Kalas - still struggling for fitness

[Cityboy1954]

14 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

He will be gone by August no question. As will Wells, Bentley, Massengo and Scott.  Others are more in doubt as will depend if they are happy to sign a new contract on reduced terms, but those 5 are definite 

Edit: and Martin will be gone. 6 definite 

Yeh agree another Nathan Baker goodbye .

[Rocking Red Cyril]

7 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

My brain

Massengo - obvious, hasn’t signed contract 

Scott - obvious, has basically said it

Martin - old and poor we won’t offer him a contract 

Kalas/Wells - both on huge money and will go and earn good money elsewhere 

Bentley - we have two other keepers 

We need to get the wage bill down so I think it’s pretty obvious they all go. Unsure of likes of Dasilva as hard to say 

Well many things seem obvious in football to the supporter and are far from what actually happens. Where has Scott said he leaving too ? 

So my point again is nothing definite there. 

[GrahamC]

8 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

My brain

Massengo - obvious, hasn’t signed contract 

Scott - obvious, has basically said it

Martin - old and poor we won’t offer him a contract 

Kalas/Wells - both on huge money and will go and earn good money elsewhere 

Bentley - we have two other keepers 

We need to get the wage bill down so I think it’s pretty obvious they all go. Unsure of likes of Dasilva as hard to say 

I think you’re largely right, if you think about it for five minutes you can make fairly educated guesses.

However we do have Scott on a long contract so someone is going to have to pay very big money, Kalas is going to struggle to get any offers if he can’t get back on the pitch & Wells will be 33 by then so we might have a chance on a much reduced deal if we want him.

Spot on about the rest, there are a fair few others out of contract too or who we have an option on, Semenyo, O’Leary, Vyner, King, Klose, plus 2 out on loan In Owura Edwards & Taylor Moore, so it is going to be a summer of big change.

Edited November 27, 2022 by GrahamC

[Packman]

I'm guessing everyone commenting about the treatment of animals on this page are all vegan?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Fordy62]

8 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

My brain

Massengo - obvious, hasn’t signed contract 

Scott - obvious, has basically said it

Martin - old and poor we won’t offer him a contract 

Kalas/Wells - both on huge money and will go and earn good money elsewhere 

Bentley - we have two other keepers 

We need to get the wage bill down so I think it’s pretty obvious they all go. Unsure of likes of Dasilva as hard to say 

That’s a massive amount of money isn’t it? Hopefully we can reclaim our mantle of plucky underdogs. 

[And Its Smith]

26 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

That’s a massive amount of money isn’t it? Hopefully we can reclaim our mantle of plucky underdogs. 

Between £4-5m per year in wages for sure and if we get around £15m for Scott happy days.

Mystic Dave signing off for now 

[Lanterne Rouge]

34 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Between £4-5m per year in wages for sure and if we get around £15m for Scott happy days.

Mystic Dave signing off for now 

When will you be back? Or don`t you know?

[The Saturday Boy]

4 hours ago, Packman said:

I'm guessing everyone commenting about the treatment of animals on this page are all vegan?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am. And a volunteer for Sea Shepherd and have been to Italy and Iceland this year on campaigns. Anyway, back to Kalas

[kernored]

4 hours ago, Packman said:

 

 

I am NOT a vegan, but think that animals should not be held in captivity to the please of tourists, Any one who thinks they are well treated is very naive,.

[Kid in the Riot]

37 minutes ago, kernored said:

I am NOT a vegan, but think that animals should not be held in captivity to the please of tourists, Any one who thinks they are well treated is very naive,.

That's all very well, but there is more than a hint of hypocrisy that as a meat eater you accept that eating animals that have been electrocuted, shot with bolt guns, had their throats slit, or in the case of chickens gassed, is OK due to your dietary preference. 

This hypocrisy is hard for people to acknowledge as we're indoctrinated from a very young age that farm animals are "meat" and dolphins, lions, giraffes etc are magical creatures whose lives are worth more. But if you want to be consistent then surely ALL bad treatment/killing of animals is unacceptable?

