Todays matches

[AnAstonVillafan]

19 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I'll concede they have very much made the most of their spending and good fortune.

We have five players out injured. That is not good fortune.

The starting line up last night had just two of the current managers signings. The key here is improvement of existing players through coaching. Our captain was signed by Steve Bruce while we were in the Championship for less than £3m.

So less spending and fortune, and more coaching, planning, good recuitment, building confidence and installing a culture and mentality. The money helps and is needed but that's not what it's all about.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, AnAstonVillafan said:

We have five players out injured. That is not good fortune.

The starting line up last night had just two of the current managers signings. The key here is improvement of existing players through coaching. Our captain was signed by Steve Bruce while we were in the Championship for less than £3m.

So less spending and fortune, and more coaching, planning, good recuitment, building confidence and installing a culture and mentality. The money helps and is needed but that's not what it's all about.

Historic good fortune I mean

Full credit now of course but there were a couple of sliding doors moments in 2019 and 2020.

To a degree but I'd have to look at the Additions to Intangible Assets etc it's a mix- had you kept Dean Smith in November 2021 Aston Villa may have slid back down.

Emery a very good manager of course.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Anyway most PL clubs are objectionable one way or another. A few that aren't but.

[AnAstonVillafan]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Historic good fortune I mean

Full credit now of course but there were a couple of sliding doors moments in 2019 and 2020.

To a degree but I'd have to look at the Additions to Intangible Assets etc it's a mix- had you kept Dean Smith in November 2021 Aston Villa may have slid back down.

Emery a very good manager of course.

As I said before we got lucky only with the ownership. Thats the only sliding doors moment. If they never brought us when they did, we'd be where Sheffield Wednesday are right now.

Sometimes it's good for a football club to advance, move forward.  Our owners put the money in to keep Jack Grealish, only eventually selling him for the correct price.  They also sacked Bruce, Smith and Gerrard at the right times.  With Emery in, he has been provided with everything he needs and backed to advance us. 

And my goodness did last night feel good. If there is a club out there which is everything wrong in English club football Man City is that club.

 

Not us

[GrahamC]

11 minutes ago, AnAstonVillafan said:

And my goodness did last night feel good. If there is a club out there which is everything wrong in English club football Man City is that club.

 

Not us

Chelsea run them pretty close.

[frenchred]

2 hours ago, AnAstonVillafan said:

Aston Villa did not cheat, and passed EPL & EFL investigations.

Bless

[W-S-M Seagull]

23 minutes ago, AnAstonVillafan said:

As I said before we got lucky only with the ownership. Thats the only sliding doors moment. If they never brought us when they did, we'd be where Sheffield Wednesday are right now.

Sometimes it's good for a football club to advance, move forward.  Our owners put the money in to keep Jack Grealish, only eventually selling him for the correct price.  They also sacked Bruce, Smith and Gerrard at the right times.  With Emery in, he has been provided with everything he needs and backed to advance us. 

And my goodness did last night feel good. If there is a club out there which is everything wrong in English club football Man City is that club.

 

Not us

Your owners sold your stadium to themselves which saw your narrowly avoid breaching ffp. 

I'd say clubs like yours, doing things like that, is what is wrong with English football. 

Man City haven't done that. 

So yes, it is you. 

[Rob k]

Watching Everton v Newcastle, free kick every 15 secs, boring.

[AnAstonVillafan]

22 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Your owners sold your stadium to themselves which saw your narrowly avoid breaching ffp. 

I'd say clubs like yours, doing things like that, is what is wrong with English football. 

Man City haven't done that. 

So yes, it is you. 

If you think we're in the same boat as Man City, then there is no hope for you.  We were investigated and no wrong doing was found. It's good enough for me.

I'd be furious if we were convicted and I'd concede to your opinion. I'm not going to accept a rival football fan saying we're guilty of something when professional investigators said we are not. I will admit that selling the stadium is a dodgy practice and personally I dont like it. But we as fans can not influence that.

Man City are not co-operating with an ongoing active investigation. They are using top lawyers to delay and frustrate over one hundred charges. They may well be found not guilty, but the evidence is damning even if you can question how it came to light. Could be three or four years before there is even a hearing, and they have transformed into the dominant force in European football in the meantime.

 

That is a bad joke.

[Mr Popodopolous]

27 minutes ago, AnAstonVillafan said:

If you think we're in the same boat as Man City, then there is no hope for you.  We were investigated and no wrong doing was found. It's good enough for me.

I'd be furious if we were convicted and I'd concede to your opinion. I'm not going to accept a rival football fan saying we're guilty of something when professional investigators said we are not. I will admit that selling the stadium is a dodgy practice and personally I dont like it. But we as fans can not influence that.

