Why Are We Constantly Celebrating Average & Our Failed Past?

[KegCity]

2 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Personally I celebrate the trophy wins and I celebrate the fact that our club exists.

2014/15 we won two trophies. Including a league title. For me that's a bigger achievement than the Liverpool and Man Utd Cup wins. People will say they are tinpot trophies - to that I say they are the competitions that we qualified for that season, and we won them. It should be celebrated.

I also, and I know not everyone will agree with this, I don't think we have to be in the premier league to be considered "successful". I don't think winning, and climbing the pyramid, are the be all and end all of a football club. Is it the aim? Maybe yes. Is it the sole measure of achievement? Not for me.

But I absolutely agree with you that wishing happy birthday to active ex-players is a bit unnecessary.

What else is a measure of achievement? Amount of academy players in the first team? Community outreach?

Both great of course but not the same as winning, or at least progressing, on the pitch.

[Tim Monaghan]

9 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

Debate ? ? ?

Basically you’ve posted,  in general terms , criticising the forum , current threads , and the fanbase  for their mentality......

With your significant contribution .........suggesting we all ‘get with the times’

 

What does this actually mean ?

 

When something is actually happening there are plenty of posts on the current and the future if that’s what you crave 

 

 

I'm willing to acknowledge your apology for the inaccuracies in your initial post.

Criticism, whether directed towards fans or the club, includes myself in the mix. Personally, and it appears that this sentiment isn't unanimous, I'm growing weary of the incessant focus on Pearson. I understand that many in the fanbase were fond of him (count me in), but he's moved on. The perpetual negativity surrounding it is tiresome. Nigel is no longer with us.

Based on the forum discussions (which is my primary reference), it feels like a rather toxic environment. To me, that seems like a fair-sized sample of the fanbase, and the prevailing atmosphere is overwhelmingly negative. Perhaps I lean towards optimism more than most, or maybe I'm completely off the mark. It just strikes me that as a fanbase and a club, we are overly fixated on the negatives. Even when we finally undergo a shakeup, the response is, once again, toxic. I'm not asserting that my perspective is the correct one; it's simply my opinion and observation. I understand that engaging in a meaningful debate can be challenging for some without resorting to personal or rude remarks. (Rest assured, I'll always respond in a similar tone and respect the tone directed at me.)

This space seems saturated with Nigel admiration, and the club's page is extending birthday wishes to Jamie Paterson as if he were some legendary figure. It's all a bit peculiar and tinpot. 

"Suggesting we all ‘get with the times’, what does that actually mean" - In simple terms, get over what's been done. Stop wishing ex players a happy birthday, be a bit more forward thinking. Stop getting exited about a win over Manchester United 6 years ago, its so tinpot. Of course look back and smile, but I want to spearhead, think forward. I don't get that vibe anywhere. 

Just my opinion. 

 

[Super]

He certainly has a point about the leaving card thread it's beyond embarrassing. When we've had such little success it's pretty obvious we will keep looking back to random wins against top class opposition. 

[lenred]

37 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

"I'm intrigued what any sports fan can do apart from looking back at previous glories?" - I do agree with this, but a win against Liverpool and Manchester United, well. But that's kind of my point, we seemed to be happy with, meh. It was a great night, but we don't want to seem to push, and yeah, the Lansdowns are part of that problem, but they are trying and clearly JL saw what I did with Pearson. Absolutely love the guy but a change was needed. 

Wholeheartedly agree with this point.  It’s embarrassing that we continuously celebrate these matches year after year.  It’s the definition of tinpot.   Will ‘Boro be putting posts on their socials in 6 years time about a cup run.  Will they ****.  

[Mr Popodopolous]

As far as club sizes go we are probably based on some historic League table midtable to lower midtable in the Championship. One point it was higher end League One, lower Championship as an average position.

Should we have achieved more, very much so. Did we waste opportunities? In different ways 2007-08, 2017-18 and maybe even to an extent 2018-19.

We're we possibly building up to another one under NP? Yes I believe. Will we now? Probably not but let's hope so.

[jj77]

Are you a newcomer to Bristol?

[Bazooka Joe]

1 hour ago, Ghost Rider said:

Am I the only one who thinks like this? 

Seems so.

 

Edited December 20, 2023 by Bazooka Joe

[2015]

15 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

We have consistently backed the wrong horse during their tenure in a lot of ways yeah.