[Guest]

Tomas has had a decent appearance record up to his injury

2016-17 38 games

2017-18 35 games

2018-19 38 games signed for us 1/7/19 for reported £8m after a loan spell. Reported £22K PW.

2019-20 23 games

2020-21 40 games

2021-22 35 games Initial injury was March 22

2022-23 32 minutes.  Subsequent injury, knee? Groin? Calf?

Out of contract 6/23, so can walk away then having played to date approx 100 games since signing at an estimated overall cost of circa £12M…..£120,000 per game to date.

Having been out since March he clearly has a very difficult / unusual set of injuries given his decent appearance record previously, I’ll repeat we may not see him in a red shirt again, the second of our warrior defenders lost to us.

Whatever your take on his off field life, just like Baker he has put his body on the line on numerous occasions.

I stand to be corrected on the above, but if anywhere near the true figures is it any wonder the club has cost SL so much money.

Should he play the remaining 20 or so league games that figure reduces to £100,000 per game, what a crazy business championship football is.

Disclaimer- I am far from having any knowledge of the accounting procedures involved in running a football club, so no doubt the people who do can put me straight.

 

[spudski]

2 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

That's all very well, but there is more than a hint of hypocrisy that as a meat eater you accept that eating animals that have been electrocuted, shot with bolt guns, had their throats slit, or in the case of chickens gassed, is OK due to your dietary preference. 

This hypocrisy is hard for people to acknowledge as we're indoctrinated from a very young age that farm animals are "meat" and dolphins, lions, giraffes etc are magical creatures whose lives are worth more. But if you want to be consistent then surely ALL bad treatment/killing of animals is unacceptable?

It's an interesting debate.

I eat meat, but I do my best to ensure it's been ethically treated.

I also eat less than I used to.

Many animals hunt, eat meat and kill. Yet they are often kind when not hunting for food to other species.

We as humans eat meat...some choose not too. We, like animals, can be kind and treat animals with compassion.

Using an animal as entertainment, is imo, totally different.

Many cultures respect animals and treat them well. 

From my experience, people in the UK have very little understanding of food produce.

You've got the vegans and vegetarians...and then a massive amount of the population who couldn't tell you where fruit, veg or meat came from. The supermarket or fast food outlet is as far as they know.

I've found many other countries are far more respectful and educated about animal welfare.

Then you have the extremes like China and Korea who couldn't give a stuff about animals.

We are a strange nation...probably the most loving towards animals, yet one of the least educated when it comes to food.

 

[Rebounder]

4 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

That's all very well, but there is more than a hint of hypocrisy that as a meat eater you accept that eating animals that have been electrocuted, shot with bolt guns, had their throats slit, or in the case of chickens gassed, is OK due to your dietary preference. 

This hypocrisy is hard for people to acknowledge as we're indoctrinated from a very young age that farm animals are "meat" and dolphins, lions, giraffes etc are magical creatures whose lives are worth more. But if you want to be consistent then surely ALL bad treatment/killing of animals is unacceptable?

I know what you are saying. I'm veggie - cant quite manage vegan. I decided to take the jump to Veggie when I was doing some stuff around the badger cull and it didn't sit right to be eating meat anymore. It was a decision I'd thought about for a long time. I'm still hypocritical, but everyone is to an extent and we have to also do what's manageable within the world we try to survive in so I don't judge other people on their choice to eat meat. 

Its true there is a disparity between iconic animals and how we view them, and then animals that are less cute, or seen as pests. I watched people throwing jellyfish around on a beach, and when I challenged someone they did it more. A real disconnect between sea life and land animals. 

All of that being said, I do feel saying "yeah but we eat meat" to be a bit of a strawman when trying to challenge something like this. It's a process and I was quite warmed to see people being against this on here. Hopefully we can move away from seeing animals as entertainment, and then also food. 

[maxjak]

On 26/11/2022 at 18:21, frenchred said:

The blokes on holiday FFS, give him a break!

