Would City games sell out with cheaper prices?

[reddogkev]

The obvious part - general consensus is football tickets are too expensive (not just at City, I hasten to add).

Without checking for 100%, I'd say our average attendance must be approx. 19k.  It would be outstanding if we got to the stage where we frequently sold out Ashton Gate.

Why doesn't this already happen?  The Championship is a very high quality league, full of big teams and talented players.  I feel the City of Bristol, coupled with surrounding areas, should have enough people who support City to easily fill the ground for every league game.  So my question is, would cheaper match tickets (added to the much improved match-day experience) guarantee selling out each game?  And for those who mention buying season tickets or memberships, I'm only interested in the reduction of the actual league game ticket cost, and whether this would help us fill the stadium.

Imagine, for argument's sake, the price for each game was £20.00, would we always fill the ground, or is this just wishful thinking?

 

 

[DaveF]

Most of them would rather stay home and watch Sky Sports.

[DolmanDave]

I would like to think so.

I got some friends who would like to go more often but can't warrant a season/membership  ticket due to work/family commitments.

 Shame really, as cup games £12-£15 they're well up for it.

 

 

 

[WTFiGO!?!]

Can't or won't justify average £30.

This thread will inevitably swerve towards membership which equates to about a £130 upfront commitment for four games of football.

If that's value for you then that's your choice.  Everyone I know begs to differ.

A six game flexi-ticket is an option the club seriously needs to consider.

[CyderInACan]

I've mentioned on here previously that Bristol Sport have to pay for a "residents' parking scheme" on matchdays if 3 games out of 5 get over 25k each. Now this might cheekily include Bris (in which case that's unlikely to happen for a year or two) but if it's just based on City's crowds I'll bet there's a reluctance to go nuts on ticket prices to get bums on seats as a result. 

It was agreed with the council as a condition of the redevelopment of AG. 

[cidercity1987]

I don't think the prices are untoward.

Membership card 1 x £20= £20

10 games x £23= £230

Total £250 for 10 games or £25 per game.

Average salary £28,000 for 35 hours, 48 weeks or £16.67 per hour or £25 per 90 mins.

Seems totally fair?

I don't think reducing prices by a fiver will make much difference.

 

 

[Monkeh]

No we wouldn't sell out with cheaper tickets we'd add about 3k onto our avg attendance though,

tickets for football are just overpriced full stop, £20 plenty

[Champion Dung Spreader]

Yes, cheaper prices would in the long run, mean that we would sell out more often. I know lots of people who would love to attend live football regularly and who say that football is now for rich people.  They will not pay a lump sum for a season ticket, but would be prepared to pay on the day if prices are low enough. Consequently and sadly many young people have never experienced a sense of belonging to a local club, which was a given back in the day.

 I am very much in favour of cheap PotD. It would result in attendances varying with team performance. This would mean that that club owners would be subjected to real time performance related pay like the rest of us are at work every day. What's "good" for us should be good for rich club owners.

[cidered abroad]

We'll put bums on seats soon enough when we become much more consistent, especially with our home performances and are sitting comfortably just below the play off places. 

Our attendances are now the highest for many years, we have significantly increased our corporate and use of the stadium other than on match days, so let's see where that takes us.

Agreed we need to increase match day numbers but let's do it by attracting new fans who will then stick with us, rather than selling out simply because it's cheap. One bad result and they will disappear rapidly like the tide at Weston Super Mud.

As a dual ST holder, I notice that when very cheap deals are on offer for Bristol Rugby, the majority of adults who take up those offers, aren't too interested in the game, usually a group chatting among themselves and swilling down the beer and taking little interest in the match. I'm wholly in favour of all special deals for under 16 year olds as they are the future. 

[WTFiGO!?!]

18 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

I don't think the prices are untoward.

Membership card 1 x £20= £20

10 games x £23= £230

Total £250 for 10 games or £25 per game.

Average salary £28,000 for 35 hours, 48 weeks or £16.67 per hour or £25 per 90 mins.

Seems totally fair?

I don't think reducing prices by a fiver will make much difference.

 

 

By average I presume you mean the mean average?  Completely distorted by outliers at the extreme ends of the scale.

Take home £16.67 per hour, as a norm?  I bloody wish.

Living expenses are becoming extortionate.  In real terms, nurses are £3k per annum worse off than they were five years ago.