Johnson & Son. Both were given too much money in the end which f***** us in the long run. Sorry but it's true about Gary.

[bert tann]

16 minutes ago, 2015 said:

We're a small club that plays in a big City. Our history is very very modest, at best. 

We should expect better. Unfortunately, we've missed the boat on appointing the right Manager's, many nearly moments and an ownership that isn't ruthless enough to see us get to the top.

Rovers are much more modester than what you are.

City have always been a bunch of loosers.

[2015]

Just now, bert tann said:

Rovers are much more modester than what you are.

City have always been a bunch of loosers.

Nah your history is just crap mate 

[W-S-M Seagull]

Was Nige a failure? Not sure about that. 

 

[ooRya]

2 minutes ago, bert tann said:

Rovers are much more modester than what you are.

City have always been a bunch of loosers.

Just going to run this through Google Translate............................................

[BCFCGav]

I actually undertook a hefty project in my free time at work over the past year to check something and maybe it's relevant here.

In our history, we've won 10 trophies.

Championship (or equivalent) x1

League 1 (or equivalent) x4

EFL Trophy x3

Anglo-Scottish Cup x1

Welsh Cup x1

No major honours, and some of the cup wins could be called a little underwhelming. So this got me thinking about how we stack up to the other 71 EFL clubs (based on the make-up of the leagues last season). 

I delved into all 71 of their histories and compiled a list of everything they'd won in that time (as best I could, we are going back 120 years in some cases). I counted every trophy unless it was at non-league level (anything below League 2), or was regional (I didn't count our Gloucestershire cups for example). I also considered major honours to be worth more (kind of obvious, a League 2 title and a European Cup could hardly be weighted equally). And, of the 72 clubs, when looking at quantity and quality of honours, we came around 30th. So 6th in League 1 if all EFL clubs were positioned based on their honours history.

So to summarise, we have underperformed by Championship standards but have more than most the clubs in League 1 and 2 to shout about when it comes to history.

Maybe this isn't actually that relevant at all, but I found it interesting to do so though people might find it interesting to read. 

And you are correct, I'm not very fun at parties.

 

[2015]

Just now, W-S-M Seagull said:

Was Nige a failure? Not sure about that. 

 

Tidied up the mess he inherited off the pitch, but on the pitch factually we were still average and I liked NP you know that. Not a failure, but not exactly a resounding success either.

[Super]

1 minute ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Was Nige a failure? Not sure about that. 

 

Not saying he was a failure but certainly wasn't a success. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

8 minutes ago, 2015 said:

Johnson & Son. Both were given too much money in the end which f***** us in the long run. Sorry but it's true about Gary.

I can't agree on GJ not fully, if anything I'd say we were too cautious January 2008.

Some better backing and we go up. Read things on here about toxic players by March 2010 too.

Edited December 20, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[lenred]

2 minutes ago, BCFCGav said:

I actually undertook a hefty project in my free time at work over the past year to check something and maybe it's relevant here.

In our history, we've won 10 trophies.

Championship (or equivalent) x1

League 1 (or equivalent) x4

EFL Trophy x3

Anglo-Scottish Cup x1

Welsh Cup x1

No major honours, and some of the cup wins could be called a little underwhelming. So this got me thinking about how we stack up to the other 71 EFL clubs (based on the make-up of the leagues last season). 

I delved into all 71 of their histories and compiled a list of everything they'd won in that time (as best I could, we are going back 120 years in some cases). I counted every trophy unless it was at non-league level (anything below League 2), or was regional (I didn't count our Gloucestershire cups for example). I also considered major honours to be worth more (kind of obvious, a League 2 title and a European Cup could hardly be weighted equally). And, of the 72 clubs, when looking at quantity and quality of honours, we came around 30th. So 6th in League 1 if all EFL clubs were positioned based on their honours history.

So to summarise, we have underperformed by Championship standards but have more than most the clubs in League 1 and 2 to shout about when it comes to history.

Maybe this isn't actually that relevant at all, but I found it interesting to do so though people might find it interesting to read. 

And you are correct, I'm not very fun at parties.

 

Found that very interesting tbh.  I’ll come and join you in the kitchen

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 minute ago, 2015 said:

Tidied up the mess he inherited off the pitch, but on the pitch factually we were still average and I liked NP you know that. Not a failure, but not exactly a resounding success either.

