Board Representation

[NickJ]

Thirty one years ago a small group of businessmen thought they had returned Bristol City to its supporters, to financial sustainability, and to accountability. For the following 21 years, they were correct.

 

http://www.bcfc3lions.co.uk/page106.html

[cityboy]

The only people that the board are there to represent, and are accountable to, are the shareholders of the club.

I don't see why fans feel that they deserve a place on the board.  If you shop at Tesco's regularly, do you also demand a place on their board?

 

Edit: actually read the thread now.  Great post Billy Wedlock.

[Cowshed]

The only people that the board are there to represent, and are accountable to, are the shareholders of the club.

I don't see why fans feel that they deserve a place on the board. If you shop at Tesco's regularly, do you also demand a place on their board?

That is a little silly.

An FC is a club. A club that only exists to play football for its members [fans]. It is not a retail business.

The reason fans are disillusioned is not only due to the football. The club has forgotten what it actually is and views fans as customers.

The custodians [the board] of the FC should be accountable to a degree to everybody.

[NickJ]

Cityboy, I am afraid you entirely miss the point.

 

A football club is not comparable with Tesco's - if it were, 12,000 people would not turn up every week to purchase a shit product.

 

A football club does not exist for its shareholders, it exists for its supporters. Everything else is of secondary importance.

 

I thoroughly recommend you read the link in my previous post above.

 

The Ashton Gate Eight are famous, but in point of fact the real heroes in 1982 were the 4 local businessmen, aided by a core of others and thousands of City fans, who saved the club back then. The fundamental safeguard they put in place was that no one shareholder could own more than 25% of the club. That has been dismantled, destroyed, however you want to put it, by the current majority shareholder.

 

I'm not suggesting anything in particular towards the current majority shareholder, but what I do say is that there is an increasing recognition among the fans that we have been disenfranchised, and an increasing frustration and anger about that.

[jollycobblerred]

So just consider the opposite scenario to the one where the board has thought about this in advance, acted decisively and got a manager in quickly to address the current league position and assess ahead of the transfer window opening. That is they take weeks and weeks to work through applications losing several shortlisted candidates to rival offers. Eventually appoints manager but transfer window time narrowing snd meanwhile ecit cup and fall deeper into relegation zone. ... you get the picture.

Fact is a lot of people are fed up with the boring play and crap results and would moan at whatever happened next. Demanding justification from the board is a pointless process. Its simply about getting back to entertaining and winning football really urgently. Until then, anything anyone does is wrong and bound to be damned.

 

Agree with this, we are at the bottom of league one and have been all season. If come January we still were, and THEN the board acted, we would be accusing them of sitting on their hands and acting too late. Personally I thought the decision to get rid of sod was an odd one, given all the five pillar talk, which I actually agree with, but at least they have acted, done SOMETHING to try and stop the rot.

[CotswoldRed]

The only people that the board are there to represent, and are accountable to, are the shareholders of the club.

I don't see why fans feel that they deserve a place on the board.  If you shop at Tesco's regularly, do you also demand a place on their board?

 

Edit: actually read the thread now.  Great post Billy Wedlock.

 

Why do people think its like any other business?

 

It is exposed to some very similar challenges, yes, but for starters what other business do capable businessmen invest in knowing they'll make a loss (almost certainly). It is the worst possible type of investment.

 

They are not investing to make money, so they do not expect to make a profit and neither do shareholders expect a dividend or an increase in the share price.  Apart from some notable exceptions this applies to all clubs.

 

So, given you won't make any money and won't return a profit, people going into it don't do it for business reasons at all.  They do it for notoriety, love of the game, ego and enjoyment (sometimes).  Within that context there is room for a relationship with the fans.  I'm sure the fans applauding a chairman/owner's actions helps to massage the ego a little more.  SL certainly won't be enjoying the last few years, but least of all because of the money he's lost.  He'll be upset that his team are crap and the fans/public that loved him don't seem to any more.  People are doubting him.

 

SL will know that some decisions HAVE to be made with complete autonomy and without liaising with the fans.  At the same time he'd rather be watching his team in his stadium with a full house singing his name.

[Jordan Tansley]

What a load of tripe.

No need for that, but obviously welcome to hold your own opinion.

