Aussie Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 The ones I was referring to was the clip I posted and that's regular Calais Police. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS2 Red Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS2 Red Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 double post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrs Court Red Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 I somewhat doubt someone in Eritrea? Reads the Daily Mail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 I somewhat doubt someone in Eritrea? Reads the Daily Mail. or knows who UKIP are. On a day when another illegal immigrant found guilty of a sex attack cannot be sent home because of his human right to a family life, even though (it is reported) he has left his wife and kids, that's where the soft touch is, greedy lawyers acting like vultures picking the carcasses of a one sided human rights act for great personal gain and as an unemployable not will the tax payer line the pockets of these greedy lawyers but also be liable for all the benefits pay outs that will come with it. The human rights act will have to one day be confined to history and all because of the greed of the lawyers and then people who really do need it's protection will not get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS2 Red Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 I somewhat doubt someone in Eritrea? Reads the Daily Mail. I somewhat doubt my post was a serious comment on the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrs Court Red Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 I somewhat doubt my post was a serious comment on the situation. Compared to some of the nonsense on here that suggestion was positively sane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 2, 2015 Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 I think it's immoral that a single economic migrant is looked after (put into a hotel, fed, given spending money) until the very last homeless British soldier or under-nourished British pensioner is taken care of. Sorry if that's too populist for some. I agree. Unfortunately under our current government I fear that thos kind of injustice will get worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 2, 2015 Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 I agree. Unfortunately under our current government I fear that thos kind of injustice will get worse. and you believe which alternative choice of UK government would have actually changed things for the better?. This government are as shit as everybody knew they would be and any alternative government would be at least as shit and at a loss about what to do about this situation.. Firstly closing Sangatte at the request of Blunkett was a huge mistake, there was an opportunity to fund it properly and process these migrants and then either give them asylum on a pro rata basis to EU countries or repatriate the failed and the best bit of all is we could have blamed the French if anything at all went wrong and especially for not allowing them access to UK human rights gravy train lawyers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted August 2, 2015 Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 I think it's immoral that a single economic migrant is looked after (put into a hotel, fed, given spending money) until the very last homeless British soldier or under-nourished British pensioner is taken care of. Sorry if that's too populist for some. Alternatively, if a solider has gone to war to a country and killed innocent people. I'd rather a give a home to a citizen of that country seeking asylum, than that soldier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 and you believe which alternative choice of UK government would have actually changed things for the better?. This government are as shit as everybody knew they would be and any alternative government would be at least as shit and at a loss about what to do about this situation.. Firstly closing Sangatte at the request of Blunkett was a huge mistake, there was an opportunity to fund it properly and process these migrants and then either give them asylum on a pro rata basis to EU countries or repatriate the failed and the best bit of all is we could have blamed the French if anything at all went wrong and especially for not allowing them access to UK human rights gravy train lawyers. That is the underlying problem though. 5,000 sleeping rough in and around Calais, but, in the UK, thousands given free accommodation, meals and cash benefits while their case is being heard - and you wonder why they risk their lives (again) to cross the channel (I am aware that Germany and Sweden are also favoured destinations for similar reasons). And, of course, the legal process is dealt with free of charge (to the migrants) but funded by UK taxpayers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Alternatively, if a solider has gone to war to a country and killed innocent people. I'd rather a give a home to a citizen of that country seeking asylum, than that soldier Umm under the orders of his government?! I am not sure what point you are trying to make either. He/she does what is asked of them, then are dumped by their government for a foreign national. is that what you are suggesting? or are you playing devils advocate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshy Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 That is the underlying problem though. 5,000 sleeping rough in and around Calais, but, in the UK, thousands given free accommodation, meals and cash benefits while their case is being heard - and you wonder why they risk their lives (again) to cross the channel (I am aware that Germany and Sweden are also favoured destinations for similar reasons). And, of course, the legal process is dealt with free of charge (to the migrants) but funded by UK taxpayers. You have to wonder what the 500 unaccompanied minors now being cared for by Kent C.C., foster carers and social workers were doing before they reached British soil. We have a legal duty to look after them, the French would obviously be happy to see them die on the streets---or am I being too harsh. I don't know, I don't live there. From what I read in the French press there are plenty of French voices saying that our rules regarding identity cards for work and benefits are too lax and this is what is causing the problem. Consequently they are advocating that the problem be switched from Calais, which is effectively the border at the moment, to Dover, where they think the border should be. From the French point of view there is a certain logic to just letting them through thus forcing us to deal with the problem at Dover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 and you believe which alternative choice of UK government would have actually changed things for the better?. This government are as shit as everybody knew they would be and any alternative government would be at least as shit and at a loss about what to do about this situation.. Firstly closing Sangatte at the request of Blunkett was a huge mistake, there was an opportunity to fund it properly and process these migrants and then either give them asylum on a pro rata basis to EU countries or repatriate the failed and the best bit of all is we could have blamed the French if anything at all went wrong and especially for not allowing them access to UK human rights gravy train lawyers. No, I agree that the migration issue would not be any different under any government. I meant that lives of ex military, pensioners etc will get worse under the current regime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 No, I agree that the migration issue would not be any different under any government. I meant that lives of ex military, pensioners etc will get worse under the current regime. But would have got better under the alternative bunch of idiots in Labour?