Reading at home match thread

[spudski]

24 minutes ago, RedM said:

I agree. I came away thinking that it was a good thing that the result didn't matter today, but of course it should have. 

We are on the right tracks, mostly, but don't look like being able to push on to the next level (and I don't mean the Premiership). We are not ruthless/clinical or consistant enough. Its hard to explain but I don't think we have that extra 'something' I see in some teams. 

I agree...regardless of injuries, I think we still flatter to deceive. 

I get the impression most fans, can see the whole picture for what it is. We get the debacle of the mess created in the past. We understand the position of the club and it's squad. 

We mostly approve of the direction NP has taken us. 

However...the frustration of creating chances and not converting still continues. The frustration of playing well and conceding silly goals still continues. This has been like this for a long time. There is always an excuse to be found...never counteracted with the situation of the opposition. 

Whilst NP down plays expectations, I expect deep down he is really frustrated and expects better. I know I do with certain established players. 

[Beni71]

Personally thought we played some decent football today. Reading are a poor team and we’re very one dimensional. Not a surprise the way we conceded. 
 

Conway was excellent and thought Weimann was at his best when he was on the pitch. 
 

Come the final whistle felt like a loss given the performance. Yes, we lack some quality in the final 3rd but much prefer this team/squad under NP Vs the bloated over paid squad from earlier this season and the last two seasons. 

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

14 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

It was rather amazing the number of times they could've had a man through, but then the Reading player contrived to either fall over his own feet or otherwise totally fail to control the ball.

You could see why they are where they are. 

and why we are where we are. There's 3 points between us.

[spudski]

3 minutes ago, Percy Pig said:

That's just being overly focused on the outcome for me. Create that much in every game and we win more than we don't. 

Happy to criticise the clinicality of the team of late,  but won't  criticise the performance. Its not flattering to deceive, its just football sometimes. 

' football sometimes'...I can agree with, if it's ' sometimes'. 

However our performance today is typical of many games. Substance with no result. 

We create...but don't score from the chances created. 

We concede from silly mistakes. 

Those two sentences sum us up. 

Everyone can see we are going in the right direction. Everyone pretty much wants NP to do well. We can all see the progress. We all understand the past mess. 

However...sometimes constructive criticism is needed. Without fearing our criticism will be detrimental to NP. 

I'm sure he would agree at the frustration. 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, marcofisher said:

I don't think he fits the way Pearson wants to play and I don't think we will even see him offered a deal on reduced terms. Considering his rumoured salary there must be better players in L1/L2 who will better fit the bill, such as the Wimbledon lad we were bidding for in Jan. 

The story is that he’s one of the players that has NOT been offered anything, not even on reduced terms.  Seems like Nige was really keen to move him on in January.  I can’t see Jay having done anything to make Nige change his mind.  I can imagine that Nige feels it’s not quite time to give Morrison or now Leeson a go.

53 minutes ago, Spoonbed said:

It’ll be interest to see if Fev’s ( whose opinions I massively respect) changes his opinion when watching back again. I watched it on Robins tv , and thought Weimar and Wells were exceptionally poor( and I’m a fan of both players). Though Nakhi was very heavy legged with poor movement, and nothing seemed to come off for Weiman. 
Definately a position we need to strengthen

Quite possibly.  We all see different things.  Although same might apply to you and @Shuffletoo on a second watch also.

I thought Weimann was at the heart of most of our good stuff in the first half, him and Tanner linked up well.  Involved in the goal, shot cleared off the line, etc.

In the second half it was him drifting in from the right and finding / playing in Mehmeti a couple of times.

 

[ralphindevon]

Enjoyable game, once we start converting that dangerous possession into goals we’ll be a top half team comfortably.

Was desperate for Anis to get something for all his endeavours, I think if he’d got one he’d get a few before the seasons up.

If it wasn’t for Alex Scott I’d certainly be voting for Cam Pring for player of the year. What a talent, the best crosser in the team which we missed a bit today. Hopefully he’ll be back on the left soon. 