Also, people that can't commit the time and/or money to a season ticket (available at about £17 per game cheapest) are unlikely to justify paying £25 for 10.

I would be astounded if SL hadn't had business analysts in to advise on the balance between prices and take up and no doubt they will claim they have it about right.

Everyone I know who doesn't attend but would like to state they have basically been priced out.  

The average age of attendee in England is now 50, it was 27 in 1990.  I think that is very telling.

Football is now a luxury for the comfortable.

[Eddie Hitler]

35 minutes ago, CyderInACan said:

I've mentioned on here previously that Bristol Sport have to pay for a "residents' parking scheme" on matchdays if 3 games out of 5 get over 25k each. Now this might cheekily include Bris (in which case that's unlikely to happen for a year or two) but if it's just based on City's crowds I'll bet there's a reluctance to go nuts on ticket prices to get bums on seats as a result. 

It was agreed with the council as a condition of the redevelopment of AG. 

A residents' parking scheme in the sense of put up signs designating resident permit only and administer the issuing of the permits to each house?

If so then I wouldn't have thought that would be too expensive; an office junior could administer that in half a day a week.

[Bristol Rob]

7 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

A residents' parking scheme in the sense of put up signs designating resident permit only and administer the issuing of the permits to each house?

If so then I wouldn't have thought that would be too expensive; an office junior could administer that in half a day a week.

And then paying to enforce it....

[Spike]

59 minutes ago, DaveF said:

Most of them would rather stay home and watch Sky Sports.

Maybe most but not all. I'd love to go to the gate more but living in Cardiff and not driving means £7-15 for the train before I even buy a ticket. If a ticket is £30 by the time I get the buses, train and ticket im down around £50. For that I can take the mrs and the kids out for a meal, knocking the prices down by £10 may not sound like much but £20 for a ticket is far more appealing than £30 and helps keep the costs down. 

Ultimately for me it comes down to value, I am not happy with our squad or the performances, change that and suddenly the price becones acceptable, as it is I don't see value or entertainment for money, I just see it as paying £50 to waste a Saturday. I love the club, always will but I'm old enough and wise enough to know what I want for my money and right now City don't offer it. 

[Eddie Hitler]

5 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

And then paying to enforce it....

Hence the question mark in my post.

Though again how much does it cost to hire a parking warden for an afternoon, £200 tops (I know they're not paid that).

It's all very small potatoes and I don't think that it would be a consideration for ticket pricing; if we start seeing some serious success then 30k gates ahoy.

[Red Grovesy]

The "residents' parking scheme" has been mentioned a couple of times. This got me thinking. 

The stadium and facilities are excellent but parking and transport could still be an issue for some? Maybe if decent 'reasonably priced' parking was available (Long Ashton Park & Ride for example), this may encourage more people to attend?

How about securing a deal with the Long Ashton P&R and offering the matchday ticket that includes parking rather than reduce the cost of the ticket? Might this encourage more to turn up?

[onlyotib]

Iv always said I really don't mind paying £40 a ticket as long as we hav a chairman pumping millions into the club. It has to work both ways.

[Monkeh]

5 minutes ago, Red Grovesy said:

The "residents' parking scheme" has been mentioned a couple of times. This got me thinking. 

The stadium and facilities are excellent but parking and transport could still be an issue for some? Maybe if decent 'reasonably priced' parking was available (Long Ashton Park & Ride for example), this may encourage more people to attend?

How about securing a deal with the Long Ashton P&R and offering the matchday ticket that includes parking rather than reduce the cost of the ticket? Might this encourage more to turn up?

Not for the want of trying,

The council have balls'd up majorly there not a jot the club can do until the council sort themselves out 

[Monkeh]

2 minutes ago, onlyotib said:

Iv always said I really don't mind paying £40 a ticket as long as we hav a chairman pumping millions into the club. It has to work both ways.

We don't pay 40 quid a ticket and we do have a chairman pumping millions in,  

[EnderMB]

I'd like to see Bristol City more often than I do, but it comes down to value for money for me. It's too expensive to be a regular thing for me, and a trip to Ashton Gate is more of a treat for me than a regular thing.

£30 isn't a lot of money, but £60+ a month is quite a lot just for tickets. Add travel costs to that, and the general bother of getting in/out means that as far as cost goes it's a bit too much. I hear enough frustration around the ground from parents taking their kids to safely say that I think cheaper tickets and streamlining the process of getting the fans in and out of the stadium would go a long way towards more people going to watch the games.