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 You have to wonder what the 500 unaccompanied minors now being cared for by Kent C.C., foster carers and social workers were doing before they reached British soil. We have a legal duty to look after them, the French would obviously be happy to see them die on the streets---or am I being too harsh. I don't know, I don't live there. From what I read in the French press there are plenty of French voices saying that our rules regarding identity cards for work and benefits are too lax and this is what is causing the problem. Consequently they are advocating that the problem be switched from Calais, which is effectively the border at the moment, to Dover, where they think the border should be. From the French point of view there is a certain logic to just letting them through thus forcing us to deal with the problem at Dover. Moving the problem to Dover is possibly the worst thing we can do. You'll never keep them out then. The answer is to significantly strengthen both the eurotunnel and port. The reason the tunnel has come under attack from this mob is because the port processes are now much stronger. It's not about border or not. You need to check each truck, each car and when any are found then you imprison them for trespassing. You don't fix the problem by letting them in. They are like ants you let one in, then there's another and another etc. Tough times require tough measures. Hate to reiterate but in Australia we detain every claimant and do not let in anyone now. They are either sent back or settled on Papua. The reason is simple - people just don't want them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 But would have got better under the alternative bunch of idiots in Labour?!? Almost goes without saying doesn't it? Labour created the welfare state (the system that often looks after ex military and vulnerable pensioners) and want to protect it. Despite what they say, the tories don't give a shit about it and are looking to privatize everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Almost goes without saying doesn't it? Labour created the welfare state (the system that often looks after ex military and vulnerable pensioners) and want to protect it. Despite what they say, the tories don't give a shit about it and are looking to privatize everything. Yeah by proposing to tax me 50% to pay for it..... If Labour elect those nutcase lefties like Corbyn then they'll be out of power for a generation. So I wouldn't rely on them any time soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Yeah by proposing to tax me 50% to pay for it..... If Labour elect those nutcase lefties like Corbyn then they'll be out of power for a generation. So I wouldn't rely on them any time soon. Well, it depends what you want I guess. if you want to live in a civilized country that looks after vulnerable people you might have to be prepared to be taxed slightly more (although for most people the changes would be insignificant). I just find it slightly ironic when people on the right complain when there are cuts in military grants and welfare. It's what you voted for after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 To their credit in Eastern Europe they have a better sense on how to handle this mob. Note why so few migrants try and get into Polish trucks, simply scout out the response of groups of Polish truckers when they catch them. We are simply far too soft whereas Eastern Europeans have less care for being all nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 If the Bulgarians can protect their land border with Turkey (with a 50 mile fence) then why can't the UK protect the port of Calais? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3183352/How-Bulgaria-keeps-migrants-50-miles-razor-wire-Fence-Turkish-border-15ft-tall-5ft-wide-said-kept-500-people-month.html Haha, the Daily Mail through and through... I recently visited Nogalies (a town that borders Mexico and America) and couldn't help but think that the hideous looking fence subconsciously creates much of the violence and animosity that the authorities have to deal with. Treat people like animals and they will act like it I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 The Eastern Europeans handle the stowaways.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 The Eastern Europeans handle the stowaways.... Disgraceful behaviour. I hope the men that beat these people up are bought to justice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 This lot broke the locks on their trucks and were hiding away in goods that they are responsible for bringing into the UK. This is the lorry driver livelihoods. I think they showed restraint in the circumstances. Why would you defend criminal behaviour like breaking into their property? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 This lot broke the locks on their trucks and were hiding away in goods that they are responsible for bringing into the UK. This is the lorry driver livelihoods. I think they showed restraint in the circumstances. Why would you defend criminal behaviour like breaking into their property? Not defending it at all. If they are also guilty of an offence then they should face the consequences. I do think that resorting to violence to address the problem is possibly the worst thing you could do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 You think you can reason with that lot in Calais?! Seriously? The Poles recognise that the best way to stop them breaking into their lorries is to pull them out and make sure they think twice about doing it again. You can't reason with these people? They are illegal migrants. You simply take a hard stance. I learned this in the army in Israel. You cannot reason with those who don't understand reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 No, I agree that the migration issue would not be any different under any government. I meant that lives of ex military, pensioners etc will get worse under the current regime. Yet again a one eyed view are you really suggesting that any other government whatever colour would treat ex servicemen any differently? Just to please RR, Blair gave IRA murderers a get out of jail free card but left all British army personnel on offer for prosecution, that's how much him and his government cared about the military. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 You think you can reason with that lot in Calais?! Seriously? The Poles recognise that the best way to stop them breaking into their lorries is to pull them out and make sure they think twice about doing it again. You can't reason with these people? They are illegal migrants. You simply take a hard stance. I learned this in the army in Israel. You cannot reason with those who don't understand reason. I'm afraid you have been unable to grasp my points or where I am coming from. If you had read and understood my previous comments on this thread you would see that I have already addressed your questions. Ultimately, all these things you and others have been suggesting like building a bigger fence, beating them up?! etc are not going to work in the long run. Until we start showing a bit of empathy and start addressing the issues at the source it will keep happening. You believe that the heavy handed approach will work, I don't. Our views are completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Fine our views can be different. I'd argue though that mine are built off almost 3 years of being in exactly that situation. Handling bogus refugees intent on violence and breaking into perimeter fencing. You don't reason with them. You either give in or you stand your ground. Yes I have zero empathy for this lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jimmer Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Yet again a one eyed view are you really suggesting that any other government whatever colour would treat ex servicemen any differently? Just to please RR, Blair gave IRA murderers a get out of jail free card but left all British army personnel on offer for prosecution, that's how much him and his government cared about the military. No party is perfect and I don't align myself to any of them unconditionally. But in general I think the kind of people we have been alluding to would be more looked after by a labour government. Actually even more so if they are going further to the left! I do find it appalling that charities like Help for Heroes even have to exist. It seems ridiculous to me that you can be injured fighting for your country and rely on a charity to look after you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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