The Politics Thread

[Mike Litoris]

Corbyn was one of the Soviet Union's best apologists in the Cold War era....all the Cold War was down to American actions, the Soviets were all peace loving peoples....yeah ****** right.

For much of the later period of the Cold War that revisionist theory of its history was pretty much accepted and popular.

Post revisionist theory is contemporarily accepted. Which is essentially, they were both as bad as each other and it was a needless but inevitable tension.

It's hardly the biggest crime to be up to date with historical narratives. As he was at the time.

[bucksred]

Yes, but you can't tar everyone with the actions of a few. That would be like saying various bosses have gone to jail ergo every employer is corrupt.

Anyone who works in the media knows how the print unions basically operated as a criminal syndicate. But then do do the big banks....

Yes, but you can't tar everyone with the actions of a few. That would be like saying various bosses have gone to jail ergo every employer is corrupt.

Anyone who works in the media knows how the print unions basically operated as a criminal syndicate. But then do do the big banks....

Yes, but you can't tar everyone with the actions of a few. That would be like saying various bosses have gone to jail ergo every employer is corrupt.

Anyone who works in the media knows how the print unions basically operated as a criminal syndicate. But then do do the big banks....

Toche mon brave...take it you appreciate the difference in Tory Politicians? Or does the usual blind anti Tory bigotry of the socialists preclude a fair assessment of their abilities?.

I have personally met ONE Liebour politician I didnt want to punch very hard and that is Jim Murphy one of the few stars of the no Campaign in Scotland. He was a decent chap, but as with all Liebour politicians on the subject of defence has a huge lack of understanding about the Armed Forces and Veterans..something vey close to my heart..something they share with Liberal Dumboprats the useless Green Party. Yes Tories are useless but when it comes to defence of the realm, do me a favour...better them in charge than the party of Foot, Wilson, B Liar and dipshit Brown...all parties have vets in their ranks...only Tories have quite grasped the nessesicty of defending the realm.

[Red-Robbo]

Toche mon brave...take it you appreciate the difference in Tory Politicians? Or does the usual blind anti Tory bigotry of the socialists preclude a fair assessment of their abilities?.

I have personally met ONE Liebour politician I didnt want to punch very hard and that is Jim Murphy one of the few stars of the no Campaign in Scotland. He was a decent chap, but as with all Liebour politicians on the subject of defence has a huge lack of understanding about the Armed Forces and Veterans..something vey close to my heart..something they share with Liberal Dumboprats the useless Green Party. Yes Tories are useless but when it comes to defence of the realm, do me a favour...better them in charge than the party of Foot, Wilson, B Liar and dipshit Brown...all parties have vets in their ranks...only Tories have quite grasped the nessesicty of defending the realm.

I take it you've missed the recent defence cuts.

I think Ashdown (lib dem) is the only recent party leader to have served in the forces btw.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I take it you've missed the recent defence cuts.

I think Ashdown (lib dem) is the only recent party leader to have served in the forces btw.

 

oh I don't know, Tony did a great impression of a WW1 general.

[Red-Robbo]

oh I don't know, Tony did a great impression of a WW1 general.

Or Churchill perhaps? He dreamt up the morass of the Gallipoli landings.

I'm touched that Bucks Red can follow my postings where I've criticised various Labour leaders and talked about how I'm an undecided voter who has voted in all different ways in the past, but was so disillusioned that I didn't even bother at the last Euros, and glean that I'm some sort of Dave Spart figure.

Running my own business I am in fact a super-capitalist pigdog! Oh and I've been in the Army too. Once. A long, long time ago thank God!

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Or Churchill perhaps? He dreamt up the morass of the Gallipoli landings.

I'm touched that Bucks Red can follow my postings where I've criticised various Labour leaders and talked about how I'm an undecided voter who has voted in all different ways in the past, but was so disillusioned that I didn't even bother at the last Euros, and glean that I'm some sort of Dave Spart figure.

Running my own business I am in fact a super-capitalist pigdog! Oh and I've been in the Army too. Once. A long, long time ago thank God!