Just because your on holiday does not mean you suspend your moral stance?  In fact if you have a high profile, it gives you the opportunity to draw attention to issues?   I like Kalas, but i would suggest he has had plenty of breaks? 

[maxjak]

18 hours ago, spudski said:

It's an interesting debate.

I eat meat, but I do my best to ensure it's been ethically treated.

I also eat less than I used to.

Many animals hunt, eat meat and kill. Yet they are often kind when not hunting for food to other species.

We as humans eat meat...some choose not too. We, like animals, can be kind and treat animals with compassion.

Using an animal as entertainment, is imo, totally different.

Many cultures respect animals and treat them well. 

From my experience, people in the UK have very little understanding of food produce.

You've got the vegans and vegetarians...and then a massive amount of the population who couldn't tell you where fruit, veg or meat came from. The supermarket or fast food outlet is as far as they know.

I've found many other countries are far more respectful and educated about animal welfare.

Then you have the extremes like China and Korea who couldn't give a stuff about animals.

We are a strange nation...probably the most loving towards animals, yet one of the least educated when it comes to food.

 

You make some valid points.........but it always make me puke......when i read that a healthy animal has been killed in a "Humane" way?  I see that as a oxymoron 

[spudski]

11 minutes ago, maxjak said:

You make some valid points.........but it always make me puke......when i read that a healthy animal has been killed in a "Humane" way?  I see that as a oxymoron 

Yes, it's an emotive subject for sure,  and the debate can go round in circles, depending on your stance. 

We are all ' animals, mammals '...all part of that kingdom.

Kindness to other species is shown throughout one another.

I am constantly in awe at the kindness shown by other creatures to one another. Intelligence, compassion and feeling seemingly endless in our discovery and understanding.

Yet....when it comes to food. In the animal kingdom, if you eat meat, it goes out of the window.

Torn to shreds, hunted down and often eaten alive.

Very rarely do you see other animals, using others as entertainment though.

So I guess ' humanly' being killed for food, in a quick non stressful way, is better than being hunted and eaten alive? 

Who knows... definitely a hot debate.

Edited November 28, 2022 by spudski

[maxjak]

18 minutes ago, spudski said:

Yes, it's an emotive subject for sure,  and the debate can go round in circles, depending on your stance. 

We are all ' animals, mammals '...all part of that kingdom.

Kindness to other species is shown throughout one another.

I am constantly in awe at the kindness shown by other creatures to one another. Intelligence, compassion and feeling seemingly endless in our discovery and understanding.

Yet....when it comes to food. In the animal kingdom, if you eat meat, it goes out of the window.

Torn to shreds, hunted down and often eaten alive.

Very rarely do you see other animals, using others as entertainment though.

So I guess ' humanly' being killed for food, in a quick non stressful way, is better than being hunted and eaten alive? 

Who knows... definitely a hot debate.

You again make valid points........but i would say that humans have choice, they do NOT have to kill and exploit animals.  In the wild, animals who are predators, kill as a means of survival, there is no moral dilemma, it is purely instinctive....so they either hunt and kill,  or they die?  I would also argue that being killed, by whatever means, is NEVER Non stressful?   You state that "we are all animals, mammals, all part of that kingdom"

I would counter that as humans  we have intellect, and are able to make Decisions and moral judgements, whereas animals do not have that luxury?  

Edited November 28, 2022 by maxjak

[Atticus]

On 26/11/2022 at 23:25, And Its Smith said:

My brain

Massengo - obvious, hasn’t signed contract 

Scott - obvious, has basically said it

Martin - old and poor we won’t offer him a contract 

Kalas/Wells - both on huge money and will go and earn good money elsewhere 

Bentley - we have two other keepers 

We need to get the wage bill down so I think it’s pretty obvious they all go. Unsure of likes of Dasilva as hard to say 

Then if we survive this season, next we are f***** anyway.