 

1 minute ago, Super said:

Not saying he was a failure but certainly wasn't a success. 

Depends how you want to quantify success. 

I'd say cutting our wage bill, clearly out all the dead wood, bringing I'm 35 million whilst retaining our Championship status can be considered a success. 

There was no serious expectation to get promotion in any of the seasons he was here so I'm just not sure how his tenure can be considered a failure. 

[Tim Monaghan]

3 minutes ago, Bazooka Joe said:

Seems so.

 

And I'm happy with that. 

I believe the distinction lies in my willingness to embrace being proven wrong.

Harvard recently conducted a study on the malleability of people's opinions, and it resonated with me, particularly in the context of some discussions on this forum. In essence, the study highlighted that when individuals hold an opinion that is later proven wrong, a staggering 83% are unwilling to admit their error or maintain an open mind. Instead, they tend to double down on their original stance, perhaps to save face or protect their ego. It's a phenomenon that rings true in many cases on here. 

However, I fall outside that 83%, and my perspective is ever-evolving. If presented with better information or a well-rounded argument, my opinion is prone to change. Regrettably, such openness to diverse viewpoints appears to be somewhat lacking in our forum discussions.

[Tim Monaghan]

8 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Was Nige a failure? Not sure about that. 

 

Has anyone said Nigel was a failure? 

[ExiledAjax]

17 minutes ago, KegCity said:

What else is a measure of achievement? Amount of academy players in the first team? Community outreach?

Both great of course but not the same as winning, or at least progressing, on the pitch.

Existing.

Being a living and continuing part of the history of Bristol.

Providing a place within a community, both physical and online, where people can connect and enjoy a shared experience.

Being a positive force in that community.

There's lots of clubs that do this well, there's plenty that don't.  

The academy is important, but I believe that every person who goes through it and has a better life because of it, is a reflection of it's success. It's not all about getting cheap first team players.

You don't have to win football matches to do all of the above.

[2015]

5 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I can't agree on GJ not fully, if anything I'd say we were too cautious January 2008.

Some better backing and we go up. Read things on here about toxic players by March 2010 too.

Signed Adebola then we started playing long ball football after then. Signed a lot of average players on long contracts who couldn't get shifted off the wage bill really.

If we had a good replacement after GJ then who knows, but we all know what happened.

[W-S-M Seagull]

4 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

Has anyone said Nigel was a failure? 

Yea, you did. 

We seem to love the same old stuff, especially this weird obsession with Nigel Pearson. The guy was just so average, I don't get where all the love comes from. It's just basic and, well, a bit rubbish. We're basically cheering on failure and being okay with being average.

[glynriley]

17 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

"Suggesting we all ‘get with the times’, what does that actually mean" - In simple terms, get over what's been done. Stop wishing ex players a happy birthday, be a bit more forward thinking. Stop getting exited about a win over Manchester United 6 years ago, its so tinpot. Of course look back and smile, but I want to spearhead, think forward. I don't get that vibe anywhere. 

Just my opinion. 

 

That's all a bit difficult when you've seen the same mistakes being made over and over.

You start the revolution to get rid of the owner and his puppet board, and I'll be right there with you.

[Bazooka Joe]

4 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

I'm growing weary of the incessant focus on Pearson. I understand that many in the fanbase were fond of him (count me in), but he's moved on.

See, that's the issue.

Pearson didn't move on.

He was ousted unfairly, and treated badly.

If that wasn't the case, people wouldn't keep banging on about it and lambasting the inept Lansdowns.

Because, unless the Lansdowns are held to account, what happened to Pearson, just as easliy happen to Manning as soon as the Lansdowns consider he is stepping out of line.

So, if you want to focus on the future, let's do that.

Step one: Let's think how we can get rid of the Lansdowns, because after sufficent time in control, they have demonstrated that they cannot deliver success.

[Tim Monaghan]

2 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Yea, you did. 

We seem to love the same old stuff, especially this weird obsession with Nigel Pearson. The guy was just so average, I don't get where all the love comes from. It's just basic and, well, a bit rubbish. We're basically cheering on failure and being okay with being average.

No, that's the voices in your head.  Pay your fiver. 

