Negative Mindset/substitutions

[screech]

Good post. The point is, had SC listened to the opinion of the fans, he would've made attacking substitutions, made defensive substitutions, brought on JET, sold JET, left JET out of the squad, played five up top, played six at the back, played a diamond formation... He can't please everybody all of the time, which is why he makes the important decisions. And by the look of our league position he is calling the majority of them correctly. Amen to that.

 

Why doesn't he play long ball football as well? We could have tried that to get some of our fans on his back, this unbeaten run crap is doing my nut, if he had anything about him we would have won every game we played.

Poxy manager, will probably lose a few games this season too.

[downendcity]

Have you read the entire thread or just page 2? What you thought Jeff meant isn't the case when you read his next post.

 

 

 

MRR,

 

Worse than that. I thought I was answering a post on the "Not Good Enough Thread" so read and responded to your post completely out of context - my apologies! 

 

Having said that, on  a more general basis, reading many posts on OTIB since the Fleetwood game, my comments are valid given the complete overreaction and speculation from many posters as to what Cotts might have/could have /should have done to avoid dropping points.

 

Some City fans must have been besides themselves with frustration seeing our good start to the season. They have been waiting patiently for a chink of light at the end of the tunnel, signalling the possibility that our unbeaten run and topping the table might soon be at an end. This will herald a resumption of normal service, so they can get back to doing what they know and do best, namely finding fault with the team's, the players' and the manager's performances.

 

I'm not saying everything is perfect at the moment, but I am happy to enjoy a period of relative success, during which the manager and players are getting a lot more right than they are getting wrong. Long may it continue.

[Talk Of The Town]

I'm sick to death of this winning streak we've had recently. Can we please get that dower loser o'driscoll back please

[And Its Smith]

Ah, forgot the rule that you aren't aloud an opinion if you don't attend the game, ever so sorry sir.

The game yesterday was one of only two games I've missed this season, so I think I'm very much entitled to my opinion thankyou.

Oh my word. I literally need to spell it out.

You are entitled to your opinion on games you have watched and I congratulate you on seeing so many games already this season. A lot of people are not in a position to see so many games and come on here to get INFORMED opinions on how games have gone.

Your opening post was written in the style of someone who went to the game. The language used implied you were there. Your opinion on yesterday's game is from a commentator.

Perhaps you'd like to post your marks out of ten?!

[Aussie]

To be fair that opening post was read by me as if written by someone who was there.

[RedM]

So, with Team effort we drew the game, but with Squad effort we might have won it?

[Esmond Million's Bung]

So, with Team effort we drew the game, but with Squad effort we might have won it?

 

or lost it?

[Robin1988]

Ah, forgot the rule that you aren't aloud an opinion if you don't attend the game, ever so sorry sir.

The game yesterday was one of only two games I've missed this season, so I think I'm very much entitled to my opinion thankyou.

It does weaken your argument somewhat to base it upon other people's opinions. Or just going by the score.

[RedM]

or lost it?

Ah yes, I have forgotten that option. It's been a while.

[spudski]

The real problem with threads like this are, people are trying to suggest as matter of 'fact' that, we dropped points because of substitutions either through lack of, lateness of or wrong ones, of course by the same token had SC listened to the advice we could have dropped even more points, who knows? certainly not the forum mystic Meg's. Constructive critique is fine, like 'what might have happened if?', opinion is fine but to suggest it to be pretty much a statement of fact is ridiculous.

 

The FACT's that actually matter are 11 league games unbeaten, 4 points clear at the top of the league, 17 leagues games unbeaten in total, 1 defeat in the last 24 league games, 3 of our last 5 defeats were against the 3 promoted teams last season and the other 2 were against teams expect to be amongst our rivals this season.

 

What I love is the incredible shift in expectation from 12 months ago. 12 months ago we were still 3 WEEKS AWAY from our first league win of the season and yet people were saying crap like, 'what did you expect, playing against them', 'we are in transition', 'we only lost by the odd goal' and our leader was telling us to 'expect more pain'.

 

The unchanged squad that we have put out consistently over the past 5/6 games, contains 9 of last seasons squad from a year ago and as I said in a previous thread, they couldn't beat a ******* egg, so a lot has changed and pretty much all for the good, it's time to forget the apocalypse that many predicted when SC took over and support him, whether you don't like his accent or his interviews, it seems to me the most important people at the club like him and that is the players and that's another change for the good.

Excellent facts... I'll also add to them.

In the last three games...it is a fact, that we have conceded two goal leads in the second half, and each time, SC has conceded that we didn't play the same way in the latter parts of the second half, that got us that two goal advantage in the first place.

He also say's he doesn't know the reason for it.

