Vyner - year extension option activated

[richwwtk]

3 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

If we can sell Ralph Milne to Man Utd, anything's possible....

Alex Ferguson's first signing at Man Utd wasn't it?

I think in this case, though, Richard Dryden to Southampton might be more of a parallel.

[Searles]

1 hour ago, Packman said:

I suggested that prem clubs might be looking at Vyner on another thread, several laughing emojis later and it turns out I might be right. It wouldn't surprise me.

Well done that is some skill you have.

[RedRoss]

I'm sure we're trying to get Vyner on a new contract.. however we've not had much news as of yet.

Surely there will be a cut off during this window for him to make a decision and if he's inclined to not sign potentially he could be off?

[Parkwaymom]

I’m sure I heard an interview a couple of months ago where i interpreted his comments as indicating he’d be very happy to move this summer if a suitable offer was made. 

[Jeez]

 

2 hours ago, Parkwaymom said:

I’m sure I heard an interview a couple of months ago where i interpreted his comments as indicating he’d be very happy to move this summer if a suitable offer was made. 

If you’re a player like Zak - you have to be thinking it’s either time for a proper contract from City or use his best season as a stepping stone to build his career elsewhere.

It wasn’t so long ago that he wasn’t fancied and played so many games due to injuries & to his credit he really, really kicked on.

I get Pearson saying they need to prove more than one season, but football moves so quickly these days & a player like Zak is taking a risk staying on current contact if say his game time gets reduced due to new signings etc.

[Mendip City]

14 minutes ago, Jeez said:

 

If you’re a player like Zak - you have to be thinking it’s either time for a proper contract from City or use his best season as a stepping stone to build his career elsewhere.

It wasn’t so long ago that he wasn’t fancied and played so many games due to injuries & to his credit he really, really kicked on.

I get Pearson saying they need to prove more than one season, but football moves so quickly these days & a player like Zak is taking a risk staying on current contact if say his game time gets reduced due to new signings etc.

Agree. I really home I’m wrong but Rob Dickie looks like a potential replacement. That would really bother me, selling a younger player who’s had his best ever season and bringing in an older player who has just had his worst. 

[GrahamC]

20 minutes ago, Mendip City said:

Agree. I really home I’m wrong but Rob Dickie looks like a potential replacement. That would really bother me, selling a younger player who’s had his best ever season and bringing in an older player who has just had his worst. 

 Vyner is 26, Dickie is 27.

Age is therefore completely irrelevant here, we have no idea what is going on behind the scenes, but to suggest this is like bringing in a Timm Klose type is very odd.

[TommyD68]

It’s quite an important decision for Zak, he’s coming into his prime now and arguably the next contract he signs will be the most important as that’s where he’s most likely to be at his peak. Like others have said he’s coming off the back of his best ever season and deserves an improved contract offer..  I imagine City have offered either the same terms or a slight increase, however given the minutes he’s played and performances from him this season I think that would be slightly naive from City to expect him to sign. I personally think it would make more sense to let Kalas go which will free up some wages and offer Zak a better long term contract. We could be looking at the next club captain there once Weimann and James move on, it would be a real shame to let him go in my opinion. It wouldn’t surprise me if a couple championship clubs make an offer towards the end of the window if City and Zak make a good start to the season. 

[Davefevs]

16 minutes ago, TommyD68 said:

It’s quite an important decision for Zak, he’s coming into his prime now and arguably the next contract he signs will be the most important as that’s where he’s most likely to be at his peak. Like others have said he’s coming off the back of his best ever season and deserves an improved contract offer..  I imagine City have offered either the same terms or a slight increase, however given the minutes he’s played and performances from him this season I think that would be slightly naive from City to expect him to sign. I personally think it would make more sense to let Kalas go which will free up some wages and offer Zak a better long term contract. We could be looking at the next club captain there once Weimann and James move on, it would be a real shame to let him go in my opinion. It wouldn’t surprise me if a couple championship clubs make an offer towards the end of the window if City and Zak make a good start to the season. 

I honestly think the contract being offered currently will be far superior to the one he signed in Oct 2020 (3+1), but I think Nige is pointing out (not necessarily to Zak) that one good season doesn’t entitle you to a contract at / near the top of the wage structure either.