[Merrick's Marvels]

23 minutes ago, spudski said:

' football sometimes'...I can agree with, if it's ' sometimes'. 

However our performance today is typical of many games. Substance with no result. 

We create...but don't score from the chances created. 

We concede from silly mistakes. 

Those two sentences sum us up. 

Everyone can see we are going in the right direction. Everyone pretty much wants NP to do well. We can all see the progress. We all understand the past mess. 

However...sometimes constructive criticism is needed. Without fearing our criticism will be detrimental to NP. 

I'm sure he would agree at the frustration. 

You're frustrated. We all are.

Pearson was upbeat afterwards, going so far as to say there are good times ahead.

That'll do for me. 

Even more so given the fact, with everyone fit our team - a Pearson team - will have plenty of 6 footers to deal with set pieces into our box- unlike today. Being the point. 

A goalkeeper who doesn't go walkabout would help too. That's a personal preference, not one I expect to be popular and not wishing to sidetrack this thread either. 

With a team full of novices, Pearson is providing points and performances that few other City managers with the same resources at Tier 2 level ever have.

Edited April 1, 2023 by Merrick's Marvels

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, spudski said:

' football sometimes'...I can agree with, if it's ' sometimes'. 

However our performance today is typical of many games. Substance with no result. 

We create...but don't score from the chances created. 

We concede from silly mistakes. 

Those two sentences sum us up. 

Everyone can see we are going in the right direction. Everyone pretty much wants NP to do well. We can all see the progress. We all understand the past mess. 

However...sometimes constructive criticism is needed. Without fearing our criticism will be detrimental to NP. 

I'm sure he would agree at the frustration. 

The way the game panned out…and resulted in what was a frustrating afternoon, was in part (a good part) because of Reading.  They sit deep, fill the box and rely on “number of bodies” to make it difficult to create clear-cut chances from close-in.  On a pitch where it was difficult for agile players to be agile (!) it gives defenders an extra split-second to mark, block, etc.  Mehmeti’s shot late on that looked more like a cross, was a result of the ball bobbling just as he strikes it.

We had quite a few melees in the box too, didn’t quite fall to us.

If you ever played attack v defence on a half pitch in training (I’m sure you have), you know how difficult it is to score when the defence only has one objective…and they don’t get dragged out of shape.

Performance wise, I’m pretty content.

Result wise, less so.

One final thing.  We have no real bench currently to keep the levels up.  So when your best players go off you are weakening yourself.  Some teams are able to strengthen with subs.  It was right to sub Conway today, but I think today Conway’s 59 mins highlighted the gulf between him and Bell overall.  I’m not referring to today for Bell (not sure anyone would compare a 2 min display!!), but over the period he’s been out.  Conway is a star.  Bell has done ok…that’s a big difference.

[Red-Robbo]

22 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

and why we are where we are. There's 3 points between us.

 

TBH the gulf looked larger. Reading have their injury list, but ours is like the roll call after the Battle of the Somme. 

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

8 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

TBH the gulf looked larger. Reading have their injury list, but ours is like the roll call after the Battle of the Somme. 

It did indeed yet we are where we are.

[maxjak]

A very frustrating game.........but although i am in danger of being over pedantic.........when i Hear NP state that the goal we conceded from a set piece "was a lesson learnt", it does make me wonder how many lessons do we  need     until we learn?   While appreciating the injury problems evident at the back this season, it was still a really poor goal to concede?  But then again, I guess if the forwards had done THEIR job..........it would have been a mere consolation?

Edited April 1, 2023 by maxjak

[spudski]

2 minutes ago, Percy Pig said:

As I said, no issue with criticising our finishing, it's been poor for a while. (4-3-3 is a bag of shite formation for teams at our level, in my opinion and this is the inevitable consequence of setting up in a series of 1v1s rather than doubling up in key areas). 

Performances have been average lately, but that's been down to injuries to our most important 4 or 5 players.