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

MRR,

 

Worse than that. I thought I was answering a post on the "Not Good Enough Thread" so read and responded to your post completely out of context - my apologies! 

 

Having said that, on  a more general basis, reading many posts on OTIB since the Fleetwood game, my comments are valid given the complete overreaction and speculation from many posters as to what Cotts might have/could have /should have done to avoid dropping points.

 

Some City fans must have been besides themselves with frustration seeing our good start to the season. They have been waiting patiently for a chink of light at the end of the tunnel, signalling the possibility that our unbeaten run and topping the table might soon be at an end. This will herald a resumption of normal service, so they can get back to doing what they know and do best, namely finding fault with the team's, the players' and the manager's performances.

 

I'm not saying everything is perfect at the moment, but I am happy to enjoy a period of relative success, during which the manager and players are getting a lot more right than they are getting wrong. Long may it continue.

 

Thanks for this. We're peas in a pod as far as your thoughts go. Well said.

[Major Isewater]

Excellent facts... I'll also add to them.

In the last three games...it is a fact, that we have conceded two goal leads in the second half, and each time, SC has conceded that we didn't play the same way in the latter parts of the second half, that got us that two goal advantage in the first place.

He also say's he doesn't know the reason for it.

 

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Excellent facts... I'll also add to them.

In the last three games...it is a fact, that we have conceded two goal leads in the second half, and each time, SC has conceded that we didn't play the same way in the latter parts of the second half, that got us that two goal advantage in the first place.

He also say's he doesn't know the reason for it.

 

You might want to re-visit what you claim to be facts, because your facts are incorrect.

 

As for your last sentence do you know as a fact the reason for it.

[Aussie]

Excellent facts... I'll also add to them.

In the last three games...it is a fact, that we have conceded two goal leads in the second half, and each time, SC has conceded that we didn't play the same way in the latter parts of the second half, that got us that two goal advantage in the first place.

He also say's he doesn't know the reason for it.

I knew had a few Guinnesses before the game yesterday but bugger me I missed two goals completely

[Robin1988]

As for your last sentence do you know as a fact the reason for it.

I don't think there is a black and white answer. Against Fleetwood, they pulled it back to 3-2 - you'd think they'd be the ones piling on the pressure from that, far from it. We went the closest to scoring through Smith before Dobbie's screamer. Again, yesterday, Fielding's been challenged twice all game; the Forde effort in the first half, and the goal, again a blinder.

 

It's curious that we've won more points from losing positions than we've dropped from winning ones; the divide in coverage seems rather perverse.

[spudski]

You might want to re-visit what you claim to be facts, because your facts are incorrect.

 

As for your last sentence do you know as a fact the reason for it.

Doh...but you get my drift...

So we were 3-1 up at Fleetwood and conceded two goals in the second half to make it 3-3.

We were 2-0 up against Dons and conceded two goals in the second half...then got a winner to make it 3-2.

One nil up against Walsall then conceded a late goal again for a 1-1 draw.

 

There is a pattern forming. If you were at the games you would see it.

 

As for the reason for it? I'm not the manager...he works with them everyday...if he doesn't know, how are we?

[GodEmperor Palpatine]

I don't think there is a black and white answer. Against Fleetwood, they pulled it back to 3-2 - you'd think they'd be the ones piling on the pressure from that, far from it. We went the closest to scoring through Smith before Dobbie's screamer. Again, yesterday, Fielding's been challenged twice all game; the Forde effort in the first half, and the goal, again a blinder.

 

It's curious that we've won more points from losing positions than we've dropped from winning ones; the divide in coverage seems rather perverse.

 

Just to point out Walsall were deserving of a point and probably more... Fielding wasn't tested as much due to last ditch blocks and weak efforts in front of goal. A more clinical team would've stuck a couple of those chances away.

 

We were under pressure a lot and the whole performance from City was lethargic

[GodEmperor Palpatine]

Doh...but you get my drift...

So we were 3-1 up at Fleetwood and conceded two goals in the second half to make it 3-3.

We were 2-0 up against Dons and conceded two goals in the second half...then got a winner to make it 3-2.

One nil up against Walsall then conceded a late goal again for a 1-1 draw.

 

There is a pattern forming. If you were at the games you would see it.

 

As for the reason for it? I'm not the manager...he works with them everyday...if he doesn't know, how are we?

 

Rochdale included Spud.. 1 up and drew 1-1.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Doh...but you get my drift...

So we were 3-1 up at Fleetwood and conceded two goals in the second half to make it 3-3.

We were 2-0 up against Dons and conceded two goals in the second half...then got a winner to make it 3-2.

One nil up against Walsall then conceded a late goal again for a 1-1 draw.

 

There is a pattern forming. If you were at the games you would see it.

