Derby Day Insight

[ciderup]

Young Daniel, I hope you can sense irony for your own well being!

[BS3 GAS]

You a bit tired BS3?

[Bar BS3]

You a bit tired BS3?

You do know that Wage bills are now based on turnover...?

[Evander SnowyField]

Cheers N/cookie. Think that is genuinely what the OP was after, not some sarcastic dick head. As this is a city forum, I don't really understand why DDD thinks we would all know so much about your lot. Only thing I would say is, don't expect us to just roll over if your players show a bit of passion, we are slowly but surely getting rid of all the bottlers that have held us back in recent years.

Yes thanks Nailsea, what I was after in the OP, and yes I agree, we will be up for it. Seems to be some sort of envious misjudgment that just because we have dropped down from the championship that we lack passion or pride, can only see that as jealousy of our ability to attract decent players.

[Sargent Pepper]

DDD, as mentioned, we don't know your players so enlghten us. I'm sure someone that actually watches them has told you what they're like.

Tell us about your team.

Your joking aren't you? He only clicked on the link to try & find out more about the Rovers himself. Always to busy on our forum to go you see

[BS3 GAS]

You do know that Wage bills are now based on turnover...?

No i think you'll find a wage bill is what it says in the tin ! the total amount of wages paid out , as in a bill for wages

you are thinking of FFP whereby your wage bill must equate to a % of your turnover

Turnover takes into account money coming in and out which indeed includes wages but a wage bill is in itself its own thing

[ashton_fan]

For all those people saying Rovers have no chance, I agree they shouldn't based on the relative skill levels of the players but anything can happen in one game (injuries, sendings off, penalty decisions etc.). Also, we have an abysmal record against League 2 opposition in cup games in recent seasons:

2010/11 Southend (a) L 2-3

2011/12 Swindon (h) L 1-2

2011/12 Crawley (a) L 1-2

2012/13 Gillingham (h) L 1-2

ie we've lost 4 out of 4, and we were a Championship club when we played those games. Based on this Rovers should be favourites, we just don't play very well when we're the underdogs.

Having said that I still expect us to win, but it shouldn't be assumed the result is a certainty!

[DancinDannyD]

My 2 pennies worth...

Rovers are far froma team of cloggers as suggested ,

Hard working good ball playing centre half in Tom Parkes who will go on to play at a higher level, partners old fashioned more physical centre half in Mark Mccrystal.... a steady centre half partnership. These two formed the backbone of our defence in the latter half of last season and with Smith (see later) formed one of the better defensive units in L2 in the second half of last season under Ward (when players were played in their correct positions unlike under McGhee). We were difficult to score against last season until the foot come off the pedal the last few games once safety was assured. This season we've not started so well defensively, but the signs were there they were getting back to their best on Saturday. Agree that Parkes has the ability and potential to be a Championship player in time.

THe now famous John Joe O'toole is a combative excellent central midfielder and on his day should be playing at a much better level will get stuck in and can pick a pass and strike a ball well. O'toole was the key man at the end of last season and our performances dropped after he left. As Nailsea says, a combative player who controls the midfield and is prepared to work his socks off for the team, albeit not yet showing the same levels of consistency as last year.

Ellis Harrison and Alfe Santos (one of the 2 will feature id have thought with the other on the bench) are to very promising youngsters who will cause your lot problems with pace and skill if they play. Both have the potential to go on to bigger and better things. Harrison likes his mazy runs, can be a bit hit and miss at times but tries to play exciting football and with more experience will be one to watch. I've only seen Santos the once and he seems another talented youngster but needs to build up some strength / bulk out a bit as can be physically dominated by bigger players. Both these, plus Eliot Richards, Mitch Harding, Shaquille Hunter and Tom Lockyer (scored the winner and man of the match Saturday) are products of our youth system who have made the breakthrough to the First Team in the last 12 months so are still a little raw but with lots of potential. Richards, Harding and Hunter probably won't feature tomorrow and it will be interesting to see how the other youngsters cope with the occasion.

Matt Harrold has more to his game than a big lump up front and his goal scoring record at rovers is none to shabby however is not yet fully match fit so 90 mins tomorrow might not be productive on the night but will be priceless in terms of bringing him back to match fitness , Clarkson obvioyusly known to you , struggled with injuries like his time with you but seems fitter and has found the net a few times already

My Player to watch is Micheal Smith come on leaps and bounds since signing from Irish league playing at the top of his game and can see him getting a move to the championship if he continues. Agree, easily player of the season last year after a dodgy first year with us, continuing that form so far this year.

