MarcusX Posted June 19, 2014 Report Share Posted June 19, 2014 To settle a debate... Was it a terrible header by Gerrard, or did Jagielka get lost in no mans land when he should have dropped off? Personally I think Gerrard should have done better, but ultimately Jagielka should have been deeper. He got stuck in no mans land and couldn't react Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted June 19, 2014 Report Share Posted June 19, 2014 To settle a debate... Was it a terrible header by Gerrard, or did Jagielka get lost in no mans land when he should have dropped off? Personally I think Gerrard should have done better, but ultimately Jagielka should have been deeper. He got stuck in no mans land and couldn't react All that + Cahill failed to react as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 To settle a debate... Was it a terrible header by Gerrard, or did Jagielka get lost in no mans land when he should have dropped off? Personally I think Gerrard should have done better, but ultimately Jagielka should have been deeper. He got stuck in no mans land and couldn't react All that + Cahill failed to react as well. Yes crap all around...The worst central defence in English history! John Terry is laughing his cock off! four awful goals......I can see why he retired from International football, he could see what was left to play with at this level! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK0wnag3 Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Gerrard shouldn't have been playing. He was anonymous against Italy and he managed to do worse today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoldenBall Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Yes crap all around...The worst central defence in English history! John Terry is laughing his cock off! four awful goals......I can see why he retired from International football, he could see what was left to play with at this level! We all moaned when we had Cole-Ferdinand-Terry-Neville as our back four, what would we do to have those playing now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Gerrard shouldn't have been playing. He was anonymous against Italy and he managed to do worse today. Agreed, he is a very over rated player in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dandare 1966 Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Gerard lost the champion ship for Liverpool now he,s done England great player great bloke but past it and should not have been in the team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Gerard lost the champion ship for Liverpool now he,s done England great player great bloke but past it and should not have been in the team Who instead though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedUn Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 To settle a debate... Was it a terrible header by Gerrard, or did Jagielka get lost in no mans land when he should have dropped off? Both. The immobility of the central defenders reminded me of the German mauling in South Africa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 It is clearly Jagielka's fault horrific defending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 It's the fault of the FA for allowing too many foreign players in the prem, even we cant get a decent CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveybadger Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 I'd like to throw this in too - If Hart had actually stood upright the ball would simply have hit him. He seemed to just duck out the way, although perhaps I'm being harsh and he was trying to move his arm towards it by moving his body. I think he has looked decidedly nervous during this world cup, although don't blame him playing behind our defence. Same old same old from England though - inability to pass the ball accurately and maintain it under pressure. Thought Uruguay completely worked us out after Saturday (drop off and deny space for people like Sterling to attack) and as usual English players aren't bright enough to work out a plan B for themselves. The defence (which is rubbish) simply hides the real reason we aren't very good IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelbcfc Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 At the end of the day were just not good enough. I reckon that is the strongest team he could have put out, Now is the time to get rid of the old guard and build around the younger players. Forget the euros just build a young team for the next 4 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 I'd like to throw this in too - If Hart had actually stood upright the ball would simply have hit him. He seemed to just duck out the way, although perhaps I'm being harsh and he was trying to move his arm towards it by moving his body. I think he has looked decidedly nervous during this world cup, although don't blame him playing behind our defence. Same old same old from England though - inability to pass the ball accurately and maintain it under pressure. Thought Uruguay completely worked us out after Saturday (drop off and deny space for people like Sterling to attack) and as usual English players aren't bright enough to work out a plan B for themselves. The defence (which is rubbish) simply hides the real reason we aren't very good IMO. Great summary. Spot on with every comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipdawg Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 To settle a debate... Was it a terrible header by Gerrard, or did Jagielka get lost in no mans land when he