 

As for the reason for it? I'm not the manager...he works with them everyday...if he doesn't know, how are we?

 

Earlier in the season we were conceding goals to some questionable defending, to be fair that seems to be slowly but surely improving, recently I think it would be fair to say that we have been on the wrong end of some very good goals and a couple of wonder strikes.

 

Also all of the talk about substitutions is not only guess work but sort of implies that somehow BCFC are the only team who can actually influence the end result, as somebody pointed out yesterday there are 2 teams on the field playing not just BCFC.

 

and finally if that is all that is going wrong for us on this wonderful unbeaten run, it's been 5 years in coming and long may it last, 12 months ago was the undoubted lowest point of all.

[cityexile]

I think it is fair to remind us how far we have come in a year, it is easy to forget!

Equally, I do not see this horde of hidden posters waiting for things to go wrong, so they can enjoy having a go at Cotts. I can only talk for myself, but I enjoy talking football in general, and about City in particular. Yes of course there is a bit of 'armchair management' in it, but do not mistake that for being anything other than delighted when we win.

I think it is a fair observation to say Cotts is reluctant to use subs. Its pure speculation to know whether it would have made a difference. Even if he was 100% right not to use any, that in itself is a worry, that we have no one on the bench who, even as fresh legs, can just slip in.

It may be (speculation again...) that from a poor side Cotts has built us a quality first eleven. He may also simply need more time to build us a quality squad. I would have been happy with the play offs before the season started, as showing real progress. Expectations as has been said have changed, but would still be happy.

None of that is critical of Cotts. It is however observations as to what we may still need to do to build a title winning side, and a world away from hoping we do badly.

I do not know, but I suspect if I went on to a Real Madrid fans forum even there they may have debates about went well, could have gone better, on any given day.

[Robin1988]

Just to point out Walsall were deserving of a point and probably more... Fielding wasn't tested as much due to last ditch blocks and weak efforts in front of goal. A more clinical team would've stuck a couple of those chances away.

We were under pressure a lot and the whole performance from City was lethargic

Why do you cast 'last-ditch blocks' aside as though good defending isn't important? Bizarre.

[GodEmperor Palpatine]

Why do you cast 'last-ditch blocks' aside as though good defending isn't important? Bizarre.

 

Nice spin...

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I think it is fair to remind us how far we have come in a year, it is easy to forget!

Equally, I do not see this horde of hidden posters waiting for things to go wrong, so they can enjoy having a go at Cotts. I can only talk for myself, but I enjoy talking football in general, and about City in particular. Yes of course there is a bit of 'armchair management' in it, but do not mistake that for being anything other than delighted when we win.

I think it is a fair observation to say Cotts is reluctant to use subs. Its pure speculation to know whether it would have made a difference. Even if he was 100% right not to use any, that in itself is a worry, that we have no one on the bench who, even as fresh legs, can just slip in.

It may be (speculation again...) that from a poor side Cotts has built us a quality first eleven. He may also simply need more time to build us a quality squad. I would have been happy with the play offs before the season started, as showing real progress. Expectations as has been said have changed, but would still be happy.

None of that is critical of Cotts. It is however observations as to what we may still need to do to build a title winning side, and a world away from hoping we do badly.

I do not know, but I suspect if I went on to a Real Madrid fans forum even there they may have debates about went well, could have gone better, on any given day.

 

I agree with this and especially the highlighted part, I can see a lot of the bench and some other fringe players moving to pastures new, perhaps even some during the january window.

[Robin1988]

Nice spin...

How ironic.

We didn't have battlers throwing themselves in front of things last season, or at least for the first part. Now you cast it as though a negative. Every team has to do it, even good ones. Remember GJ's 'granny in the goal' spiel, which happened to co-incide with his successful years?

[Who Are Rovers?]

Oh my word. I literally need to spell it out.

You are entitled to your opinion on games you have watched and I congratulate you on seeing so many games already this season. A lot of people are not in a position to see so many games and come on here to get INFORMED opinions on how games have gone.

Your opening post was written in the style of someone who went to the game. The language used implied you were there. Your opinion on yesterday's game is from a commentator.

Perhaps you'd like to post your marks out of ten?!

But the point of the post was suggesting the negative tactics, and this leading to throwing points away.

Fortunately enough, I was at the Rochdale, Fleetwood and MK Dons games where we did throw away points, and in the MK Dons game came close to doing so, the same problem occured. This thread wasn't just referring to one game, this is a thene that has ran throughout the season.

I understand you having a moan for me being 'negative,' but can you not understand my point?

[Robin1988]

But the point of the post was suggesting the negative tactics, and this leading to throwing points away.