The bench is stronger now with Matt Gill, and (a Much thinner and fitter Garry Kenneth) both lacking match fitness and Eliot Richard whos bag a couple of goals already this season.

Wardy will set up as you prob remember , 1st aim to keep it tight and not let you have chances and hope to hit you on the break, with players like JET and Baldock you should be winning with ease, being honest i barely have heard of any of the other players in your team other than mentions on here and brief reports in the papers and tweets but thats the nature of lower league football, if we had heard of these players they wouldnt be playing in leagues 1 and 2 !!

i hear a lot of you saying things are coming together with the city team but then read others saying its rubbish and its been a long run without a league win, early goal for you and i fear it could be 3/4 nil but the longer we hold out the better our hopes get.

On wage bill of each side it should be 5 - 0 city on passion and heart it could be 1 nil to us!

A good summary, I've supplemented with my (genuine) thoughts above.

[HoldenBall]

Another thing to worry about, they don't concede many at the moment.. Yes they don't score a lot as well their plan of putting 10 men behind the ball will be well thought out and structured

[Super]

Another thing to worry about, they don't concede many at the moment.. Yes they don't score a lot as well their plan of putting 10 men behind the ball will be well thought out and structured

Then again i am sure they haven't come up against quality forward players that we have. Best Chance they have is attacking us.

[DancinDannyD]

Then again i am sure they haven't come up against quality forward players that we have. Best Chance they have is attacking us.

Agree, if we sit back and defend for penalties / concede territory and possession you'll murder us. Best chance is to ensure a tight defensive unit but look to get the ball to the wings quickly and attack whenever we can.

If we don't try and take the game to you wherever possible, we'll lose with a whimper.

Another thing, if we concede first it's effectively game over. It's been some considerable time since we went behind in a game and came back to win.

[View from the Dolman]

No i think you'll find a wage bill is what it says in the tin ! the total amount of wages paid out , as in a bill for wages

you are thinking of FFP whereby your wage bill must equate to a % of your turnover

Turnover takes into account money coming in and out which indeed includes wages but a wage bill is in itself its own thing

No, you're confusing FFP with SCMP.

[Bar BS3]

No i think you'll find a wage bill is what it says in the tin ! the total amount of wages paid out , as in a bill for wages

you are thinking of FFP whereby your wage bill must equate to a % of your turnover

Turnover takes into account money coming in and out which indeed includes wages but a wage bill is in itself its own thing

You are contradicting yourself there.

Yes, FFP dicatates that your wage bill must be a maximum percentage of your turnover (which is money coming in, not money in and out)

A wage bill is therefore dependant on turnover and with the difference in the clubs turnover (I predict to be in the region of 50% higher at BCFC, after relegation)

This allows a potential wage bill, relative to that of turnover.

For instance (this is all based on very rough guess work)

BCFC turnover £7.5m = £4.5m wage budget

Gas turnover £5m = £3m wage budget.

That difference, in my view, does not equate to 5-0 being reasonable based of difference of wage will - just look at the massive disparity in wage budgets within the Championship, let alone the Premier league.

[BS3 GAS]

No, you're confusing FFP with SCMP.

No, you're confusing FFP with SCMP.

SCMP is a part of the FFP system

http://www.football-league.co.uk/page/FLExplainedDetail/0,,10794~2748246,00.html

[ciderup]

No, you're confusing FFP with SCMP.

In all honesty, I don't know the difference either. Can someone explain it?

EDIT: Thanks for the link Cookie.

[BS3 GAS]

You are contradicting yourself there.

Yes, FFP dicatates that your wage bill must be a maximum percentage of your turnover (which is money coming in, not money in and out)

A wage bill is therefore dependant on turnover and with the difference in the clubs turnover (I predict to be in the region of 50% higher at BCFC, after relegation)

This allows a potential wage bill, relative to that of turnover.

For instance (this is all based on very rough guess work)

BCFC turnover £7.5m = £4.5m wage budget

Gas turnover £5m = £3m wage budget.