[Atticus]

12 minutes ago, maxjak said:

You again make valid points........but i would say that humans have choice, they do NOT have to kill and exploit animals.  In the wild, animals who are predators, kill as a means of survival, there is no moral dilemma, it is purely instinctive....so they either hunt and kill,  or they die?  I would also argue that being killed, by whatever means, is NEVER Non stressful?   You state that "we are all animals, mammals, all part of that kingdom"

I would counter that as humans  we have intellect, and are able to make Decisions and moral judgements, whereas animals do not have that luxury?  

There are plenty of animals that are omnivors.

It certainly isn't hypocritical to be a meat eater but not want animals to be treated inhumanely for the enjoyment of people.

 

If people have a guilt trip about it fine, but don't assume that others should.

Edited November 28, 2022 by Atticus

[Atticus]

22 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

That's all very well, but there is more than a hint of hypocrisy that as a meat eater you accept that eating animals that have been electrocuted, shot with bolt guns, had their throats slit, or in the case of chickens gassed, is OK due to your dietary preference. 

This hypocrisy is hard for people to acknowledge as we're indoctrinated from a very young age that farm animals are "meat" and dolphins, lions, giraffes etc are magical creatures whose lives are worth more. But if you want to be consistent then surely ALL bad treatment/killing of animals is unacceptable?

Try halal then, which more and more supermarkets and takeouts are serving  

[spudski]

13 minutes ago, maxjak said:

You again make valid points........but i would say that humans have choice, they do NOT have to kill and exploit animals.  In the wild, animals who are predators, kill as a means of survival, there is no moral dilemma, it is purely instinctive....so they either hunt and kill,  or they die?  I would also argue that being killed, by whatever means, is NEVER Non stressful?   You state that "we are all animals, mammals, all part of that kingdom"

I would counter that as humans  we have intellect, and are able to make Decisions and moral judgements, whereas animals do not have that luxury?  

Again...it's a subject that can go round in circles. 

I guess it's purely down to the person to judge.

Also on how their health is.

Some people really struggle with their diet and how it effects their body.

My sister is a vegetarian. She has been for over 40 years. I call her mother earth...always been aware of nature, tries to be organic. Keeps bees, has allotments...you get the picture.

Yet since turning vegetarian as a child, she's had nothing but problems with her stomach and digestion. 

I know other vegetarians with the same problems. Always ill, often anaemic.

I'm the same with processed food. I have severe reactions with many processed items.

So I eat naturally. I eat a balanced diet based on , grow it, pick it, fish it, kill it. 

Don't mess with it...food sources grown naturally as mother nature intended.

I find eating a balanced diet works best for me. If man has buggered around with it, I suffer.

I've tried vegetarianism. It made me Ill. So many pesticides on fruit and veg. Even organic made me suffer. My stomach couldn't take it. Constantly in pain.

Yet others can survive on eating crap.

We are all individuals. All our bodies work differently. You have to listen to it. And find what works for you as an individual.

As humans ...we can all be caring and empathic towards animals. Care for them and treat them well. 

As for killing an animal humanly...a shot to the head in the wild...no stress. They wouldn't know anything about it.

Studies have shown that animals can make moral judgements and help one another out. With the advent of social media, so many videos showing animals in the wild, different species helping one another out, with no benefit to the helper. So they are aware.

Even trees help one another out. Studies show that in a forest, if trees are lacking water or nutrients, the others who have plenty will use the root system to supply the ones suffering. 

More and more evidence is coming to light that the earth could be a living entity.

Who know what we don't know about plants etc.

All I know, is the more man mucks around with it, trying to create un natural foods, the more likely we are to suffer. Bill Gates can do one for a start...with his ' plastic 3d meat products'. The bloke is evil personified. I digress :laugh:.

As for Kalas...his response came across as ' ignorance is bliss'. He'd rather not know and just believe what he's been told by the park who are making a fortune from captive dolphins and using them as entertainment. Now that...you really can control.

 

 

 

[Kid in the Riot]

1 hour ago, Atticus said:

It certainly isn't hypocritical to be a meat eater but not want animals to be treated inhumanely for the enjoyment of people.