should have dropped off? Personally I think Gerrard should have done better, but ultimately Jagielka should have been deeper. He got stuck in no mans land and couldn't react All of the above and more. Shocking defending throughout from England. I think everyone's got so excited by our new-found attacking options that we forgot to do any defending Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRISTOL86 Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Harsh I'd like to throw this in too - If Hart had actually stood upright the ball would simply have hit him. He seemed to just duck out the way, although perhaps I'm being harsh and he was trying to move his arm towards it by moving his body. I think he has looked decidedly nervous during this world cup, although don't blame him playing behind our defence. Same old same old from England though - inability to pass the ball accurately and maintain it under pressure. Thought Uruguay completely worked us out after Saturday (drop off and deny space for people like Sterling to attack) and as usual English players aren't bright enough to work out a plan B for themselves. The defence (which is rubbish) simply hides the real reason we aren't very good IMO. Harsh to blame any keeper in a one on one like that, especially when it's Suarez on the other end. He was left horrendously exposed by a woeful defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 how can anyone blame hart?! jagielka has two options deal with the long ball himself or go back ten yards and anticipate the danger. he did neither. if flint did that he would be slated on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Rollason Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 ball watching, both goals. WHERE'S SUAREZ??, HE'S BEHIND YOU FFS. easy to do mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveybadger Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 how can anyone blame hart?! jagielka has two options deal with the long ball himself or go back ten yards and anticipate the danger. he did neither. if flint did that he would be slated on here. Harsh Harsh to blame any keeper in a one on one like that, especially when it's Suarez on the other end. He was left horrendously exposed by a woeful defense. To make it clear, Gerrard and Jagielka were clearly the main reasons that the goal was scored, just trying to say that I think Hart could (possibly) have done better too. But if the first 2 do their job Hart is irrelevant. Regardless, I think Hart has declined from the keeper we thought / hoped he would be, possibly ever since Pirlo chipped his penalty over him in the Euros just to take the mickey out of his arrogance (and said so afterwards). Don't know why, possibly just another case of a young english player being told he's great because he plays in the Premier Legaue, believing the hype and taking his foot off the pedal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 To make it clear, Gerrard and Jagielka were clearly the main reasons that the goal was scored, just trying to say that I think Hart could (possibly) have done better too. But if the first 2 do their job Hart is irrelevant. Regardless, I think Hart has declined from the keeper we thought / hoped he would be, possibly ever since Pirlo chipped his penalty over him in the Euros just to take the mickey out of his arrogance (and said so afterwards). Don't know why, possibly just another case of a young english player being told he's great because he plays in the Premier Legaue, believing the hype and taking his foot off the pedal? Suarez has such an array of finishing like placement, power, delicate chip, you name it he can do it. Joe Hart covered the bottom corners which is the most likely destination for that ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Always Believesham Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Joe Hart of 2013 saves Suarez's second; harsh or not, when in form, Hart looks unbeatable - he is not a man in form and is thinking too much about every shot he faces. His reactions served him so well playing for both Birmingham and Man City; since they won the league, he has dropped off - you can't blame any player for not being at his peak though. Two amatuer mistakes have cost us two important goals so far; Cahill lost Balotelli in the same way Jagielka lost Suarez for Uruguay's opener; both times the defender looks at the striker and tries to second guess his next move. They could/should have been so much tighter so they can watch the ball and 'feel' the player they are marking. Before all that though, Gerrard should have gone straight through whoever it was that strolled through his 'tackle'; he's focused on trying to creat something when he should simply be focused on trying to stop the opposition coming forward - regardless of the deflection, a stronger tackle ensures he can't keep possesion. As for the second, Gerrard is prone to these kind of faus pas' & he should have got a call. I think it's because he knows he is England's 'action man' and is trying to do it all - as for Jagielka; even if Gerrard's up ready to head it, as long as he pulls out, Jagielka meets it and it's danger over. Defensively, we blew our game against Germany at the last World Cup with one CB meeting the ball and one player dropping off; the CB's have pace now, if nothing else, and they can afford to do it, it is the right thing to do. I don't know whether Gerrard's challenge for the ball has thrown Cahill but it's his job to come accross and he has to do it quicker. For me though; the defence have made mistakes