Midlands Robin Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 I'll make no secret of the fact that Sean Dyche easily makes it on to my list of least favourite City players however there is no denying that he is doing a decent job as a manager. Ian Wright seems to think so and in this article he claims that Dyche could be the perfect replacement for Wenger at Arsenal and should, in time, be considered for the England job: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41478071 So, my question is, has Ian Wright lost his marbles or is Dyche good enough to bring success to a club that has gone stagnant under its current manager and where the weight of expectation and the demands of successful European competition would test even the very best managers? Would he make a good international manager in the future or is he just being touted for the role because of the continuing lack of truly successful English managers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipdawg Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Marbles: Lost Dyche is good, but jumping from Burnley, who by necessity play a very 'functional' brand of football, to managing Sanchez, Lacazette, Ozil, etc, just won't work. There'll be no respect from the players at the club or that the club want to buy and the scale of the challenge is completely different. Like going straight from doing a Parkrun to the London Marathon. Dyche needs a job at a club somewhere inbetween first- an Everton or a Newcastle perhaps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 I think he deserves a chance. Nothing to say players wont respect him at all. Managers have taken the leap before and it has worked perfectly well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 5 minutes ago, RedDave said: I think he deserves a chance. Nothing to say players wont respect him at all. Managers have taken the leap before and it has worked perfectly well. Agree. Without significant backing I feel Burnley have near enough reached their ceiling, especially with so many competitors close geographically. Dyche deserves a chance at a bigger side.. wouldn’t be surprised to see him at somewhere like Everton or West Ham before the season is out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodjias Wrist Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 The uproar from Arsenal fans if Dyche replaced Wenger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cider-manc Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 If this did happen I personally feel that it would work out like moyes at Manchester United. The fans would want a big name manager and as soon as it went slightly off would turn quicker on dyche than one of those big names. Like United fans who gave LVG more time than moyes despite early results being more favourable to moyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 2 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said: Agree. Without significant backing I feel Burnley have near enough reached their ceiling, especially with so many competitors close geographically. Dyche deserves a chance at a bigger side.. wouldn’t be surprised to see him at somewhere like Everton or West Ham before the season is out. Everton, West Ham, maybe Southampton, any club of that sort of stature would be a good move for him. Maybe Villa, if they get back up..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderMB Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 The day Arsenal follow Ian Wright's advice on management is a year to the day that Arsenal accept relegation to the Championship. I've got nothing against Dyche. I think he deserves an opportunity at a higher level. My gripe is that Dyche would be a stop-gap while a high-calibre replacement is sought. After seeing how Moyes's career has nosedived after getting a top job, I'm not sure if others would see it as a good opportunity without being promised significant investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRISTOL86 Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Doesn't matter who is managing Arsenal when there is such a lack of ambition from above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 The trouble is that Dyche's talent appears to be taking all the parts from Vauxhalls, Volkswagens, Fords and so on and putting them together in such a way they can compete with the Mercedes of the Premier League. If he was given a Mercedes, I don't think he would know how to handle the parts to make them work for him in the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 No doubt whatsoever that Dyche has complete respect from his players at Burnley. Even Joey Barton called him "an impressive man". Some compliment that... Im no not sure how many of the Burnley squad are foreign imports but at Arsenal the majority are so to me it'd be question of whether Dyche could earn the same level of respect. Im sure he has the skills and tactical nouse to manage a top club and personally, with Arsenal being my second club I'd love to see him take over from Wenger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyderInACan Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Bar BS3 said: Everton, West Ham, maybe Southampton, any club of that sort of stature would be a good move for him. Maybe Villa, if they get back up..? But they're walking the division, apparently. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 5 minutes ago, CyderInACan said: But they're walking the division, apparently. . . Yeah, well it is only a "bang average" division..! