B-Rizzle Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 So, there are basically three possibilities here... 1) He raped her and is guilty. He has served his time but needs to acknolwedge his crime and show some remorse so that he can be properly rehabilitated back into society. As I've mentioned early if he had taken this approach I think he would be a Sheff Utd player by now and this whole thing would have calmed down. 2) He raped her and is guilty but won't acknowledge his crime or show remorse and is therefore being ridiculed for this and is finding it very hard to find a club to sign him because of this. 3) He didn't rape her, it was consensual and he is innocent. He will naturally fight/appeal his conviction to clear his name. As with number 2, until such time comes that he is cleared he is going to be ridiculed for his lack of remorse and will find it very hard to find a club to sign him. Ched Evans has missed the boat as far as option 1 goes which leaves us in this extremely messy grey area somewhere between options 2 and 3. Everyone has their own opinions but only he really knows the truth of what happened. He's only got himself to blame and there's a very good chance he's ruined his professional football career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I would have thought it was patently obvious. No, it isn't. Why should he not be able to perform the role best suited for his abilities if there is no need to protect those he works with? The fact that may be kicking a ball is neither here nor there. Would you rather he runs the door or is a toilet attendant at a nightclub? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Could easily have been written by the Daily Mail, "scouring the streets" ffs. Equally there will always be people looking to profit from vulnerable footballers in privileged positions. I use the word vulnerable as a means of being particularly susceptible to conviction, not that I feel sorry for him. OK, pray explain Mcdonald's text to Evans, "got a bird". Because it would appear that Evans took it to mean 'for us both' and his mates obviously took it to mean 'we'll document it on video'. Evans says Mcdonald was there when she consented, Mcdonald says he wasn't. Mcdonald had the decency to leave by the front door and even ask the receptionist 'to keep an eye on her', whilst Evans crept out on the fire escape and just left her. The whole night could been written by the Daily Mail and Evans was the author not me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 So, there are basically three possibilities here... 1) He raped her and is guilty. He has served his time but needs to acknolwedge his crime and show some remorse so that he can be properly rehabilitated back into society. As I've mentioned early if he had taken this approach I think he would be a Sheff Utd player by now and this whole thing would have calmed down. 2) He raped her and is guilty but won't acknowledge his crime or show remorse and is therefore being ridiculed for this and is finding it very hard to find a club to sign him because of this. 3) He didn't rape her, it was consensual and he is innocent. He will naturally fight/appeal his conviction to clear his name. As with number 2, until such time comes that he is cleared he is going to be ridiculed for his lack of remorse and will find it very hard to find a club to sign him. Ched Evans has missed the boat as far as option 1 goes which leaves us in this extremely messy grey area somewhere between options 2 and 3. Everyone has their own opinions but only he really knows the truth of what happened. He's only got himself to blame and there's a very good chance he's ruined his professional football career. Best post on the subject yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Okay, so if I, as a man, get really drunk this Friday night - too drunk to consent to sex - and end up going home with a girl and have sex have I been raped? The answer to your question is no. As someone with a law degree, you should know that rape must involve penetration by the penis. In the circumstance you describe the girl could only ever be tried for sexual assault but not rape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 But why? I can understand preventing some offenders from some roles for prevention of reoffending but there's no reason to fear that. The nature of the beast! Any job where you are so openly exposed to the public, you are going to be judged on your actions and behaviours. People will naturally want themselves distanced from someone with such convictions and would definitely not want them to become a role model or idol for their children! Imagine the situation, you take your child to a game and they ask you why everyone I'd booing that player and then ask you what a rapist is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handsofclay Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 What gets me is the amount of people on here stating the fact that Evans was found guilty by our judicial system. Yes. But that same judicial system passed a sentence of imprisonment as his punishment that he has now served. It did not impose a prison sentence and then add that he will upon his release never be allowed to work again. Yet that is what is being advocated. And before anyone says that it's only football he is being hounded out of...are you saying it will be quite okay for him to become a baker, an accountant or a university professor? I find Evans' crime distasteful but mob mentality even more worrying. It is the people who quote our great judicial system as a reason to hit upon a felon who has done his time who then abandon that and advocate the use of mob rule which is the opposite of justice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 The nature of the beast! Any job where you are so openly exposed to the public, you are going to be judged on your actions and behaviours. People will naturally want themselves distanced from someone with such convictions and would definitely not want them to become a role model or idol for their children! Imagine the situation, you take your child to a game and they ask you why