As sad as it sounds, I think a lot of people would be willing to pay a bit more for a better experience. If normal tickets were £15, but £40 got you a nicer seat, more leg room, some food, and somewhere quieter to wait around before and after the game I think more people would turn up. I've heard good things about the hospitality tickets, but not much for the executive stuff.

[Nibor]

Elasticity is what it's about. In sales bullshit a perfectly elastic price means if you halve it you sell twice as many. Because fans are remarkably loyal customers ticket prices are only a little elastic.

If we halved prices we'd sell more but nowhere near double and we couldn't fit them in anyway.  Makes sense for Bradford but not for us.  If we took 25% off we'd sell a few more but likely not to enough to replace 25% of lost revenue on the ones we sell now.  I think the pricing is about right, less than £20 a game for ST holders. 

What makes sense is lots of incentives for kids to make sure the base goes up in the long term and the club do a pretty good job of that. 

[Jackson Lamb]

If clubs can pay around £40mil-£189mil a player, then there is no excuse for cheaper tickets.

[Pezo]

I find this a funny conversation point that can never be fully proved one way or another.

I think the clubs stance is that if prices are £30 then they can lower them but if they were £20 they cant increase them to £30 if we started selling out.

Personally I think if people want an excuse not to go then cost is an easy one but if we draw Man C in the cup I assume they wouldn't be interested because it will cost more than Barnsley.

[reddogkev]

31 minutes ago, onlyotib said:

Iv always said I really don't mind paying £40 a ticket as long as we hav a chairman pumping millions into the club. It has to work both ways.

Bloody eck, I certainly mind paying £40 a ticket!  If a rich chairman / owner wants to pump millions into a club, that's fine if it's their decision, but the fans don't have to bankroll it!

[NOTBLUE]

Why not have banding system,based on where we are in the table,band c if we're bottom 8,band b if we're middle 8 and band a if we're top 8,band c could start at a little above the season ticket prices,add a little more for mid table,and bit more if we're top 8,no idea how it would work in practice mind.

[Robbored]

It's a difficult balance for the club.

i think my sc works out at around £20 per match which as the club rightly say is the cheapest way to watch City. So potd prices have to be higher than £20 or nobody would buy a season card.

The quid a kid initiative was effective in filling AG but I cant remember the last time that was on offer.

[BRISTOL86]

It's simply impossible for the club to offer 'cheap' tickets whilst meeting the demands of fans in terms of transfer and wage spending, unfortunately. 

Add to that the fact that we do not have a large hardcore following. 

The focus for the club should be maximising season ticket sales. I don't know how much cheaper they could realistically be made but we need to be pushing for 20,000 STs over the next few years - that's the only way we're going to routinely sell out. 

[Nibor]

5 minutes ago, Robbored said:

i think my sc works out at around £27 per match which as the club rightly say is the cheapest way to watch City. So potd prices have to be higher than £27 or nobody would buy a season card.

You're paying £621?  

[Robbored]

8 minutes ago, Nibor said:

You're paying £621?  

Whoops!   Bit of typo there.........  I'd better edit it....

£19. Per match...

[CyderInACan]

1 hour ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Hence the question mark in my post.

Though again how much does it cost to hire a parking warden for an afternoon, £200 tops (I know they're not paid that).

It's all very small potatoes and I don't think that it would be a consideration for ticket pricing; if we start seeing some serious success then 30k gates ahoy.

For it to be enforced it has to be legal - you can't just randomly create a parking zone at the drop of a hat can you? I'd imagine there's a lot of legal stuff to go through first and then it's not just a case of ticketing people etc. 

[Monkeh]

11 minutes ago, Nibor said:

You're paying £621?  

he needs two seats, have you not seen all the Z's?

[onlyotib]

38 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

Bloody eck, I certainly mind paying £40 a ticket!  If a rich chairman / owner wants to pump millions into a club, that's fine if it's their decision, but the fans don't have to bankroll it!

On the flip side. U could pay £10 a ticket with no club backing and watch a team in the conference which are not going to achieve anything in the long run 

[Eddie Hitler]

21 minutes ago, CyderInACan said:

For it to be enforced it has to be legal - you can't just randomly create a parking zone at the drop of a hat can you? I'd imagine there's a lot of legal stuff to go through first and then it's not just a case of ticketing people etc. 

