Expectations and hopes for the rest of the season.- what do we do in January..?

[Allwaysred]

I'm hearing Eisa out onloan in January!!!

[Robbored]

2 minutes ago, Allwaysred said:

I'm hearing Eisa out onloan in January!!!

Source?    

[spudski]

34 minutes ago, Robbored said:

It’s about being realistic Spudski - not that many clubs (4 or 5 ) would expect a top two finish this season. The obvious ones this season are Boro, WBA, Leeds, Norwich and possibly the Blades. For every other club the pray offs is the best hope - us included and personally I like to have something to aim for during the run in.

There are negatives of course - disappointment  if you dont make it and the possible hangover going into the next season but they can be exciting - I’m sure many of us can remember Roberts scoring against Hartlepool  and the Dolman Stand shook and Noble’s screamer at Selhurst Park.....

 

Of course...from a fans perspective, it's exciting.

[phantom]

Well we are becoming hard to beat again and that is a great foundation to have.

Steve Lansdown is expeting at least a top 6 finish so am expecting some exciting additions to the current starting 11 during January

Hopefully post Christmas we get results like we did pre-Christmas last season

[RedM]

I’ve heard a striker is our priority. We have Korey back in February so might gamble that we can get to then. Think Walsh is due back around that time too, if not before. But February does seem a long way off.

We got so much wrong in last January’s window, after being in a much more attractive position too. Surely we can’t do such bad business again?

[spudski]

18 minutes ago, phantom said:

Well we are becoming hard to beat again and that is a great foundation to have.

Steve Lansdown is expeting at least a top 6 finish so am expecting some exciting additions to the current starting 11 during January

Hopefully post Christmas we get results like we did pre-Christmas last season

That's what I'm hoping for too...otherwise imo, he's seriously delusional if he thinks we are top 6 quality with this squad. We might just get lucky...but we scream mid table side.

I guess when you are in his position you have to say positive things to the public. Wouldn't look good if he said I'm happy with mid table...hardly going to sell season tickets or gain sponsorship.

All smoke and mirrors.

15 minutes ago, RedM said:

I’ve heard a striker is our priority. We have Korey back in February so might gamble that we can get to then. Think Walsh is due back around that time too, if not before. But February does seem a long way off.

We got so much wrong in last January’s window, after being in a much more attractive position too. Surely we can’t do such bad business again?

If we don't get a midfielder in, then imo, we are stuffed.

Korey and Walsh will take months to get match fit and sharp again. Expecting way too much from them.

Too much pressure on Pack now. We can't rely on the youngsters to make us top 6 or even mid table.

We need a signing or a good loan in midfield.

[Robbored]

1 hour ago, spudski said:

Of course...from a fans perspective, it's exciting.

To me, as a fan that’s what watching footie is all about and why I get very frustrated when the stuff served up at AG is drab and dreary.......

[glynriley]

1 hour ago, Allwaysred said:

I'm hearing Eisa out onloan in January!!!

Quite a few rumours flying around on that one. Hope it's not to a L2 club mind.

A cynic might look at a £1.5M deal between a father and son, for a 24 year old who now can't get a look in at a club with a goal scoring problem, and wonder what the thinking was behind it.

I'm not though, so I won't ponder that.

[Robbored]

1 hour ago, glynriley said:

Quite a few rumours flying around on that one. Hope it's not to a L2 club mind.

A cynic might look at a £1.5M deal between a father and son, for a 24 year old who now can't get a look in at a club with a goal scoring problem, and wonder what the thinking was behind it.

I'm not though, so I won't ponder that.

LJ mentioned Eisa in a recent interview and  said (paraphrase) that he looks good in training but ‘can look a little lost’ in the Championship.

So obviously LJ and his assistants don’t feel that he’s quite ready for the Championship so a possible loan to a league 1 outfit seems a good plan.

[Allwaysred]

Plymouth onloan for games and there striker part of deal in January... 