 

Here is Mourniho being unveiled as Chelsea manager. Oh my god where was the chairman, there was the press officer.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOl1lDK7V60

Well that's obviously different isn't it? What questions could there have been for the Chelsea board having appointed the Champions League winning manager? In our case several present journalists have claimed they had questions for the board and couldn't get answers. Not curious?

 

Who cares about his contract length ? What is it to you, or any fan. You don't know what clauses there are, and if he gets fired, you know who will pay for it

I care. We have been sold the 5 pillars strategy and one of those is about financial prudence. If you can explain how a near 4 year deal represents financial prudence when the average tenure in football management is about a year (i don't have the stats to hand) that would be greatly appreciated. This is about the endless stream of (for want of a better word) Bullshit from the board. How can we buy into this 5 pillars strategy if it is already being contradicted? Why is it such an issue for you to accept that some fans want the board on record confirming the things you state as fact despite no genuine proof?

 

Manager ?of the first team yes, recruitment is handled by Keith Burt. Nothing changes. He will spend more time talking with players than coaching, he will have learnt a lot at QPR with Harry on that score.

Again, proof would be fantastic. You say nothing changes but I can't help but feel that it does and have had nothing to truly confirm that from the board. I'm really struggling to understand everyone who defends the board has such an issue with people wanting transparency? Is that really an unrealistic and unnecessary demand? 

Unelected leaders. Are you for real. What private business elects directors. Nothing to do with anyone here. They put in the money, they buy part of the club, end of. Unelected leaders indeed. Where do you make it up.

To be fair, you have every right to criticise that one. The wording wasn't very good. I had this conversation with DL, and he seemed to understand what I meant. Again though, you gloss over the actual point of that question. Evasive and selective quoting, you could get a job on our Board, Billy. Where is the due diligence? It was JL who talked of this. These people don't have free reign simply because they are the decision makers. If they do then what if their latest whim is to turn AG into houses or merge BCFC and BRFC? extreme cases, but a lack of accountability breeds bad decision making.

 

Everyone saw the potential applicants list, it seemed on here that none of them would have seen as an a great appointment. SC is know to the owners and to Keith Burt. Clearly they felt he was the right man for our current circumstance. It is hardly difficult to work out. They don't have to explain anymore than that. I am sure having knowledge of SC had bearing on him getting the job. Goes on every day in real life. Did I jump for joy, no, but equally what else can we expect when facing a double relegation.

 

Here's my problem with that and why i asked if the applicants were even looked at. What if a very good, in fact brilliant manager fancied the challenge? What if via an interview process he had proven that he was a much better applicant? We have a 'recruitment expert' on the board and none of the principles of recruitment have been followed... How can that not concern you? Do you care at all about how this club is run?

 

What responsibility would like the board to take if it does not work out ? Did SL fold the club ? no. He could have done easily, a number of times, and walked away. That he has stuck to it, made significant moves to change to the weaknesses of scouting, coaching and academy seems to me to suggest that a new approach is being taken, That he will still bankroll an updated stadium to assist the income potential of the club, suggests also he is not a quitter.

 

Steve isn't on this board. He is irrelevant to this decision (Well he should be) I'd like to think that JL might accept that they got it wrong publicly, Keith Dawe might grunt in public? Any kind of accountability would be grand.

 

I have no idea if SC is the man for the job, I wish we were higher up the league, and winning games playing great football. But I do know that the club provides endless opportunity to interact with fans, has improved community involvement no end. Fans get listened too on many many occasions. That the club has problems is damn obvious, but to think that just as you support the club you have gained any superior right to "answers" to non questions is fantasy. It is a sport, it is entertainment,it is business,  if you don't like it, you are within your right, not to pay money, and not come. That is your right. If you want more than that, and think you can do better, then you need to buy the club. Do you think there are people  lining up to buy BCFC ? Do you think someone will come in and build a new stadium ? If you can find someone tell SL, as I am sure he would stand aside. 

 

Really getting sick of this non-argument. What you're saying is that because SL owns the club he is beyond reproach. That criticising the running of the club is some kind of tripe-riddled crime. With respect, that's exactly the attitude that could see this club end up soulless like Cardiff, Hull or broke like Pompey. Questions are good, transparency is good. Blind faith is counter-productive.

 

The only answers I want as a fan, is that when SC has looked at the side, the players, that he finds out how to start winning some games. The only thing that has depressed me this week is threads like this, ill informed , fantasy land tripe. 