Today was fine. Arguably better than fine. Just didn't score.

Most goals at this level are a result of a defensive errors! 

Thanks for the response. 

I agree..our finishing has been poor for a long time. We create quality chances. But don't finish.

As a comparison to our competion...Anyone who has followed Sheffield Utd this season will compare, and be highly frustrated. They create far below us...yet score, defend and win more. 

However...conceding from silly mistakes has also been like it for a long time. Regardless of formations, injuries, or personnel. 

For me...it's not 433 that's the problem...it's the quality of performances weekly by championship standard players,that flatter to deceive. 

Don't get me wrong... I think we will improve and are improving.

But let's not protect NP from constructive criticism, just because we want him here and fear criticism is negative. 

He will be fuming inside imo...even though he's seen positives in performance for next season. 

10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

The way the game panned out…and resulted in what was a frustrating afternoon, was in part (a good part) because of Reading.  They sit deep, fill the box and rely on “number of bodies” to make it difficult to create clear-cut chances from close-in.  On a pitch where it was difficult for agile players to be agile (!) it gives defenders an extra split-second to mark, block, etc.  Mehmeti’s shot late on that looked more like a cross, was a result of the ball bobbling just as he strikes it.

We had quite a few melees in the box too, didn’t quite fall to us.

If you ever played attack v defence on a half pitch in training (I’m sure you have), you know how difficult it is to score when the defence only has one objective…and they don’t get dragged out of shape.

Performance wise, I’m pretty content.

Result wise, less so.

One final thing.  We have no real bench currently to keep the levels up.  So when your best players go off you are weakening yourself.  Some teams are able to strengthen with subs.  It was right to sub Conway today, but I think today Conway’s 59 mins highlighted the gulf between him and Bell overall.  I’m not referring to today for Bell (not sure anyone would compare a 2 min display!!), but over the period he’s been out.  Conway is a star.  Bell has done ok…that’s a big difference.

I concur with your sentiments Dave...however...we can make as many excuses as we like, and point out Readings' game plan and pros...They've only got a point against Blackpool and lost a host of games beforehand, with arguably a stronger squad available. 

They are cannon fodder. We should have nailed them. Them and QPR are awful ATM. 

[Kingswood Robin]

11 minutes ago, spudski said:

Thanks for the response. 

I agree..our finishing has been poor for a long time. We create quality chances. But don't finish.

As a comparison to our competion...Anyone who has followed Sheffield Utd this season will compare, and be highly frustrated. They create far below us...yet score, defend and win more. 

However...conceding from silly mistakes has also been like it for a long time. Regardless of formations, injuries, or personnel. 

For me...it's not 433 that's the problem...it's the quality of performances weekly by championship standard players,that flatter to deceive. 

Don't get me wrong... I think we will improve and are improving.

But let's not protect NP from constructive criticism, just because we want him here and fear criticism is negative. 

He will be fuming inside imo...even though he's seen positives in performance for next season. 

I concur with your sentiments Dave...however...we can make as many excuses as we like, and point out Readings' game plan and pros...They've only got a point against Blackpool and lost a host of games beforehand, with arguably a stronger squad available. 

They are cannon fodder. We should have nailed them. Them and QPR are awful ATM. 

Agreed. Reading looking like a team with about 6 players making their debut. They were appalling and we should have smashed them out of site. No excuses for that, just not good enough.

Edited April 1, 2023 by Kingswood Robin

[ralphindevon]

17 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

The way the game panned out…and resulted in what was a frustrating afternoon, was in part (a good part) because of Reading.  They sit deep, fill the box and rely on “number of bodies” to make it difficult to create clear-cut chances from close-in.  On a pitch where it was difficult for agile players to be agile (!) it gives defenders an extra split-second to mark, block, etc.  Mehmeti’s shot late on that looked more like a cross, was a result of the ball bobbling just as he strikes it.

We had quite a few melees in the box too, didn’t quite fall to us.