Fortunately enough, I was at the Rochdale, Fleetwood and MK Dons games where we did throw away points, and in the MK Dons game came close to doing so, the same problem occured. This thread wasn't just referring to one game, this is a thene that has ran throughout the season.

I understand you having a moan for me being 'negative,' but can you not understand my point?

Is that the Rochdale game where we conceded 10 minutes after half time when Keith Hill's team talk had an immediate effect?

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

I understand you having a moan for me being 'negative,' but can you not understand my point?

 

And can you understand the point that whilst we are unbeaten etc,etc that talk of negative mindset is as equally unwarranted as talk of walking the league with SC as god?

 

I don't think either is remotely accurate. Even if you ignore the shambles of the past few seasons and taking this season in isolation, we've got a new team doing well but still learning and hopefully improving. 

 

One thing I really don't understand is how away draws are so say "throwing away points"? - it's as if we are so much better than anyone else that unless we win , we have seriously cocked up.

 

Just out of interest, would it make a great deal of difference if we were down 2-0 or 1-0 and fought back to still earn an away draw?

 

We are not the only good team in our division and not the only team on the pitch wanting to win the game.

 

Jeez- I dread to think how a loss is going to go down on here.

[downendcity]

And can you understand the point that whilst we are unbeaten etc,etc that talk of negative mindset is as equally unwarranted as talk of walking the league with SC as god?

 

I don't think either is remotely accurate. Even if you ignore the shambles of the past few seasons and taking this season in isolation, we've got a new team doing well but still learning and hopefully improving. 

 

One thing I really don't understand is how away draws are so say "throwing away points"? - it's as if we are so much better than anyone else that unless we win , we have seriously cocked up.

 

Just out of interest, would it make a great deal of difference if we were down 2-0 or 1-0 and fought back to still earn an away draw?

 

We are not the only good team in our division and not the only team on the pitch wanting to win the game.

 

Jeez- I dread to think how a loss is going to go down on here.

 

Samaritan's phone number on speed dial?

Counsellor's on hand at Ashton Gate?

Anti-depressants out of stock at chemists south of the river?

Doctor's surgeries full to overflowing around Bristol?

OTIB in melt down?

[And Its Smith]

But the point of the post was suggesting the negative tactics, and this leading to throwing points away.

Fortunately enough, I was at the Rochdale, Fleetwood and MK Dons games where we did throw away points, and in the MK Dons game came close to doing so, the same problem occured. This thread wasn't just referring to one game, this is a thene that has ran throughout the season.

I understand you having a moan for me being 'negative,' but can you not understand my point?

I don't think you do understand. I haven't once moaned at you being negative. I don't care if you are positive or negative. It has no effect on me. I have said that you posted as if you were there. As if your opinion had substance. It didn't. Not for this game as you were not there.

[spudski]

Earlier in the season we were conceding goals to some questionable defending, to be fair that seems to be slowly but surely improving, recently I think it would be fair to say that we have been on the wrong end of some very good goals and a couple of wonder strikes.

 

Also all of the talk about substitutions is not only guess work but sort of implies that somehow BCFC are the only team who can actually influence the end result, as somebody pointed out yesterday there are 2 teams on the field playing not just BCFC.

 

and finally if that is all that is going wrong for us on this wonderful unbeaten run, it's been 5 years in coming and long may it last, 12 months ago was the undoubted lowest point of all.

To be honest, I think a lot is being misunderstood on this thread.

Nothing is taken as a given, and we all know we have had a good start.

 

However...some, and the manager have acknowledged that in the last 3-4 games we have conceded goals whilst playing differently to how we got in front in the first place. We have sat back and let teams come at us.

SC has said he doesn't know why it has happened.

So in saying that, it must be a concern to him why his players revert to letting teams come at them, instead of playing the way they did when they got in front. If he is not in control and able to change things on the pitch to negate that pressure...then that has to be a worry.

It's a negative side to our game that is creeping in...we've got away with it for now, but if it is ignored now, and results start to change then all our good work will have gone to waste.

It's no point ignoring it and sticking our head in the sand hoping it will go away, just because results have been positive.

I do see it as points dropped, rather than won, as we have been in winning positions and lost it...we haven't fought back to draw.

It has to be nipped in the bud now...or it will grow and be harder to stop.

 

Our real test will come, when we are losing and maybe two down.

 

I've yet to witness us change the way we play under instruction.

 

SC has said, that he has hoped in games that the players will click again during a game and that it will all come good.

 

Well the time will come when you can't rely on 'hope' and as a manager you have to make change and get the players to do things differently on the park to negate the opposition.

 

I've not witnessed that yet.

 

This is not being negative...but being pro active...be ready before hand... not reactionary.

 

Long may our run continue...but lets do it in control.