[Bristol Oil Services]

On 26/11/2022 at 23:25, And Its Smith said:

My brain

Massengo - obvious, hasn’t signed contract 

Scott - obvious, has basically said it

Martin - old and poor we won’t offer him a contract 

Kalas/Wells - both on huge money and will go and earn good money elsewhere 

Bentley - we have two other keepers 

We need to get the wage bill down so I think it’s pretty obvious they all go. Unsure of likes of Dasilva as hard to say 

Should've listened to Neil Kinnock in 1987, he warned us not to be old, or shit. And poor. Or something.

[maxjak]

4 hours ago, Atticus said:

Try halal then, which more and more supermarkets and takeouts are serving  

You do realise that halal meat involves slitting the creature's throat, which involves slicing through the windpipe and jugular vein? So well done supermarkets?   I would prefer that they show videos of slaughterhouses and abbatoir's above those wonderful fridges,that are full of beautifully packaged slices and portions wrapped in plastic?   Although that would be detrimental to the delicate sensibilities of shoppers, and the profits of the multinationals..........and of course the public must be protected to the realities of how meat is produced?  .....Although there are plenty who don't give a S**T, as long as it tastes good?

[spudski]

40 minutes ago, maxjak said:

You do realise that halal meat involves slitting the creature's throat, which involves slicing through the windpipe and jugular vein? So well done supermarkets?   I would prefer that they show videos of slaughterhouses and abbatoir's above those wonderful fridges,that are full of beautifully packaged slices and portions wrapped in plastic?   Although that would be detrimental to the delicate sensibilities of shoppers, and the profits of the multinationals..........and of course the public must be protected to the realities of how meat is produced?  .....Although there are plenty who don't give a S**T, as long as it tastes good?

Imo, all schools in the UK should visit slaughter houses and see how animals are slaughtered.

It happens in many other cultures...near to home...where it's common for people to know how to slaughter an animal.

From experience...far more thought and respect is given. 

Less meat eaten...and what's eaten is used fully.

I had a Czech GF in the past. All hair, nails, make up etc.

Went to visit her family just outside of Prague and watched her and her father slaughter a pig on their small holding. It was taught as a child. They also as a family foraged for mushrooms in the forests in the weekend. Everything was used and respected.

The father butchered and used everything. It lasted for many months.

I would rather we lived like that...than just visiting a supermarket and not ever thinking about where our produce came from.

I've felt inept compared to other cultures, as to where we totally rely on others to provide for us.

Knowing how to grow fruit and veg, keep animals, know about the seasons, soil, read the stars, sail a boat,crude a horse...these are basics that our ancestors knew like ABC.

Yet we get told about Pythagoras and such like, and never use it 

Turn off supply, electric and internet and we are all fecked.

Stark reality when you think about it.

[bbew]

What I find most odd is those who defend the rights of animals and how they live / die (which is not a bad thing for them to do I will add), but simultaneously turn a complete blind eye at the way so many humans suffer in their final years.

Particularly in the last couple of years, where people were happy to just go along with the elderly being locked in a room for months on end, lonely and  confused, not even given so much as a vitamin tablet by our government even though they were the most vulnerable. Being told by the medical profession we wont come and help you if you become ill, you will be automatically enroled into having a do not resuscitate order, but if you do want to live and you are really ill we may at that point offer a little help.  So many dieing alone in hospital with no visitors, thinking their family didn't care.  The government sacked 40,000 people that cared for the elderly, leaving so many without the care the deserve/require.  It was extraordinary times, but the way people were treated and the fact so many are either unaware or don't care is baffling.

Yes, we all have a duty to treat animals better, but we also have a duty to our fellow humans.

Edited November 28, 2022 by bbew

[spudski]

12 minutes ago, bbew said:

What I find most odd is those who defend the rights of animals and how they live / die (which is not a bad thing for them to do I will add), but simultaneously turn a complete blind eye at the way so many humans suffer in their final years.