I don’t think we should be under-offering either (just because he’s local), nor do I think Kalas’s offer has much bearing on Zak’s offer either…it will be based on them individually.

I fully expect him to sign a new deal here.

[Porto Red]

Is it just me or does the emphasis on getting in defenders early doors seem to make more sense through the lens of the club knowing that we were likely to lose both Kalas and Vyner before long?

[RedRoss]

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/bristol-city-open-fresh-contract-8539743

Offered a contract previously which was rejected. Awaiting new talks with the player. With our new policy of selling players proactively I can see him going this window unless we just get really bad offers it may be better to keep for a year. Previously Nigel wants players out if the don't want to commit however.

Edited June 21, 2023 by RedRoss

[Silvio Dante]

3 minutes ago, RedRoss said:

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/bristol-city-open-fresh-contract-8539743

Offered a contract previously which was rejected. Awaiting new talks with the player. With our new policy of selling players proactively I can see him going this window unless we just get really bad offers it may be better to keep for a year. Previously Nigel wants players out if the don't want to commit however.

I’ve said this on a couple of threads - I think he’s going this summer. 
 

For as good as Zak was last season he was above his prior standards, and was on his way out the summer before. We will have (when all fit) McCrorie, Atkinson, Dickie, Naismith and offered to Kalas. Add Pring/Roberts and that’s 7 CB options without Zak. It’s clear to me we’re planning without him, and I stand by that he should only be given a contract reflective of what Nige thinks his worth is to the team over the next 3 years.

If Kalas accepts, I think Vyner leaves. Even if he doesn’t I’m not convinced he stays.

 

[cidered abroad]

On 10/06/2023 at 12:25, Davefevs said:

I honestly think the contract being offered currently will be far superior to the one he signed in Oct 2020 (3+1), but I think Nige is pointing out (not necessarily to Zak) that one good season doesn’t entitle you to a contract at / near the top of the wage structure either.

I don’t think we should be under-offering either (just because he’s local), nor do I think Kalas’s offer has much bearing on Zak’s offer either…it will be based on them individually.

I fully expect him to sign a new deal here.

Is Pring in the same position as Vyner? Less than one good steady form, so needs another one this season before an increase?

[RedRoss]

1 minute ago, Silvio Dante said:

I’ve said this on a couple of threads - I think he’s going this summer. 
 

For as good as Zak was last season he was above his prior standards, and was on his way out the summer before. We will have (when all fit) McCrorie, Atkinson, Dickie, Naismith and offered to Kalas. Add Pring/Roberts and that’s 7 CB options without Zak. It’s clear to me we’re planning without him, and I stand by that he should only be given a contract reflective of what Nige thinks his worth is to the team over the next 3 years.

If Kalas accepts, I think Vyner leaves. Even if he doesn’t I’m not convinced he stays.

 

Completely agree, I've had that same feeling. Weve already sorted out a contingency plan of sorts and may go back into the market if he is moved on and Kalas doesn't resign. I also think we should stick to the contract we've deemed good enough to offer based on his last few years not just the upturn in his form last season. Nigel has said we won't be offering bumper wages just off one good decent and I agree.

[marcofisher]

13 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

I’ve said this on a couple of threads - I think he’s going this summer. 
 

For as good as Zak was last season he was above his prior standards, and was on his way out the summer before. We will have (when all fit) McCrorie, Atkinson, Dickie, Naismith and offered to Kalas. Add Pring/Roberts and that’s 7 CB options without Zak. It’s clear to me we’re planning without him, and I stand by that he should only be given a contract reflective of what Nige thinks his worth is to the team over the next 3 years.

If Kalas accepts, I think Vyner leaves. Even if he doesn’t I’m not convinced he stays.

 

Both Atkinson and Kalas have been victims of long-term injuries. Naismith had a lot of niggles las season too, and I think we may see him more in front of the back four. I think we will try to keep Vyner for these reasons.

 

[RedRoss]

6 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

Is Pring in the same position as Vyner? Less than one good steady form, so needs another one this season before an increase?

I'd say so. All players need to be treated the same way. That being said we have an extra year security with Pring to demonstrate exactly that.

[Davefevs]

Zak has got a big decision to make.

He’s had a good season, but lots in the melting pot, e.g.