That difference, in my view, does not equate to 5-0 being reasonable based of difference of wage will - just look at the massive disparity in wage budgets within the Championship, let alone the Premier league.

now BS3.. read again .... what i said you have a higher wage bill... nothing more nothing less (nothing to do with turnover/profit ect)

Your wage bill ie total wages is higher than rovers, that is it plain and simple! ( and not surprisng as you play in and have been playing in a higher league , my point being higher wages will or should bring you better players ie a team with a £5m wage bill should be stuffing a team with a £1m wage bill (figures an example only )

[DancinDannyD]

now BS3.. read again .... what i said you have a higher wage bill... nothing more nothing less (nothing to do with turnover/profit ect)

Your wage bill ie total wages is higher than rovers, that is it plain and simple! ( and not surprisng as you play in and have been playing in a higher league , my point being higher wages will or should bring you better players ie a team with a £5m wage bill should be stuffing a team with a £1m wage bill (figures an example only )

... and used to playing Championship standard players week in, week out. Even in L1 the standard of opposition each week is higher than L2. So whichever way you cut it, highly paid ex-Championship players with experience against high quality players should do over a team from the basement, at home, 19 times out of 20.

[BS3 GAS]

In all honesty, I don't know the difference either. Can someone explain it?

EDIT: Thanks for the link Cookie.

i have read it plenty of times and still dont get it really, and there are loopholes all over the place , how the bloody hell do accrington manage with players like Nicky Hunt and francis jeffers on crowds of just over 1000!! there crowd on sat was 1.174 inc prob 100 or so away fans , on a midweek night this season i can see them getting under 950 for a league game! hoew do they survive ( im glad they do but how!)

[ciderup]

i have read it plenty of times and still dont get it really, and there are loopholes all over the place , how the bloody hell do accrington manage with players like Nicky Hunt and francis jeffers on crowds of just over 1000!! there crowd on sat was 1.174 inc prob 100 or so away fans , on a midweek night this season i can see them getting under 950 for a league game! hoew do they survive ( im glad they do but how!)

It certainly isn't all encompassing.

I would suggest our figure is hampered by the players we still have on Championship wages yet our figure appears to be derived from our Championship turnover. What difference that makes to tomorrow night is neither here nor there but it's overly complicated IMHO and open to abuse as you say.

[TinnionForEngland]

Bristol Rovers fans are so funny/such losers. They make out we all think we're Premier League class and should be getting gates of 50,000 each week with players like Didier Drogba and John Terry. The truth is i have never heard anybody say City are anything other than a small fish in a big pond and we were over the moon to be playing teams like Newcastle United and Blackburn Rovers. We spent 6 years in the Championship, during which we came one game away from the Premier League, what are we supposed to do, come out and say we're shitter than Rovers? Your an utter bunch of bitter weirdo's, funny how one minute your fans say 'We're going to be higher than you soon', but as soon as this game comes around it's 'We've got nothing to lose, you should win easily' blah blah blah, no time for any of you, you all talk bollocks.

[Bar BS3]

now BS3.. read again .... what i said you have a higher wage bill... nothing more nothing less Yes you did say more. You said that the difference in our wage bill means that we should be beating you 5-0. then is utter rubbish. (nothing to do with turnover/profit ect) You still don't seem to get it, that turnover IS directly related to wage budget.

Your wage bill ie total wages is higher than rovers, that is it plain and simple! ( and not surprisng as you play in and have been playing in a higher league , my point being higher wages will or should bring you better players ie a team with a £5m wage bill should be stuffing a team with a £1m wage bill (figures an example only ) I am fully aware of your point. My point was that the difference in our wage bill is not vast enough to justify your origional claim that because of it, we should be beating you 5-0.

[Guest]

My 2 pennies worth...

Rovers are far froma team of cloggers as suggested ,

hard working good ball playing centre half in Tom Parkes who will go on to play at a higher level, partners old fashioned more physical centre half in Mark Mccrystal.... a steady centre half partnership

THe now famous John Joe O'toole is a combative excellent central midfielder and on his day should be playing at a much better level will get stuck in and can pick a pass and strike a ball well

Ellis Harrison and Alfe Santos (one of the 2 will feature id have thought with the other on the bench) are to very promising youngsters who will cause your lot problems with pace and skill if they play.

Matt Harrold has more to his game than a big lump up front and his goal scoring record at rovers is none to shabby , Clarkson obvioyusly known to you , struggled with injuries like his time with you but seems fitter and has found the net a few times already

My Player to watch is Micheal Smith come on leaps and bounds since signing from Irish league playing at the top of his game and can see him getting a move to the championship if he continues.

