Taylor10

I am sure this game was 2-2!?

Glad to see a thread started on both. Such a huge positive tonight. Both exceptional in and out of possession and looked like seasoned pros. Different class.

Am I alone in enjoying their demise? Ole seems like a decent bloke but he’s so far out of his depth. In all honesty he should never have got anywhere near that job. I also don’t think he recruited that well in the summer. I think Sancho will come good, but at that price United didn’t need him. Central midfield has been a problem area for them. I’m also not convinced CR7 was what they needed either, although he’s a machine. I hope they continue to plummet and the plastics keep going into meltdown. It’s good entertainment if nothing else.

Some good points@Mr Popodopolous I completely agree RE budget not always determining fortune and I recognise that we have not been able to pay anywhere near the wages of a lot of clubs in this division, throughout LJ’s reign and of course even more so now. My point regarding resources though isn’t just around wages or transfer fees as such. I include player turn over in and out in that, as well as loans. I guess you could refer back to the old ‘clubs in the bag approach’ as well whereby if say we as City fans, hypothetically speaking if we were looking at another champ club spending those transfer fees, recouping fees at a rate the manager can then go and heavily reinvest back in the playing squad having such a high volume of player incomings from fees, loans and free transfers I think we would quite rightly be saying said club should be at least finishing in the play offs, so why not us, even with the wage restriction in comparison? To clarify my point, which I should of eluded to in my post was mainly about the resources LJ had going into the 19/20 season. Any other club, even if unable to spend the top wages, after recruiting so many players and spending so much in transfer fees (although LJ earned the right to do that) would have been at the very least expected to finish in the top 6, so to get nowhere near is quite astounding and in turn brings us to where we are today. I just can’t help but feel any other club in this division, that was in our/LJ’s/MA’s position at the start of that season and of course going into Jan still able to reinvest so heavily would be expecting to finish at least top 6, so again I ask why not us? To have not got anywhere near was criminal really.

If only it were that simple @Desso I think we do need to show more attacking intent at home but we quite simply don’t have the technical or tactical ability required to do so consistently. As for sitting back, we don’t have anyone in the team that can dictate the tempo of the game or keep hold of the ball when under pressure. We really do struggle even retaining possession.

I’m not sure kid. Yes the wages were and probably never will be that of ‘top 6’ in comparison to a lot of sides in this division. However without meaning to go over old LJ ground again, in my opinion the scattergun approach and any lack of recruitment plan/recruiting to a style of play or having any sort of plan was the main restriction as such, not wages. I think with those type of resources at another club say, we would probably be saying ‘that club should be finishing in the play offs’. That’s not to discredit the good work LJ did in raising some of the funds to spend in the first place and indeed maximising some players value. I dont think he gets the credit he deserves at times for this because of the heavy investment or ‘clubs in the back approach’ on the playing side which didn’t pay off, that as you say now is coming back to bite us. Every club outside of the top 6 in England have to sell their best players, but LJ was fortunate he was afforded the resources to replace them. A little harsh to of expected a top 6 finish in each season he was here granted, but at the very least should have finished in the top 6 in one of those seasons. His last one I guess was the best chance, given that he didn’t do this at least once with his resources, was a failure. Of course during his tenure some clubs occupying the top 6 were paying astronomical wages but to have got nowhere near to breaking into it with a good few years of solid investment was a major disappointment.

Amazes me people still try and defend Johnson and his/MA’s scattergun transfer dealings. Of course he improved or enhanced some players but he also had the biggest budget in the clubs history ? any other club in this division with those resources would of been at the very least finishing in the top 6 each season.

He used to cover the toolstation league for the gazette & herald a good few years back now. He played Sunday football as well. Don’t think he was the most popular. Seldom says anything positive about City but is meant to be a fan.

Amazed Kane is getting stick. His numbers for England are ridiculous and the type of goals to game ratio that people would be going nuts over if it was Ronaldo or Messi.

Exciting times for English football and im intrigued to see how Southgate evolves this squad.

Frightening strength in depth. Some players not even called up that I believe would be better than some of the players already in that squad. Also worth considering there is bound to be one or two more that will emerge over the course of the next year. Over to you Gareth.

Nige, my thoughts are with you. I wish you all the very best in what I hope is a speedy and full recovery. Stay strong.

Granted being a young player in a poor side doesn’t help but from what I’ve seen he’s anything but class. He is young so time is on his side to develop but he has an awful lot to do to become a regular at this level. Aside from a few displays I haven’t seen a lot to suggest he will succeed at this level but I hope he does of course.

