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11 minutes ago, headhunter said:

https://foreverbristolcity.podbean.com/e/reading-h-reviewed/  [also on Spotify, Apple & Google]

After the furore of Ian's "Pearson must go" rant on Saturday he's back alongside the more measured thoughts and opinions of DaveFevs, Neil Sutton & Mark Tovey with DaveP [Headhunter] in the chair.

Best quote: DaveFevs, "at the start of the season where did you expect us to finish Ian?"    Ian, "about 16th" !!!! Nothing like moaning for the sake of it!!

Really good pod guys  many thanks

He certainly looked to be carrying a few extra pounds when he came on  and unlike Swift; had zero impact on the game.

Joao also looked unfit, and for a guy that always seems to score against us, was completely ineffective.

Why was Swift only on the bench for them? Completely changed the course of the game with his movement, anf passing when he came on.

On 06/02/2022 at 14:27, GrahamC said:

I can listen to Neil (not Nick) Sutton every week, he sits in front of me!

Cheers @GrahamC, you made me laugh there. Which given that I'm stuck at Bristol Crown Court in a trial for the next 4 weeks isn't easy.

I know Thomas (my eldest) loves shooting the breeze with you now, and your carefully considered opinions on Referees and Linesman.

I try to take a balanced approach anyhow. There are so many similarities with the 1982 situation, with all the budget issues, playing kids, smaller squads, and players out of position. The only difference is really we have SL behind us, and for some unfathomable reason, although we really have been poor for the last two seasons, we still find ourselves in the Championship; and hopefully not looking at relegation (I still check Peterborough, Barnsley & Derby after every game ).

We are yo, yoing this season. Sometimes good, sometimes bad. Very rarely in between for me. It is what it is; and let's be fair for me this season has been seen the emergence of a number of potential future stars (Semenyeo & Scott, jury still out on HNM for me).

I love the club( it gets under your skin doesn't it), and enjoy doing the podcasts when I can.

I'm looking forward to a time when we actually win back to back games again. Small gains isn't it.

3 hours ago, VT05763 said:

and just use Academy products and free transfers for the next 2 years at least ?

Possible or not ?

 

It's like 1982 all over again.....

4 minutes ago, Marcus Aurelius said:

The only positive is most other clubs won’t be able to offer any of them especially ludicrous contracts 

True, but there may be some that are not asking them to take the type of wage cuts that we are proposing.

We did an excellent job with Weimann last year, on his contract. Not sure a number of those that we want to keep won't get better offers.

Time to get creative......

Just going through the list of players that are either entering their last year,  or we have 1 year options on (not a particularly great negotiating position) at the end of the current season.

.When you consider the amount of players going into their last year of contract next season, it certainly is something that the press haven't picked up on.

In essence we are either negotiating or selling Kalas, MOL, Cundy, Massengo, Semenyeo, Bentley, Martin, Wells, KP, JD, Vyner, Moore, and COD amongst others I've missed of course (Bakinson , Baker ). I know there are a few option years in that list. But we still need them really to commit to us beyond that option year or they walk for next to nothing.

It's not like last summer,  when the list of departures almost wrote themselves. There are key players here, that we will need to build the team around; at a time where FFP (in it's current form) might be hitting us hardest. The players we don't want are not going to be easy to shift either, as their contracts are at a level not consistent with either the current market or their level of performance.

I don't envy Richard Gould this summer. It's going to be a difficult job balancing the demands of the players, with the necessity to no doubt still cut back even further from our current position. we're not alone in this of course. But any new signings would have to be factored in with new contracts for the list above.

Even the players leaving in the summer at the end of their contracts will be getting some form of loyalty bonuses; and players going into the last year of their contracts are normally paid at their highest rate. That's probably why the wage bill still managed to go up last season?

Tough times ahead....

20 hours ago, Davefevs said:

This kinda sums it up for us.

Beat all the teams below us, mix against those around us.

That second goal resembled a training ground session….in fairness Flint resembled a mannequin!

I had to laugh as Martin outpaced him.. 

Demonstrates exactly what i said on the podcast @Davefevs. We are in a mini type league at the bottom, and unlike last season appear to be competitive against the teams below us.

Not sure about our next 3 games points wise. But our home form has come at the right time to just keep us being sucked into anything too disastrous.