If you ever played attack v defence on a half pitch in training (I’m sure you have), you know how difficult it is to score when the defence only has one objective…and they don’t get dragged out of shape.

Performance wise, I’m pretty content.

Result wise, less so.

One final thing.  We have no real bench currently to keep the levels up.  So when your best players go off you are weakening yourself.  Some teams are able to strengthen with subs.  It was right to sub Conway today, but I think today Conway’s 59 mins highlighted the gulf between him and Bell overall.  I’m not referring to today for Bell (not sure anyone would compare a 2 min display!!), but over the period he’s been out.  Conway is a star.  Bell has done ok…that’s a big difference.

That’s a good point re the bench. I can’t remember a more lightweight bench for us, even in seasons we’ve not been doing as well as this. Which makes it difficult when you’re starting with players like Conway that you know you’ll have to sub after an hour.

This in a season where we’ve seen at Ashton Gate maybe the most expensive bench ever assembled in club football when we played Man City. It feels and looks more than one league apart. 

[Davefevs]

47 minutes ago, spudski said:

I concur with your sentiments Dave...however...we can make as many excuses as we like, and point out Readings' game plan and pros...They've only got a point against Blackpool and lost a host of games beforehand, with arguably a stronger squad available. 

They are cannon fodder. We should have nailed them. Them and QPR are awful ATM. 

We aren’t that great either though (at the mo’).  We might be seen as cannon fodder by some too.  We are a shadow of the team that can contain Atkinson, Naismith, Scott that results in Pring having to play CB, plus Kalas too. 

37 minutes ago, Kingswood Robin said:

Agreed. Reading looking like a team with about 6 players making their debut. They were appalling and we should have smashed them out of site. No excuses for that, just not good enough.

Out of interest who were the 6 (ish) Reading players you thought looked / played as if they were making their debuts?

[Kolsch]

That was a really frustrating performance today against a poor Reading side.

Decision making and final ball in the Reading half was poor throughout. It showed today just how much we miss Scott and his ability to cut open defences and pick a killer pass.

[spudski]

Just now, Davefevs said:

We aren’t that great either though (at the mo’).  We might be seen as cannon fodder by some too.  We are a shadow of the team that can contain Atkinson, Naismith, Scott that results in Pring having to play CB, plus Kalas too. 

Out of interest who were the 6 (ish) Reading players you thought looked / played as if they were making their debuts?

Are we that much better at winning games..not performing...with all those in the team? 

Even with everyone fit...and available, and playing to their strengths...where are we? 

[Davefevs]

7 minutes ago, spudski said:

Are we that much better at winning games..not performing...with all those in the team? 

Even with everyone fit...and available, and playing to their strengths...where are we? 

If our best(ish) 11-14 were available every week, we’d be top half I reckon.  With some further depth we can be top 10, pushing.

We’ve had an 8 game and 13 game unbeaten run this season…coincided with having those players fit.  Of course that’s an over-simplification of it, but I also recognise you don’t get your best players playing every week, hence why I’ve always argued we aren’t anywhere near a top half “squad of first teamer”…if that makes sense.

I’m happy with the progress of players as individuals in the main.  Need to have that level in depth next season to really kick-on.

[Merrick's Marvels]

19 minutes ago, spudski said:

Are we that much better at winning games..not performing...with all those in the team? 

Even with everyone fit...and available, and playing to their strengths...where are we? 

Top half of the middle 8.

But Conway will get better, Pring will get better, Tanner will get better, pray god Atkinson will get better (pray god his knee does) Scott will get better (yes I know, I know), Sykes will get better, Mehmeti will get better, Bell will get better, Kane Wilson might turn out to be Carlos Alberto re-incarnated and Kalas will get fit or a centre half of Pearson's choosing will replace him, ie a gurt big un (what input has Pearson had on any of our defensive signings so far?? precious little, I think).

And if Scott leaves, there's money to spend.

Cheer up!