He did have one of his better games in the 2nd half against 10 men, however in the first half he must of touched it 3 times at best. Class player? Steady Jon.

Sorry Dave. Just never going to happen. Also based on this season what evidence is there that Warnock could even do the job asked? When he left boro they were only a single win better off than us, with a better squad and he’s had the luxury of recruiting 13-14 players to add to that squad. I will also add to that as when we went to there place we were well worth a point. Never going to happen.

I agree with many of your points and this squad should be doing better, but not by much I don’t think. The one constant in all this for me is under performing players. Most under 3 different managers. As you say, most of them at times have shown what they are capable of, however not consistently. Maybe at times that’s been down to application, but for the majority to not be able to maintain those performances consistently at this level under numerous managers quite simply tells me they are not good enough for this level or where we want to be.

Without meaning to go over old ground he has been the most backed manager in our history surely? Yes he had to sell his best players but he was given pretty much all of that money back to recruit again. He had a huge budget during his time here. Any other side/manager in this division with those resources would at the very least have been expected to deliver a playing style/identity & to be finishing in the top 6. If we were looking on at any other club in this division with the resources he had we would of been envious, so I’m surprised people think he over achieved.

As I said with Holden, different circumstances but still an unproven manager at this level but my point being if Lowe came in now wouldn’t it yet again show a complete lack of direction and any sort of plan? We were all screaming for a proven manager, so what happens now? If Lowe comes in does he get a bigger budget than NP? Where’s the direction here? Of course it’s a result driven business, we all know that. NP will know that. The only current argument I can make in his favour is that this is not his team, still a squad full of LJ players and he has had no budget, as well as the infrastructure for successful or sustainable recruitment is quite simply not there at present. I think it’s harsh to be critical of him missing games due to covid, look at SC for example and the time he missed. Unhelpful yes, but until we know why he wasn’t present yesterday it’s unfair to assume and I’m sure NP wouldn’t carry on for the sake of it if it meant it was detrimental to his own health. I wasn’t expecting anything other than a struggle this season. Just look at the state of the squad. Stevie Wonder would tell you this squad was always going to struggle, regardless of who’s in charge. However I didn’t expect such weak and inept performances that quite simply don’t resemble an NP side. That for me is the biggest concern I have and is what makes me question if he’s the right man or not.

This is the problem Dave. What guarantees would a new manager bring? This squad is abysmal and our worst since we’ve been in the champ for me. However does that excuse NP? I see a lot of people on here calling for Ryan Lowe, an unproven manager, who is doing a great job at Plymouth but under totally different circumstances. Slightly different scenario but 99% of the fan base were up in arms employing an unproven manager at this level in Holden. Granted he hasn’t had the exposure or experience Lowe has, but would this type of move yet again show a complete lack of leadership and plan from SL?

Your last sentence sums it up for me. We didn’t have one player, not one who was prepared to try keep the ball in that second half, let alone as a team. It was very alarming to watch but it was like it the entire second half. The 10 men of cov by far the better side but my word we made it easy for them. Yes we can question managers & tactics but there was a serious lack of desire & professional pride in that City side today.

Bang on Dave. I think the manager & tactics have to be questioned, but I said in another thread that some of these players have under performed consistently for 3 different managers. This is a very very poor squad of players make no mistake about that.

Certainly have to question the management/tactics but can we please stop making excuses for this squad? Nowhere near good enough, gutless and many of this squad have underperformed under the last 3 managers. Granted a large percentage of this squad were LJ signings, but regardless the majority of this squad won’t take us forward, no matter who’s in charge.

This squad is shit. I fail to see how anyone else can think this squad is any better than bottom half. However the doubt regarding NP is now starting to creep in also. Today was inexcusable, shit squad or not.

Granted I think NP needs to get more from this bunch but seriously what are people expecting? Honestly? This is a desperately poor squad of players. If we were in L1 with this squad we wouldn’t get promoted. Yes NP needs to do more but people are over looking how bad this squad is. I’m not excusing NP or these dismal displays, but with such a clear out in the summer followed by a lack of investment, plus no recruitment structure in place surely there isn’t one person that expected anymore than middle table? Mid table at an absolute push as well.

Nail on head kid. This squad is terrible and for me comfortably worse than the last champ squad we had that went down. NP needs to get more from what he has but I think a lot of people are over looking just how bad this squad is. 14 players moved on yet this squad is still mainly LJ’s which tells you a lot. Amazing how some of the NP out brigade are trying to claim Baker & Weimann were his signings too.