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midlands Robin Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Southampton are an interesting case. They used to get by creating a tread mill of decent young players who kept them in the hunt for the top 10 and were moved on for decent profits. Things seem to be slowing down in that area and they look like they are running out of steam. Having a chat in the pub last night we thought that Southampton could find themselves in danger of getting dragged into a relegation scrap this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Port Said Red said: The trouble is that Dyche's talent appears to be taking all the parts from Vauxhalls, Volkswagens, Fords and so on and putting them together in such a way they can compete with the Mercedes of the Premier League. If he was given a Mercedes, I don't think he would know how to handle the parts to make them work for him in the same way. Absolutely this. I'm so tired of hearing managers who have done well on a limited budget talked about as if they're better than those who've achieved success with a large budget. It's two different jobs and success in one in no way guarantees success in the other (though it certainly doesn't rule it out). Dyche is clearly a good manager and a forward-thinking one, but to stick him straight in a big club and assume he'd be successful is quite daft. He needs to either take an interim step to an Everton or a West Ham, or he needs to turn Burnley into regular top 8 contenders with a budget to match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petehinton Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 If Gareth Southgate can be England manager there’s no reason anyone can’t be tbh. Dyche has done much much more than Southgate as a manager/coach, so no reason why there should be any uproar if he was ever considered Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luxo Jr. Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 The England question is interesting. The Arsenal one, not so much. One of the reasons the Allardyce farce was so disappointing is that he seemed like exactly the sort of manager England needed right now. We need to be hard to beat, gritty, competitive, because like it or not, we don't have the talent to compete with the style of play we're trying to implement. Dyche could maybe do a good job. We don't have bad players, we just don't have players good enough to carry a team without a definitive playing style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poland_exile Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Ian Wright likes to shout loudly. A great footballer, but as a pundit / celebrity his talents are limited to making senseless noise. Who remembers his chat show?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havanatopia Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 6 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said: Agree. Without significant backing I feel Burnley have near enough reached their ceiling, especially with so many competitors close geographically. Dyche deserves a chance at a bigger side.. wouldn’t be surprised to see him at somewhere like Everton or West Ham before the season is out. Everton strikes a chord for sure. 3 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said: Doesn't matter who is managing Arsenal when there is such a lack of ambition from above. Wow. Think you should study the amount Arsenal have spent on transfers in the last 5 years; up there and how much they spent on their new stadium; up there with the best. Nothing about the money Arsenal have spent suggests lack of ambition, nothing. What might suggest that is their loyalty but in no way is that lacking in ambition and you are, anyway, ruling that out in your remark. I would therefore like to know what you are referring to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shtanley Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Job for Cotts surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRISTOL86 Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 13 minutes ago, havanatopia said: Everton strikes a chord for sure. Wow. Think you should study the amount Arsenal have spent on transfers in the last 5 years; up there and how much they spent on their new stadium; up there with the best. Nothing about the money Arsenal have spent suggests lack of ambition, nothing. What might suggest that is their loyalty but in no way is that lacking in ambition and you are, anyway, ruling that out in your remark. I would therefore like to know what you are referring to? The fact that they see finishing 4th as an achievement to be proud of? Everything is in place for them to be England's best team, you have to severely question the decision making from above as to why it hasn't happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Hunt-Hertz Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 3 hours ago, Robbored said: No doubt whatsoever that Dyche has complete respect from his players at Burnley. Even Joey Barton called him "an impressive man". Some compliment that... Im no not sure how many of the Burnley squad are foreign imports but at Arsenal the majority are so to me it'd be question of whether Dyche could earn the same level of respect. Im sure he has the skills and tactical nouse to manage a top club and personally, with Arsenal being my second club I'd love to see him take over from Wenger. I thought City were your second club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One Team In Keynsham Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 8 hours ago, chipdawg said: Marbles: Lost Dyche is good, but jumping from Burnley, who by necessity play a very 'functional' brand of football, to managing Sanchez, Lacazette, Ozil, etc, just won't work. There'll be no respect from the players at the club or that the club want to buy and the scale of the challenge is completely different. Like going straight from doing a Parkrun to the London Marathon. Dyche needs a job at a club somewhere inbetween first- an Everton or a Newcastle perhaps I disagree: all he has to do is play the old "show us your medals" game: none of the squad will be able to match his Division 2 play-off winners bauble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havanatopia Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 2 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said: The fact that they see finishing 4th as an achievement to be proud of? Everything is in place for them to be England's best team, you have to severely question the decision making from above as to why it hasn't happened. You spoke of lack of ambition not decision making. You can have huge ambition but make seriously bad decisions. I would not necessarily take issue with you on the latter but that was not the premise of your earlier post; lack of ambition