1 hour ago, GrahamC said:

No, he’s not.

But with Tanner injured & Simpson seemingly impersonating Lord Lucan the only other option (bar Scott, who is needed in midfield anyway now) is to play Vyner there, go to a back four & play Pring alongside Kalas with Jay back in his natural position.

We are transparently a right sided defender short & with seemingly no prospect of Moore being recalled, have to bring one in over the next 8 days.

We must be trying to sort out some parting of the ways with Simpson?

Hopefully with that and Bakinson, Jannah, and Pearson possibly 8-10k off the wage bill, and a new defender or two. 

Not sure of the concept on a 2 year contract for klose (source Gregor). I wouldn't be looking for anything more than end of the season.

16 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Really pleased for him today, came on at a tough time & asked to play out of position but stuck to his task & got a high five from Nige late on when he blocked a through ball.

Clearly not his position but should be pleased with his efforts.

I agree with you @GrahamC over his application, and his workrate; but he's definitely not a right sided defender is he?

Hates using his right foot, and mishit it a number of times. Similarly ran alongside the attacker a number of times, where it was evident he didn't want to put his right foot in.

As you quite rightly point out though. Didn't stop working, and what over options do we have in that position? We'd need to take Scott out ofnthe centre, where he is far more effective. 

13 hours ago, grifty said:

To be fair to COD I think he's done pretty good recently, has sparked up a good partnership with Pring and although still struggles with his delivery, he won a lot of headers today and put himself about a bit.

He's obviously not going to be a player to take us further, but for the amount of stick he gets, he's doing alright.

I still think COD flatters to deceive a bit. Again yesterday he got himself into good positions but the delivery was either poor, or he cut back on himself; rather than driving forward; and taking on the set of poor cardiff defenders.

I think Semenyeo got more assists in one match than COD had got all season? Says it all really.

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Yep, he scored 4 on debut, a hatrick v Cov on Boxing Day, and another 12 goals in 120-odd games!

Nov 25th 1977 - in a 4-1 win over Middlesborough.

My first ever City game. I think we finished 17th that season (77-78), which was a good result after the previous season.

2 minutes ago, ralphindevon said:

As Nige seems to be the sort of manager that likes a player who is willing to put his body on the line and take an occasional hit for the team, I’m surprised he’s stuck with COD as much as he has.

I know he’s better at defending than Palmer but to think Palmer doesn’t get a sniff!!

Not a particularly high bar set by Palmer though is it.

8 minutes ago, Snufflelufagus said:

Such a shame we let Eliason leave and not COD. 

Did we let him leave though? 

I thought it was one of those last year of contacts (possible on an option year). He wanted to go, and wasn't signing a new contract so we cashed in on the offer from France.

Lets be clear though, if we exercised COD's option, there is no £2m+ offer from any club waiting in the background.

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I said:

To be perfectly clear - There’s no way I’d give him another year at his current wage level.

Ha ha, got you @Davefevs.

Apologies, that makes a lot more sense.

Another Murder up in Glos, so missed the game yesterday. Just seen the report from @Olé

I did start this topic thinking there might still be some support for COD. But it looks like that proverbial horse has bolted!

45 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Definitely not - take up the option.

Either of the other two options depending on how the manager sees him.  I’m happy for him to be a squad player going forward.

There is a 4th option - move on now - but I don’t think that’s realistic.

Nope

3 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Didn’t he say we should definitely not take up the option? That’s how I read it.

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

For a bottom half team like us he’s “okay”, average.  What does he bring?  Pace, direct running, work rate.  When he’s playing well.  If you want all of the negative stuff just read @Olé’s view on his review of yesterday.

I think he’s in the £12-15k p.w range which is twice as much as he’d get in the current climate imho.

In 6 years here, I’d say his current level is no better than when he first joined.  He’s had ups and downs in that time.

I think you could easily find a more suitable replacement on less money than he will be holding out for.

If we could renegotiate his wages down to say £6k p.w then I’d consider it.  I suspect he and his agent will think he’s worth more…and ultimately he won’t be here next season.  He will find another Championship club, but imho it won’t be a decision we live to regret.

At 26, he should be flying.

I wonder if the contract situation has already concluded???

Wouldn't argue with any of that second post @Davefevs 

However in your first post on the topic, you advocated taking up his option year.