I was assuming that it would go through the council and we would have to pay for a warden's time as we pay for police time on matchday.  I wasn't envisaging Mark Ashton going out with a pot of paint and a high vis jacket.

My point was that the cost would be minimal and would not influence any decision upon ticket pricing.

[onlyotib]

1 hour ago, Monkeh said:

We don't pay 40 quid a ticket and we do have a chairman pumping millions in,  

Ye the point I'm trying to make is I don't mind paying over the top prices if we r trying to achieve something and the backing is there all in place

[SARJ]

2 hours ago, DaveF said:

Most of them would rather stay home and watch Sky Sports.

Sorry Dave mate but I call b*llocks on that. My own father, brother and several colleagues all love coming down the Gate but are unwilling to pay approx £30 a ticket for Championship level football, which I totally sympathise with. Make the tickets a tenner and you'd be getting 21k attendance each week easy, if not more.

Likewise I'd like to add that I sit in the unreserved area of the South Stand. It cost £350 for a ST roughly, which isn't too bad when you break it down. If it would have been £450-500 like other areas of the stadium I simply couldn't afford to attend, so in that respect you can add my name to the list of supporters who'd like cheaper prices. And no, I wouldn't rather sit at home and watch Sky Sports either. 

[gordie]

Be interesting to see how many we get against Derby it being mates rates, I know not everyone will be able to get it for a tenner but the majority will be able to I would have thought, at this moment in time even at a tenner I wouldn't think there would be more than 22000 there

[Monkeh]

25 minutes ago, onlyotib said:

Ye the point I'm trying to make is I don't mind paying over the top prices if we r trying to achieve something and the backing is there all in place

thats good for you but the day we start charging £40 a match is the day I'll start going to watch bath on a Saturday instead

[Snufflelufagus]

Derby game for season ticket holders is being 2 friends for £10 each. So that is very cheap. Surely if it was down to price then this game will sell out easily.

[DaveF]

26 minutes ago, SARJ said:

Sorry Dave mate but I call b*llocks on that. My own father, brother and several colleagues all love coming down the Gate but are unwilling to pay approx £30 a ticket for Championship level football, which I totally sympathise with. Make the tickets a tenner and you'd be getting 21k attendance each week easy, if not more.

Likewise I'd like to add that I sit in the unreserved area of the South Stand. It cost £350 for a ST roughly, which isn't too bad when you break it down. If it would have been £450-500 like other areas of the stadium I simply couldn't afford to attend, so in that respect you can add my name to the list of supporters who'd like cheaper prices. And no, I wouldn't rather sit at home and watch Sky Sports either. 

I've only ever had about 3 colleagues with any interest in going down the Gate

[BrightCiderLife]

26 minutes ago, SARJ said:

Sorry Dave mate but I call b*llocks on that. My own father, brother and several colleagues all love coming down the Gate but are unwilling to pay approx £30 a ticket for Championship level football, which I totally sympathise with. Make the tickets a tenner and you'd be getting 21k attendance each week easy, if not more.

Likewise I'd like to add that I sit in the unreserved area of the South Stand. It cost £350 for a ST roughly, which isn't too bad when you break it down. If it would have been £450-500 like other areas of the stadium I simply couldn't afford to attend, so in that respect you can add my name to the list of supporters who'd like cheaper prices. And no, I wouldn't rather sit at home and watch Sky Sports either. 

19k a week @ £30 each or 21k @ £10..? 

The choice is between £570,000 or £210,000.

The difference is £360k.

Had we done that just once last season we wouldn't have been able to sign Matty Taylor so I think Bristol Sport has got this one right. They're maximising the finances while ensuring that most fans who want to attend can attend. 

[reddogkev]

14 minutes ago, onlyotib said:

On the flip side. U could pay £10 a ticket with no club backing and watch a team in the conference which are not going to achieve anything in the long run 

Yep, you are right, but I feel the happy medium is somewhere in between those prices you've mentioned - and preferably not closer to the £40 mark!

Perhaps City have the tickets prices right for the level we are at, but if tickets could be lowered, we'd come closer to filling the gate each game.  Currently, the cheapest standard adult ticket for Burton next month (as an example) is £28 for the South Stand - which seems too high.

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

It depends what you mean by a sell out. Few sides in the Championship will fill the Atyeo. 