everyone I'd booing that player and then ask you what a rapist is? But the precedent is there: McCormack, Hughes, King etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshtonGreat Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 What gets me is the amount of people on here stating the fact that Evans was found guilty by our judicial system. Yes. But that same judicial system passed a sentence of imprisonment as his punishment that he has now served. It did not impose a prison sentence and then add that he will upon his release never be allowed to work again. Yet that is what is being advocated. And before anyone says that it's only football he is being hounded out of...are you saying it will be quite okay for him to become a baker, an accountant or a university professor? I find Evans' crime distasteful but mob mentality even more worrying. It is the people who quote our great judicial system as a reason to hit upon a felon who has done his time who then abandon that and advocate the use of mob rule which is the opposite of justice. You speak a lot of sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashtonboy Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Okay, so if I, as a man, get really drunk this Friday night - too drunk to consent to sex - and end up going home with a girl and have sex have I been raped? You really are a total p***k aren't you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stortz Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 What gets me is the amount of people on here stating the fact that Evans was found guilty by our judicial system. Yes. But that same judicial system passed a sentence of imprisonment as his punishment that he has now served. It did not impose a prison sentence and then add that he will upon his release never be allowed to work again. Yet that is what is being advocated. And before anyone says that it's only football he is being hounded out of...are you saying it will be quite okay for him to become a baker, an accountant or a university professor? I find Evans' crime distasteful but mob mentality even more worrying. It is the people who quote our great judicial system as a reason to hit upon a felon who has done his time who then abandon that and advocate the use of mob rule which is the opposite of justice. He is still vilifying and harassing his victim and his ongoing 'campaign' is potentially making other young lads think what he did is ok. He has hardly served his time, been rehabilitated and returned to society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redrobbin Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 No, it isn't. Why should he not be able to perform the role best suited for his abilities if there is no need to protect those he works with? The fact that may be kicking a ball is neither here nor there. Would you rather he runs the door or is a toilet attendant at a nightclub? He was of a privileged position and has abused this privileged position; in short he has blown it. Only himself to blame. He has no God given right to continue in his chosen career just because he's good at it, after such a crime. There are far more better footballers than him that didn't make the grade for whatever reason, or simply weren't spotted or where disillusioned by it all. That are making a good living alongside ourselves doing " ordinary jobs". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 But the precedent is there: McCormack, Hughes, King etc. True. It is a difficult situation. I think people tend to subconsciously think that rape is worst forgetting that though McCormack and Hughes killed people. It's not really fair to compare the two crimes, however McCormack and Hughes have always shown remorse for their actions. King is a bit different in that respect. It would be easier for Evans to find a club, if he is and was from an early stage remorseful for his actions. He will find it hard to be accepted whilst he claims to be innocent especially if his appeal is rejected Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handsofclay Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 He was of a privileged position and has abused this privileged position; in short he has blown it. Only himself to blame. He has no God given right to continue in his chosen career just because he's good at it, after such a crime. There are far more better footballers than him that didn't make the grade for whatever reason, or simply weren't spotted or where disillusioned by it all. That are making a good living alongside ourselves doing " ordinary jobs". You're right he has no god given right to play football, but equally I see no reason why he should be prevented when others have been allowed back in the game. What Lee Hughes did was absolutely deplorable. He got drunk, smashed his motor, killed and did a legger. But he was welcomed back in to the game. The only thing that makes me uneasy as I've said before is the lack of remorse... But if he truly believes he's innocent then I won't knock him for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handsofclay Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 He is still vilifying and harassing his victim and his ongoing 'campaign' is potentially making other young lads think what he did is ok. He has hardly served his time, been rehabilitated and returned to society. Then bring charges for this against him. What you advocate is a campaign of vilifying and harassing him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashtonboy Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Well you can quote me and say that sure, but why? I dont feel any differently on the matter then you. It could happen to anybody's sister or daughter etc. What I was merely pointing out was that people would be alot safer if they didnt feel the need to get so ridiculously intoxicated when going out. The state of some people in town is an embarrassment. Theres the difference. To you and I they are an embarrassment, to a rapist they are an opportunity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stortz Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Then bring charges for this against him. What you advocate is a campaign of vilifying and harassing him! You asked why people were so opposed to him playing again, I provided you an answer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handsofclay Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 So just to clarify are you saying that fans of clubs who have shown an interest in signing him are wrong to voice their opposition?, women groups are wrong to voice theirs?. No, I have said direct it at the judicial system that doesn't adequately punish criminals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 No, I have said direct it at the judicial system that doesn't adequately punish criminals. I thought the penal system was to re-habitate not punish, do you believe he is re-habilitated?