Man City are not co-operating with an ongoing active investigation. They are using top lawyers to delay and frustrate over one hundred charges. They may well be found not guilty, but the evidence is damning even if you can question how it came to light. Could be three or four years before there is even a hearing, and they have transformed into the dominant force in European football in the meantime.

 

That is a bad joke.

The way in which it was done is suspect..why does it still sit on the Balance Sheet in the way that it does. Unusual maybe.

Big sliding doors moment was the Goal line tech not working as well. Goal Line Tech failing is unprecedented.

Big assist was HS2 going through your clubs Training Ground. Well it was and it wasn't. Financially it was in an FFP sense.

You also neglect to mention that you call it a loophole, it is a rule that was closed off and was only open for for or 5 years. UEFA never opened it, bit odd wouldn't you say.

I appreciate we've debated these before.

Manchester City they are accused of loads and their Hearing is scheduled for next Autumn as per some reports. God knows what happens if they're found guilty.

Edited December 7, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[AnAstonVillafan]

7 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

The way in which it was done is suspect..why does it still sit on the Balance Sheet in the way that it does. Unusual maybe.

Big sliding doors moment was the Goal line tech not working as well. Goal Line Tech failing is unprecedented.

Big assist was HS2 going through your clubs Training Ground. Well it was and it wasn't. Financially it was in an FFP sense.

You also neglect to mention that you call it a loophole, it is a rule that was closed off and was only open for for or 5 years. UEFA never opened it, bit odd wouldn't you say.

I appreciate we've debated these before.

Its suspect yes. But there it is. It is what it is.  A loophole used to save the football club ? Maybe ,

It is odd. I don't care anymore. If the football club say its compliant I will accept that, and not care about what anyone else says, unless they have seen the books. Case closed.

Its behind us now. No Villa fan worries about it with the season we are having right now.  We have moved on.

The goal line tech was not a turning point. We lost more points to corrupt and erroneous refereeing that season than we gained in that Sheffield United game. Its just that rival fans and some media obess over that one incident, totally forgetting the times we were wronged.

The HS2 compensation was completly justified. Bodymoor Heath is a valuable asset in which the club invested heavily and recompense for losing a portion of it is fair.

 

Anyways this Everton vs Newcastle is quite good the toffees have scored so it will be interesting to see if Newcastle can respond.

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, AnAstonVillafan said:

Its suspect yes. But there it is. It is what it is.  A loophole used to save the football club ? Maybe ,

It is odd. I don't care anymore. If the football club say its compliant I will accept that, and not care about what anyone else says, unless they have seen the books. Case closed.

Its behind us now. No Villa fan worries about it with the season we are having right now.  We have moved on.

The goal line tech was not a turning point. We lost more points to corrupt and erroneous refereeing that season than we gained in that Sheffield United game. Its just that rival fans and some media obess over that one incident, totally forgetting the times we were wronged.

The HS2 compensation was completly justified. Bodymoor Heath is a valuable asset in which the club invested heavily and recompense for losing a portion of it is fair.

 

Anyways this Everton vs Newcastle is quite good the toffees have scored so it will be interesting to see if Newcastle can respond.

 

 

Hope Everton go down that's for sure, cheats they are. Self righteous and entitled too. Hope the clubs pursue them for compensation too.

Suspect stuff should be looked at again by the relevant League or FA or someone.

HS2 feels like it was fast tracked or quicker than it would've been for a small business or home owner. Fact Aston Villa met a Government Committee I dunno, would most affected get to present to a Government Committee? Open to debate

Counterfactual is interesting. Had that loophole been shut forever ie never opened as UEFA didn't, I suspect Aston Villa either fail FFP getting a deduction or are hemmed in financially and don't get promoted in 2018-19.

Corrupt and wrong are 2 different things. One I hear most cited is Crystal Palace away but then again we can go back to Aston Villa being gifted a goal by Leeds without any strict obligation in 2019.

[1960maaan]

Turned Everton on at 75 minutes and 0-0 with Newcastle .

Everton just scored a third , depending on VAR , 3-0 . This lot don't look like relegation fodder.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Definitely not relegation fodder- they got the deduction at a good time too.

[1960maaan]

Spurs not making the most of a lead again . West Ham lucky with the Ward Prowse goal , but looked a different team 2nd half. Hope they play a weaker team against us . 

[Markthehorn]

27 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Definitely not relegation fodder- they got the deduction at a good time too.

Probably be nearer Europe !

 

6 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

Spurs not making the most of a lead again . West Ham lucky with the Ward Prowse goal , but looked a different team 2nd half. Hope they play a weaker team against us . 