Edited April 1, 2023 by Merrick's Marvels

[spudski]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

If our best(ish) 11-14 were available every week, we’d be top half I reckon.  With some further depth we can be top 10, pushing.

We’ve had an 8 game and 13 game unbeaten run this season…coincided with having those players fit.  Of course that’s an over-simplification of it, but I also recognise you don’t get your best players playing every week, hence why I’ve always argued we aren’t anywhere near a top half “squad of first teamer”…if that makes sense.

I’m happy with the progress of players as individuals in the main.  Need to have that level in depth next season to really kick-on.

I agree on paper with your observations... however a lot of what we think, in reality, often goes below our expectations.

I often look at expectations and view that we often air on the side of positivity, when in reality, the results prove differently. 

As we stand I see us as just above relegation. With improvement...mid table. 

Our constant displays ' flatter to deceive ' regardless of personnel, injuries or formations. 

You've only got to look through pretty much every games post comments to see the same elements occurring...a common theme. 

4 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Top half of the middle 8.

But Conway will get better, Pring will get better, Tanner will get better, pray god Atkinson will get better (pray god his knee does) Scott will get better (yes I know, I know), Sykes will get better, Mehmeti will get better, Bell will get better, Kane Wilson might turn out to be Carlos Alberto re-incarnated and Kalas will get fit or a centre half of Pearson's choosing will replace him, ie a gurt big un (what input has Pearson had on any of our defensive signings so far?? precious little, I think).

And if Scott leaves, there's money to spend.

Cheer up!

I am cheerful...just a realist. 

C'mon mate there's a lot of hope in your post. Saying ' will get better' doesn't make it fact. 

We hope they do. 

 

[Merrick's Marvels]

12 minutes ago, spudski said:

I agree on paper with your observations... however a lot of what we think, in reality, often goes below our expectations.

I often look at expectations and view that we often air on the side of positivity, when in reality, the results prove differently. 

As we stand I see us as just above relegation. With improvement...mid table. 

Our constant displays ' flatter to deceive ' regardless of personnel, injuries or formations. 

You've only got to look through pretty much every games post comments to see the same elements occurring...a common theme. 

I am cheerful...just a realist. 

C'mon mate there's a lot of hope in your post. Saying ' will get better' doesn't make it fact. 

We hope they do. 

 

Guess I retain 100% faith in the manager. At least until he's been given the chance to build his own team - which will probably require the sale of Scott but that's life. 

Other than that, I'm not sure what you expected from this set of players this season. 

Edited April 1, 2023 by Merrick's Marvels

[Hamdon Mart]

Was going to type out a gert long post of my thoughts but most of them covered already.

But briefly...

1. JD is not half the player he used to be, whether he has checked out of the club already, I'm not sure. Lost count today of the number of times he looks forward but then passes back, stifling any momentum City try to build on the left, and that's happened countless matches this season. Genuinely think it affects Mehmeti too; not sure how but he looks a far better player with Pring behind him.

2. Cornick and Mehmeti just need a goal and then others will follow. Watch them both score in the final game of the campaign before we break up for 3 months. 

3. Conway looked good after several weeks out.

4. Max's distribution much better today - he had a purple patch of ten minutes where a couple of throws and kicks were nailed perfectly. 

5. Er, that's it.

[spudski]

13 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Guess I retain 100% faith in the manager. At least until he's been given the chance to build his own team - which will probably require the sale of Scott but that's life. 

Other than that, I'm not sure what you expected from this set of players this season. 

I also have faith in NP... however imo, like me, he would have expected better results, not necessarily performances, from our squad this season. After all he has stated we are looking for top 6. 

We are far from that results wise. 

And that is my point. 

You've only got to speak to fans of other clubs...the majority say we should be better results wise from our performances. 

We as fans who watch every week can see that. We perform well, yet concede silly goals and don't put away very decent chances. 

You can only keep doing that for so long. 