Would that not mean a further year on his current wages?

Not quite sure of your position on this, as you've made your point well in your second post that there are probably better options out there next season for his circa 12-15k?

Just now, Davefevs said:

Definitely not - take up the option.

Either of the other two options depending on how the manager sees him.  I’m happy for him to be a squad player going forward.

There is a 4th option - move on now - but I don’t think that’s realistic.

I'm intrigued though @Davefevs what do you feel COD brings to the team?

I'm guessing wages wise he would be in the circa 15k bracket? As a legacy of our old free spending days, and of course generally the last year of contract is the highest one, particulary with loyalty bonuses etc.

Of all the players that City have to make a contract decision about this summer, surely COD is the most intriguing.

He's been at the club 6 years now, and yet of coursr he still remains as infuriating as ever.

At times he has shown us what he is capable of. The goal against Norwich a few seasons ago. The third goal away at Birmingham last season. The first half against Blackburn this season, and of course the first 20-25 against QPR recently.

You look at the player, his pace; and potential crossing ability; and you wonder just why he can't do it on a more regular basis?

We don't really have a player in the squad at the moment on the left that can replicate what he "potentially" can do; and thus he is still given the game time to once again fail to perform.

When you see the amount of caps that he has for ROI under different managers; you can see that he is still held in some regard in the game; and yet when his last contract was nearing the end, there was no-one there of course willing to make us an offer.

Any yet of course, the stats bear out the true story. For all his show, his actual impact on results over the course of the season is at best minimal. Generally 1-2 goals, and a couple of assists. Jesus, even Bakinson looks a world beater based on that!

Defensively for me he's always looked a bit of a liability, pariculary in the air (for example Fulham, QPR, Barnsley away last season, there will be others of course).

So the real question is, do we take up the option (on same wages of course), try to renegotiateon a new contract, or walk away?

For me, i think it's time to walk away. He's not shown himself to be the creative player we need; and certainly not one to take us higher up the league next season (hopefully).

Like a say Paterson, he may flourish elsewhere; and that is a chance of course you take with these sort of players. But i think he's had more than enough time now to demonstrate to us that he is part of our future; and hasn't convinced me i'm afraid.

14 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Depends which board you're talking about. 

Bristol City Holdings Limited - the company that published our consolidated group accounts - that has two directors, Doug Harman and Jon Lansdown.

It's subsidiary is Bristol City Football Club Limited which has 4 directors - Richard Gould, Gavin Marshall, Doug Harman and Jon Lansdown.

Well I think we can rule Jon out 

Unless it's a strip design competition he was also talking to him about.

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Interesting thread on the West Ham forum of all places citing our examples- and seemingly many clubs outside the PL want FFP to be scrapped or similar. OP says he was speaking to a BCFC Board member!

https://www.kumb.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=182307

The Telegraph article- behind the paywall- that someone on there kindly posted.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2022/01/12/bristol-city-facing-points-deduction-transfer-market-collapse/

I don't think you can pull the system out mid stream- any reform IMO should kick in come 2024/25 at the earliest- two clubs this season have albeit via agreed settlements received deductions, Sheffield Wednesday last year and Birmingham 2 years before.

On a side note, if the EFL are only including gate receipts and matchday losses as FFP related then surely a) Rather a lot of sides will get deductions at one level or another and b) PL and EFL rules are basically the same- will this also apply to the PL? Everton are fairly close, Aston Villa up until 2021 still include 2 seasons of EFL loss limits- if in PL case you only include matchday revenue and there were also TV rebates up there, you might have some PL sides fall foul no?? I would also say it's fair if an owner pays staff instead of furloughing to add that back although that would have to be scrutinised very closely.

If Aston Villa's FFP losses exceed £72m to 2021 then they should be punished accordingly. If it's only matchday revenue, TV rebates and possibly furlough losses that can be excluded then that's quite likely they are over no?

Hmm.. How many Board Members do we actually have?

Given that the person that has apparently "Spoken to our Board Member" last night.; but waited until the RG interview has come out to post all about his meeting with the "Board Member"; it seems somewhat coincidental that every detail of that meeting seems to be identical to comments made by RG in his interview. 

Yep, seems legit.....