Spurs didn’t take their chances when on top too .

[Kodjias Wrist]

Haven't taken much interest in the prem in years tbf but table looks quite interesting currently.

I used to really like villa as a kid (early 2000s) but a big proportion of their fans have this inflated ego of themselves, especially when they were in championship. I don't remember Newcastle, West Ham or Leeds fans being as bad.

[phantom]

2 minutes ago, Kodjias Wrist said:

Haven't taken much interest in the prem in years tbf but table looks quite interesting currently.

I used to really like villa as a kid (early 2000s) but a big proportion of their fans have this inflated ego of themselves, especially when they were in championship. I don't remember Newcastle, West Ham or Leeds fans being as bad.

I do agree about Villa fans, but Newcastle fans have always had these super fan mentality about themselves 

They promised so much earlier in the season but have literally run out of quality players being available 

Four horse race at best at the moment 

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 hour ago, AnAstonVillafan said:

It is odd. I don't care anymore. If the football club say its compliant I will accept that, and not care about what anyone else says, unless they have seen the books. Case closed.

What I find odd is that when it comes to your own club you say it's all fine because the club say its fine. 

You've then posted some pretty damning stuff about Man City. Man City have themselves said they are not guilty and have irrefutable evidence to prove so. 

Surely if both clubs are saying they are not guilty then you should hold the same view for both clubs? 

[Kodjias Wrist]

4 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

What I find odd is that when it comes to your own club you say it's all fine because the club say its fine. 

You've then posted some pretty damning stuff about Man City. Man City have themselves said they are not guilty and have irrefutable evidence to prove so. 

Surely if both clubs are saying they are not guilty then you should hold the same view for both clubs? 

Whilst i see the hypocrisy of what the villa fan is saying, we all know Man City have spent several times more money than Villa have in the last several years in the prem.

I think if you were asked who in the prem are most likely to be breaking financial rules 99% of fans would say Man City.

Edited December 7, 2023 by Kodjias Wrist

[Kodjias Wrist]

9 minutes ago, phantom said:

I do agree about Villa fans, but Newcastle fans have always had these super fan mentality about themselves 

They promised so much earlier in the season but have literally run out of quality players being available 

Four horse race at best at the moment 

Shame as I like seeing different clubs floating around in the top 6. 

[phantom]

2 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Your owners sold your stadium to themselves which saw your narrowly avoid breaching ffp. 

I'd say clubs like yours, doing things like that, is what is wrong with English football. 

Man City haven't done that. 

So yes, it is you. 

I'd say it was pretty common knowledge that if Villa hadn't gone up the season they did the EFL were building their case against them 

But they pushed boundaries and gambled and got in the Premier League so got away with it all 

Fortunately for them they bombed out the inept Gerrard who was taking them down and have had an amazing start to the season 

They've not really been hit by any serious injuries yet, and the extra European football will assumedly impact on them at some point 

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 minutes ago, phantom said:

I'd say it was pretty common knowledge that if Villa hadn't gone up the season they did the EFL were building their case against them 

But they pushed boundaries and gambled and got in the Premier League so got away with it all 

Fortunately for them they bombed out the inept Gerrard who was taking them down and have had an amazing start to the season 

They've not really been hit by any serious injuries yet, and the extra European football will assumedly impact on them at some point 

In theory could the PL and EFL work on the 3 years to 2019.

A minor problem is that the head of the PL by weird coincidence supports. We'd never guess.

There was also the small matter of the huge swing into the red in 2019-20 had Aston Villa stayed down.

I've done various starting point estimates...perhaps a £60-65m hole to fill just to get level.

[AnAstonVillafan]

8 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Counterfactual is interesting. Had that loophole been shut forever ie never opened as UEFA didn't, I suspect Aston Villa either fail FFP getting a deduction or are hemmed in financially and don't get promoted in 2018-19.

Corrupt and wrong are 2 different things. One I hear most cited is Crystal Palace away but then again we can go back to Aston Villa being gifted a goal by Leeds without any strict obligation in 2019.

Getting promoted isn't always about finances.  As a Villa what I'm I supposed to think about the loophole ? I don't like it.

The Crystal Palace away goal was a disgrace and a Man Utd fans themselves admit they were very fortunate to get a penalty when it was their playler who commited a foul, not ours. 

Maybe these things even out ?

[AnAstonVillafan]

7 hours ago, phantom said:

I'd say it was pretty common knowledge that if Villa hadn't gone up the season they did the EFL were building their case against them 

But they pushed boundaries and gambled and got in the Premier League so got away with it all 

Fortunately for them they bombed out the inept Gerrard who was taking them down and have had an amazing start to the season 

They've not really been hit by any serious injuries yet, and the extra European football will assumedly impact on them at some point 

Havent been hit by serious Injuries ?