[RedRaw]

3 minutes ago, Allwaysred said:

Plymouth onloan for games and there striker part of deal in January... 

So send them our "not yet ready" striker and pay more money for another lower league striker who may not be ready? another punt?

IF SL is really expecting a play-off push, then we need a striker who will go straight into the side and ideally have Championship or similar experience

[Robbored]

2 minutes ago, RedRaw said:

So send them our "not yet ready" striker and pay more money for another lower league striker who may not be ready? another punt?

IF SL is really expecting a play-off push, then we need a striker who will go straight into the side and ideally have Championship or similar experience

Difficult to find a Championship proven striker in the winter window. 

The advantage of signing Ladapo would be that he’s been playing competitive matches week in week out - Eisa hasn’t.....

[Mr Popodopolous]

Striker...or goalscoring midfielder?

By adding a striker to a side with (loosely) one up front if you're not careful you can risk your tactical balance and lose the midfield. 

Still think if we're serious about a playoff push (don't think it is on myself)- then a goalscoring midfielder- and I don't mean a Paterson'10' type- but one who is comfortable as a number 10 and in CM would maintain our threat and probably improve our balance.

Would also enable both O'Dowda and Eliasson to start more readily in the same team.

To pick an example, Johansen of Fulham if available and affordable would fit the bill attributes, style and record wise for a half season loan in this position I think.

Regards Eisa, if it's true he is off to Plymouth on loan that could be reasonable. Vyner did well there, it's League One albeit lowly so a step up but not too big from Cheltenham. Do we need their striker though?

[Guest]

I would be happy with a 10-14th place finish with some more consistency in our performances. Would rather finish 14th with a few exciting performances and a few defeats with us attacking a lot more (our so called identity stamped on the team), rather than finishing 10th with some boring non-attacking performances.

I would love us to have a chance at the playoffs with 5/6 games left but just cannot see it myself, would happily be proved wrong though.

[JoeAman08]

47 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Striker...or goalscoring midfielder?

By adding a striker to a side with (loosely) one up front if you're not careful you can risk your tactical balance and lose the midfield. 

Still think if we're serious about a playoff push (don't think it is on myself)- then a goalscoring midfielder- and I don't mean a Paterson'10' type- but one who is comfortable as a number 10 and in CM would maintain our threat and probably improve our balance.

Would also enable both O'Dowda and Eliasson to start more readily in the same team.

To pick an example, Johansen of Fulham if available and affordable would fit the bill attributes, style and record wise for a half season loan in this position I think.

Regards Eisa, if it's true he is off to Plymouth on loan that could be reasonable. Vyner did well there, it's League One albeit lowly so a step up but not too big from Cheltenham. Do we need their striker though?

Think striker for me. We need a midfielder but not a goal scoring one. Brownhill for me can score goals. I’d rather see him in that more advanced role with Smith and Pack occupying deeper roles.

Without Smith has made me appreciate him more. When he wasn’t picking the ball up from CBs he would find little pockets to occupy and turn forward. Miss him but as said probably late Feb early March for fully match fit Korey.

So I’d still want a midfielder but does not need to be a goalscorer and rather more budget go towards striker help. 

Not sure about the Plymouth striker. Is a gamble for sure but could pay off. Personally wouldn’t buy him in January. Not a popular thing here but some clubs across Europe bring in a player on loan with an option to buy from lower leagues or smaller clubs. Could this be an option? A loan fee plus Eisa wages paid until end of season. Explore buying/swapping in June? Idk genuine question. If not rather go young premier league striker wanting to prove himself. 

As for midfielder, I’d explore a “pivot” option. Not convinced Pack is best in thst role. Walsh I think is better for it but again coupd be March before match fit again. Failing that someone who can take up similar spaces that Smith did or that Paterson often does. We need the help centrally so much that we could use anyone from a 10 type to the deeper pivot type with anything in between. Just needs to be better than all of our other options. Tough task but I don’t feel we can afford cover anymore. 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Striker...or goalscoring midfielder?