• was that Zak’s peak
• can he show he’s good enough to be in a top 10 / 6 side
• what role will he get elsewhere 
• what money will he get elsewhere 
• what fee do we want

A lot to weigh up.

For, as much as he improved last year, both performance wise and vocal / leading wise, he started from a lower point, and to me he’s at the standard to play and perform.  We are looking to improve, Zak needs to improve again.  If he can, great.  But it’s not a given.

I want all my Centre-backs to be pushing each other…even though as someone else posted a few days back, I’d like to see pairings build.

[Merrick's Marvels]

6 hours ago, marcofisher said:

Both Atkinson and Kalas have been victims of long-term injuries. Naismith had a lot of niggles las season too, and I think we may see him more in front of the back four. I think we will try to keep Vyner for these reasons.

 

If Kalas and/or Vyner left, we'd try to sign O'Brien from Palace. Then we'd be:

Dickie + McCrorie/O'Brien 

Atkinson + Naismith/Roberts

If Kalas stayed, so much the better. 

[cidered abroad]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Zak has got a big decision to make.

He’s had a good season, but lots in the melting pot, e.g.

• was that Zak’s peak
• can he show he’s good enough to be in a top 10 / 6 side
• what role will he get elsewhere 
• what money will he get elsewhere 
• what fee do we want

A lot to weigh up.

For, as much as he improved last year, both performance wise and vocal / leading wise, he started from a lower point, and to me he’s at the standard to play and perform.  We are looking to improve, Zak needs to improve again.  If he can, great.  But it’s not a given.

I want all my Centre-backs to be pushing each other…even though as someone else posted a few days back, I’d like to see pairings build.

Having seen O'Leary, Kelly and Vyner as raw youngsters at Taunton in the pre season of 2015, nothing would give me greater pleasure to see the two still at City as the lynch pins in our defence.

Yet, as I've posted in another thread recently, I expect that Pearson may be unsure that the two still with City, having taken until their mid twenties, will continue improving fast enough to take us higher in this league let alone the Prem.

[GrahamC]

7 hours ago, Silvio Dante said:

I’ve said this on a couple of threads - I think he’s going this summer. 
 

For as good as Zak was last season he was above his prior standards, and was on his way out the summer before. We will have (when all fit) McCrorie, Atkinson, Dickie, Naismith and offered to Kalas. Add Pring/Roberts and that’s 7 CB options without Zak. It’s clear to me we’re planning without him, and I stand by that he should only be given a contract reflective of what Nige thinks his worth is to the team over the next 3 years.

If Kalas accepts, I think Vyner leaves. Even if he doesn’t I’m not convinced he stays.

 

Interesting theory.

Would just say though based on their recent injury records the likelihood of all of those others being fit at the same time is on the very slim side of remote.

Atkinson is definitely out until around November, Kalas was available only 12 games out of 46 last season, Naismith for just 26.

Dickie does have a pretty decent availability record (last two seasons 43/46 & 38/46) but Vyner’s last 3 seasons have seen him being available for 46, 46 & 45 games respectively.

Even if he isn’t our best central defender that sort of reliability is invaluable when you look at the record of some of the others.

[The Swan and Cemetery]

Think how we dealt with Massengo maybe instructive. If you’re not prepared to sign, don’t expect to play. For HNM that was potentially fine given age, games under his belt and acknowledgement of potential in his home country… for Zak/others, missing a season or so when at prime age might be very risky for getting a new club/remuneration he’s after. I really like Zak and think reasonable to believe he may not have reached his ceiling, but as a City fan, think we need to be fair, but tough, in our negotiating approach and if that means recruitment is to backfill a player that’s not playing, rather than one that’s left the club, sobeit. Whilst financially tricky in the here and now, think it helps us in the medium term with the message it sends. 

[OldlandReddies]

Don't think anyone will come in for him. 

 

Better off staying with us for at least another season as we and he are going places. 

 

If he went elsewhere it could really backfire. 

[W-S-M Seagull]

I've said many times on here about how Pearson gives little nuggets in his press conferences which don't always make sense at the time but eventually they do. 

He previously said about how players can't expect top dollar after one good season or something along those lines. It's clear now that he was on about Zak. From my poor memory that interview may have been around the time that we now know Zak rejected the contract? 