Particularly in the last couple of years, where people were happy to just go along with the elderly being locked in a room for months on end, lonely and  confused, not even given so much as a vitamin tablet by our government even though they were the most vulnerable. Being told by the medical profession we wont come and help you if you become ill, you will be automatically enroled into having a do not resuscitate order, but if you do want to live and you are really ill we may at that point offer a little help.  So many dieing alone in hospital with no visitors, thinking their family didn't care.  The government sacked 40,000 people that cared for the elderly, leaving so many without the care the deserve/require.  It was extraordinary times, but the way people were treated and the fact so many are either unaware or don't care is baffling.

Yes, we all have a duty to treat animals better, but we also have a duty to our fellow humans.

I agree with your sentiment...but why do you say people concerned with animal welfare have turned a blind eye to human suffering?

You can be concerned for both surely?

I lost both my parents during COVID lock downs.

Restrictions on visits to hospitals and care home.

Even restriction on numbers at their funerals.

I've become numb to the madness of it all. The frustration, sadness, the fear felt by all concerned.

Both my parents could possibly have still been here, if it weren't for lock downs and cancellation of necessary quick operations on cancer and tumors. 

I could go on...but you've only got to listen to people and how everyone has a different view on the subject. 

People are conditioned. They believe whatever they are told. Some think...others follow like lemmings. 

What is a fact these days? What's true? What isn't? It's hard to define fact from fiction. Every piece of fact and news has an agenda behind it. For every pro there's a con. 

We all, even if we disagreed with it...followed the rules. For the greater good. 

What a load of bollox that turned out to be. 

The leaders doing everything thing they wanted...regardless of the rules they set. 

Seeing so much come to light, the hypocrisy and game that was played... hopefully people in the future will stand up as one and say **** you if it happens again.

Others around the world are now doing that now.

We need to stand up as individuals and do what's right for humans and animals. Rather than let leaders dictate our thinking.

We complain about them, let them get away with it, then pretty much forgive and forget... Yesterday's news being chip paper...and they continue in the same vein, and we let it happen.

We are conditioned to obey and not argue. All in the name of science, the greater good and for our own safety and welfare.

 

[Taz]

So long and short of it is, Kalas is still struggling with injury, but is taking some time away on holiday in the close season break whilst the World Cup is on.

Didn't the club put a post up yesterday (or maybe the day before) saying back to work? Surely this means very few players were around? 

Meanwhile on otib, people are getting uptight about dolphins and Kalas being away and not being at the club......

Edited November 30, 2022 by Taz
Formatting is all over the place!!

[GrahamC]

47 minutes ago, Taz said:

So long and short of it is, Kalas is still struggling with injury, but is taking some time away on holiday in the close season break whilst the World Cup is on.

Didn't the club put a post up yesterday (or maybe the day before) saying back to work? Surely this means very few players were around? 

Meanwhile on otib, people are getting uptight about dolphins and Kalas being away and not being at the club......

It appeared to me that the majority of players were back yesterday, Wells, Dasilva, Scott & Vyner were shown in the video & it has been reported today that Naismith trained too. Weimann might have been given a few more days off as he featured for Austria & picked up a knock. Semenyo we all know about.

It appears from what Kalas posted & various rumours that his injury isn’t sorted, so that is the logical explanation as to why he’s not back with them.

[Negan]

On 26/11/2022 at 19:00, spudski said:

Sadly...There's a lot of people who are uneducated on such things. 

All they are interested in, is money, holidays, material possessions, and sharing it on social media. 

There are a lot of footballers that fall into this category.

I'm not saying it's the case with Kalas...but there are many that simply aren't interested in such information.

Blimey...you've only got to look at China and it's populations ignorance to shark fins.

Some are either ignorant or want to turn a blind eye...as showing others on social media you are eating it or exploiting it, is more important.

Get your point but I hate people who lecture others about this stuff “you shouldn’t go to zoos or aqua parks, they capture them and train them for our entertainment” said person then goes on to eat a chicken burger with bacon and cheese on….. 

I get the argument that just because you eat meat/dairy products doesn’t mean you can’t speak up against these kinds of things but it’s massively hypocritical to say we can’t use them for entertainment but we can kill and eat them by the billions each year one is far worse than the other.