If we're talking the home stands, then City's average home support (after deducting the away following) is about 17,500. Given that we have a little over 13,000 season ticket holders, this suggests a walk-up of around 4,000. If you reduced ticket prices you might another 2,000 but I would doubt many more. 

[SARJ]

25 minutes ago, BrightCiderLife said:

19k a week @ £30 each or 21k @ £10..? 

The choice is between £570,000 or £210,000.

The difference is £360k.

Had we done that just once last season we wouldn't have been able to sign Matty Taylor so I think Bristol Sport has got this one right. They're maximising the finances while ensuring that most fans who want to attend can attend. 

Hear what you're saying in that financially it makes sense, but still, just goes to prove that football is a money making business these days.

Look at Bradford for example, multi-millionaire chairman who's focused on making the club 'great' rather than expanding his coffers. Replica kits are only £25, season tickets £100 and he's vowed to drop prices more the better the team do. He'd rather have a full stadium and great atmosphere and it seems to pay dividends, Bradford went to Wembley and only narrowly missed promotion. Certainly a team to watch for the future and I hope they succeed as it will force other clubs to follow suit.

[wendyredredrobin]

This season I bought a season ticket, (well 3 actually) but what kept me away quite a lot last year was not only the cost of single match tickets, but the fact that the remaing tickets available were all in rows 1 and 2 where you cant really see much for the money you pay. So galling to see all those empty seats with great views in the Upper West Stand.

Price reductions might bring a few fans back in the courss of time, but the top tier needs to be open more and the 2 or 3 rows in the front discounted.

Top six in the league will help to bring the fans back of course, but it does take time and performances to convert single game visitors into regular visitors and ultimately season card holders.

It is those that can only attend 10 or 15 games per season due to costs or other commitments that probably need encouragement.  May be a discount scheme based on number if tickets bought or perhaps a free purple and lime shirt once you have bought "x" tickets.

The only other thing I can think of is flexible pricing (like the airlines) but that would probably have a negative effect on both atendances and revenues.

I do know that Because of single match costs, I didn't buy 3 tickets for 8 or 9games last season that I otherwise would have and I bet there are a few thousand in the same boat.

[View from the Dolman]

8 minutes ago, SARJ said:

...Replica kits are only £25...

You might want to let Bradford themselves know that... http://bantams.clubstore.co.uk/bc-9062-ss-home-jsy-17-18

[old_eastender]

4 hours ago, reddogkev said:

The obvious part - general consensus is football tickets are too expensive (not just at City, I hasten to add).

Without checking for 100%, I'd say our average attendance must be approx. 19k.  It would be outstanding if we got to the stage where we frequently sold out Ashton Gate.

Why doesn't this already happen?  The Championship is a very high quality league, full of big teams and talented players.  I feel the City of Bristol, coupled with surrounding areas, should have enough people who support City to easily fill the ground for every league game.  So my question is, would cheaper match tickets (added to the much improved match-day experience) guarantee selling out each game?  And for those who mention buying season tickets or memberships, I'm only interested in the reduction of the actual league game ticket cost, and whether this would help us fill the stadium.

Imagine, for argument's sake, the price for each game was £20.00, would we always fill the ground, or is this just wishful thinking?

 

 

I think the attendances in the League Cup, when prices are just £10, tells you the answer is "no", we would not fill the ground if tickets are made cheaper.

No doubt if PoTD tickets had less of a mark-up over Season Ticket prices that would help sell some more, but moreover if we want a full ground we need a team that is winning on the pitch. The League One / Cup double season apart (when the ground was almost sold out every game at much reduced capacity), we have been starved of success, give us a side in the top six pushing for promotion to the PL, and then we will see 25,000 gates each week. 

[SARJ]

6 minutes ago, old_eastender said:

I think the attendances in the League Cup, when prices are just £10, tells you the answer is "no", we would not fill the ground if tickets are made cheaper.

All due respect but I don't think you can include League Cup games in this argument as they traditionally have low attendances, unless we draw a big team.

We need to focus on filling the Gate every week in the league.

[ashton_fan]

We could sell out some games if the price was low enough, but the club would almost certainly get reduced income so what's the point? The objective for the business is to maximise income from the available capacity.

[Welcome To The Jungle]

4 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

We could sell out some games if the price was low enough, but the club would almost certainly get reduced income so what's the point? The objective for the business is to maximise income from the available capacity.