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ten minutes of rough Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Now it seems it's Port Vale ! They have previous.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashtonboy Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 You're right he has no god given right to play football, but equally I see no reason why he should be prevented when others have been allowed back in the game. What Lee Hughes did was absolutely deplorable. He got drunk, smashed his motor, killed and did a legger. But he was welcomed back in to the game. The only thing that makes me uneasy as I've said before is the lack of remorse... But if he truly believes he's innocent then I won't knock him for that. There are many professions where it would not be appropriate to return after a rape conviction. I believe the entertainment industry ( including football) is one of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I thought the penal system was to re-habitate not punish, do you believe he is re-habilitated?. He is still within the penal system. He is released from prison on licence but very much still within the penal system - hence not going to Malta. He will still need to have regular meetings, attend awareness courses, discuss the offence. His release from prison does not necessarily mean hands wiped job done, but that he doesn't present a risk to society and is ready to integrate whilst continuing his rehabilitation. A necessary part of that integration is to work, if that's as a footballer I think it's damn rich to prevent him from doing so when others have been given another chance for some of the very worst crimes; like drunk driving and fleeing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 There are many professions where it would not be appropriate to return after a rape conviction. I believe the entertainment industry ( including football) is one of them Watch any Mike Tyson fights or films he's cameod in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aizoon Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 You really are a total p***k aren't you! And you seem quite incapable of answering his question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Everyone has their own opinions but only he really knows the truth of what happened. I believe that if you check, this is all well documented i.e. every sordid detail of what Ched did to this girl - it came from his own mouth (she doesn't remember a thing). It appears that what Ched can't accept is this: You can not turn up at a hotel room and invite yourself to have sex with a woman who is clearly pissed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 He is still within the penal system. He is released from prison on licence but very much still within the penal system - hence not going to Malta. He will still need to have regular meetings, attend awareness courses, discuss the offence. His release from prison does not necessarily mean hands wiped job done, but that he doesn't present a risk to society and is ready to integrate whilst continuing his rehabilitation. A necessary part of that integration is to work, if that's as a footballer I think it's damn rich to prevent him from doing so when others have been given another chance for some of the very worst crimes; like drunk driving and fleeing. I understand all of that, but I would have thought the major part of re-habilitation was recognising your offence and of that there is certainly no evidence of that whatsoever. As for the preventing of him from working, the hypocrisy here is mind blowing, people are saying I don't mind him playing football, but I wouldn't want him at my club. He is paying the price for his own arrogance, he could and should have just apologised to the girl and not just to his girlfriend and then he could have held the moral high ground over the furore about him playing again. At this moment in time he is a convicted rapist and IMHO I do not expect that to change in the future and neither do I expect Evans to suddenly 'get it'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebristolred Posted January 4, 2015 Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 I understand all of that, but I would have thought the major part of re-habilitation was recognising your offence and of that there is certainly no evidence of that whatsoever. As for the preventing of him from working, the hypocrisy here is mind blowing, people are saying I don't mind him playing football, but I wouldn't want him at my club. He is paying the price for his own arrogance, he could and should have just apologised to the girl and not just to his girlfriend and then he could have held the moral high ground over the furore about him playing again. At this moment in time he is a convicted rapist and IMHO I do not expect that to change in the future and neither do I expect Evans to suddenly 'get it'. If I believed I was innocent and if I believed that girl had mugged me off for various reasons (perhaps compensation, I'm not sure), then I sure as hell would not apologise. Admittedly, it's still pretty grim of him to do what he did even if she did consent (i.e. walk into a room where 2 people are doing it and waiting his turn) but in that case it's not an offence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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