48 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

A Kelly sell on clause would be really handy right now. My gut feeling is that Bournemouth would leave it to the summer or next season in the event of staying down, they of course cheated FFP under the old regs but since coming down they've been quite willing to sell and cut back thusfar. Their Post Balance Sheet Events in 2020 accounts suggested a £51m profit on player disposal last season so they will trade!

Think @Davefevs mentioned it a while back.

Had we sold Kelly in 2019/20 as opposed to 2018/19, it was literally a couple of weeks from the end of our Reporting Period then we wouldn't have made a profit in 2018/19 but it would have pushed the Kelly profit on disposal into 2019/20. Same deal, same club just 2-3 weeks on- big difference! Probably would have moved £10-15m into this new starting point albeit averaged across 2019/20, 2020/21 due to the effect of Covid as with losses.

Would Moore be of interest to Hearts on a more long term basis? Maybe- they look likely to lose Souttar after all.

Palmer there has been speculation about.

I think DaSilva is still a good player with time of time on his side but if he needed to go due to finances so be it.

I wonder if someone got a bonus for turning over the first profit in 20 years ?.

I think it was about £10m, so this fee is the difference between a loss or profit for that set of results of course

32 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

Reading the EP article, I may be naive, but I’m still not that concerned at this stage.

When he was chief executive of Surrey, Gould often used the media as a means to put pressure on the ECB. This is what he’s doing here - he’s laying out a damaging but plausible scenario of the majority of clubs having huge losses and breaching FFP, and then pointing out that in turn would kill the integrity of the competition due to those losses arising from an “act of God” as opposed to mismanagement (although there is a degree - cough - Ashton, it’s not the main factor here). The line about taking the deduction vs selling players is an iteration of that we can’t undermine the competitiveness of clubs following Covid.

Basically, it’s a push article to set the ground for either a major allowance for Covid related losses (as noted, our concerts/conferences is actually the big hit), or reform. As all bar the parachute clubs will be impacted to some degree, there will be a rally behind this - it’s just we’re first over the hill and laying the groundwork 

Gould strikes me as a CEO who is going to be pushed to the front by a number of clubs to collectively argue on their behalf alongside City.

He is articulate, thoughtful; and comes across as a man with experience who perhaps the EFL will feel they can negotiate with?

Some of the CEO's at other clubs come across as either second hand car dealers, or nothing more than nepotistic appointments by Foreign owners.

2 minutes ago, CheddarReds said:

 

 

Slightly taken out of context on a hypothetical situation there Gregor.

But heh ho, lets get those clickbait headlines going.

9 minutes ago, headhunter said:

I would agree with that. I guess it is about whether City hold their nerve for 12 months after which the chickens come home to roost in some shape or form with regards to FFP compliance.

David,

As per my earlier post, I don't think City are in a terrible position compared to a number of Championship clubs.

The 2019 results push the problem 12 months into the future, and hopefully by then the EFL will have come to their senses over 20-21, and future application of some sort of Salary Cap.

There will be a number of clubs that for this season here and now, have breached the FFP, as they don't have a 2019 season to include in their figures. Those clubs will be of more immediate  concern to the EFL in my view.

Big decisions to be made of course this Summer around all of the OOC's, Optional years, and players going into their last year of contract of course.

We could be looking at a vastly different team in August 2022 to the one that finishes this season.

27 minutes ago, Monkeh said:

Yep, unless ffp changes we are in the shit,

Ffp will likely change and most of the division will be in the same shit 

I don't see us as being alone in the FFP  situation of course.

We are the only club in the Championship to have released 2021 accounts, and I reckon a number of clubs results will be worse than ours.

With the 2019 results keeping us within guidelines for this season, there will be Championship clubs that don't have that luxury, and will fail the FFP for this season, and will of course be of more immediate concern for the EFL.

Moving forward the situation has to change of course. How can the Championship, L1 & L2 have different systems? And of course, how competitive can the Championship be under FFP with the PPs that a number of clubs are getting for 3 years. It's all getting a bit farcical now.

I can see a situation where the EFL when confronted by the 20/21 figures, just concede that the clubs shouldn't be penalised due to "Act of God"; and are given a free pass. The system then has to change to some form of Salary cap for all three leagues that is consistent across the board. They then have to figure out how to strip out these PP's out of the Salary Cap situation, to allow the Championship once again to be a competitive division. 

Not going to be an easy one for them to manage, that's for sure.