Because your fellow supporters who love City just as much as you may be able to go more.

[BRISTOL86]

8 minutes ago, Welcome To The Jungle said:

Because your fellow supporters who love City just as much as you may be able to go more.

The club isn't a charity though, it's a business. They set prices in order to maximise revenue. 

They will have modelled various scenarios to ascertain the best price point for season tickets and pay on the day to balance the supply and demand and maximise revenue. 

For example 12000 STs at £350 is better than 16000 at £250. 

Now you could argue that intangible benefits accrue from increasing the ST holder base (and I'd agree) but only to a certain point. 

The trouble is that STs are already very well priced, and we still don't sell anywhere near enough to get sell outs. 

I expect the marginal gains of additional bums on seats do not outweigh the lost revenue from reducing current pricing, or we'd probably be doing it. 

[Maesknoll]

2 hours ago, Monkeh said:

thats good for you but the day we start charging £40 a match is the day I'll start going to watch bath on a Saturday instead

It'll get there, I can remember when a ticket in the Dolman went from £9 to £10, double figures, that felt like the beginning of the end!!  At £9 it seemed reasonable value at 10p a minute, but we still paid the tenner the next season, the way football is going, we're bound to be looking at £40 tickets before too long.

[Welcome To The Jungle]

9 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

The club isn't a charity though, it's a business. They set prices in order to maximise revenue. 

They will have modelled various scenarios to ascertain the best price point for season tickets and pay on the day to balance the supply and demand and maximise revenue. 

For example 12000 STs at £350 is better than 16000 at £250. 

Now you could argue that intangible benefits accrue from increasing the ST holder base (and I'd agree) but only to a certain point. 

The trouble is that STs are already very well priced, and we still don't sell anywhere near enough to get sell outs. 

I expect the marginal gains of additional bums on seats do not outweigh the lost revenue from reducing current pricing, or we'd probably be doing it. 

Which is why the £179 ST price offered by promoted Huddersfield last season would be a good start and then keep general sale ticket prices proportionally the same. Now if Huddersfield can find a way to get the books to balance and get promoted, I'm sure our owner who has made billions in the financial sector can find a way, especially as our stadium probably produces more income off the pitch. Surely we can do better than Huddersfield! 

P.S. "A club is an association of two or more people united by a common interest or goal." So the club isn't the business, it is the people. This has been forgotten largely in England where it would be more accurate to say most fans support football teams, rather than the club. 

[GrahamC]

1 hour ago, SARJ said:

Hear what you're saying in that financially it makes sense, but still, just goes to prove that football is a money making business these days.

Look at Bradford for example, multi-millionaire chairman who's focused on making the club 'great' rather than expanding his coffers. Replica kits are only £25, season tickets £100 and he's vowed to drop prices more the better the team do. He'd rather have a full stadium and great atmosphere and it seems to pay dividends, Bradford went to Wembley and only narrowly missed promotion. Certainly a team to watch for the future and I hope they succeed as it will force other clubs to follow suit.

That is all well and lovely but there are a couple of big differences here;

Bradford is poor, third world poor so everything is cheaper there (houses, wages etc).

They are in League One with a big ground they still cannot fill, so whilst their business model sort of works for them, it doesn't for us.

We are currently at about 75% of ground capacity, so a price reduction will not increase or even achieve the same income, whatever any of us think about ticket prices.

[SARJ]

3 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

That is all well and lovely but there are a couple of big differences here;

Bradford is poor, third world poor so everything is cheaper there (houses, wages etc).

They are in League One with a big ground they still cannot fill, so whilst their business model sort of works for them, it doesn't for us.

We are currently at about 75% ground capacity, so a price reduction will not increase or even achieve the same income, whatever any of us think about ticket prices.

Understood Graham.

But as this thread has developed, it comes down to 1 simple thing: would the club rather see a full stadium each week with low ticket prices, or a half empty stadium but good profits. Sadly, the latter is preferred by most clubs.

[View from the Dolman]

6 minutes ago, SARJ said:

Understood Graham.

But as this thread has developed, it comes down to 1 simple thing: would the club rather see a full stadium each week with low ticket prices, or a half empty stadium but good profits. Sadly, the latter is preferred by most clubs.

Which clubs are making "good profits"?

[Welcome To The Jungle]

2 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

That is all well and lovely but there are a couple of big differences here;

Bradford is poor, third world poor so everything is cheaper there (houses, wages etc).