 

indeed, but boy didn't he come up trumps the 2nd time around, yes plenty of mistakes/failures that happens in 'just' wars but thank god we had him in charge to make some of the most difficult decisions a PM has ever had too make.

[Red-Robbo]

indeed, but boy didn't he come up trumps the 2nd time around, yes plenty of mistakes/failures that happens in 'just' wars but thank god we had him in charge to make some of the most difficult decisions a PM has ever had too make.

He made the brilliant political call that Nazism had to be opposed. At the time he said it, it wasn't a fashionable sentiment outside the far left. He foresaw that there could be no political bartering with such pepole and made a brilliant, inspiring figurehead when he was called to lead.

For that - and I'm getting in Gobbers' mode here - this country will forever owe a debt of gratitude to the man. Whatever his mistakes before and after.

The generals in the second conflict were much more successful at keeping Winston and the other politicians away from the ops room. Which is as it should be!

[Esmond Million's Bung]

He made the brilliant political call that Nazism had to be opposed. At the time he said it, it wasn't a fashionable sentiment outside the far left. He foresaw that there could be no political bartering with such pepole and made a brilliant, inspiring figurehead when he was called to lead.

For that - and I'm getting in Gobbers' mode here - this country will forever owe a debt of gratitude to the man. Whatever his mistakes before and after.

The generals in the second conflict were much more successful at keeping Winston and the other politicians away from the ops room. Which is as it should be!

 

and Churchill did an even better job of keeping the French at bay and in general out of the loop.

[Red-Robbo]

and Churchill did an even better job of keeping the French at bay and in general out of the loop.

Didn't he say "the biggest cross I have to bear is the Cross of Lorraine"?

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Didn't he say "the biggest cross I have to bear is the Cross of Lorraine"?

 

Another flawed hero of mine T E Lawrence also said after another liberal coalition disaster presided over by Lloyd George after they reneged on their promise to the Arabs in WW1 at the 1920 Paris conference. "The people of England have been led in Mesopotamia into a trap from which it will be hard to escape with dignity and honour.'

 

By **** was he right 94 years on.

 

The old ones are still the best.

[Red-Robbo]

Another flawed hero of mine T E Lawrence also said after another liberal coalition disaster presided over by Lloyd George after they reneged on their promise to the Arabs in WW1 at the 1920 Paris conference. "The people of England have been led in Mesopotamia into a trap from which it will be hard to escape with dignity and honour.'

By **** was he right 94 years on.

The old ones are still the best.

Aye. My former father-in-law was in the Somerset Light Infantry, who have Jellalabad (sp?) principle among their battle honours. He'd studied that war and he told me years back what a vipers nest it would be sending troops to Afghanistan.

Lessons of the past not learned!

[chipdawg]

Toche mon brave...take it you appreciate the difference in Tory Politicians? Or does the usual blind anti Tory bigotry of the socialists preclude a fair assessment of their abilities?.

I have personally met ONE Liebour politician I didnt want to punch very hard and that is Jim Murphy one of the few stars of the no Campaign in Scotland. He was a decent chap, but as with all Liebour politicians on the subject of defence has a huge lack of understanding about the Armed Forces and Veterans..something vey close to my heart..something they share with Liberal Dumboprats the useless Green Party. Yes Tories are useless but when it comes to defence of the realm, do me a favour...better them in charge than the party of Foot, Wilson, B Liar and dipshit Brown...all parties have vets in their ranks...only Tories have quite grasped the nessesicty of defending the realm.

I can't be the only one who's spotted the irony of accusing Red-Robbo of "blind anti Tory bigotry", and then repeatedly referring to "Liebour" and "The Liberal Dumbocrats"? Is blind anti-Labour and anti-Lib Dem "bigotry" more acceptable?

[Esmond Million's Bung]

So it would appear even Tony Benn wasn't keen on inheritance tax, obviously only intended for people who live in the real world, bless him.

[The Batman]

So it would appear even Tony Benn wasn't keen on inheritance tax, obviously only intended for people who live in the real world, bless him.

 

I was about to start a new thread about him, but thought there might be something in here.

