The conundrum that is Naismith

[old_eastender]

There is no doubting that Naismith's ability to, in general, bring down through balls, come forward out of defence and play neat passes has been an important part of us playing good possession football. He also has a sweet left foot from free kicks which have profited us. However, he had already been directly responsible for 3 goals given away before last night (and it could have been more, but for some less clinical finishing and good Bentley saves). The 2 given to Norwich last night makes that 5 goals gifted in just 9 games. Something has to change, as he will become targeted by opposing teams.

For me, either we:

a) switch him to left Centre Back (where he played so well for Luton), and move Atkinson to the middle - on the basis that when he loses the ball to the opposition trying to play out it's less likely to lead to a direct chance on goal. 

b) leave him in the middle but with clear instruction to take a more safety first approach and be prepared to drop him (for Klose when fit) if he doesn't.

c) leave him in the middle but instruct Vyner or Atkinson to cover him from behind when he brings the ball out like he did before giving it away for Norwich's 2nd.

Personally I'd go with option a) although that would probably make him less effective for building our forward play. No matter that he is generally a really good footballer, you can not just cannot carry on like it is with him gifting a goal away every other game. 

 

[TDarwall]

I'm not sure moving him to LCB makes a huge difference. Giving the ball away close to our own goal is always going to cause a problem.  He had made a huge difference to us overall & so much of our play goes thru him. If you drop or constrain him, we could be  tighter at the back but we'd not play the same way, so overall would be less effective.

 

 

 

[2015]

He needs to stay in his position, move him anywhere else and our performance levels will drop. That is all

[swanker]

However good he is, he can’t keep giving the ball away and costing us goals. 
Its becoming embarrassing for the bloke!

[Super]

Probably leave him for now as we really don't have anyone to come in anyway and just hope that he makes less mistakes. 

[Topper 123]

Personally id play klose behind him as a old fashioned sweeper 

[REDOXO]

I’m not sure it makes a bit of difference where he plays in a back three. Mistakes  will get punished. Naismith has got us punished to the point where you can argue he is personally responsible for several points being thrown away. 
 

The bloke is a senior professional. The moment the ball bounced we were going to concede then to shank a pass straight to them giving them possession in on goal is bloody unforgivable. 
 

put that together with the other mistakes this season and you would not be out of order to not make excuses for the guy. 
 

He needs to stop making school boy errors as where ever plays in a back three they will cost us a goal. 

[Logical-City]

Retracted : maybe he wouldn’t be terrible moved to the right …

 

Edited September 15, 2022 by Logical-City

[mozo]

What was the Chelsea player a few years back who had big hair and similarly was really classy but also a bit of a liability? Reminds me of him.

[BLRed]

Generally had a bad game last night. Mid-placed passes, poor crossing, poor decision making. Was an off day but annoyingly, one that cost us. Still, as others have said, he has improved us massively in the way we play so we may just have to accept to odd mistake. 5 however is too many so certainly needs curbing somehow

[Topper 123]

I think he will be big enough to recognise his mistakes and learn so rather than slate the bloke let’s all support him and the team as we move forward in the hope of progression COYR 

[rednotblue]

4 minutes ago, mozo said:

What was the Chelsea player a few years back who had big hair and similarly was really classy but also a bit of a liability? Reminds me of him.

David Luiz

[Logical-City]

2 minutes ago, Magger1 said:

I think he will be big enough to recognise his mistakes and learn so rather than slate the bloke let’s all support him and the team as we move forward in the hope of progression COYR 

Worth getting behind I think as he brings more than he takes away. Cost us 6 points this season but massive part in us having 14. 

He’s still settling in hopefully as the season goes on will improve.

Kalas is not a bad option to fall back on 

[spudski]

It's obvious NP wants to play out from the back. Naismith is probably our most natural ball playing passer of a ball in the present back three. 

He wants to utilise his vision and passing ability to break lines.

He's obviously confident in his own ability...however, he quickly needs to cut out passing across advancing forwards, where if intercepted like yesterday, you leave yourself massively open.

When he's good it works. What's sad...is it's the individual errors that are doing us...not the style of play.

Naismith did play left in a back 3 at Luton and did well there.

You could in theory swap his position with Atkinson who has played more centrally. 

I guess it's finding a balance between being affective at building from the back and creating...or shoring up more and being less creative.

The conundrum will be what we do when a fit and ready Kalas returns.

Imo...Vyner, Naismith and Atkinson all contribute to the way we play...front foot and offensive.

The likes of Kalas and Klose far more defensive and less effective offensively.

Then you have the likes of Joe Low and Ryley Towler in the wings waiting for their chance to come.

 

 

[Fordy62]

37 minutes ago, 2015 said:

He needs to stay in his position, move him anywhere else and our performance levels will drop. That is all

Yep. This is where I’m at. Wouldn’t sacrifice our style of play for the errors just yet. 

Hoping that things will tighten up when Kalas returns. 

[Logical-City]

1 minute ago, spudski said:

It's obvious NP wants to play out from the back. Naismith is probably our most natural ball playing passer of a ball in the present back three. 

He wants to utilise his vision and passing ability to break lines.

He's obviously confident in his own ability...however, he quickly needs to cut out passing across advancing forwards, where if intercepted like yesterday, you leave yourself massively open.

When he's good it works. What's sad...is it's the individual errors that are doing us...not the style of play.

Naismith did play left in a back 3 at Luton and did well there.

You could in theory swap his position with Atkinson who has played more centrally. 

I guess it's finding a balance between being affective at building from the back and creating...or shoring up more and being less creative.

The conundrum will be what we do when a fit and ready Kalas returns.

Imo...Vyner, Naismith and Atkinson all contribute to the way we play...front foot and offensive.