I see progress... I also can't see us progressing further than what we are if we have to keep selling our best players, and keep replacing them with young hungry players to develop...and if they do...sell them again. 

It's a perpetual motion of one step forwards,two steps back. 

As an example...do you have faith that any money from Semenyo and Scott will be spent on players that equal their quality? 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Nice to see James and Conway back and not a moment too soon with our stretched squad.

We dominated but more and half IMO, first half felt like..oh we had a lot of the ball but something wasn't quite there. Albeit disallowed goal, in fact were both of these right or?

Should have won, the goal itself seemed a soft one for us to concede, we had strong spells of pressure and dominated..but we seem to be in one of our less clinical phases.

[glynriley]

1 minute ago, spudski said:

 

As an example...do you have faith that any money from Semenyo and Scott will be spent on players that equal their quality? 

What a stupid question. To replace them with players of equal quality, will require spending £30 million. 

We’ll replace them with players who cost very little but can be developed into multi million pound assets. Easier said than done of course, but such is the lot of perineal under achievers. 

[pillred]

5 hours ago, Spike said:

It's deserved because we've not taken our chances, they've created and taken one. Had we put away one of our numerous chances it wouldn't have been an equaliser, it would have been a consolation goal. 
We've obviously been the better team in our play but when it comes to scoring goals it's a fair scoreline atm because we've been so shit with our chances.

Hard to disagree painful as that is, but it's what we do ( well most of the time) one day apart from 2015 when almost everything went right for us we do seem to be a club where every 50-50 ball seems to fall to the opposition. Our time will come hopefully before I kick the bucket :laugh:.

[Daniro]

2 hours ago, maxjak said:

A very frustrating game.........but although i am in danger of being over pedantic.........when i Hear NP state that the goal we conceded from a set piece "was a lesson learnt", it does make me wonder how many lessons do we  need     until we learn?   While appreciating the injury problems evident at the back this season, it was still a really poor goal to concede?  But then again, I guess if the forwards had done THEIR job..........it would have been a mere consolation?

You'd think the lesson "Don't give their big striker a free header from free kicks" would have been learned a long time ago

[pillred]

3 hours ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

and why we are where we are. There's 3 points between us.

In reality, though whose shoes would you rather be in, I mean they were crap weren't they and got away with a result they and their fans know they did not deserve, overall our trajectory  will mean we will improve as a team, would you as a Reading fan be able to say the same? 

Edited April 1, 2023 by pillred

[Kingswood Robin]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

We aren’t that great either though (at the mo’).  We might be seen as cannon fodder by some too.  We are a shadow of the team that can contain Atkinson, Naismith, Scott that results in Pring having to play CB, plus Kalas too. 

Out of interest who were the 6 (ish) Reading players you thought looked / played as if they were making their debuts?

Unfortunately I don't have an intimate knowledge of the Reading team, but I saw basic mistakes all over the place from them. They looked nervous at times and made poor decisions, some of which was caused by us, which is good.

Large parts of our game are improving and I'm supportive of Pearson and think/hope we'll continue to improve. I know it's not all about one game, but we carelessly threw points away today and I don't think we should shy away from that, we're better than that now. I know that's how it goes sometimes, but we should have put them to the sword and the fact that we didn't was what made it not good enough for me today.

[Davefevs]

33 minutes ago, pillred said:

In reality, though whose shoes would you rather be in, I mean they were crap weren't they and got away with a result they and their fans know they did not deserve, overall our trajectory  will mean we will improve as a team, would you as a Reading fan be able to say the same? 

Exactly.

Option 1: retain your best players, lose points, fall under a business plan, fail business plan then getting prepared for another points deduction that threatens your Championship status, or…

Option 2: bite the bullet, cut the costs, at the expense of your first team numbers and depth, whilst developing the ones that remain (and the culture) and integrate youngsters, whilst preserving your championship status fairly comfortably AND setting the foundations for future progress.

I know it’s not as black and white as the two extreme options I present, but I’m glad we are running with something more like option 2 than option 1.