By adding a striker to a side with (loosely) one up front if you're not careful you can risk your tactical balance and lose the midfield. 

Still think if we're serious about a playoff push (don't think it is on myself)- then a goalscoring midfielder- and I don't mean a Paterson'10' type- but one who is comfortable as a number 10 and in CM would maintain our threat and probably improve our balance.

Would also enable both O'Dowda and Eliasson to start more readily in the same team.

To pick an example, Johansen of Fulham if available and affordable would fit the bill attributes, style and record wise for a half season loan in this position I think.

Regards Eisa, if it's true he is off to Plymouth on loan that could be reasonable. Vyner did well there, it's League One albeit lowly so a step up but not too big from Cheltenham. Do we need their striker though?

Good post, and good point in bold.  Think, with Weimann, Paterson and Adelakun plus Watkins we have enough to cover the “forward line” now Diedhiou seems to gave his mojo back.  Looking forward to seeing how Keogh handles him tomorrow!

That leaves only a CM to bring in.  Johansen is a good shout.

[BobBobSuperBob]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Good post, and good point in bold.  Think, with Weimann, Paterson and Adelakun plus Watkins we have enough to cover the “forward line” now Diedhiou seems to gave his mojo back.  Looking forward to seeing how Keith handles him tomorrow!

That leaves only a CM to bring in.  Johansen is a good shout.

(Unless he’s changed a mind because of Famaras efforts in the last few games Dave) - his focus was on a chance taker or a ‘creator’

[Davefevs]

17 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

(Unless he’s changed a mind because of Famaras efforts in the last few games Dave) - his focus was on a chance taker or a ‘creator’

Yes, I know you spoke to him and that’s what he said, but I wonder whether 4141/4411 has changed the emphasis.

[Grey Fox]

This league is so tight that small improvements (or the opposite) can make a dramatic difference. Our back four is IMO as good as we can hope for,what we lack is a cosistant goalscorer, so if we can get a top striker (and it is a big IF) then go for it, if not give our youngsters a chance. Quality midfielder would be nice, but a striker is what could make the difference.

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, JoeAman08 said:

Think striker for me. We need a midfielder but not a goal scoring one. Brownhill for me can score goals. I’d rather see him in that more advanced role with Smith and Pack occupying deeper roles.

Without Smith has made me appreciate him more. When he wasn’t picking the ball up from CBs he would find little pockets to occupy and turn forward. Miss him but as said probably late Feb early March for fully match fit Korey.

So I’d still want a midfielder but does not need to be a goalscorer and rather more budget go towards striker help. 

Not sure about the Plymouth striker. Is a gamble for sure but could pay off. Personally wouldn’t buy him in January. Not a popular thing here but some clubs across Europe bring in a player on loan with an option to buy from lower leagues or smaller clubs. Could this be an option? A loan fee plus Eisa wages paid until end of season. Explore buying/swapping in June? Idk genuine question. If not rather go young premier league striker wanting to prove himself. 

As for midfielder, I’d explore a “pivot” option. Not convinced Pack is best in thst role. Walsh I think is better for it but again coupd be March before match fit again. Failing that someone who can take up similar spaces that Smith did or that Paterson often does. We need the help centrally so much that we could use anyone from a 10 type to the deeper pivot type with anything in between. Just needs to be better than all of our other options. Tough task but I don’t feel we can afford cover anymore. 

Someone like Johansen would be an upgrade not cover. Fact he can cover 2 positions in one game and would fill a need for goals in midfield, plus assists last 2 seasons had similar numbers again.

How would it setup then. Smith, Pack, Walsh, Brownhill and a new striker same team is it, Diedhiou, O'Dowda, Eliasson out of consideration in the reconfigured team?

Changing the setup and balance of a side creates as many puzzles as answers- I'd be wary of this just as things look a bit settled and our form, performances steadily- albeit from a low base- improving.