The bench is stronger now with Matt Gill, and (a Much thinner and fitter Garry Kenneth) and Eliot Richard whos bag a couple of goals already this season.

Wardy will set up as you prob remember , 1st aim to keep it tight and not let you have chances and hope to hit you on the break, with players like JET and Baldock you should be winning with ease, being honest i barely have heard of any of the other players in your team other than mentions on here and brief reports in the papers and tweets but thats the nature of lower league football, if we had heard of these players they wouldnt be playing in leagues 1 and 2 !!

i hear a lot of you saying things are coming together with the city team but then read others saying its rubbish and its been a long run without a league win, early goal for you and i fear it could be 3/4 nil but the longer we hold out the better our hopes get.

On wage bill of each side it should be 5 - 0 city on passion and heart it could be 1 nil to us!

I know Clarkson hes on top gear the rest WHO ??? NEVER HEARD OF THEM.

Been to many derbies when I knew of the likes of Jarman and Smash and Grab and when played at greaseville, was much more interesting than tomorrows over hyped/policed game will be.

[DancinDannyD]

Bristol Rovers fans are so funny/such losers. They make out we all think we're Premier League class and should be getting gates of 50,000 each week with players like Didier Drogba and John Terry. The truth is i have never heard anybody say City are anything other than a small fish in a big pond and we were over the moon to be playing teams like Newcastle United and Blackburn Rovers. We spent 6 years in the Championship, during which we came one game away from the Premier League, what are we supposed to do, come out and say we're shitter than Rovers? Your an utter bunch of bitter weirdo's, funny how one minute your fans say 'We're going to be higher than you soon', but as soon as this game comes around it's 'We've got nothing to lose, you should win easily' blah blah blah, no time for any of you, you all talk bollocks.

Well this forum is famous for taking ONE persons comments on the Rovers Forums and then quoting them ad infinitum as Rovers fans general views or behaviour ("Barcelona of L2" / Boob cricket anyone?) so you can't then whinge when it happens in reverse.

It's a fact that a section of your support on this very forum were talking of the Premiership this time last year after your good start, and also saying how you'd walk League 1 (a 'piss-poor' division to quote at least one poster) ahead of the new season. In fact, after the L1 play-offs last year a number of your fans were saying how City would regularly 'thrash' teams in L1 the standard was so poor.

Simple facts: You can afford higher quality players than the Gas, most of your team are Championship players, you are at home. On paper, you should be spanking a mid-table Division 4 side at home in a cup tie.

[Evander SnowyField]

I know Clarkson hes on top gear the rest WHO ??? NEVER HEARD OF THEM.

I think Harold was on neighbours?? Fat guy married to Alsa, ran the coffee shop

[Guest]

Well this forum is famous for taking ONE persons comments on the Rovers Forums and then quoting them ad infinitum as Rovers fans general views or behaviour ("Barcelona of L2" / Boob cricket anyone?) so you can't then whinge when it happens in reverse.

It's a fact that a section of your support on this very forum were talking of the Premier League this time last year after your good start, and also saying how you'd walk League 1 (a 'piss-poor' division to quote at least one poster) ahead of the new season. In fact, after the L1 play-offs last year a number of your fans were saying how City would regularly 'thrash' teams in L1 the standard was so poor.

Simple facts: You can afford higher quality players than the Gas, most of your team are Championship players, you are at home. On paper, you should be spanking a mid-table Division 4 side at home in a cup tie.

Anything could happen tomorrow many lower clubs have raised themselves to at least match their opponents in a cup game, Liverpool a week or so ago for example and us taking the Super Leeds and Liverpool out. This shouldn't have happened "on paper" who ever wants it more will take it tomorrow.

[TinnionForEngland]

'Most of your team are Championship players' well clearly not as they've been deemed not good enough to play there at this moment in time. They are league one players mate, unless you know something I dont.

[The Chaplain]

So this Michael Smith... where does he play?

[westred1]

So this Michael Smith... where does he play?

Normally, right back. Wednesday? On his arse when JET runs rings around him.

[DancinDannyD]

'Most of your team are Championship players' well clearly not as they've been deemed not good enough to play there at this moment in time. They are league one players mate, unless you know something I dont.

ok, ex-Championship players with lots of Championship experience

[HoldenBall]

Normally, right back. Wednesday? On his arse when JET runs rings around him.

JET doesn't run though, he walks!