 

Yes, Socialism strikes again. What's mine is theirs, what's theirs is theirs.

 

Do people not realise socialism only applies to everyone else, and only redistribute everyone else's money.

 

Of course, any time you criticise them, the name calling starts. It's hilarious.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I was about to start a new thread about him, but thought there might be something in here.

 

Yes, Socialism strikes again. What's mine is theirs, what's theirs is theirs.

 

Do people not realise socialism only applies to everyone else, and only redistribute everyone else's money.

 

Of course, any time you criticise them, the name calling starts. It's hilarious.

 

The sad state of UK politics IMHO is thus.

 

The Tories are *****, everybody knows that they are ***** and they make no secret of the fact that they are *****. Cameron is a **** and many in his own think he's a ****.

 

Labour keep telling us that only the Tories are *****, but actually when they get into power they are just at least as big ***** as the Tories, which IMHO makes them the biggest ***** of all, many of his own party think Miliband is a **** and especially the ones who bring in the money and in general the country thinks he's a ****.

 

Lib Dems actually did the right thing when at the time the country actually needed a majority government and now they are paying the inevitable price, a price they would also have paid had they got into bed with Labour,  the only good thing for them is they can promise any old shit, they will never have to deliver it.

 

Farage is just a ****.

 

But here is the saddest thing of all the electorate are so pissed off with our lying, sleazy, thieving, answer avoiding political elite, that many are willing to vote UKIP another party who fulfil the lying, sleazy, thieving, answer avoiding job description and even more sadder is if the Tories put Boris up as their leader in May 2015, there is an incredible chance he could beat anybody that Labour could up and probably head off UKIP to boot and why would people vote UKIP or Boris?, do the people believe UKIP or Boris will be good for the country?, do they ****, the people are fed up with all of the political elite virtually to a man and are prepared to send the country to hell in hand cart and the only ones who don't get it? are the 2 major parties because they are all *****.

 

Amen.

[Calculus]

The sad state of UK politics IMHO is thus.

 

The Tories are *****, everybody knows that they are ***** and they make no secret of the fact that they are *****. Cameron is a **** and many in his own think he's a ****.

 

Labour keep telling us that only the Tories are *****, but actually when they get into power they are just at least as big ***** as the Tories, which IMHO makes them the biggest ***** of all, many of his own party think Miliband is a **** and especially the ones who bring in the money and in general the country thinks he's a ****.

 

Lib Dems actually did the right thing when at the time the country actually needed a majority government and now they are paying the inevitable price, a price they would also have paid had they got into bed with Labour,  the only good thing for them is they can promise any old shit, they will never have to deliver it.

 

Farage is just a ****.

 

But here is the saddest thing of all the electorate are so pissed off with our lying, sleazy, thieving, answer avoiding political elite, that many are willing to vote UKIP another party who fulfil the lying, sleazy, thieving, answer avoiding job description and even more sadder is if the Tories put Boris up as their leader in May 2015, there is an incredible chance he could beat anybody that Labour could up and probably head off UKIP to boot and why would people vote UKIP or Boris?, do the people believe UKIP or Boris will be good for the country?, do they ****, the people are fed up with all of the political elite virtually to a man and are prepared to send the country to hell in hand cart and the only ones who don't get it? are the 2 major parties because they are all *****.

 

Amen.

You don't write leaders for The Spectator do you?

[Red-Robbo]

[Esmond Million's Bung]

[Red-Robbo]

They are ALL at it, they are ALL great at telling the rest of us what to do and then because they can, they do the complete opposite, him and his wife tied all of this up for tax avoidance purposes and you know it, the house may have been in his dead wifes name, but for most of us in the real world the house is the main/only asset and would go to the surviving spouse, that's people in the real world people survive, you know the people Benn claimed to be a defender of.

Did he or his wife break the law? of course not, like all tax avoidance dodges it is only there for one section of society, a section that he was a fully paid up member of, but what he did was morally wrong and after a lifetime of banging on about distribution of wealth, another socialist is exposed as a charlatan.