 

Fantasy? I'm open to answers. I've hardly made any judgements. If they answer those questions and provide convincing arguments for their decisions I will back them. I ask again, why is transparency such an issue for you. I find that usually when people are uncomfortable with giving answers they usually have something to hide.

 

So . lets assume you have now bought out Sl. Taken the club on. Just what is your magic formula ? Maybe you have some fantastic ideas, maybe the club is missing something, and maybe some innovative thinking could uncover some secrets of success. Of course, like on a video game, that is rather easy to do, when you start working in the harsh realities of pro sport, in a City that is not renowned for football success, with no cheques to write from your bank account, with no fans to boo you and call you names , with results that are not real, it is all rather easy. 

 

Why don't you ask to join a training session with SC ? 

 

As I said elsewhere, This is not about Board out, this is about Board, get better at looking after my club. The rest of those two paragraphs are dirge unworthy of reply...

[Jordan Tansley]

I was the one who asked Adam Baker about publicising the profiles of the board members. I haven't heard anymore on this since the initial response, which I will put down to the fact that it must have been a very busy couple of days for Adam. For what it's worth, here's my opinion...

I bought into the 5 pillars strategy. At the time, it made a lot of sense. Had it not been for the events of the past week, it would sort of still make sense. The reason I say sort of is because it has become increasingly apparent that there is something missing. A strategy is not a destination, it is not a vision, it is not the objective. A strategy is the method of achieving that vision. I'm not clear on what our vision is, nor perhaps more importantly what timeframe we are working to. How do we know therefore whether the strategy is successful? How/when is progress measured?

Our current league position is unacceptable, we all know that, yet individually every pillar of the strategy was being implemented successfully (except possibly talent recruitment which wasn't even SODs job?) So is the strategy wrong? Or is our position in the league solely the responsibility of our previous head coach? How was this assessed? Whatever the answer, recent decisions by the board seemingly disregard the patience they asked fans to show. They disregard financial prudence. They disregard the staff structure when JL was so vocal about the role of head coach within the club hierarchy.

So, my reason for asking for more information about the board members was to address the issue that, with this latest turn of events, they have alienated a large percentage of the fan base. They are invisible, seem disinterested, seem disorganised and some might say incompetent. Apart from the visibility, the rest is subjective. Yet the overriding issue is one of accountability. The board cannot continue to place accountability for the success of the whole club at the feet of the head coach. The lack of board representation at the SC press conference was further evidence that they are not addressing this fundamental issue.

I don't like to criticise without being constructive, so this was where my request to Adam Baker was leading. I think the board need to be far more transparent. Tell us who you are and what you bring to the table! Tell us what you want to deliver for the club and what you are doing to effect that change. I also think that a member of the board should each sponsor one of the five pillars. This would align our boardroom structure with the strategy and address the issue of accountability. The Chairman needs to lead the whole thing. He needs to be the glue that ensures the whole is greater than the sum of the individual parts. He needs to stand up, speak up and lead from the top. If he's not prepared to do that, we need somebody competent who can. (SL - that bit was for your attention). Let's be a bit radical and set ourselves some tangible targets, not just in terms of league positions but across each of the pillars. Then.... when it all works and we are back in the Championship, with 7 of our first team having come through the academy, all playing in an improved stadium, we'll know who deserves the pat on the back. If it doesn't work.... well...

 

A fantastic post, Stan.

[cityboy]

An FC is a club. A club that only exists to play football for its members [fans]. It is not a retail business.

The reason fans are disillusioned is not only due to the football. The club has forgotten what it actually is and views fans as customers.

 

A football club is not comparable with Tesco's - if it were, 12,000 people would not turn up every week to purchase a shit product.

 

A football club does not exist for its shareholders, it exists for its supporters. Everything else is of secondary importance.

 

This may have been true even 20 years ago, but it's no longer the case.  Like it or not, professional football now is more a business than a sport, and fans are it's customers.  There's no difference between us and retail customers other than a massively increased sense of brand loyalty.

[NickJ]

Either you seriously believe there is nothing wrong with that, which is sad, or you have accepted that nothing can be done about it, which is a defeatist attitude.

 

While sufficient numbers continue to believe that football is sport not business, and football teams belong to their communities not wealthy individuals, there remains hope for a better future for OUR club.