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

44 minutes ago, Supersonic Robin said:

Even the Man United game, as good as it was, feels bittersweet when you reflect on how we've fallen away since, and how others have cruised past us into the Premier League in that time.

I do think there's an argument to say that the club (& fanbase) would benefit from a bit of a shift in mindset - we should be conscious of the fact that our history is disappointing and we should expect more.

 

No matter where we are- that night at the Man U game was simply sublime. Nothing bitter for me.

I started attending matches in the early 80's so thats 40 years now. Probably half that has been in Div 3. I genuinely don't get the "we should expect more" in that if you choose to drive a Ford Fiesta 1.1 then it's silly getting frustrated that it doesn't do 0-60 in 4.2 seconds.

I think we've only once looked like we may genuinely get to the top tier since 1980 and we've never come close since that season or before.BCFC are rank outsiders every year and I don't see that changing without a really big slice of luck/rub of the green/everything clicking.

 

[Simon bristol]

39 minutes ago, 2015 said:

We're a small club that plays in a big City. Our history is very very modest, at best. 

We should expect better. Unfortunately, we've missed the boat on appointing the right Manager's, many nearly moments and an ownership that isn't ruthless enough to see us get to the top.

Yes, agree with all this,, i could say we are shite,, but thats more rovers level,, we are mediocre,, and anything we can do to get even some regard from the main stream, like beating united, is celebrated as a great time in our history 

[Swede]

57 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

With the greatest of respect, that is all nonsense. 

"besides being a fierce defender of anything Lansdown" - Rubbish, I have been extremely critical of the Lansdowns. A simple looks at my posting history would show that. 
"Anti Nigel Pearson" - Again, wrong. I was upset with the sacking of Pearson, again, have a check, but, what the lording of him is silly. He's gone, get over it. 

" jealousy spot about one popular poster" - Are we talking about Davfevs? Literally couldn't care less about him, I actually think he's a decent guy full of statistical knowledge, again see a recent post. 

So, you've basically got everything wrong. Pretty impressive. 

With all due respect fella, I think you've missed the trick with Nigel Pearson, as has the club [sadly]

There are a lot of fans who think the same way hence all of the continued interest. Most managers/coaches run their course and get the inevitable parting of the ways, its part of football management. With Pearson he got rid of the high earners, steadied the ship and given the meagre budget he had, had made us competitive and looking to reach the net step. There was a feeling that we were on the cusp of something better, who knows.

Now we are starting again, yes; we all have to move on but here we are, still in the same position but with a vastly less experienced coach yet the club still have the same aspirations. The proof will be if the new coach is given a lot more funding for player recruitment come the January transfer window.

The communication from the club has been extremely poor with no real indication of why we jumped ship mid season and this is why there is still a lot of interest in Nigel Pearson. 

[The Journalist]

1 hour ago, Ghost Rider said:

I'm a bit fed up with everything Bristol City right now. It all just feels a bit backward, you know? Why are we so stuck in the past as a club and as fans, especially when we've not really achieved much? Check out the first page of the forum, and you'll see what I mean:

• Nigels leaving card
• Nigel Pearson, Bit of an Artist
• Making a fuss about winning the Carabao Cup 6 years ago (No mention of that Liverpool win we keep harping on about)
• Richard Gould back
• Mark Aston thread

And don't get me started on our social media team—constantly wishing old players happy birthday and every new shirt being some kind of "throwback." It's like we're stuck in a time loop or something.

Why can't we, as a club and a fanbase, be a bit more with the times? We seem to love the same old stuff, especially this weird obsession with Nigel Pearson. The guy was just so average, I don't get where all the love comes from. It's just basic and, well, a bit rubbish. We're basically cheering on failure and being okay with being average.

Why can't we, as a club and fanbase, get with the times a bit more? We're stuck on the same old things, especially this weird love for Nigel Pearson. The bloke was just so average; I'm scratching my head wondering why everyone's so into him apart from the fact he was a bit edgy. It's just basic and, well, a bit tinpot. We're basically cheering on failure and settling for being just average.

Am I the only one who thinks like this?

P.s Don't get me started with the love for Massengo just because he had big hair. Never has such a below average player been so lorded.  

 

Probably stems from the current team being below average and under-invested in, an ownership that’s losing interesting and a new robotic manager who fans are struggling to connect with.

None of that is the fault of the supporters. Nor the media team, to be fair.