I'm not overly fussed if he stays or goes. I still think he has a mistake in him and has moments where he switches off, Blackpool at home sticks in the memory. 

I also have my doubts whether he can improve further and is there a possibility that last season he was simply playing for a contract? What version of Zak do we see if he gets a new contract? He always seems a bit too laid back for my liking. I like cbs who are ready to go to war. 

I also feel as if our new signings were pretty keen to join us. That's the type of players I want here. It doesn't appear that Zak has the same desire as them right now. 

If a new contract isn't signed by the start of pre season then unfortunately he has to have the Massengo treatment. 

[Sleepy1968]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

If a new contract isn't signed by the start of pre season then unfortunately he has to have the Massengo treatment. 

if you trigger a contract extension, then leave a player out of the team for that extension period, then you've royally f'd up.

[BCFCAL]

16 hours ago, cidered abroad said:

Is Pring in the same position as Vyner? Less than one good steady form, so needs another one this season before an increase?

I think so, but as Dave said, I think the offer on the table for Vyner will be a better contract than he had previously, just not at the top of the wage structure. Pring is slightly younger and has more time on his contract though, so isn't a time critical issue.

I think if Vyner doesn't sign, he will eventually be phased out of the squad in this coming season, which I can't see him benefiting from in the slightest, as won't see any clubs being in for him if he only plays max 20 games or so next season.

[marcofisher]

2 hours ago, BCFCAL said:

I think so, but as Dave said, I think the offer on the table for Vyner will be a better contract than he had previously, just not at the top of the wage structure. Pring is slightly younger and has more time on his contract though, so isn't a time critical issue.

I think if Vyner doesn't sign, he will eventually be phased out of the squad in this coming season, which I can't see him benefiting from in the slightest, as won't see any clubs being in for him if he only plays max 20 games or so next season.

Agreed, although maybe he is waiting to see if any reported interest in him leads to a bid. I think he may well sign on later in the transfer window/just after it shuts if nothing comes about.

[BCFCAL]

5 minutes ago, marcofisher said:

Agreed, although maybe he is waiting to see if any reported interest in him leads to a bid. I think he may well sign on later in the transfer window/just after it shuts if nothing comes about.

Agree with you, shame that an academy player is going about it in that way though after one good season, when he wasn't exactly pulling up any trees beforehand and the club stuck with him.

[marcofisher]

2 minutes ago, BCFCAL said:

Agree with you, shame that an academy player is going about it in that way though after one good season, when he wasn't exactly pulling up any trees beforehand and the club stuck with him.

True, but he will also argue that he had an opportunity, not because the club afforded him it because with injuries there was no real choice, and he took it. Maybe this summer is the one chance he will have for a big move whereas a few more years and he will not be a young centre half.

I don't blame him, he is a smart lad, and has been with us for a long time. It's not unheard of that someone may simply just think a fresh start may be good for them and their career.

[BCFCAL]

4 minutes ago, marcofisher said:

True, but he will also argue that he had an opportunity, not because the club afforded him it because with injuries there was no real choice, and he took it. Maybe this summer is the one chance he will have for a big move whereas a few more years and he will not be a young centre half.

I don't blame him, he is a smart lad, and has been with us for a long time. It's not unheard of that someone may simply just think a fresh start may be good for them and their career.

That's very true, just a shame really I suppose, because I think if he goes to the premier league, he doesn't start for any club. Also an extreme lack of loyalty in today's game.

Saying that, I cant blame any footballer that goes for money, especially playing at Championship level, they're not getting the six figure sums p/w that the league above are, may as well get that pension pot as high as possible and sort your family out!

Edited June 22, 2023 by BCFCAL

[bcfc01]

I think NP is totally correct in saying that one good season isn't grounds for a huge increase in salary.

We've all seen many times players who have a stellar season or great loan period who then regress back to how they were. For me, Zak was never good enough to be an automatic choice in the Championship prior to last season, too many lapses of concentration and too many mistakes for his age and experience. I'd be very wary of offering him a 3 year deal on greatly improved wages if I were NP.

If he feels that he is worth more then he should test the market, which he is obviously doing. At 26, if he can get a better deal elsewhere he should take it.

Either way, best of luck to him.