and been punished; the strikers have been disappointing so far - no matter what anyone says about the crosses; if you look for one of your players, you are more likely to profit from getting the ball in the box; B*llocks to this 'play it across the 6 yard box and hope someone puts it in'; it works when you are on the break or it's the only option... sometimes (see both of england's goals). We've had 11 shots on target in 2 games; there have been plenty of chances but far too many have been off target. Had we been playing against keepers in the form of Mexico's GK it would be a different story but the bottom line is: our attackers are there to score goals, if they are only having a shot on target every 15 minutes, we will not win games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samo II Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cider-manc Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Gerrard shouldn't have been playing. He was anonymous against Italy and he managed to do worse today. Just going to throw it out there.... Gerrard had a higher forward pass completion rate than any other England player against Italy. which is what his position requires him to do... collect the ball off the defence and get the team moving forward. Thought we have been unlucky to lose both games but we brought it on ourselves with poor defending. (Gerrard, Jagielka and Johnson had nightmares last night.) I also thought that Rooney played quite well last night- He had poor moments but was overall our best player. However I think it may have been at the cost of the sort of performance we were hoping would continue after the Italy game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Gerrard shouldn't have been playing. He was anonymous against Italy and he managed to do worse today. To be fair he played some super long passes but energy where were you ? Not the Gerrard of old who could take a game by the scruff of the neck and drive the team on ,alas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedHead05 Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Terrible defending,jags has to attack the ball with Gerrard or drop deep.Cahill has to cover,he was trying to play offside,when a draw was good enough!! I don't blame Hart for not saving it, Suarez is one of the best finishers in the world,but if he was my keeper I would have wanted him out at Suarez's feet,he allowed him to take a touch,let the ball settle then hit it!!Start further out your goal,penalty spot,it came from a kick out by the keeper,him being out further would have rushed Suarez rather than giving him plenty of time!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bs3 Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 We all moaned when we had Cole-Ferdinand-Terry-Neville as our back four, what would we do to have those playing now You may have but I and others certainly never. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunnyfunt Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the powder puff attempt of a tackle by Gerrard which led the way to the first goal. An inexcusable peice of play putting England on the back foot for which we struggled to get back our defensive shape and Jagielka lost his man in behind. The second was 2010 against ze Germans all over again..A punt upfield and a lack of communication from both Gerrard and Jagielka, with the latter stuck in no mans land. Where was Baines though covering round the back? Surley he could see PJ was in a poor postion to cover or win the ball? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezgimed Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 how can anyone blame hart?! jagielka has two options deal with the long ball himself or go back ten yards and anticipate the danger. he did neither. if flint did that he would be slated on here. Because the ball was struck right at him, and he moved to the left to let it past him. Yes all very high speed etc but stand tall and it might just hit you and not go in the net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One BCFC Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 Tactically we were shocking yesterday. Uruguay did their homework, they closed us down early on and gave us no time to play like we did against Italy. There was no Plan B, the football we were playing against Italy wasnt working but Roy did nothing to change the game. The movement was terrible for international attackers and we were slow. All I have to say about the defence is Johnson and Baines are like wingers but not very good ones. Cahill and Jagielka well what do you expect? It was embarassing and they were scared of Suarez, embarassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted June 20, 2014 Report Share Posted June 20, 2014 I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the powder puff attempt of a tackle by Gerrard which led the way to the first goal. An inexcusable peice of play putting England on the back foot for which we struggled to get back our defensive shape and Jagielka lost his man in behind. The second was 2010 against ze Germans all over again..A punt upfield and a lack of communication from both Gerrard and Jagielka, with the latter stuck in no mans land. Where was Baines though covering round the back? Surley he could see PJ was in a poor postion to cover or win the ball? How is it lack of Communication from Gerrard? I agree he was poor last night but absolutely no blame on his part for that goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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