They are in League One with a big ground they still cannot fill, so whilst their business model sort of works for them, it doesn't for us.

We are currently at about 75% ground capacity, so a price reduction will not increase or even achieve the same income, whatever any of us think about ticket prices.

Can I suggest then almost every team, in almost every city, in almost every country in the world where you can get tickets cheaper than Ashton Gate. Such teams include Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund etc etc. But, I hear you say, these teams have other incomes from TV and sponsorship meaning they can afford it. Well, Huddersfield did it, and are dropping some prices below the £100 mark for a ST. Bradford are doing it who still encounter many of the same costs and your argument that everything is cheaper up North doesn't explain Leeds United or Sheffield Wednesday does it! 

Ticket prices in the UK are stunningly overpriced bar a handful of cases. We are no exception. Being average in a horrendous system doesn't make it right does it?

[Kingswood Robin]

3 hours ago, onlyotib said:

On the flip side. U could pay £10 a ticket with no club backing and watch a team in the conference which are not going to achieve anything in the long run 

Flip it over again and you could be paying £40 a match to a team that won't achieve anything in the long run.

If it's cheaper we all get to share the pain.

[semblar]

I'll keep things in percentage terms, as there are a mix of kids and concessions that affect the total...also I'll ignore the home/away split and assume that you get the same ratio of food/drink/programme sales.

We currently average 19k or so attendance. Moving to a 27k attendance is a 42% uplift. To match the income in isolation you can drop the price by almost 30%. Sounds ok in principle...

There are two main problems with this kind of analysis though, even ignoring the broad assumptions above.

1. the 19k average included the near sellouts. We can't just add 8k to each gate, especially considering the Atyeo is away only now.

2. This leaves nowhere to go for the club if they want to use success as the driver for increased matchday revenues... other than raising the prices again. As things stand, there is enough space for a good run and (hopefully!) attractive football to pull more people in. If the club lowered prices to the point where AG was full every match, where would we be able to put the additional fans who are success-driven rather than price-driven? There is a far larger capacity to try to lower prices to increase attendances with the rugby, as there was a 13.7k average last season so room to increase the attendance an still have space for success to bring in higher crowds

[Kingswood Robin]

5 minutes ago, Welcome To The Jungle said:

Can I suggest then almost every team, in almost every city, in almost every country in the world where you can get tickets cheaper than Ashton Gate. Such teams include Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund etc etc. But, I hear you say, these teams have other incomes from TV and sponsorship meaning they can afford it. Well, Huddersfield did it, and are dropping some prices below the £100 mark for a ST. Bradford are doing it who still encounter many of the same costs and your argument that everything is cheaper up North doesn't explain Leeds United or Sheffield Wednesday does it! 

Ticket prices in the UK are stunningly overpriced bar a handful of cases. We are no exception. Being average in a horrendous system doesn't make it right does it?

A good point well made sir.

I had a "discussion" about parking charges with a chap from Leeds while in Ilfracombe recently. I commented that I thought the prices were a bit of a rip off. He declared (like they do in Yorkshire) that it wasn't, because it was cheaper than parking in central Leeds. I replied that just because it wasn't as big a rip off as up in gods country, it didn't mean it wasn't still a rip off. Surprisingly he had no response.  

[Super]

Said it lots of times our prices are disgraceful as many other clubs are.

[BRISTOL86]

1 hour ago, Welcome To The Jungle said:

Which is why the £179 ST price offered by promoted Huddersfield last season would be a good start and then keep general sale ticket prices proportionally the same. Now if Huddersfield can find a way to get the books to balance and get promoted, I'm sure our owner who has made billions in the financial sector can find a way, especially as our stadium probably produces more income off the pitch. Surely we can do better than Huddersfield! 

P.S. "A club is an association of two or more people united by a common interest or goal." So the club isn't the business, it is the people. This has been forgotten largely in England where it would be more accurate to say most fans support football teams, rather than the club. 

Not entirely comparable circumstances. Huddersfield's expectations did not match ours in the Championship. They were as stunned as anyone that they performed the way they did. Simply put our level of investment in the team could not survive if we halved the cost of our STs.

They are able to offer that deal in the Premiership because of the windfall that has come with promotion.

As much as I sympathise with your romantic view of the footballing world, it's a business, pure and simple. 