But once again you confuse socialism with being a trappist monk. It does not mean you have to go around giving your possessions away and wearing a hair shirt.

Benn was born into great wealth and could have used that wealth to build up an even bigger fortune, like the Thatchers. Instead he spent his long life campaigning for causes he believed in, refused to take a ministers salary and had no outside directorships or other paid work. The Mail story is incorrect as he did not own the house he is said to have transferred to his kids. It's owned by a trust composed of the wider family.

I often disagreed with him politically, but he struck me as an honest man. And having met him a couple of times, I can say he was also a nice man.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

But once again you confuse socialism with being a trappist monk. It does not mean you have to go around giving your possessions away and wearing a hair shirt.

Benn was born into great wealth and could have used that wealth to build up an even bigger fortune, like the Thatchers. Instead he spent his long life campaigning for causes he believed in, refused to take a ministers salary and had no outside directorships or other paid work. The Mail story is incorrect as he did not own the house he is said to have transferred to his kids. It's owned by a trust composed of the wider family.

I often disagreed with him politically, but he struck me as an honest man. And having met him a couple of times, I can say he was also a nice man.

 

Tax avoidance then simple as and flies in the face of his distribution of wealth mantra, who apart from his family benefited from the distribution of his wealth?.

 

Perhaps his time as a politician would have been better spent, explaining to the many, how to protect their assets from the taxman and being distributed.

 

I would like to add a post script here, if I was as wealthy as Benn would I have done the same, you're damn right I would, but I never claimed to be a socialist. As for Trappist monks I suspect that they are more likely to distribute their meagre wealth than was the case here.

[Red-Robbo]

Tax avoidance then simple as and flies in the face of his distribution of wealth mantra, who apart from his family benefited from the distribution of his wealth?.

Perhaps his time as a politician would have been better spent, explaining to the many, how to protect their assets from the taxman and being distributed.

I would like to add a post script here, if I was as wealthy as Benn would I have done the same, you're damn right I would, but I never claimed to be a socialist.

Just as well, as I'm not sure you fully understand the term!

You don't seem to get that the house the story was on about was not owned by Benn therefore not his asset and not his to "protect" or otherwise.

Leaving that aside, you and I will probably agree that inheritance tax as it currently operates in the UK is ridiculous.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Just as well, as I'm not sure you fully understand the term!

You don't seem to get that the house the story was on about was not owned by Benn therefore not his asset and not his to "protect" or otherwise.

Leaving that aside, you and I will probably agree that inheritance tax as it currently operates in the UK is ridiculous.

 

it's ridiculous especially when highlighted by cases such as this.

 

As for the ownership of the house that was purely for tax purposes and you know it, in the same way I am damn sure that another distribution wealth left wing firebrand and multi property owner Michael Meacher has protected his huge 'property is theft' portfolio and I daresay all of the rest of the Tories, Labour, Lib Dems, UKIP and Greens.

[Red-Robbo]

it's ridiculous especially when highlighted by cases such as this.

As for the ownership of the house that was purely for tax purposes and you know it, in the same way I am damn sure that another distribution wealth left wing firebrand and multi property owner Michael Meacher has protected his huge 'property is theft' portfolio and I daresay all of the rest of the Tories, Labour, Lib Dems, UKIP and Greens.

I guess Meacher used his earnings to invest in property which is probably better than buying shares in arms companies or mines running on virtual slave labour I suppose.

If he'd specifically spoken against second home ownership then that would make him a hypocrite. If not he's just an entrepreneur in the same way this board always praises Lee Johnson for being.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I guess Meacher used his earnings to invest in property which is probably better than buying shares in arms companies or mines running on virtual slave labour I suppose.

If he'd specifically spoken against second home ownership then that would make him a hypocrite. If not he's just an entrepreneur in the same way this board always praises Lee Johnson for being.

 

There you go.

 

and will explain a little deeper our conversation a couple of weeks ago about property in Wimbledon, perhaps.

 

[Red-Robbo]

There you go.

and will explain a little deeper our conversation a couple of weeks ago about property in Wimbledon, perhaps.