was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRISTOL86 Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 13 hours ago, havanatopia said: You spoke of lack of ambition not decision making. You can have huge ambition but make seriously bad decisions. I would not necessarily take issue with you on the latter but that was not the premise of your earlier post; lack of ambition was. Good point. But to the casual observer the ambition just isn't there. Perhaps I'm wrong and they're doing everything they can to be serious title contenders and just ballsing it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Rojo Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 He's one of those managers that are excellent in getting the best out of 'good' players that dont have big egos that need careful pampering - and of course dont have the English media circus reporting on everything they do. He excels in this type of team because his players want to keep their heads down, work hard, graft and fight for everything. The complete opposite to the Premier Leagues golden child teams like Arsenal, that when it gets tough, players have tantrums and cause unrest amongst the team - and especially with the manager. He's better off staying where he is, building his reputation further and keeping far far away from the day time TV sitcom teams like Arsenal and even further away from the total embarrassment that is the England team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touch_my_butter Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 On 10/3/2017 at 11:25, Robbored said: No doubt whatsoever that Dyche has complete respect from his players at Burnley. Even Joey Barton called him "an impressive man". Some compliment that... Im no not sure how many of the Burnley squad are foreign imports but at Arsenal the majority are so to me it'd be question of whether Dyche could earn the same level of respect. All good points. See Moyes -> Man Utd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offside Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 I imagine lots of Arsenal fans would want a "big name" when Wenger goes - whatever his merits, I can't see Dyche fitting that bill. It would be interesting to see what would happen if he was their manager, though. I can see the parallels with Moyes at Man Utd - taking over from a long serving manager, high expectations, pressure to win trophies etc. When Arsenal do get a new manager, will he be afforded the same patience Wenger has enjoyed to be able to build his side's identity? Probably not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midlands Robin Posted October 4, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 Wenger won a double with Arsenal in his first full season in charge. I think any new manager would be given some time to re-build but expectations would be massive. It seems that to the Arsenal board the basic requirement for successful season is a top 4 finish with qualification for the Champions League. The fact that Arsenal have never won the top trophy in Europe will surely be the biggest requirement for a new manager. I don't see Sean Dyche as being the kind of man to build a champions league wining side (at the moment). I agree with the comments above that he needs to work with a team that has more resources than Burnley and with the way that Ronald Koeman is going at Everton that step up to the next level could be just around the corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havanatopia Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 8 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said: Good point. But to the casual observer the ambition just isn't there. Perhaps I'm wrong and they're doing everything they can to be serious title contenders and just ballsing it up. Put it this way, you would not spend 40 or 50 million on more than one player just to stand still or go backwards. I do not understand how a casual observer is important or even relevant in this discussion. However, since you use the term what does a casual observer have to go on? The league table is about it and that tells us that Arsenal are the 5th best in the Premier League, that they finished 1 point outside of the top four and 6 points ahead of Man Utd. I don't think that is ballsing it up; falling short? for sure but since there are 6 teams considered realistically capable of reaching the top four, if that is the pre-supposed goal, then two are always going to be disappointed. By that token you could say the team that finished 6th last season also 'ballsed it up'. That of course would be disingenuous because MU won the Europa League and gained entry to the Champions League via a different route; however, that is hardly a casual observation. Each of those six teams are capable and gunning for the title; only one can win it. I think the discussion here should be about not the casual observer but about a football fan who knows the game, watches the matches, sees what has happened since 2005 and then makes an argument for Arsenal making some poor choices and being slow to rectify their errors while other teams around them have advanced and others caught up such as Spurs, Man City and Liverpool re-entering the fray. Two of those three teams are having to wait significantly longer for their next title triumph, especially Spurs - 1961, compared to Arsenal. I have said for years that Arsenal have never replaced their back line of Tony Adams, Martin Keown, Nigel Winterburn and Lee Dixon and nor have sufficient leaders who are British. That was their backbone. Nor do they have a midfield 'policeman' like N'Kolo Kante or Matic. If you look at most of the other big 5 they nearly all at least have solid leaders in their ranks. Wenger has to take the blame for that failing. Maybe City can help Arsenal by selling them Flint in January for 20 million and they should look to find a new Patrick Viera. As you have said they have the potential they just lack the ability to deliver it as a cohesive unit and filling those few on field spaces with the correct type of player is what it will likely take. I still fancy them for a top 4 finish though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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