'Club' is just a word in the company name.

 

[reddogkev]

1 hour ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Not entirely circumstances. Huddersfield's expectations did not match ours in the Championship. They were as stunned as anyone that they performed the way they did. Simply put our level of investment in the team could not survive if we halved the cost of our STs.

They are able to offer that deal in the Premiership because of the windfall that has come with promotion.

As much as I sympathise with your romantic view of the footballing world, it's a business, pure and simple. 

'Club' is just a word in the company name.

 

The suits and money grabbers involved want it to be a business, the fans want it to be a passion.

What you have stated is exactly everything wrong with the modern game - Football should not be a business, it should be treated as a sport that captures the hearts of the world.

[TBW]

I'd go more regularly if it were £10 or £15. Can I afford £30, sure... Just don't want to pay that for 90 minutes of football.

[wendyredredrobin]

3 minutes ago, Robin TBW said:

I'd go more regularly if it were £10 or £15. Can I afford £30, sure... Just don't want to pay that for 90 minutes of football.

Lucky to get a whole 90 minutes from this lot.

[BRISTOL86]

34 minutes ago, reddogkev said:

The suits and money grabbers involved want it to be a business, the fans want it to be a passion.

What you have stated is exactly everything wrong with the modern game - Football should not be a business, it should be treated as a sport that captures the hearts of the world.

I didn't say it was right. Just a sad reality. I agree with you. 

[SecretSam]

It's a complicated equation. There are so msny alternative ways to spend leisure time and disposable income. 

I think making kids' tickets very cheap is the way forward.

[SecretSam]

8 hours ago, Nibor said:

Elasticity is what it's about. In sales bullshit a perfectly elastic price means if you halve it you sell twice as many. Because fans are remarkably loyal customers ticket prices are only a little elastic.

If we halved prices we'd sell more but nowhere near double and we couldn't fit them in anyway.  Makes sense for Bradford but not for us.  If we took 25% off we'd sell a few more but likely not to enough to replace 25% of lost revenue on the ones we sell now.  I think the pricing is about right, less than £20 a game for ST holders. 

What makes sense is lots of incentives for kids to make sure the base goes up in the long term and the club do a pretty good job of that. 

It's not "sales bullshit", Elasticity of Demand is a well-established economic concept.

Otherwise I'm with you.

[SecretSam]

9 hours ago, WTFiGO!?! said:

By average I presume you mean the mean average?  Completely distorted by outliers at the extreme ends of the scale.

Take home £16.67 per hour, as a norm?  I bloody wish.

Living expenses are becoming extortionate.  In real terms, nurses are £3k per annum worse off than they were five years ago.

Also, people that can't commit the time and/or money to a season ticket (available at about £17 per game cheapest) are unlikely to justify paying £25 for 10.

I would be astounded if SL hadn't had business analysts in to advise on the balance between prices and take up and no doubt they will claim they have it about right.

Everyone I know who doesn't attend but would like to state they have basically been priced out.  

The average age of attendee in England is now 50, it was 27 in 1990.  I think that is very telling.

Football is now a luxury for the comfortable.

1. "Mean" and "Average" are the same thing; Median or Mode, perhaps?

2. 1990: 27 years ago. Long time, society, leisure and options have changed dramatically since then.

3. It's a bit rich to criticise a fellow poster for using the Mean Income, then go and base your assertions on...Mean Age. BTW, those 27 year olds in 1990 would be in their 50s now...

[SecretSam]

1 hour ago, reddogkev said:

The suits and money grabbers involved want it to be a business, the fans want it to be a passion.

What you have stated is exactly everything wrong with the modern game - Football should not be a business, it should be treated as a sport that captures the hearts of the world.

It needs to be both. Run it on love and charity and Bristol City FC would be gone in a season

[South Somerset Red]

Ask Bradford City who have adopted the German model. 150 for and adult season ticket and a fiver for a under 11s season ticket. Smart on their part especially on the under 11s, you are creating fans for life. 

[RobintheRed Red]

Last season took my two Grandsons for there first match both aged five to six years old bought there tickets quid a kid great price but paid thirty six pounds each for my daughters to bring them so a total of seventy four pounds i know its not essential took them in Avon packett drinks crisp etc glad to say they loved it took the daughters as i was not prepared to leave the ground if they played up they want to come again but its too expensive for four in south stand should do a cheaper deal