Pack not pivot- Would be further forward I assume. Wonder who could have filled that role between midfield and defence- oh yes oddly we released someone who on paper could if fit etc I think have filled it. Anyway that ship has sailed, we'll never know.

Paterson unless as a pure number 10? I wouldn't play him otherwise personally. Brownhill or even Smith as the first '1' in a 4-4-1-1 could be interesting.

[Wanderingred]

6 hours ago, spudski said:

It's far from the weakest. Probably one of the toughest in a long time. It doesn't have a couple of strong teams...It's full of teams with quality players, vast experience and resources.

The reason it is 'open' is because everyone one of these teams is capable of beating one another on their day. That doesn't mean it's weak. Quiet the opposite.

It's a league where 3 wins over a season will be the difference between mid table and a play off spot.

I'm also in the camp of aiming for the play offs is futile. You have to be aiming for top 2 imo.

Play offs are imo, a poison challis, unless you go up.

More often having a negative effect on the three teams that don't go up via the play offs.

We saw this ourselves.

Sorry but from the quality of football I've seen in the numerous Championship games I've watched this season, I totally disagree with you.

[Robbored]

22 minutes ago, Wanderingred said:

Sorry but from the quality of football I've seen in the numerous Championship games I've watched this season, I totally disagree with you.

The Championship games you’ve seen on TV? 

[Mr Popodopolous]

52 minutes ago, Wanderingred said:

Sorry but from the quality of football I've seen in the numerous Championship games I've watched this season, I totally disagree with you.

Some teams have got stronger in their own right though. Leeds, Forest and arguably Norwich.

Then again, the 3 who came down from PL weaker than 3 who went up from here last season.

Teams have got patently weaker as well. Us for one! Brentford when Smith went, Ipswich minus McCarthy, Waghorn, Garner, McGoldrick.

Midtable and lower midtable. Birmingham improved, Sheffield Wednesday worse.

Top 6 in and around? Sheffield United bit better, Middlesbrough a bit worse. Aston Villa and Derby? More attractive football, whether they're better teams remains to be seen.

Overall, seems weaker yeah.

[Garland-sweden]

Think Stoke have chance to be top six.

[JoeAman08]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Someone like Johansen would be an upgrade not cover. Fact he can cover 2 positions in one game and would fill a need for goals in midfield, plus assists last 2 seasons had similar numbers again.

How would it setup then. Smith, Pack, Walsh, Brownhill and a new striker same team is it, Diedhiou, O'Dowda, Eliasson out of consideration in the reconfigured team?

Changing the setup and balance of a side creates as many puzzles as answers- I'd be wary of this just as things look a bit settled and our form, performances steadily- albeit from a low base- improving.

Pack not pivot- Would be further forward I assume. Wonder who could have filled that role between midfield and defence- oh yes oddly we released someone who on paper could if fit etc I think have filled it. Anyway that ship has sailed, we'll never know.

Paterson unless as a pure number 10? I wouldn't play him otherwise personally. Brownhill or even Smith as the first '1' in a 4-4-1-1 could be interesting.

In a 4411 Paterson wouldn’t play for me. Brownhill would be the 1.

Johansen as an example would mean Brownhill would be a bit deeper which is ok. He can play with either Smith or Pack and also out wide.

Eliasson, O’Dowda and Paterson to battle it out for the wing spots. Guess Watkins and Weimann too. They are all way too erratic in their performances. Guess Eliasson been the most consisntent but he seems to shrink in the bigger games. Weimann could come alive out there with a Johansen or someone of that ilk possibly. 

This is why we need the quality over the quantity. We have a number of options that can do a job but not many who can take a position and make it theirs. 