Surprised you're a fan of socialist comedian Mark Thomas. I thought they were all the devil incarnate, based on your experiences of not wanting to join a union in the 1970s.

Anyway, my reaction to that clip is. So? It appears you aren't the only one who thinks any politician to the left of Genghis Khan should live in some sort of unworldly state of monasticism.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Surprised you're a fan of socialist comedian Mark Thomas. I thought they were all the devil incarnate, based on your experiences of not wanting to join a union in the 1970s.

Anyway, my reaction to that clip is. So? It appears you aren't the only one who thinks any politician to the left of Genghis Khan should live in some sort of unworldly state of monasticism.

 

or do what I say not what I do or just plain hypocrite.

 

Why write books telling us what we should be doing and then do completely the opposite?

[Red-Robbo]

or do what I say not what I do or just plain hypocrite.

Why write books telling us what we should be doing and then do completely the opposite?

Why even bring it up?

I point out that outright fraud was involved in the transfer of Mrs Thatcher's multi-million pound estate to her kids and your counter is to bring up some peripheral Labour figure from decades ago who quite legally bought some houses!

You should spend more time reading Private Eye and less on the Mail Online. It'll give you a much better picture of how Britain is today.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Why even bring it up?

I point out that outright fraud was involved in the transfer of Mrs Thatcher's multi-million pound estate to her kids and your counter is to bring up some peripheral Labour figure from decades ago who quite legally bought some houses!

You should spend more time reading Private Eye and less on the Mail Online. It'll give you a much better picture of how Britain is today.

 

I think your memory is playing tricks on you old bean, I brought up Benn and you brought up Thatcher. 

 

But I will say you do have all the credentials for working as a hack on the DM, making up stories.

 

I will say this slowly THE TORIES ARE *****, FFS they can't even find somebody to head up an enquiry that hasn't broken bread with Leon Brittan at one time or another but deep down an overwhelming majority of the political elite are exactly the same.

 

The Tories bang on about people paying their taxes and abusing 'the system', they write books with that message firmly ingrained in them and then find ways of not paying their taxes and abusing the system because they are ***** and far too many Labour warriors bang on about distribution of wealth and write books telling us about that ideology, sadly it's usually not their wealth they are talking about.

 

You can throw all of the ill informed insults you like at me, I couldn't give a ****, but you are far to precious about the Labour party, Ed is calling a life of spin awaits if you want it.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

DP

[Red-Robbo]

I think your memory is playing tricks on you old bean, I brought up Benn and you brought up Thatcher.

But I will say you do have all the credentials for working as a hack on the DM, making up stories.

I will say this slowly THE TORIES ARE *****, FFS they can't even find somebody to head up an enquiry that hasn't broken bread with Leon Brittan at one time or another but deep down an overwhelming majority of the political elite are exactly the same.

The Tories bang on about people paying their taxes and abusing 'the system', they write books with that message firmly ingrained in them and then find ways of not paying their taxes and abusing the system because they are ***** and far too many Labour warriors bang on about distribution of wealth and write books telling us about that ideology, sadly it's usually not their wealth they are talking about.

You can throw all of the ill informed insults you like at me, I couldn't give a ****, but you are far to precious about the Labour party, Ed is calling a life of spin awaits if you want it.

You brought up an incorrect story - a smear if you like - suggesting Benn was a hypocrite for avoiding inheritance tax. I mentioned a relevant related story about how Maggie not only avoiding inheritance tax but all other taxes and yet again you leap to the Tories' defence by talking about some bloke from Labour's distant past who bought some houses once. WTF does that have to do with inheritance tax avoidance? You should change your board name to Roger Irrelevant.

What amuses me about your posts here Es is that you so vehemently deny being a Tory when it's clear from your political viewpoint, terminology, sources of reference, continuing defence of them that you actually ARE a Tory. Every frame of reference for you screams it. Why be ashamed? I know lots of Conservatives, I even voted for them once. Next election, I'll probably vote Lib Dem however.

When it comes to insults though, check your own posts mate. Yours are littered with them. I'm an ill-informed hack journalist who makes things up am I? If you say so Boris...