage them to put together a proper matchday bus network like they have in Reading to the Mad Stad. http://www.readingfc...6~166295,00.pdf Don't know why they don't do this already - would take more cars off the road and reduce parking problems whilst allowing more people to have a drink. Thats already part of the plans for ashton vale tbh regualor buses from the centre and train station to the new ground they were/are going to utilise the underused Long Ashton park and ride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheshire_red Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 he bank rolls them with his personal fortune of 750 million the intrest alone is enough to bankroll both clubs Doesn't work like that, SL doesn't have £750m in cash in any bank, that's his net worth give or take £? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blagdon Mike Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Interesting how this discussion has developed - mostly about sharing AV one way or another with the 'egg-pushers.' I wholeheartedly share Steve’s vision for Bristol taking it at face value - building up the City via business and sport. But our overriding interest is of course Bristol City and the apparent spreading of Steve's effort will concern us. Rugby has always rivalled football in Bristol, this has perhaps been one of our problems. In Bath, rugby outstrips football. Things could be different if the sports pulled together at AV. Even then, that would make two clubs dependent on one individual in the immediate future. The danger is there for all to see and, not to make a fine point of it, that's why we set up and need the Supporters Trust (now Club & Trust). Bristol Rugby will feel this more so because they will see themselves as the lesser partner. Even at AV, the strong Exeter Rugby Club would prevent Bristol Rugby looking to the SW in the same way as BCFC. Regarding the colours and badges in a dual purpose AV - can't this be done largely with lights and mirrors (Brighton)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 Whatever happens it really muddys the water when it comes to profit making for both city and bristol. In some respects I think Steve should be looking at a new stadium for bristol as well to make both clubs self sufficient entitities. Of course that will never happen with our council and nimbys. If I was a bristol fan I'm not sure what I would think, clearly wages and money is not on the same scale as football, but if the investment is to be large, and the intention is to grow and hold your own in the prem, then having your own ground and the benefits that come with it have to be a long term ambition. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see bristol playing at city for virtually no rent, then a application to go in to build a 10-15k stadium in their own right somewhere in Bristol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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