I don’t have any names to suggest but I’d rather not bring in anyone if we are going to bring in more average or punts. We have enough spots that need improved to not just bring in for the sake of it. Personally think we can upgrade the wings(ironic because we brought so many in this summer). Striker we need someone to compete with Diedhiou who has gotten better but no pressure on him to perform. Obviously a CM whether a creative or defensive. All that said probably need to bring in at least one just to boost the lads. Sounds silly but after a tough month in December I think a new face is a way to freshen up the squad. Can backfire as we saw last season but can also give some new life as we saw when we brought in players like Tomlin, Cotterill and Odemwingie a few seasons ago

[ScottishRed]

8 hours ago, Robbored said:

LJ mentioned Eisa in a recent interview and  said (paraphrase) that he looks good in training but ‘can look a little lost’ in the Championship.

So obviously LJ and his assistants don’t feel that he’s quite ready for the Championship so a possible loan to a league 1 outfit seems a good plan.

So we buy a 24 year old who has never been remotely close to playing at this level and the HC says he looks a “ little lost” ! What a surprise.

It was a completely bizarre signing at £1.5m.........frankly given the back story I am not surprised, but given FFP etc, the mind boggles.

[Silvio Dante]

There’s a lot of revisionism going on about Eisa.

In the summer, the general forum consensus was that there was a hot property on our doorstep who was worth a punt (and again, I’ll make the point that £1.5m on a striker at this level is a squad player or punt). We’d not taken similar punts on local players (eg Ollie Watkins) and the deal was seen as being worth a go - relatively low fee, but possible high reward. This has now gone in some people’s eyes to a dodgy father/son deal.

Truth of it for me is that he was worth a go, and may still come good. However, in the cameos I’ve seen, his thinking is 2-3 yards short in the championship at present (He gets the position but the reaction is too slow). He’s scored goals everywhere though so clearly has that in his game. 

I think he’s some way off ready for this level and needs a league one loan - dare I even say R*vers would be ideal as they need a striker and its on our doorstep. However, he’s not ready for a run in our team yet from what I’ve seen and playing him at the moment could be counter productive for everyone 

[Robbored]

15 minutes ago, ScottishRed said:

So we buy a 24 year old who has never been remotely close to playing at this level and the HC says he looks a “ little lost” ! What a surprise.

It was a completely bizarre signing at £1.5m.........frankly given the back story I am not surprised, but given FFP etc, the mind boggles.

No doubt Eisa has a goalscorers instinct but the gulf between L1 and the Championship is vast and some players take time to adapt to a higher quality of football and it seems Eisa fits into that category.

He may well make the step up but could also become another John Akinde..

[Davefevs]

45 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

There’s a lot of revisionism going on about Eisa.

In the summer, the general forum consensus was that there was a hot property on our doorstep who was worth a punt (and again, I’ll make the point that £1.5m on a striker at this level is a squad player or punt). We’d not taken similar punts on local players (eg Ollie Watkins) and the deal was seen as being worth a go - relatively low fee, but possible high reward. This has now gone in some people’s eyes to a dodgy father/son deal.

Truth of it for me is that he was worth a go, and may still come good. However, in the cameos I’ve seen, his thinking is 2-3 yards short in the championship at present (He gets the position but the reaction is too slow). He’s scored goals everywhere though so clearly has that in his game. 

I think he’s some way off ready for this level and needs a league one loan - dare I even say R*vers would be ideal as they need a striker and its on our doorstep. However, he’s not ready for a run in our team yet from what I’ve seen and playing him at the moment could be counter productive for everyone 

Always thought £1.5m was over the odds to a club like CTFC.

But from the clips and bits and pieces there is something about his finishing (little backlift and a “placer” under pressure), that thinks he has something to offer.  Although on the little evidence in a City shirt, I don’t think he could play on his own up front.

Does need minutes, and perhaps with Diedhiou’s mojo returned, minutes next to him might allow us to gauge his good he is or not.

[Robbored]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Does need minutes, and perhaps with Diedhiou’s mojo returned, minutes next to him might allow us to gauge his good he is or not.

Definitely needs game time - could start against Huddersfield. That would seem like an ideal game for him.