The likes of Kalas and Klose far more defensive and less effective offensively.

Then you have the likes of Joe Low and Ryley Towler in the wings waiting for their chance to come.

 

 

Did he play to the left ? I can only find highlights of the Fulham game of him where he is playing central?

Maybe it’s just eagerness he has just made a big move after only a couple of seasons as a defender at a new club? It’s just basics at this point as an ex defender I would think Pearson would be all over this, he has technical ability clearly so should not be slicing clearances or miscontrolling the ball.

Concentration and composure needed I think Klose needs to play with Naismith and Atkinson.

Vyner has to be sacrificed but we still win a lot of games with that back 3 IMO just a gamble each time which I enjoy tbh we will win more than we lose but how many can we win ? Paid off for Luton 

[ashton_fan]

Our defence looked much better last season when Klose came in as the central defender of the three so it remains an option to bring him back there once fit. However it would be difficult for him to play alongside Naismith as neither have much pace.

I would be tempted to bring in Kalas in the middle once he's available, if he's the last man then he has a chance of covering Naismith's errors the only problem would be who to drop, Atkinson and Vyner are both playing well. I don't think it can be left as it is as all our three losses have included mistakes by KN and there have been other games where he's made bad errors but got away with it. As Dean Smith said in his pre-match interview promotion sides have to be based on a solid defence, we can't expect to consistently score three goals to get us out of trouble, particularly in away matches.

[Charlie BCFC]

I’m sure people didn’t have issues with this before last night so why now? Thought he patched up second half and was a lot better. Time to move on to another difficult game Saturday 

[spudski]

18 minutes ago, Logical-City said:

Did he play to the left ? I can only find highlights of the Fulham game of him where he is playing central?

Maybe it’s just eagerness he has just made a big move after only a couple of seasons as a defender at a new club? It’s just basics at this point as an ex defender I would think Pearson would be all over this, he has technical ability clearly so should not be slicing clearances or miscontrolling the ball.

Concentration and composure needed I think Klose needs to play with Naismith and Atkinson.

Vyner has to be sacrificed but we still win a lot of games with that back 3 IMO just a gamble each time which I enjoy tbh we will win more than we lose but how many can we win ? Paid off for Luton 

If you go on Who Scored, you can see every game he played for Luton and which position, formation etc 

I don't think Klose is the answer...that back three would be slower than a snail.

If we had a fully fit squad...my preference would be Kalas-Atkinson-Naismith.

[Super]

I think the question will be if he keeps making these mistakes. Will there come a time when NP has to drop him.

[A Horse With No Name]

1 hour ago, Magger1 said:

Personally id play klose behind him as a old fashioned sweeper 

You mean like Dick Van Dyke in Mary Poppins?

[ChippenhamRed]

17 minutes ago, Charlie BCFC said:

I’m sure people didn’t have issues with this before last night so why now? Thought he patched up second half and was a lot better. Time to move on to another difficult game Saturday 

Could it possibly be because he made two mistakes which lead to two goals? Just a hunch.

[And Its Smith]

I don’t see it as a conundrum right now. Keep playing him in this position and let’s keep playing good football 

[Atyeo's Love Child]

The thing that did him on the first goal was having the ability to do more than just head it clear, that hesitation cost us.

Hopefully next time he's in a similar situation he chooses to just head the ball.

[The Journalist]

One thing that would be madness (and I'm not sure anyone's suggesting this necessarily) would be to remove him from the back three.

I thought the last 10-15 minutes last night were interesting, as Norwich continually closed his passing angles and forced him to switch across to Vyner, whose passing range is just nowhere near Naismith's. His mid/long-range passing is absolutely top class for this level.

As a broader point, (and this is partly because we've got three ball-playing centre-halves) this current team reminds me a lot of the 2002-03 side. Ridiculously open, often you're left tearing your hair out, but so good going forward and genuinely a pleasure to watch. We're never out of any game.

[Dr Balls]

The player that Naismith most reminds me of is Ruud Krol from that golden period of Dutch “Total Football” (although obviously not quite as good as him). He usually played at left back in a back 4 or as a sweeper. The thing to understand as a team is who covers in behind when this type of player is the last man at the back and then comes forward.

All of our centre backs (including Klose and Kalas) are footballers who are capable of taking the ball upfield, going past opposition players and playing a decent pass or even cross, which is core to how Pearson wants us to play. It’s very similar to Wilder’s Sheffield United team and formation from a few years ago and our very own “League 1 Galaticos” under Cotterill. We just need to cut down the individual defensive errors.

Edited September 15, 2022 by Dr Balls

[johnbytheriver]

He is a brilliant fooballer! some of the time he is let down by the players in front of him not taking up the correct positions.Without him our new style of football would not be possible. First name on the team-sheet for me.

[MartockRed]

In Naismith I see a player who has so much self belief it’s almost knocking on the door of arrogance. The way he plays, the way he commands, they way he speaks in interviews. I’ve rarely seen another player in a city shirt akin to him if ever. 
We can all see what he brings to the team playing wise and I’m not saying he shouldn’t be dropped altogether if continues to cost a goal every other game, but he’s an epitome of a leader. His character influences the rest of the team in a positive way which is not to be underestimated. Taking him out the middle of a central 3 would be a mistake imo.

Only his 3rd full season playing at the back? 
He’s still learning himself. I believe he’ll reduce/eradicate the mistakes, and I have absolutely no doubt he believes that as well. 

[Mad Cyril]

Perspective.... If he had the tackling, passing, positional sense, leadership, set play impact that he does AND never made a mistake... He wouldn't be playing for us

[Norn Iron]

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Edited September 15, 2022 by Norn Iron
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