Emi Buendia did his ACL just before the season started. Tyrone Mings did his ACL on day 1.

Jacob Ramsay has been out with a metatarsal injury since pre season he's just coming back.
As is Alex Moreno who has played one game so far and Bertrand Traore as missed most of the season too.

We have been impacted by injuries since the very beginning.

[AnAstonVillafan]

7 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

What I find odd is that when it comes to your own club you say it's all fine because the club say its fine. 

You've then posted some pretty damning stuff about Man City. Man City have themselves said they are not guilty and have irrefutable evidence to prove so. 

Surely if both clubs are saying they are not guilty then you should hold the same view for both clubs? 

No.

I say its fine because the club submitted to and complied with with an EFL  investgation and the Premier League reviewed and confirmed compliance in accordance with their own policies and procedures.

No double standards or hypocrisy at Kodjia's Wrist calls it. I would accept if we were found non compliant and direct my anger towards the previous owners.

Shocking defeat for Sprus there, Has Ange Postecoglou's bubble burst.  Everton would be comfortably mid table without the points deduction, which the fans are only angry about because of the possiblity that it could relegate them. Big result for them.

[phantom]

7 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

In theory could the PL and EFL work on the 3 years to 2019.

No, they are two separate entities. 

If the FA was issuing the punishment it would be different 

Same as any punishment for Man City would only see them drop into the EFL 

49 minutes ago, AnAstonVillafan said:

Havent been hit by serious Injuries ?

Emi Buendia did his ACL just before the season started. Tyrone Mings did his ACL on day 1.

Jacob Ramsay has been out with a metatarsal injury since pre season he's just coming back.
As is Alex Moreno who has played one game so far and Bertrand Traore as missed most of the season too.

We have been impacted by injuries since the very beginning.

The point is you currently have enough cover, Newcastle have gone down to the bare bones. 

They're using two keepers and a number of kids on the bench, and have been playing a 17 year old the past few games 

Believe me I know all about Villa, as a very close friend of mine is a massive Villa fan. I went to a few games with her last season but haven't been yet this season. 

[AnAstonVillafan]

24 minutes ago, phantom said:

No, they are two separate entities. 

If the FA was issuing the punishment it would be different 

Same as any punishment for Man City would only see them drop into the EFL 

The point is you currently have enough cover, Newcastle have gone down to the bare bones. 

They're using two keepers and a number of kids on the bench, and have been playing a 17 year old the past few games 

Believe me I know all about Villa, as a very close friend of mine is a massive Villa fan. I went to a few games with her last season but haven't been yet this season. 

Fuuny you say that because I work with a few Bristol fans who I have visited Ashton Gate with and and taken to Villa Park with me as well. I want to see Bristol City do well.

I post on here from a position of respect and wanting to defend my club as well.

[1960maaan]

2 hours ago, AnAstonVillafan said:

I say its fine because the club submitted to and complied with with an EFL  investgation and the Premier League reviewed and confirmed compliance in accordance with their own policies and procedures.

From my perspective , I see teams like Bournemouth getting a £7M fine for breaking FFP but in a Promotion year is a piss take. Seeing Clubs selling their Grounds to themselves is a piss take , all be it you are not Derby and it wasn't against the rules . I was reading a bit that said Villas costs for the promotion year was near £50M then you spent £135M net ! 
If our owner had done the same and spent the same we would have found a way not to get promoted , but as fans looking at what is supposed to be an *even playing field, it's annoying.

*it's not , but it used to be closer when it was all one entity. 

[AnAstonVillafan]

31 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

From my perspective , I see teams like Bournemouth getting a £7M fine for breaking FFP but in a Promotion year is a piss take. Seeing Clubs selling their Grounds to themselves is a piss take , all be it you are not Derby and it wasn't against the rules . I was reading a bit that said Villas costs for the promotion year was near £50M then you spent £135M net ! 
If our owner had done the same and spent the same we would have found a way not to get promoted , but as fans looking at what is supposed to be an *even playing field, it's annoying.

*it's not , but it used to be closer when it was all one entity. 

I hear what you're saying. These owners are taking risks and leveraging in a desparate attempt to reach or return to the PL.

There's never an even playing field. If you think its uneven in the Championship, its worse in the Prem.

Villa's costs included a contractual payment to a former owner iirc. We did spend far too much especially in 2016 under the previous owners and that in my opinion was reckless. As I said to Mr P we were very fortunate with the change of owners. Without that, or if we had beaten Fulham at Wembley and gone up (which would have been a false dawn) I reckon we would have gone into administration.